In keeping this thread alive for those buying off the net:
On Saturday I popped down to a Yamaha Dealer (in Kent just off the M2) who were advertising a New Tenere on ebay so I withdrew £5000 and went to see them first thing saturday morning, unfortunatley it had been sold on firday night...
I diddnt really like the black anyway!
I was told that the bikes are not available in the UK because they are cheaper than on the continent (Apparently £1000 cheaper) so many sales are to Non Uk residents... Also that yamaha UK were due in a few more bikes as and when they became available, so the future looks bright.

However I did get a good look at the bike and well its not really better than the old XT600 tenere in my opinion. And certainly not worth spending the £5000 I had in my pocket on if you already have the original (I have the 1VJ)

The "bash" plate was plastic, no really- plastic, so that has to be replaced immediately-£84 for the Yamaha Alluminium one

The Yamaha Panniers are Alluminium plates wrapped in plastic - yes the black stuff is plastic, hence these are pretty unuseable and you need to go to the after market for decent hard luggage -£450+
The Top case mounts were surprisingly flimsy and I would imagine that the case would come off when riding on any nasty section off road.
So thats a no-no too, but ok for city stuff.

The grey plastic protectors were interesting, I get it they are cheap protectors that are designed to be sacrificial in the event of an off. But they are really cheap, and I think about how many off's my Xt600 has had recently (2 handle bars this year) And I wonder if it is practical.

All the bull and hype about the Fuel injection woes is really a load of twoddle, basically the throttle is really sensitive, and coming from a carb (my XT600) to the injection (a mates Xt660) I can see the difference and why it has a bad name, its only sensitive, the new tenere is supposed to be the same though on paper it is slightly de-tuned hmmm. Something to do (apparently) with reducing the throttle resonse via the ECU electrogimickry.

What struck me initially was how wide the bike is compared to my Xt600 tenere, it really is considerably wider, at the tank level. My other bike is a BMW 1150RT, so i am happy with wide bikes... but this was a surprise I had not anticipated.

The New tenere has the exhaust pipes on the left side, (so that will warm up my other leg now!) and on the right side it has a plastic watertank, that looks ludicrously flimsy and exposed. You need Engine guards - £84

Another thing that struck me is those ludircous exhause cans. when you feel them, they feel sort of soft (dare I say it?) plasticky These look pretty but have no purpose other than to inflate the price, or reduce the quality parts that add up to the end product.
The radiator looks set to collect as many dings from bouncing rocks off the oncoming vehicles or the bike in front of you as it could possibly attract, so that needs a mesh guard too (no price).
It does however have a Tow ring, for when you need to pull it out of a quadmire... so apparently the bike is not capable of getting through a quagmire (note to those travelling through Congo / Zilov gap)
Those sculptured pillion hand grips are made from the same cheap nasty plastic as the sacrificial tank guards. (BMW's have a similar sort of setup with their topbox, but it is significantly sturdier due to the material used.) By now you may have a feeling for the opinion that I was forming...

I wasnt allowed to swing a leg over, but rather grovel around and take in as much as possible. But it did seem higher than my XT, but not impossibly so. and it did look reasonably comfortable for a thin sculptured seat

Deep down the New tenere has all the same elements Good chassis, Great engine Good geometry, but those cheap and nasty plastics, just ruin it for me, particularly when you look at how many of them there are, and given the size of the tank area it should be more than 22 litres especially considering it goes under the seat.
When someone bumps the tank up to 30 litres, and with decent luggage on it I will be tempted by a second hand one and being a suitable replacement for the original but until then for the RTW traveller. You are better off buying a older Xt660 or Xt600 tenere for around a grand and using the £4000 for the trip. With the new tenere you only get more expense, carnets, import/export costs maintenance etc

My net opinion was that I own a 21 year old XT 600 tenere, and its still going strong, I can work on it myself, and eventually solve all the problems it presents. I appreciate that with technology things move forward, but some of the Tenere's ruggedness has been lost.
[RANT START]
As someone owning a newish BMW (and owned a much older BMW) and an older Yamaha, looking at replacing both bikes I can see why BMW's do cost more to buy (but not for the service - you theives) They use better quality materials, from the Front brake lever, to the plastics. Across the board there is deffinetly more meticulous attention to the nett package that is QUALITY, and yamaha seem to have forgotten that.
[RANT OVER]
I do think that this new Tenere will still be running in 20 years time and that is a tribite to the basics that they have managed to maintain.

