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Poll: HPE chains - a winner?
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HPE chains - a winner?

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  #1  
Old 5 Oct 2020
Grant Johnson's Avatar
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The end of chain lubing?

From a Regina Chain (Italy) press Release
(and BMW also announced the chain will be used on new BMW's - see below)

"Regina presents the innovative and revolutionary Z-Ring chain High Performance Endurance (HPE) which eliminates the periodic re-lubrication that motorcycle riders must perform every 1,000 km. Extensive lab and street testing demonstrate that the HPE chain has a useful life that is at least equivalent, if not greater, than a traditional regularly re-lubricated Z-Ring chain. The hydrogen-free Tetrahedral Amorphous Carbon (ta-C) coating, currently considered as the most advanced among DLC (Diamond Like Carbon) coatings, is applied on the surface of the bushings and rollers of the HPE chain. The ta-C coating reduces energy dissipation and increases efficiency in the secondary transmission, combining the very high hardness of the coated surface with a low coefficient of friction. The elimination of chain cleaning and lubricant spatter during operation minimizes environmental impact. The innovative ta-C coating process was developed through intense R&D activity of Regina engineers and is entirely carried out in our Cernusco Lombardone (LC) plant in Italy."


“The elimination of the periodic re-lubrication and the greater efficiency of the transmission raise the HPE chain to an extremely advanced technological level compared to traditional sealed chains, unthinkable until today and unparalleled on the market;” said Paolo Garbagnati, CEO of Regina. “We would like to thank all the women and the men who made the achievement of this important goal possible, including all the passionate riders, who, confidentially and professionally, contributed to the project with many extensive test rides.”
"HPE chain transmission does not need coated front and rear sprockets. The HPE chain will be available on the aftermarket starting January 2021"


From BMW:

"Lubricating your chain was yesterday. Maintenance-free like the shaft drive for the first time.

Munich. For more than 90 years, the maintenance-free, environmentally friendly and comfortable shaft drive has been one of BMW Motorrad's immovable technical cornerstones. With the M Endurance chain, BMW Motorrad now offers a maintenance-free chain with comparable characteristics for the first time.

Like previous X-ring chains, the M Endurance chain has a resident permanent lubricant filling between the rollers and pins, enclosed by X-rings. What is completely new, however, is that the previously necessary additional lubricant addition for the rollers and thus the familiar "chain lubrication" is no longer necessary, nor is any re-tensioning required from time to time due to the usual wear.

This enormous gain in comfort was made possible by using a new coating material for the rollers: tetrahedrally amorphous carbon (ta-C), also known as industrial diamond. This coating is characterized by extreme hardness and resistance and in this respect it is placed between the well-known DLC coating (Diamond Like Carbon) and pure diamond. In contrast to the metal surfaces used so far, the coating with the ta-C industrial diamond does not wear off. At the same time, this type of coating also offers a drastically reduced friction coefficient.

Thanks to excellent dry lubrication properties and the elimination of wear, the tetrahedral amorphous carbon coated rollers of the M Endurance chain offer maintenance comfort equivalent to that of a shaft drive motorcycle. This includes all the cleaning work that is unavoidable with a conventional chain due to splashed lubricant. Accordingly, the M Endurance chain also offers maximum environmental friendliness.

The M Endurance chain in 525 pitch is now available initially for the two 4-cylinder models BMW S 1000 RR and S 1000 XR. The M Endurance chain is available as accessory or directly from the factory as an option. Further BMW Motorrad models are being prepared for this feature."

--------------------

So, what do you think? What about the lack of lube where the rollers hit the sprockets - conventional wisdom is that oil there reduces shock and therefor wear? Will this be harder on sprockets? Should you lube a little anyway? Is this the end of shaft drives?
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  #2  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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If these chains prove to be as good as Regina claim it can only be a step foreward, I wonder if they have worked with coated sprockets as well and whether that improve life expectancy and efficiency even more.
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  #3  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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I'm content to wait and see. For one thing, I seldom lubricate my chains anymore--I clean them crudely (WD40), then let them suffer. They still last a long time. For another, the new chain reportedly costs US$300+. That's going to buy me a lot of DID x-ring chains, with change leftover for a sixpack of WD40.

If I find one under the Christmas tree, I'll install it.

Mark
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  #4  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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Depends on how much it costs - but I can certainly see it being used on new bikes from the factory. "Come back to the dealer and replace with an OEM chain that does not require lubrication, unlike all those third-party chains!" Of course, eventually this will be cheap and available in the aftermarket everywhere.

Natural progression of engineering and materials science. Wonderful.

