The truth is there is no 'right' or 'wrong' bike. The very fact that there can be so much discussion about what to get means that it is all 6 of one and half a dozen of teh other.

The trick is to get a bike that with which you are happy. It ought to be comfy and have a high chance of surviving the journey. If you like teh bike and find that it does what you want and expect then the likely hood is you will both get along fine.

Even seemingly unimportant things can make a tremendous difference to your riding experience.
an inch or so seat height for instance. My own bike a bmw, has never let me down and is a slab crusher par excellence..But I do not like it. and will change it next year (hopefully), Changing the front tyre from and Avon to a metzler made a huge difference and has (for me) improved teh handling and steering no end. Some one else might prefer it the other way round.

I think you need to have a reasonable range, and that is better done with fuel economy than by using a big tank. Cheaper and less weight.

I agree, entering some little third world village on a bike that looks like it just warped in from tatooine will get you a different reception than chugging in on something that technologically looks slighly familiar. My own opinion is the more technologically advanced the equipment the smaller the spanner needed to bugger up the works.

Others may argue differently based on their own experiences. In the end you pays your money and takes your chance. The best thing to do in my opinion is set up an account with a good worldwide shipper of parts for your bike.. and hope you wont need him.

Its all what you experience, seeing people walk for miles and miles from Mexico I cant help thinking where are they going and why I bet when they see me pass they ask. Why is a rich gringo spending all that time and money riding down here hot and sweaty sleeping in tent he can get a house here for far less and gust take a bus.

The long way down had people pay for the trip and all the gear plus paid the every one. You like the Idea of advertising for people and paying $40,000 to do it or getting 2 million to do the same thing.

As far packing all that gear I see people pack way to much most of time, I do and I take less than most. The beast kit depends on what you think is best are touratech panniers the best? I dont think so and I got a set.

I have had the same feelings Im going places where there are vary poor people that are getting on gust fine, all there belongs dont amount to price of gear I got in my tank bag. Bit of a let down deflates the ego. Why do I need all this when they do not.

As far a GS Vs any thing else I rather have a old r80 than a new r1200. BMW knows there target market well off people that like shinny funny looking bikes in the show room. Seen people ride 150cc bikes a lot ferther on a trip than I have ever gone. Can not see not riding some enduro but more than few have.

We get in the head we need this bit and that kit with this bike we dont but it feels right when we do. Im putting off a trip because I dont have my panniers mounted to the racks before that It was I dint have racks. I dont need any of that I can strap a duffel bag to the back and ride all a around the Americas did the USA with one. People less skill and experiance and money have done it. Fear, maybe loss of a ok paying job selling all I have to fund and free my self has more to with than I like to let my self know.

If anyone HAS to have a 1200GS and a BMW clown suit to go with it ,because they THINK that is what they need to tour the world ,then I would feel very sorry for that individual .
Pick any bike you like , someone, somewhere will have ridden one for a long distance .
Are there more GSs touring the world than any other type ? I seriously doubt it .
Are other bikes more moderate than the GS ? What does that mean ? How does a 990 KTM or a VStrom rate ?Or an R1 ?
Reliability is the most important factor in choosing a bike , your ability to get yourself going again when it , inevitably , fails is another factor .
You don't need the latest technology .

You will encounter poorer folks than you , the world is not fair , there's not much you can do about it .Maybe give away your expensive Touratwat panniers and have some made by a local craftsman - help THEIR local economy .Give the old woman a ride on the back of your bike , save her legs a bit -eh !

Who decides what is the best gear ? Do you judge by price ? Is the most expensive the best ? How much of it do you really NEED ?

You could probably buy a used 250 and tour three continents for the price of a new 1200GS.
But maybe maintaining an image is important to you ,so an expensive big bike is essential ?
These are just questions that spring to my mind and not a personal dig at you .