Cheers G

P.S.
I will not be replacing the BMW with the FJR1300 (I havent mentioned that I was looking at doing that too) too nasty as a comparison

As I walked out the shop (£5000 still in pocket) I saw a TDM and couldnt help wondering what possibilities lay with adding WR450 forks to the front end of that a bike, with its gorgeous engine, as after all this is actually closer to the true Yamaha Dakar bikes of old than the teneres.

Hmmmmm... Interesting appraisal there G - I wonder if you'd have been so scathing if the bike had actually been for sale still, and you were now riding around on it (I presume the £5000 in your pocket was there as you were pretty sure you wanted one?)

In the interests of fairness to other readers, I'd like to counter a few of the observations you made regarding features of the bike.

• The price/availability sounds like dealer bullsh!t to me - the bike is around €6000 in maninland Europe, which at current exchange rates equates to around £5000 (ie the list price) here. A few dealers in the UK still have new stock in limited colours - Woods, Abergele in North Wales have a beige one, and someone posted that a dealer in Carlisle has a couple of black ones still available.

• With the greatest of respect, the new Tenere is better than a 20 year old bike in almost every respect, but as you say, if you already own one, and are comfortable/confident with it, the original XT600's still make a great RTW/travel bike.

• The Honda works team race their Baja bikes with plastic bash plates, in fact the O/E XR650R bashplate is preferred by Johnny Cambell even on the new CRF450's. There is nothing wrong with plastic per se - it is flexible strong and light. Afterall, if it's good enough for petrol tanks etc etc.

• I agree with you the O/E luggage is not particularly robust, although as you surmise it would be fine for the majority of people using it as a day to day bike. Fortunately there are already a number of aftermarket luggage manufacturers making pannier frames for the new Tenere, so you could fit whatever boxes you prefer (Metal Mule, Hepco Becker etc), or of course stick with soft luggage which many overlanders prefer. As for the top box - I'd say that mounting system is actually very substantial, but even Touratech do not recommend using a top-box in serious off-road/overland conditions.

• The plastic tank protectors are meant to be cheap, so they don't cost a lot to replace? The are a polythene type plastic and ought to bare scuffs and scratches well. I understand they are about £25-30 a pair if you ever do need to replace them. This is surely better than scratching a painted (plastic) tank? Perhaps you just didn't like the textured finish on them?

• Interesting you thought the bike felt wide? I would say it's no wider than any other overland bike fitted with a similar size tank? Btw. the tank does not extend under the seat (unless you count the very front edge of the seat pad), the airbox and battery take up the space in the black triangle below the seat. This was journalists getting it wrong at the launch. As for needing a bigger tank? This bike averages around 60mpg and has a range of around 300 miles - more then enough for most people I would have thought?

• I wouldn't say the coolant header tank you mention is overly exposed - it sits above the right hand crankcase, has a plastic cover, and would only suffer damage if it fell on something pointed that went into the gap between the engine case and the tank.

One thing I found with the new bike is how accessible everything is for inspection/maintenance - the coolant level, the spark plug access (without having to lift the tank), oil dipstick, air filter and battery terminals under the seat, etc etc.

• As for the exhaust - why ludicrous? And yes - the covers over each 'can' are in fact plastic! The exhaust itself is a single square box under the passenger seat, that houses a catalyst so it conforms with the current Euro 3 emissions standards. The plastic covers actually provide an effective barrier between the (hot) exhaust box itself and luggage/pillion legs etc etc. You may not like the styling of them (and I don't particularly either), but these can be changed for aftermarket single or double systems should an owner desire (simply junking the catalyst at the same time, and undoubtably saving a bit of weight too).

• You mention radiator guards and engine guards? (and metal bash plates) - any bike that is going to be used extensively overland will need additional preparation. You cannot expect a manufacturer to supply those sort of components as standard when as many different owners with have their own preferences and requirements? That is what the aftermarket business is for. Yamaha do offer their own tubular engine guard and metal bash plate, as do others like Metal Mule, who also have a radiator cover in stock for those who feel they will need it. Same goes for luggage - the Yamaha O/E stuff is only one of (increasingly) many options.

• As for the towing/recovery eyelet - I thought that was an inspired way to cover the holes in the bottom yoke (as the bike has a low front fender). I would suggest there are not many 180Kg bikes (or riders) who can successfully ride through a quagmire? I'd have thought having a recovery point (or handy lashing point for shipping/ferries so that straps don't rub on the tank unnecessarily) on any overland bike is a very good idea?

