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South America Topics specific to South America only.
Photo by Marc Gibaud, Clouds on Tres Cerros and Mount Fitzroy, Argentinian Patagonia

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Photo by Marc Gibaud,
Clouds on Tres Cerros and
Mount Fitzroy, Argentinian Patagonia



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  #1  
Old 20 May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laser Jock View Post
Well spoken.

This is precisely my reasoning even though I consider the right to weaponry to be even more fundamental than the right to free speech.

Pepper spray while it has its limitations is a very reasonable compromise.

Pepper Spray can confer a substantial advantage even in the case of multiple adversaries or blunt or edged weapons. (carry a big can and be ready to spray and run)

Fox Labs makes the best hottest stuff available.
I think this is another wind up, but in case it is a practical though:

Pepper spray (and Tazer before anyone else suggests the things) is an offensive weapon in most of the world. You go to prison for owning it, you go to prison for assault if you use it, you go to prison for murder if you spray someone who's body can't handle it and they die. You also have the same issue you'd have with a small gun; injured/sprayed/fried people scream for their mates, call the police and go get their own weapons to look for the bloke who did it and stands out like a sore thumb even if he has made it thirty miles down the road.

Without getting into political debate (we'd no doubt disagree) which is for another site, the practicalities say no to any weapon, especially anything that has no other purpose.

If people really are that insecure, maybe do a self defense course or take up boxing or something? The men with guns can't confiscate your hands or head at the first border post.

Andy
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  #2  
Old 21 May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
I think this is another wind up, but in case it is a practical though:

Pepper spray (and Tazer before anyone else suggests the things) is an offensive weapon in most of the world.
In much of Central and South America (which is the forum we are in) pepper spray is legal.

I´ve had a bottle lashed to my vest for the last 35,000 km without problems.
Also have met half of dozen other riders doing the same thing.

Frankly, I can´t even begin to wrap my head around a society so feminized as to consider pepper spray an offensive weapon.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
If people really are that insecure, maybe do a self defense course or take up boxing or something? The men with guns can't confiscate your hands or head at the first border post.

Andy
Psychobabble. The fact someone is armed gives you no insight into their mind.

I´ve done a good bit of Krav Maga and numerous oriental styles. I still prefer to have a can of pepper spray on hand to tip the scales in my favor.

In fact, many people who legally carry concealed weapons keep some pepper spray around so they have a less than lethal option on hand.

You can´t legally shoot an unarmed aggresive drunk but you can spray him.

This is actually viewed as a de-escalation of force in many States.
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  #3  
Old 22 May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laser Jock View Post
<SNIP>
Also have met half of dozen other riders doing the same thing.
Frankly, I can´t even begin to wrap my head around a society so feminized as to consider pepper spray an offensive weapon.

<SNIP>

Psychobabble. The fact someone is armed gives you no insight into their mind.
I´ve done a good bit of Krav Maga and numerous oriental styles. I still prefer to have a can of pepper spray on hand to tip the scales in my favor.
<SNIP>
This is actually viewed as a de-escalation of force in many States.
Feminized society? Are you kidding me? Pepper spray sitting on a shelf is innocent. Pepper spray sprayed into somebody's face is a weapon. Same logic applied to guns, and BitTorrent...its all how you choose to use.

Hell if you limit yourself to guns, pepper spray, etc. as your options to escape tense/hot situations; then you're equally guilty as those folks that think overland bikes must have a the GS suffix or knobby tires to make it around. You underestimate the cleverness of the human mind to the same extent you'll never understand the intention of someone brandishing a weapon: the possibilities are infiinite.

Bottom line: if you choose to carry a weapon you better be prepared to kill the person and deal with the consequences. Because if you don't, whatever may happen to you could be viewed as self defense/preservation
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Last edited by MotoEdde; 22 May 2008 at 16:06.
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  #4  
Old 22 May 2008
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Originally Posted by MotoEdde View Post
Hell if you limit yourself to guns, pepper spray, etc. as your options to escape tense/hot situations; then you're equally guilty as those folks that think overland bikes must have a the GS suffix or knobby tires to make it around.
Now you´re getting nasty. ;-)
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  #5  
Old 22 May 2008
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The best protection I regularly carry with me on the bike is probably a grin and a handshake. Easy to get out, disarming, weighs nothing and carries no legal liability. Has got me out of a lot of tricky situations and even turned what looked like trouble into a free meal a few times. Looking like shit probably helps too.
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  #6  
Old 22 May 2008
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Originally Posted by henryuk View Post
The best protection I regularly carry with me on the bike is probably a grin and a handshake. Easy to get out, disarming, weighs nothing and carries no legal liability. Has got me out of a lot of tricky situations and even turned what looked like trouble into a free meal a few times. Looking like shit probably helps too.
I agree entirely and would add good situational awareness.

What´s your backup plan?
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  #7  
Old 22 May 2008
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bike lock and a tyre iron
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  #8  
Old 23 May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laser Jock View Post
I agree entirely and would add good situational awareness.

What´s your backup plan?
Plan A: Smile and Handshake
Plan B: Negotiate
Plan C: Give up something really minor (Cigar/swig of Jamesons/bung money)
Plan D: Run like B*****y.
Plan E: Give up something that's worth more than the alternative (cash/bike)
Plan Z: Tyre Iron/D Lock/boot in their bits followed by plan D

With the exception of knowing not to carry certain items at certain borders (Cuban cigars US, Jamesons Saudi, Moroccan snuff UK etc.) you can't actually get into trouble of your own making with any of the above.

Andy
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