Myself ? I'd just chose a simple reliable bike that would cruise at the speeds I like to travel , buy my gear to suit my purpose for the cheapest I could find it and not worry about what others think I should have . But I kind of like going against the norm , it's more fun that way.

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Blessed are the cracked, for they let in the light. - Spike Milligan
"When you come to a fork in the road ,take it ! When you come to a spoon in the road ,take that also ."

I ride a 650, but most of my touring has been on a old '72 Honda XL250... a beast!

But for my last trip in SA, I chose a bike that were a very common in the areas we were traveling. I don't want to be so far removed from the people that I can't really interact with them. And the best part: I took next to nothing in spare parts because every town had what I might need!

Yes, I took a $100 GPS because I was traveling roads (and trails) that were not on the maps, but that was it for the high-techness. 43 days, 3 countries, all costs (including the bike): $3,000. At that rate I could have done RTW for the price of one BMW!

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http://www.aroundtheblockmotoadventures.com/
'We build the bike (in Peru) for your Epic Ride of South America.'

If I have grasped the catalyst for this thread correctly, the question you are asking is not whether or not you should take the best gear, but what should be the motivation for doing it. If its to throw yourself into all that the world has to offer and do so in the most comfortable and the least stress-free way then spend the money and take all the high spec gear that makes it possible. And there is nothing wrong with that, whether or not another overlander may have a negative opinion of your choices.

Just like the LWR guys. They wanted to do something, and wanted to do it in a way that they were probably more accustomed to. Aside from the money they may have made from doing it, I like to think that the idea did originally start as an adventure between two friends. The important thing, is the fact that they got off their arse and did something. One hopes that even with all their backup and gear, they have a better understanding of the countries and the people they came across than those people that sit at home on their arses and judge.

The key is to choose your motivation and accept the pros and the cons that go hand in hand. On one flip of the coin, if you take all the gear and accept the fact that you are going to come across countries, cities, communities, individuals that dont have a 100th of the gear/clothes/food you are using or carrying. On the other side, take the basics and accept there may be difficulties to overcome along the way....

I personally would go for the latter.....I mean we may hate the "difficulties" when they are upon us, but if it wasnt for the fact, say that you didnt have the right sized socket, and you have to walk a couple of miles to a village and find something or someone to help, you wouldnt have half the experiences. Or indeed (and I not advocating not taking GPS!), the simple things of asking for directions (which can always be fun and totally unproductive in a country where English is not widely spoken), or getting a local to try and understand a map that is foreign to them.

I think you have to be careful not to travel round the world on your motobike, in a bubble, unless of course thats what pickles your onion. Its like some people prefer to do package tours and some people prefer to just get the flight. I am of the opinon that the more things you posess that can solve your problems for you, the more likely you are to remain detached from the country or the people. Of course you need to take essentials, but what is essential to one person is not to another.

I have no idea if I am the right tracks here, but maybe something in my post makes sense?!

Char

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Don't be scared your life may end,
Be scared that it may never begin.......

You will encounter poorer folks than you , the world is not fair , there's not much you can do about it .Maybe give away your expensive Touratwat panniers and have some made by a local craftsman - help THEIR local economy .Give the old woman a ride on the back of your bike , save her legs a bit -eh!

'Touratwat panniers'..? Is that your view of the people that buy them or the people that sell them? maybe you have similar ideas on BMW...... 'Big Macho Wanker' or XTe..... 'Xtra Tight Everywhere'...? We have different ideas for a lot of things especially when it comes to spending money but if somebody wants to buy the best they can afford or think they need, then go for it. they'll learn through good and bad advice and experiences. Why don't you stand outside the Ferrari garage, approach the customers and offer them a ford instead? Buying good quality kit doesn't have to be expensive but it does have to be good quality and if that means 'Touratwat' then so be it.
Your perfectly correct in saying the world isn't fair, it isn't and I've seen enough of it to agree with you but surely travelling around it on ANY kind of bike is still contributing to the nation your in? (Unless your flying your food/fuel in by plane). I'm going off topic a bit here I know but it is annoying when the trip of a lifetime for people gets mixed up with an enviromental awareness routine. Am I selfish in thinking I'm not here to save the world but to see it from the ground up whether I've spent 2 or 20 grand on the costs?