• Your rant did make me smile - after all, this bike is a budget machine, and is certainly at a budget price - what were you expecting for £4899? (and I paid less than that for mine). The cheapest BMW is nearly a thousand pounds more than that, and if you take a look at a new F650GS, I imagine you'd come to the conclusion it looks half finished...

The new Tenere has Brembo brakes front and rear, a (modest) quality Sachs rear shock, aluminium braced bars, bar ends, 4 position adjustable front brake lever (the same one as you find on much more expensive machines), alloy rims - good lights, instruments (including a fuel gauge), large tank, full fairing - that is a lot of bike for under £5000! - which is why it has proved so popular I imagine?

As for your idea about the TDM (quite apart form the cost of converting the front end yourself), the new 2009 'Super Tenere' is muted to have that engine (possibly bored out a little further) and may well address some of the 'quality' issues you have regarding plastics/component specification... maybe Yamaha will be able to tempt you yet?

xxx

JMo and Photographicsafari, that has to be the best attack and (better) defense on the Tenere. Anyone who is contemplating one should read your posts.

Hee hee - I think we both have too much time on our hands...

xxx

I looked at this bike but went with a KTM 640A. Clearly I'm less than impartial with my username. These were *my* reasons compared to the Tenere:

+ KTM 640 Adventure :
Carbed - rarely runs perfect, but will always run
Will go anywhere the rider is able, the difference counting especially in sand (edit: as in this is based on a pure dirt bike with roadgoing mirrors etc added)
Light
Ready to go RTW, not needing even the smallest change/mod/extra. Eg look at the handlebars on the stock tenere - guards? levers?
Flaws are well documented (numerous)
Nothing visibly cheap on it (but expected due to the difference in new cost) everything looks well/over engineered
Looked like it could be dropped all day long with no issue
Massive tank

-640: (now I have one)
Consumption sucks at 60+mph compared to fuel inj bikes
Wiring causing failure of components (most serious for me was the ignition barrel wiring, but was bypassable)
Service intervals very short compared to... anything else
Toolkit is in a stupid place
Not a comfy bike. It's not uncomfortable either. You can ride it as long as you need to.

I love the noise it makes and it's great fun to ride. It has buckets of character.

The vibes are a non-issue. Not a problem on the motorway, and irrelevant if beign ridden 'at home' on dirt tracks. Numbness etc is an internet myth.

The 640 justifies itself if you wish to take it the 5% of places other bikes struggle. Soft sand, tight technical trails, jumps/drops etc with luggage. If you're not planning on going everywhere, it's probably not worth living with the compromises it makes.

HTH.

__________________
http://bigben.to/ London to....? The big bike annual rally.
http://www.mongolbikers.com 125cc London -> Mongolia.

An interesting (and honest of you) summary there Martin... seems you were blinded by the orange glow, and realise the 640A is not the perfect travel bike, rather a dirtbike with a big tank...

For the benefit of anyone considering the new Yamaha, if I might counter some of your (perceived) critisisms of the Tenere, with some experiance of the machine myself:

The EFi on the Tenere is both simple and ultra reliable - it too will always run (and better than the carbed KTM ahem x)

The Tenere will also go where the rider is able - Slick Rock in Moab, Desert in Nevada/Arizona and New Mexico, the high passes in Colorado (yep, snow) - and the KTM would certainly suffer at 14,000+ ft... it also made a pretty good fist of the Rubicon:



What is it about the bars?! They are a nice pair of aluminium braced jobbies (not Renthal, but not bad) - my bike has been down loads of times, and they are more than strong enough.

As for not being 'RTW ready' out of the crate? - mine bike is standard except for a pair of (yes, KTM) handgaurds - so that's 36 quid you'd have to spend... the reast is more than up to the task, believe me x

There are no documented flaws for the Tenere, as it doesn't seem to have any... ahem.

Nothing cheap about the Tenere either - and has quality parts where it matters (hell, it even has the same brakes as the KTM!)

The KTM tank is admittedly 4 litres bigger... you'll need that as it is more thirsty x

As for the downsides on the KTM, this is where the Tenere particularly shines in comparison:

Good fuel consumption (and no jetting problems of course).

Wiring failure?! what is that?!

Long service intervals (hell, they suggest you don't even need to change the oil filter for 12,000 miles!)

Tool kit is in a good place, however, the tool kit itself is the usual Japanese rubbish it must be said... (KTM isn't much more robust mind you - have you tried to undo a wheel nut with that spanner made of cheese?!)

As for comfort, some owners have complained about the seat - athough you can bet it is still more comfortable than the KTM perch!

I'd say you can quite easily take the new Tenere to those same 5% of places you mention, and have a whole lot less hassle on the other 95% too?

