At the moment I have a Moto Guzzi California 1400 that I'm doing all my big trips in the US on. However, I also want something more practical for commuting, and that I could do a big trip around South America (and possibly Africa in future) on in about 3 years time. My thinking is that I will pick a commuter bike now that makes sense for that trip, as it'll give me time to learn how to perform maintenance on it and accessorize it for RTW riding. Plus, then by the time of the trip it'll be a used bike that I know well, that won't be quite as shiny and attractive to thieves as it was when it was new.

My idea of 'adventure riding' - and I accept different people define it different ways, nothing wrong with that, each to their own - is about sticking to roads as much as possible, and only doing dirt roads when it's the only route through an area, or I'd miss something really good if I don't. For example, the route I want to take would include the 319 in Brazil, which I hear can be pretty hard going with all the mud. So I know I need something that can cope with some tough terrain.

I won't have years to do these trips, just a few months... so I will need something that can cope with a few extremely high-mileage road days thrown into the mix.

I think I've narrowed down my choice of bikes to two... the new Triumph Tiger 800 XCx and the KTM 690 Enduro R. Once I've added a few accessories to the KTM like a fairing kit and suchlike to turn it into an 'adventure bike,' they both cost similar amounts, around the $15k mark. Both would handle my 15 mile 50-60mph commute to work easily.

Which one do you guys think should be my weapon of choice for this?

Here are my views of the main pros and cons of each...

Tiger 800 XCx

Pros

• Will handle high mileage road days well, especially now it has cruise control!
• Has plenty of alternator output for charging heated gear etc.
• Can probably carry a bit more stuff with me.
• Has off-road tuned traction control, which may be useful for a mainly road rider like me when the going does get tough.

Cons

• Heavy! There would be some terrain that this bike simply couldn't do.
• Potentially complicated to fix, hard to get spares for, etc.

690 Enduro R

Pros

• Would be much better off the beaten track, though I'm probably not a good enough off road rider to get the most out of it.
• I imagine it would be less complicated to repair, and easier to get parts for.

Cons

• Might be a bit of a chore to do high mileage highway days on.
• Even with a new lighting kit, the low alternator output would mean I'd have to be careful with heated stuff.

Have you ridden either? That may very well make your mind up then and there. I'm currently in a similar (ish) situation. My bike's my only transport, and I use it for everything. I currently ride far more Tarmac than anything else, so my F800 serves me well (in the same way as the Tiger might). I'd considered going down the 690 route, but was put off for three reasons, one of which will make others laugh! Firstly, yes the 690 will cope with motorway riding, but the Tiger would be more comfortable. Secondly, I currently need my bike to carry as much as I'd like, so a proper sub frame is, for me, a must. Again, there are ways around this on the 690, but I'd rather start with the correct equipment. Thirdly (get ready to laugh), I want something more reliable and with a wider dealer network than I'm led to believe the KTM has. This is where you laugh at the fact I'm on a BMW! In my defence, I'm giving serious thought to the new AT (true adventure), if any official specs ever appear. Anyway, I digress.

At the moment, despite the fact that the 690 appeals to my "leave everything behind and head off to the sunset" spirit, my brain tells me the 800 is better for me as a result of my circumstances. It sounds like you're not a million miles from where I am?

I'll go back to the beginning - ride them both and decide.

I can't imagine getting parts for the ktm is going to be easier than the triumph? Never had one myself, but a mate who had a (ok different bike altogether!) super Duke ended up getting rid, as it was off the road more than on, always waiting for parts arriving from Austria. And he was in the badlands of Glasgow... Don't fancy your chances in south America.

Triumph ain't always great at getting parts, but that's the one I'd pick. Not that I'm biased, I have an XC right now :-)

Thanks for the replies!

You're absolutely right, I need to test ride. But during the winter months that's harder to do (although, beautiful weather today, so I guess I could have!) so for now I'm just doing a little forum research and seeing what others think. I won't be buying it until the summer anyway as I still have a little more saving to do.

If I'm honest, I'm leaning more towards the Triumph because I think the vast majority of my 'adventuring' is going to be done on paved roads or decent gravel roads and I think the Triumph will be the better bike for that sort of riding. Obviously the thing that attracts me to the KTM is the fear that there will be occasional roads on the trip that the Triumph won't handle.

