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4 Jun 2015
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oxford UK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Touring Ted*
Carbs, gravity fed fuel and natural aspiration are BY FAR simpler, BY FAR, easier to diagnose and repair and BY FAR more easy to bodge, repair, adjust and any mechanic in the third world understands how it works.
Fuel injection bikes need fuel pumps and the electronics to run fuel pumps. They have servo controlled motors to let the bike idle. They need lambda sensors in their exhausts, MAF sensors in their airbox.
These are not things that can be bodged.
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Just out of interest are there any stories of bodging up F.I. systems to keep going on a trip out there? Anyone actually had to bypass sensors, lash up a (F.I.) fuel pump, fix a high pressure hose with chewing gum or a spare brake hose or anything like that? If so, how well did you understand F.I. technology beforehand?
Many people have been talking about how the simplicity of carbs are their strength, how it's easy to work out what the problem is, strip them down at the side of the road etc but that presupposes quite a bit of knowledge about how carbs work, the function of the various jets, needles etc and how the symptoms you're suffering from connects to some process inside the carb. I've ground to a halt with carb issues quite a few times over the years and spent many a happy hour cleaning out jets in campsites. If nothing else it passed the time until I eventually worked out it was an ignition problem
Not so with F.I. though. I don't really understand the system well enough to delve into it with any degree of confidence. Sure, I can point out all the bits and draw a diagram of how it all works but deep down knowledge is lacking. I don't know much about how various failure modes manifest themselves so when it stops (only had that happen once - in a car) I'm in the hands of the "professionals". For the most part I'm dependant on the robustness of the engineering and hoping that whatever has gone wrong it's in a bit I do understand.
Many of the bikes that crop up in these hallowed pages have their well known weak points - AT fuel pumps, DRZs - a long list  etc and there's often an aftermarket fix for many of them but I don't ever recall reading about anyone dealing with F.I. issues or taking spare parts with them because "the coolant temperature sensor always goes at about 20k". If it does go what happens? Can I short out the wires with a paper clip to bypass it or should I use a resistor from my tent light.
Whenever a new technology is introduced it's quite often over engineered to start with to gain public confidence but then the penny pinching starts. I know F.I. is not exactly new technology but it is in the context of the sort of bikes we're talking about here and I'm not certain the stresses and strains of overlanding will have been considered much by the manufacturers during the design process. On that basis we should perhaps expect to have to deal with more of these problems as time goes on.
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4 Jun 2015
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R.I.P.
Veteran HUBBer
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: california
Posts: 3,821
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backofbeyond
Just out of interest are there any stories of bodging up F.I. systems to keep going on a trip out there? Anyone actually had to bypass sensors, lash up a (F.I.) fuel pump, fix a high pressure hose with chewing gum or a spare brake hose or anything like that? If so, how well did you understand F.I. technology beforehand?
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Excellent points! 
I've had a few issues that were dealt with ... not really bodging up a fix or anything technical ... and I knew very little about EFI beforehand ... just a few internet words of wisdom from bike forums.
One case my Vstrom (running rough, would barely start), I simply "re-set" ECU back to default setting .. this by simply disconnecting the battery. Worked for a while but problem returned. Dealer dealt with it.
Secondary butterfly controls were dirty, draggin ... or some such. (crap air filter on Vstrom)
Another time, broke plastic high pressure fuel hose connector while removing the tank  happened at home. BMW riding buddy had it happen on the road. Bike went home in a truck. I simply went to Suzuki dealer, bought a new hose ... fixed!
Also seen fuel pumps replaced on the road (lots of gas everywhere!) BMW riding friend went to dealer, $450 pump, all fixed. Turns out a pump from a Kia or Hyundai would have worked ... $100.
So no, no real experience bodging or using electronic trickery to by pass sensors or "fool' ECU. I've heard of BMW guys who carry a little magic box to access EFI/ECU computer. These boxes can: display and clear fault codes, re-program certain parameters. Very handy! Not sure how far you can go with such a device, but better than nothing I guess?
Quote:
Originally Posted by backofbeyond
Many people have been talking about how the simplicity of carbs are their strength, how it's easy to work out what the problem is, strip them down at the side of the road etc but that presupposes quite a bit of knowledge about how carbs work
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I think the more important point is that, when "on the road" one is more likely to find a common mechanic who can deal with a carb. EFI? perhaps ... but for sure carbs are well known system.
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