Don't get me wrong, I loved the look/concept of the old 640A, but that is what it is now - old. Of course should KTM ever produce an Adventure version of their 690 Enduro, then the tables may turn once again - but for now, it really is the Tenere that should be at the top of anyone's list...

xxx

Hello,
Dick's got that bike of his on ebay again, and its a really tempting offer.

My decision process has swayed to the XT660Z (comprehensively) but this particular bike is very tempting, and leaves some cash reserve...

Interestingly if youre following this thread, I have been changing my thoughts towards watercooled bikes.
I guess its because I now that I'm looking for a primary bike not a second dedicated use only bike I need something more all round capable.

XT660Z or the XTZ750 with the TDM 850 engine with £1000 spare cash. hmmmm

Cheers G

After following this thread for a couple of months now I have finally made the move from BMW to Tenere. Picked up the new bike last Saturday after finding a lcal dealer with an '08 black model sill unregistered, a real stroke of luck that, after much bartering (ney fighting!!), only cost me a piddling £4.4k. I haven't been able to get off the thing in the past 3 days... so much fun... nimble ...responsive and truly built for purpose
I got rid of the BMGS1200 privately to a mate who couldn't believe why I was changing but I'm sure he will catch on eventually

Thanks to all concerned for your unbridled and honest input... it worked for me!

Apologies for a bit of a thread hijack so I will be brief - G, I have an XTZ750 with a TDM 850 engine fitted and Wr450f forks fitted. You are right, it is a gorgeous engine, big booming 270 degree crank, feels like a big single, lovely strong forks, it's all good. I not going to pretend that it is a Dakar bike or anything but it is not far removed. The frame has been beefed up, it's got Excel rims, MichelinDeserts, IMO etc etc and I love it to bits

There is a company in Luton that specializes in the build of these thing. Yamaha seem to develop bikes with lots of common parts and it is amazing that the forks and engine slot virtually straight in

Hijack over but it is about Teneres, albeit Super Super Teneres

No hijack - sounds awesome! - what we need is a picture though Dick?!

xxx

Oakey dokey here goes







I think I've posted about it on here before so apologies if anyone is bored with it. I've owned it for the last 15 years and it has just had a frame up, nut and bolts rebuild.

Appologies for the profanity, but Dick, "sweet mother of god that bike is what I am talking about!"
This is... this is Exactly what I had in my head.

JMo. I dont like to think of my words as scathing, but rather as those of a person who had expectations somewhat shattered by reality and the propaganda of idiot journalists who clearly are ****** illiterate ****s perhaps my words were blunt and to an extent percieved as uncomplimentary. but not scathing, rather brutally honest.

Yes I take on board exactly what you say and I agree with almost all of your defence... and counter attack. After all I am actually an ardent XT Tenere fan - God knows I'd have to be, to ressurect and run a 21 year old bike!

Regretfully one must choose some bikes with ones mind and wallet and others with ones heart. This bike lands squarely in both camps, either a practical purchase, or for its drop dead tug your heart strings gorgeousness. Bravo Yamaha for doing that marketing act of geniousness.

We all know that I had intended to buy the bike and I do think it is gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous, but thoes pipes are ludicrous, too much design there for no benefit and has to have sacrificed componentry elsewhere (the brake levers, bash plate) But this is part of what attracted me to the package, I had imagined them to be Titanium, not plastic. I cant believe those were plastic too!

Sorry with regard to the bash plates, I disagree: Race teams can afford to replace plastic sump guards every race or once one has done its job in a race. But honestly this is not suitable for a non race-bike (its an adventure bike like the original tenere...) All the launch photographs show the ali plate, hence my disappointment (I wrote the pracy immediately after seeing the bike, fresh wounds)

Those pesky journalists really need to open their eyes, look at the ****ing bike before just running out the normal diatribe from the specs sheet. ****ers

To clarify the New XT660 Tenere IS better in every way than the old XT600 Tenere (other than insurance and generally financially) Its not alot better, and certainly not the cash I had in my pocket better.
Anyone looking to buy this type of bike coming from anything other than the same type of bike is going to be really really happy, because you do get alot for your money.