But I guess worst case scenario, I turn back and alter my route... or I find someone who'll give me and the bike a ride in a truck if I have to.

Also, as you mentioned the F800GS, I should say that I wouldn't buy the Triumph before I've test ridden the BMW for comparison. In my head I'm leaning more towards the Triumph because I think the recent changes they've made to it (WP suspension, cruise control, etc.) make it the better bike on paper. But it's always possible that the BMW would feel better to me on a test ride and sway me, or that BMW may update that bike in the meantime as well.

Oh, and yeah... I'm also very interested in Honda's plans! Alas, I don't think that'll be released soon enough to make it onto my list.

From your description it sounds like only a few days of higher speed motorways..therefore you should consider it only as a percentage, or of the entire trip, look at the majority of the trips terrain and then then decide what level of bike you need to suit that portion best...

I do agree the two key things you mentioned are the biggest priority is comfort on the bike and with the bike...as it will make the whole trip considerably more enjoyable - you don't want to spend the trip worrying about breaking something / not being able to get through somewhere because of tough terrain / or how sore you are, as this will leave little time to enjoy the actual trip around you...

I think you nailed it the new Honda Transalp may be the ticket...I'm certainly waiting to see it up close...

Good luck, let us know what you decide..

__________________
Young riders pick a destination and go... Old riders pick a direction and go...

Sounds like you're a bit fluid on bike choice at this point? That's a good thing! Riding a few bikes always the way to go ... if you can manage it. Hard to get test rides on some bikes. Some local San Fran Bay area dealers can sometimes put me on a bike for a test. But I know them.

Triumph routinely offer test rides, KTM? I guess if you know the dealer you may get a go ... or if they have a Demo or used one around.

3 years commuting before you depart! :confused1: I'm pretty sure the KTM 690 would need a complete rebuild after that. The Tiger will do the miles and survive it. I'm on my 3rd Tiger (currently 1050) so a bit biased.
(owned 3 KTM's too)

Ridden BMW 800GS back to back with the Tiger 800XC ... both are very good IMO. I did not expect the BMW to ride so light. It does. But the sexy Tiger still gets my vote and it's just slightly better in sporty riding. BMW off road made me nervous ... but big street bike always do. Both good bikes!

You have to get used to them off road ... and you would do on the Tiger after a month on the road. Can you pick up a 500 lbs. (plus luggage) solo? That could be an issue. Figure about 60 lbs. of gear/tools et al.

Clearly 690 rocks off road ... but man, what a torture rack of a bike it is on highway. Needs better seat. I've ridden the 690 twice ... ON and OFF road. Fast and fun but, IMHO, not a travel bike unless very well set up. I'm sure many would disagree ... but maybe they didn't have to ride 19 hours straight through Mexico all the way to Northern California with no stop overs. 1000 miles mostly at 75 mph.

If you were doing more off road and really exploring back country (like central highlands of Peru') then the 690 could be the one. But shorter days may be in order. The Tiger could make it too I believe ... but the rider has to have some skills.

But you will have time to ride which ever bike you choose and decide.
If, in 6 months or a year you are sure you made a mistake, sell one, get something else.

The Tiger 800 has two cons for me: WEIGHT and not so great fuel economy. On the 690 you will not only have to figure out how to pack luggage but also figure out how to carry enough fuel to cross the Salar Uyuni.

The other considerations are:

-How many km's will you be riding on this trip?
-How much time do you have for your trip?
-Physically are you tall, short, strong, young, old?
-How good a rider are you on dirt?
-How mechanically minded are you?

If you have a lot of km's to ride in a short time frame go for the Tiger, if you have a long time to do the trip and you like to work on bikes get the KTM.

Don't underestimate how much time, work and cash a KTM 690 will take to get it good for a long trip if you 'fully prepare' one. If you don't have tight time constraints, prefer to ride slower and will ride a lot of tracks it will be the better bike, but if you mostly stick to asphalt it will be wasted and the Tiger would be an absolute blast to ride on the good paved roads in South America.