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Geoffshing

'Security is a product of one's own imagination, it does not exist in nature as a rule, life is either a daring adventure or nothing.'

Whoops touched a raw nerve here -eh ?

A lot of the Touratwat stuff is vastly overpriced and marginally useful [ not all mind you ] , but if it "floats your boat" , more power to you .
My main point was to NOT be a lemming or a techno snob with your equipment purchases and ,if your conscience bothers you ,to make MORE use of the goods and services available in the countries you visit .

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Blessed are the cracked, for they let in the light. - Spike Milligan
"When you come to a fork in the road ,take it ! When you come to a spoon in the road ,take that also ."

I think Charlotte Goose hit the nail on the head.

What you need on an overland RTW bike trip is a bike and some sort of luggage arangement, hard or soft.

That is it. Which bike is up to you and there is no righ or wrong answer, just right or wrong for you...

If you intend to rough it a bit then you also need shelter, and a means of cooking.
If you want to be able to fix your bike by the side of the road you need some basic decent tools.
Then, you should probably get a spare pair of underwear, in case you eat out, or need to soak up an oil spill.

After that, take what you want, that you tihnk will make the trip more fun, less hassle or both. I agree that it is better to travel light if you can, but light is subjective.

What ever you buy, get cheap, get expensive; does not matter, as long as you are happy with the price and its good kit as you will rely on it. If you don't, it's not worth taking...

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Adventure: it's an experience, not a style!
(so ride what you like, but ride it somewhere new!)

all you need is a moto,
half the balls you'll think you'll need
and a sense of humour

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Good to hear other opinions, and glad we've managed to maintain some glimmer of light-heartedness!

Oldbmw, I see your point with bike choice. What I should have mentioned is that I'm well into the bike preparation phase, and unlikely to change my bike now.
In case it makes any difference, it's an 03 XR650L. Which I hope covers all the suggested criteria you mentioned.. Apart from the seat height thing, but I'm freakishly tall :-)

DLbiten I like the possibly revealing last comment you made, and certainly I'm not about to shell out on top of the range panniers.
I'm extremely fortunate in having access to the materials and equipment I need, to make (probably terrible and more expensive) panniers for myself. Dull and self indulgent post on this subject to follow when I've finished!

Dodger your post made me grin. I'd like to go completely off topic and drone on about another of my insecurities; what the effect of (any kind) of travelling actually has on a host country, but I'll restrain myself.
I like your ethos on travel bike selection, and while I don't question the truth in your words, there seem to be more people that follow this policy on paper than actually travel on this kind of bike. ?

charapashanperu, I think you've described the kind of travel attitude that many daydream about, and I've got a lot of respect for you, for having the spirit to do it in this way.

Charlotte Goose, see you in the pub tomorrow. You owe me a pint.

AliBaba you know what I mean about the flash gear, but I see your point.

Andy, I can see what you're saying about the quality kit, but I'm slowly realising that the getting lost etc is what I'm interested in. The highlight of my last trip in Cambodia was changing a tyre, on the side of the road, with two spanners and 30+ onlookers.
The idea of getting back without any difficulties or breakdowns (unlikely as it is) scares me more than not going at all.
Like everyone's said, it is personal perspective.

Henryuk, I whole-heartedly agree with the dressing down, that's got to be a winner.

Geoff, what kind of panniers do you have? And how would you rate these panniers in terms of cost/durability?

Teflon I don't think this theory is water-tight. Surely the frequency with which you use something relates loosely in some way to its expected lifetime?
If a Chinese Kymco bike's good enough to ride to the shops and back, is it equally suitable for a multi continent journey?