Plastic: hmm sorry for my whining, but there isnt any on the old bike. I do get it honest I really I do, but if you're in the desert in Namibia/Morocco/Chalbi/Gobi/You name it, anywhere in the middle of nowhere... surely the idea is that the bike is durable and I dont want to be carrying spare plastics. because when the plastic breaks and you dont have one to replace the same thing, the next fall will hit the same previously protected are...
Perhaps it is a good thing. - I shall relinquish my dislike of many of the plastic bumpers (but not the rear handles or the ones between tank and screen)
I thought (personal opinion) that the watertank would be very easy to get holed and I see that as a vulnerable point. Lay it "gently" on the right side amongst some rocks you are riding through as you bail over the handle bars looking for something soft, and sure as eggs its a question of time before everything goes pete tong. This is not an issue with the old bike and by the looks of it not the XT660r (but I diddnt check). But I want to see this tank relocated elsewhere.

Please forgive my facetious coments regarding the tow hook. That was well and truly put to bed by JMo, this is not that bike, and yes it makes a great anchoring hook.
However the tank should be bigger for the Tenere, I doubt it would do 300 miles through rougher terrain, where it is needed and defining the bikes original purpose.

Yes many after market accessories available, I was merely illustrating the necessary costs for a traveller looking for a purpose built bike and some "necessary" accessory costs.

The Old XT 600 has only one significant advantage over the new bike: In Africa where Carnets are needed to cross borders, and you are likely to trash the bike a bit more than most places, it is a significantly better bike, as it costs far far less. (This is thinking with your mind and wallet)

As to the competition, I feel that its a tribute to Yamaha that one of the chief competitors is its aging predecessor.
Then theres that KTM, a BMW 800 & 2x650's, a brace of Honda's with their own elderly competitor, in that gem the Africa Twin. Not forgetting that wonderful Suzuki 400 (its elderly 350) and their magical Vstrom.

All things considered, truth be told the XT660 Tenere rules supreme for anyone considering a brand new long distance bike in the light Adventure travel market. (Q4-2008)


Cheers G

They were some insightful comments, Photographisafari. I first admit that I am biased as I have a new Tenere, my first ever non-BMW bike, yet I have the most fun compared to all the bikes I've had. I think most of your criticism on the new Tenere is its cheap parts aka plastic bits. Like it or not, most bikes these days go cheap even BMWs. Why? Commodity prices are rocket high still, aluminum, steel, gasoline, you name it. You can blame the chinese for it, but the reality is that bike manufacturers have to maintain that profit margin. When the cost of the parts are escalating, they have to find 'cheaper' alternatives.

Another observation is that you, like all of us bikers, are a perfectionist or taking a perfectionistic view on the new Tenere. As far as I know, most of us bikers spend an awful lots of time identifying the flaws of their bikes, researching the aftermarket options, and blogging to get opinions from other fellow bikers. I would imagine that the owners of those other comparables you mention, even the older ones, would always manage to find ways to improve the bikes to their respective perfections. That's part of the fun of motorbiking when we are not riding. I once had a perfect BMW touring bike, so perfect, unlike other BMWs, that there were only a few small parts available in after markets. So there was nothing to upgrade to, nada. It was not nearly as much fun as the Tenere.

Still I am curious, while you are certainly extremely knowledgeable about and have a pair of critical eyes on any new bikes, then why did you bring the 5G to the shop and were ready to buy? May be you were on the fence? May be you thought bringing the cash would force upon a decision? May be you are now relieved that the bike wasn't available? May be the other way around?

Yep i kind of see what you mean about the "farkling".
I had it in my head that I would get one now and sell the r1150rt, as it would be fine for touring, and do the Overland bit too. But I guess I thought it was considerably better than my old XT600 tenere. its not, its just a bit better all round.
You know when you go through that phase of thinking "Hmm I'd really LIKE a new bike" and I was really there in my heart. But I realised that i would still need to do alot more work to get it to a level where my old bike is now and spend much more money.

I had never seen one in the flesh either so I guess I was shoicked when I came into contact with something that wasnt like my old XT600 tenere. That was the point when i realised that this wasnt going to happen right there and then.

I have been watching the New Tenere's progression for a good while, but this needs more money to be spent on it, £1500 more to be spent to get it to what I wanted.
A) I dont have that right now
B) I cant see the point of spending £6500 to get a better bike that does exactly what my one does now but costs more
C) Walking out that TDM and the WR450 front end did jog my thoughts into what could be done with £3000 and some elbow grease!

So Why did I walk in with £5k? Cos I wanted to buy it, and Yes I dont like the Black, but I do like the Tenere, I guess it also struck me that I wanted to own a New Tenere, so that in 20 years time I would have two Teneres, one fourty years old and one 20 years old! This is one of the few Bikes that I would be prepared to buy new, because I would keep it for the duration.

G
I guess I figured if I was going to spend that kind of money then make it worthwhile.