You can ride nearly all pavement all the way to Ushuaia apart from a few hundred kms of fairly good hard packed gravel - people take Harleys down there, so don't think you "have to" have an adventure bike to do it.

Both are good bikes, but at this early stage I would keep a very open mind and as Mollydog says, test ride everything you can.

__________________
Cheers
Grif

'11 KTM 450 EXC
'09 Suzuki DR650
'00 Discovery Series 2 V8
'95 Defender 90 300 Tdi Overlander
http://gipperstravels.blogspot.ca

If I bought today, the Triumph would possibly sway me away from the BMW. On my F800 I've changed quite a lot, not least a suspension upgrade; the Triumph seems to have this from the get go.

I'm not sure the BMW is getting an upgrade anytime soon.

My local Honda (UK) dealer told me they're getting the new African Twin in Q3, which I took to mean September ish. Internet gossip suggests it is going to be around 200kg wet, 180 dry - take that with a pinch of salt! Autumn this year does suggest that REAL info should appear around Easter time, I would imagine? Watch the space!

Would be awesome if Honda could get the new Africa Twin out that soon ...
but I question the dealers claim. If history is our guide, then showing a "concept" bike usually indicates production version is at least two years away and often times it never shows up at all. Check your Milan show
history. Lots of concept bikes have come to nothing over the years.

But who knows? I hope you get it soon ... cause it will be a year after that, that USA would get it. (US a year behind on many new releases)

Another fantastic potential travel bike I see coming along (not out yet!) would be a smaller, lighter version of the Tenere', based on FZ-07 platform (700cc P-Twin motor). Not sure of name in UK market .. maybe MT-07? :confused1:

Anyway, the current FZ-07 is getting straight A's here in USA press and great reviews in Brit press as well. Owners forums are HOT too, raving about the bike so far.

If Yamaha can keep cost in line (FZ-07 cost is $6900 usd!!) and not tack on a bunch of so called ADV junk, keep weight down (75 HP, 397 lbs. ), I think it has possibility to DOMINATE the mid range ADV class. Yamaha are on a serious roll now ... the best of the Japanese companies for last couple years, IMO. Could be a F800GS and Tiger 800 beater, no?

Uh oh... sorry! Didn't see the latest responses, so apologies for the delay.

Really helpful stuff here, so thanks! I'll start by answering Gipper's questions.

-How many km's will you be riding on this trip?
A pretty ambitious amount of KMs!

-How much time do you have for your trip?
Not as long as I would ideally like for the distance involved, but I think enough to make it possible.

-Physically are you tall, short, strong, young, old?
31 years old, male, 6'3" tall, over 200lbs - I'm not saying it'd be fun picking up a 500lbs bike by myself, but at least I'm built for it!

-How good a rider are you on dirt?
Terrible I'm planning to get more local experience in this though before the trip, once I have the bike.

-How mechanically minded are you?
Not at all! Again, I realize this is something I need to learn before setting off on this sort of trip. One of the reasons I'm planning it so far in advance. Also plan to learn Spanish!

I think I'm pretty much decided on the Tiger or another bike of that ilk. You're all right that what it really comes down to is how much time do I have to do the trip... I have a job that I'm hoping to keep (they'll only let me take so much unpaid leave without firing me!), so that rules out doing traveling over years. I have at most 6 months, if the HR people are feeling REALLY nice. If I had years to do a trip, the KTM would be great, and I could very slowly experience all the little dirt tracks of the regions I'm passing through. But what I need is a bike that can handle high mileage highway days.

I was assuming that the Honda would be revealed at the autumn winter bike shows, then in dealers in the spring as that seems to be the pattern for new bikes. If it is released before that, then it will definitely be worth consideration! If not, I won't be able to wait that long as I need a commuter... my 1400cc Guzzi feels a little like overkill on my commute at the moment! As you say, I could always swap bikes again before the trip... but I'd like to get it right to begin with if I can.

So I think it'll be between the Tiger 800XCx (on paper, my favorite) and the BMW F800GS. I've owned a Suzuki DL650 before, and they're fantastic bikes, but I fancy something different. The Kawasaki Versys 650 doesn't seem set up at all for off-road.