MotoEdde, I agree with you absolutely. But surely there's some greater effect that you impart by going about your adventure in a hobo manor, as opposed to a space trooper?
Maybe I'm missing the point entirely, and your individual nature determines the kit you'll use, and to alter the actual equipment this doesn't change you any more than it would to buy your groceries from Fortman and Mason, rather than lidl!?



Thank you for your thought everyone.
If anyone's still reading this drivel, please have a look at the camping weekend we're organising for August. Lets fight it out in the flesh, rather than hiding behind our tft screens

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...-weekend-35394

I think a great point about this thread was made, whatever bike and kit you have dress it down as much as you can, the less you stand out the better.

I took a nearly new bike to Africa but I got it good and muddy first and got chain lube all over the thing, I had gaffa tape on the tank and all sorts of shit to make it look less desirable.

Hey when you get home you can always tart it up again.

I fully agree with this Dodger Dude!
Keep It Simple.
If you have a 1200 BMW and lets say, an electronic part or controller fails in Africa, you are as they say..... screwed!
If on the other hand you have an older model bike, with carbs, points, atc, if it goes wrong, the chances are you can find SOMETHING to fit it. ( I used a set of points and a condenser off a Skoda to make my BMW R80 run again when the Points spring broke....... Ok i needed to file it a bit here and there, make it fit, it didnt run very well, but it RAN. it lasted 3000 miles untill I got to a place where I could get BMW parts sent to me from Motobins....)

But the choice is yours.

All I can say is BE AN INDIVIDUAL.... who cares what you ride, or where, or how far? just ride!

Hi all, excellent thread and thanks as always to the Originals for setting up HU. I normally TRY to accept others' opinions but....Metal Mule panniers are FAR superior to the touratech ones. There is no question. They have been seen to act as crash bars in crashes and slides down the road at high speeds. I feel if anyone thinks otherwise they've not yet seen the M. Mules. Also for me to travel round the world I'd want to try and make it a journey. Take the most suitable bike for learning as you go/ meeting people and really travelling. That means slowly. Seriously it's the Honda C90. Reliable, small enough to carry, spares everywhere, simple and totally adequate if seeing and experiencing the journey is the aim. Finally I think the idea is to take what would be no loss if lost, wrecked or stolen. If the cheap as chips C90 expires take a bus or whatever till you find another cheapo. Meet the locals. I'm no different from the others in zooming past too fast but I try to remember that for me the reason for travelling is the actual travelling! Fair enough to others but Celtic and I seem to see it similarly. Whatever, enjoy your trips, Linzi.

Honda C90s are lovely bikes, but if you dont have one you can always travel slower on your bigger bike, by relaxed throttle control. Argos tents are just fine too. No need for a mountain quality tent if you are camping by the road. And if once or twice your cheap tent is used in stormy conditions, well that's no reason to spend a fortune on a mountain tent.

There is a tendency around to buy the most expensive kit, as if that guaranteed quality. I notice how many bust a gut to buy hideously overpriced boxes - Jeez, theyre only boxes!

Charlotte or Warthog were right - that African village woman doesnt know or care what bike you ride - but you're white and therefore rich. But none of us can substitute for any country's nonexistent social security system or negate the effects of rampant, unrestrained capitalism. To think otherwise is naive and sentimental.

However none of the above should stop us travelling on the bike.

Or on the other hand it could be rampant unrestrained Marxist-Leninist ideology or rampant unrestrained absolute monarchy . Or the people running the countries could merely be rampant unrestrained crooks . You can't blame capitalism for all the worlds's woes .

But anyway the average traveller can't do much about it except to observe and learn.
Hopefully their travel will have a more profound effect upon them and their way of thinking rather than just ticking off the list of "bought the gear- been there -seen that- got drunk -got the tee shirt" ethos that seems to appeal to many .

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Blessed are the cracked, for they let in the light. - Spike Milligan
"When you come to a fork in the road ,take it ! When you come to a spoon in the road ,take that also ."