TTR 600 Belgarda kickback

[baldone]

Howdy from down under
First post and hoping someone has expertise to unleash the beast in the TTR 600 I have in shed.
I have only had bike several months and when the previous owner dropped it off he had a bit trouble starting 10-12 kicks. I tried for 3 days couldn't get it fire. Finally got some sort routine going and was able to start 2-3 kicks.I was wanting to register so took it to the mechanic who said was blowing bit smoke because rings etc, so had cyclinder rebore, oversize piston new cam chain, valve regrind. Bike back together and no spark , after testing electrics sourced CDI from Ingitech. Hooked up and got great spark but now getting massive kickback. Looking at flywheel it physically appears that strip on flywheel is far to advanced to suit TDC. As I had not had long I spoke previous owner who claimed CDI I replaced was relatively new? Help please ? cheers Bob Toowoomba QLD

[Walkabout]

I owned one a few years ago.
I suggest you read through the earlier threads, such as those linked below, and see if they give you inspiration.

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...00-r-how-32814

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...-or-ugly-32142

My memories of that bike are very mixed but you will need a deal of inspiration and perspiration concerning kicking over the 600cc, IMO.

Welcome here, by the way: it is a good resource.

[baldone]

Gday Walkabout
Thanks for threads I have read both several times previously,, but read again.
Just came from mechanic and he even went trouble pulling top end off again just check things out. Seems Mechanic has two concerns/symptoms massive kick back like you only going to kick it once and he is a bloke that's been around a while. Also tried to do compression test but after using decomp to tdc then kicking through only getting reading 70psi. but when decomp cable disconnected can't kick over well enough to get reading. Umm so we are back to chasing CDI off a known runner to plug/play? The original CDI was replaced not so long ago by previous owner ( genuine $900) it was giving intermittent spark so sourced one from Ingitech which is producing great spark but abnormal? kickback.
Getting expensive bargin
cheers Bob

[baldone]

Lindsay.
Thanks for reply PM but I couldn't reply to you as not enough posts, thanks for sharing information.
Cheers Bob

[backofbeyond]

The thing is with big singles is that you can get kickback from a number of different sources and it doesn't necessarily mean that there's a problem with the CDI. There is a starting "ritual" of making sure the piston is in the right place (just after tdc) before you start to kick - get it wrong and it may well kick back - or do nothing at all.

Even if you get it right but don't put enough "effort" into the kick it may well kick back (you have to put close to your whole body weight onto the kickstart - it's not so much a "kick" as an attempt to jump on top of it). If you open the throttle too much combined with a feeble kick it may well launch you into orbit when it kicks back.

Back in the days when you had mechanical bob weights to control ignition advance, having those stuck in the full advance position would pretty much guarantee a violent kickback but with CDI you'd have to be unlucky to have an electrical fault duplicate that. If the flywheel has been removed and put back slightly out of position that could cause it but it would have to be a pretty inept mechanic who managed to do that.

It does seem a little strange to me that the bike started in 2-3 kicks (probably about normal for my 600 singles) before the strip down but didn't have a spark after. The electrics shouldn't have been touched other than removing stuff and putting it back.

[Walkabout]

I think you need 5 postings to be able to send PMs, so not far to go on that front.

Yes, without the decompression operating correctly I couldn't kick over the 600cc single either.

From your first post, you suspect that the timing is not set correctly - you or the mechanic are going to adjust that?

[turboguzzi]

dont know if this applies to a belgarda, but sound like it does...

if your ignition system has two pickups, then you simply need to use the second one. these old CDI had no advance curve, they simply jump from the low advance to the high advance at a fixed rpm

the ignitech has a proper advance curve so it uses only the low advance pickup. if you have another two wires coming from the pickup harness, try the other pair. to me it sounds like you are connected to the high advance pickup.

[Walkabout]

Originally Posted by baldone

Gday Walkabout
Thanks for threads I have read both several times previously,, but read again.
Just came from mechanic and he even went trouble pulling top end off again just check things out. Seems Mechanic has two concerns/symptoms massive kick back like you only going to kick it once and he is a bloke that's been around a while. Also tried to do compression test but after using decomp to tdc then kicking through only getting reading 70psi. but when decomp cable disconnected can't kick over well enough to get reading. Umm so we are back to chasing CDI off a known runner to plug/play? The original CDI was replaced not so long ago by previous owner ( genuine $900) it was giving intermittent spark so sourced one from Ingitech which is producing great spark but abnormal? kickback.
Getting expensive bargin
cheers Bob

There's been more recent discussion in here about this Belgrada bike, such as this thread:-
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...rt-but-82406-2

Apparently, you can never have enough threads about a particular model of bike.

There was always a bigger following for these bikes in Germany than within the UK, IMO.
in the earlier HUBB threads that I linked to in earlier postings there are websites based in Germany about the bike and some of those sites sell related items.

When kicking this bike, I used to keep my instep/heel off the kicker and used the flat of my foot - in that way, when it does kick back (and they do sooner or later) it would throw my foot off the kicker rather than transmit a big force along my tibia/fibia.

Here's the search that I used to find threads about the kicking issue:-
Search | Horizons Unlimited

Here's a couple of more:-
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...starting-26306

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...nt-start-24624

They remind me that "aukeboss" was the guru in here for all things related to the XT Yamaha but he doesn't seem to have been around for quite some time.

[turboguzzi]

quick search found this pic, so looks like you have twin pickups, try using the other one

[Walkabout]

Also, see post number 11 in this thread:-
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...-pick-up-64826
I did the actions listed in that thread when I had a weak spark (sometimes no spark) with my ttr600 including cleaning the earth connection of the coil bolted to the frame.

[baldone]

Gday Gents
Sorry for not replying to posts but have been tired up with work.
Writing to inform you the outcome of my ttr600 issues for which I had used Ingitech supplied CDI unit.

The bike with New CDI unit in had good spark but was giving massive kick back so the thought was it was timing issue? However when the top end was pulled off it was found that the mechanic who had just rebuilt top end had tensioned cam chain before tightening cam shaft down. When he tightened cam shaft it put massive tension on cam chain. This basically made the engine that tight/bound that when you kicked it over it would not spin faster enough and firing before TDC. The bike is now starting and running really good, thanks to new Ingitech CDI. Price was great and service excellent posted on Monday in Czech republic and at my place on Friday?

Bob

[Walkabout]

Thanks for the update: all too frequently, peeps who start threads don't come back to update.

It's often the simple things, especially after a machine has had work done recently.

For the electrics, this website has a diagnostics flow chart which is very handy regarding the charging system.
https://www.electrosport.com/technic...agnosis-center

[xtrock]

Yes i agree, ask for help and never give feedback what happen doesnt help next person or the forum in the end. Great you sorted it

[baldone]

Thanks fellas I also have been frustrated when the solution is not supplied, bit like reading a novel to find last 2 pages a torn out
Thanks for link W/bout
Cheers