Anyway, thanks again! Luckily, my local Triumph dealer is also a BMW dealer, so I think when a warm weekend comes along I'll be trying out the two main contenders!

Nice one, yeah the new XCx Tiger 800 looks pretty good now, the WP suspension and the upgraded electronics package bring it more inline with the 800 GS - the only thing I would have liked to see on the Tiger is a larger, lower mounted or under seat tank like the 800 GS Adventure.

Physically you'll be fine I'm sure, Id also think about doing some dirt skills training courses on a smaller bike and get used to sliding, skidding etc on dirt before you practice it on the new bigger bike.

My only other advice would be to buy modest size panniers, pack light and don't have a huge top box full of heavy gear, keeping the bikes profile low will help in the Patagonia winds

__________________
Cheers
Grif

'11 KTM 450 EXC
'09 Suzuki DR650
'00 Discovery Series 2 V8
'95 Defender 90 300 Tdi Overlander
http://gipperstravels.blogspot.ca

I did test ride the BMW F800GS (about 400km) and the Triumph 800XC (900km).

Both bikes are easy to ride, and handle great. I found that with the BMW you get more for the same money. The Triumph XC is too expensive for what you get. The fuel economy is better on the BMW, it's quite impressive. Only the single F650Gs use less.

The F800GS is better built for off road on my opinion. I saw a few in Mongolia, and people managed with them.

But both bikes have a big minus for me. Both engines are absolutely boring as hell. It's like driving an electric bike. No noise, no sensations.

You should really first test the bike, because if you are a guy that like engines, like real engines, you will not enjoy riding these bikes...

I have and had many different bikes. If I had to go for a BMW, it would be for a boxer, because this engine puts a smile on your face.

KTM? They are fantastic, I have a 640 Adv, and ride it in Mongolia and Russia, on the Western BAM and on the Road of Bones. But the 690 is way way better on the engine side. No vibrations, lot of power, fuel efficient, reliable, longer service intervals.
It's a pitty that there is not a Adventure version of the 690, because you need to invest quite some money to turn it into an adventure bike.

And for people doubting about the realiability of the KTM, just look at how many KTM finish the 10'000km Dakar Rally in the worst condition that you can imagine.

And if you need more proof about the reliability of the 690 engine, just check Lyndon Poskitt "Races to Places " on youtube, he crossed already half of the world with his 690RR, driving much faster than an average biker, doing 2 rallyes on the way, and only had minor repairs. Just saying....

Triumph or KTM? - somehow I would be afraid on either going for a long ride...

I'm very familiar with Triumph's triples and have spent time on the Tiger 800. These are my thoughts on the bike:

It is very smooth and can eat up road miles at whatever speed necessary
Can do the above because the triple has gobs of torque from very low in the rev range
It handles lighter than it is on paper
I would not hesitate to do 40-50k miles on the engine with only the regular oil changes and valve checks.
I've checked the valves on 4 separate Triumph Triples and they don't need resetting after the first 12k service, so it's really a nice and reliable engine.
Service in these bikes are very easy. A competent home mechanic can do just about anything without any specialty tools.
One thing I hate about the 800 is the engine location in the frame. It's an inline 3cyl and it can get very hot. The engine mounts are exactly where my knee joints are and if you happen to tuck your knees in against the frame you burn your knees...or at least I did. For that reason I would pass on that machine.

This is always a dilemma, once you get to taste the off-road you always want to go a little further. It comes down to what you want to do the majority of the time.
I own a 2011 Tiger 800 (road version) and find that it handles well enough off-road. It’s not built to follow those lighter bikes, but it will get you to those ‘’out of the way places’’. I’ve got close to 40,000Km on it and haven’t yet had a problem with it. As with any bike, the rider’s skills will determine where and how you reach the destination.
I did an 800Km off-road rally last summer and came back unscathed, but I didn’t go looking for any mud holes or extreme jumps. The rally was not judged on best time but on the closest target mileage, so I took my time and enjoyed the experience as much as those with their KTM 350’s.
I’ve also ventured onto some gravel and single track roads and have never had a problem. When it gets too rough, you respect the terrain (and your limits) and turn back. Realistically, what is the percentage of off-roading we really do?
This being said, I’m really drooling over the new 800XCR.