I don't think it will quite replace shaft drives, because it's still not completely maintenance-free - you still have to check and adjust tension, which is a much more scary process for non-technical bike owners than squirting some spray on the chain...
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  #5  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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Looks interesting as an advance and the marketing certainly ramps up the expectation to, well, as fever pitchy as bike chain marketing gets - I've seen it in a few other places as well. If it works (or works better than the current offerings) then great but I remain to be convinced it'll do what the advertising claims - no lubing. Maybe under certain limited circumstances - summer sun sports bike doing limited mileage to and from Starbucks and traded in every couple of years - for example but I await the judgement of the first person to use it RTW.

Having said that there's no doubt bike chain tech has improved over the decades. The stuff around when I first started was terrible - we wore out a chain in a bit over 4k touring miles - on a 250 - despite daily oiling. Every second article in the magazines was about chain care - anyone remember 'Linklyfe' (a kind of grease bath where you took your chain off and boiled it up in the stuff). Thankfully O rings and X rings and the other upgrades have got rid of all that mess. If Z rings move it on again then I'm all for that but I guess it's going to be 'premium product, premium price' for a while until the hype dies down.
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  #6  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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Mechanical minutiae to keep the forums buzzing over the winter and sell a few unnecessary parts to the early adopters.

I'm with Mark, current chains need a wipe down once in a while and get replaced every few tyres, just a known running cost. A simple payback calculation to me, if it costs twice as much but lasts three times longer OK, but then will I just be handing over what I spent to the next owner as I rarely keep a bike more that 30000 miles. If it has to be dealer fitted that's against it.

The faffers with their Scot oil, cans of teflon spray, lazers, plumb bob monkey things and bowstring tight chains will still faff. What your mother told you will still apply, keeping playing with it and it'll fall off.

Andy
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  #7  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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I'm another who will be happy to let others try it out before I put my own money there. Modern X-ring chains are pretty damn good and don't require copious amounts of lube.... for the money I can live with doing a spray once a week, and if it helps sprocket life that's a plus.
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  #8  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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Quote:
"plumb bob monkey things"

TWB: what is that? do I need one? how often do I have to replace it
You don't have one? I'm amazed your bike runs. Wouldn't be without mine
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  #9  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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Quote:
"plumb bob monkey things"

TWB: what is that? do I need one? how often do I have to replace it


https://youtu.be/3COrt4XMbfU

The 20 quid alternative to using your thumb (or just waiting until the throttle only results in a hammering noise and not much go)

Andy
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  #10  
Old 5 Oct 2020
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The idea is flawed ! no lubrication on front or rear sprocket. recently sold crf1000 with 33,000 miles and only adjusted chain once . I used a small tube and let this drip on to front sprocket . This works even better on a small 250 as it keeps it well oiled !!
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  #11  
Old 6 Oct 2020
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Weren't belt drives supposed to address this issue?

I'll have to ponder before casting a vote, but it does seem likely that sprocket wear will continue to be a problem, meaning the same coating on those too for this to be worthwhile.

I'd also add that being a scottoil faffer has always addressed the lubing issue for me, whilst also protecting the sprockets. They do make chain adjustment almost redundant.

I think the only area this will have a discernible difference (if you're a consistent rider) is fuel consumption, assuming their claims of lower friction are true, but even then the savings will be cents per fill-up if I have to guess.

I like innovation so, in this respect, I'm not against the idea, but I am very aware of the line where marketing gets hyperbolic in its claims. And blanket statements like "chain lube is dead" makes me raise an eyebrow or three....


Overall, I think that, whilst the chain's qualities are no doubt based in fact, the main selling point is peace of mind for the owner. A sense that they need not bother with the chain anymore and the dealership technicians can worry about tension and sprockets at the 4000km services.
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Last edited by Warthog; 6 Oct 2020 at 09:38.
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  #12  
Old 6 Oct 2020
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A lifetime chain?

You bet! If it works and it's not grossly overpriced, I'll use one and happily so.

I'm keep an eye on this.

Now, another 10,000 miles on a good rear tire? I'd like to see that too.

..................shu
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  #13  
Old 7 Oct 2020
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Will it rust/corrode?
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  #14  
Old 8 Oct 2020
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If I put such a chain on my bike, on long trips I will bring some snake oil, just in case.....
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  #15  
Old 14 Oct 2020
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I'm familiar with DLC. (Diamond like coating).

BMW put it on the cams of their S1000R series bikes. They can make the cams much lighter that way.

The coating fails all the time and destroys the top-ends.

So that's the DLC on Cam shafts in their top of the range sports bikes. Using the best factory processes.

I can't see the DLC on a chain being applied so well or of the same quality.

The marketing blurb looks like the same that you see on Diamond tipped Drill bits. Those that promise so much for £10 and they're all blunt within 30 seconds.
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