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Photo by Josephine Flohr, Elephant at Camp, Namibia

I haven't been everywhere...
but it's on my list!


Photo by Josephine Flohr,
Elephant at Camp, Namibia



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  #1  
Old 17 Jan 2018
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poder in ushuaia-need some help!

Someone here Bought or sold klr with usa plates in ushuaia?

Me and a seller are straggleing to understand if Letter of notary (poder) and going to colejio de escribro will be enough for me to cross borders and sell the bike Afterwards?
And for him to get out of argentina?

I heard stories that its ok but we want to make sure with someone who did it lately
Thnks
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  #2  
Old 17 Jan 2018
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Done it three times, but in all cases the poder was just to be able to drive it out of the country with the previous owners papers and insurance so we could swap to the new plates and documentation and insurance policy but it is rarely possible to be able to change legal ownership and title and registration and plates when out of the home country UK allows it, State of Montana and a few others in the US do, plus a couple of states in Australia.

The poder we used is at https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bz...1F1bUQyWDdNTTQ similar poder used twice in Argentina with a different one used in the Chile sale

There are a heap of people driving around with poders on vehicles with expired registrations, fake license plates and photoshopped documentation and most of them get away with it. Some don't.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kX...AsH0KJ8S_lRSoU

In this particular case the "owner" - actually the borrower - had crossed the Chile-Argentina border several times without problems until an officer noticed that some of the documentation proved that the car had been bought and sold inside Argentina and that was illegal so they just confiscated the vehicle and some of the contents. Have emails relating to another case involving confiscation. That said, most get away with it unscathed.
As for selling it later, that will require finding someone even more risk-loving than yourself, but again, obviously many manage to do it.

Xfiltrate will no doubt be along to add his experience in the matter

The reason you won't find a 27-step How-to guide on this is that every situation is different and there are so many combinations of buyer seller and circumstances and ability to follow instructions - and of course the fact that except in very restricted circumstances it is illegal - that any general guide would be of little use.
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  #3  
Old 17 Jan 2018
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...

Quote:
Caveat Emptor - BUYER BEWARE
Worth repeating
Caveat Emptor - Buyer beware
Because there is a steady, but thankfully small stream of people getting into trouble with their new purchase, I'm going to play Devils Advocate and post this on every "For Sale" section on this and every other forum I can find.
Directed primarily at the Americas situation, I imagine it will also be applicable all over the world.
Be very aware that buying a foreign-registered car from a foreigner in any country and/or state other than that of original registration is potentially a very bad move unless you fully understand the situation and fully understand the risks.
Yes, lots of people do it and I know it can be done, but there are cases where people have been stopped at the border and other cases where people have had their vehicles confiscated for irregular ownership transfer even after several successful border crossings.
I published this check list on several forums so to be consistent, I publish it here as well – AND provide the answers (in Italics) as they apply to our F350 with BigFoot Camper. Feel free to double check and ask questions.
Things to watch for -
Expired registration. Registration on Montana-registered vehicles more than 10 years old can be “Permanent” on payment of a once-only fee. Applies to this vehicle so it never expires
Non-current roadworthy or smog certification. Montana has no annual inspections, roadworthy or smog inspections to become non-current.
Fake License plates. Absolutely genuine front AND rear plates AND they are glued in place to keep them that way.
License plates with year tags missing or incorrect. Tag on the rear plate is “Perm(anent)” and there is a spare if required
Fake documents. Title and Registration documents are genuine and as supplied by Montana authorities. Quality laminated copies are also provided to use as working copies at borders and roadside stops.
Supposed original Documents that have been laminated. Nope, just the copies. Originals are carefully stored in plastic sleeves and only handed over to authorised people on the rare occasions when they won't accept the laminated copies
Bill of sale drawn up 'legally" in the foreign country. Won't be necessary since all changes are done in Montana
Not possible to obtain legal ownership in your name back in the country of origin. Truck is owned by an Limited Liability Company and you get to own that company. Can all be done by email using our Montana agent. Cost of doing this is generally less than the sales tax and transfer costs imposed on vehicle sales by most other USA States and we can share the cost.
Your nationality different to the owners or the vehicle home country Irrelevant since any person can legally own (meaning be a Director of) a Montana LLC
Multiple blank PODERS offered or poder without all required stamps or your name missing No, because that is illegal but depending how we do the handover, one Poder may be required. You may also have to get a Notarised Document in which you as director of your company, give yourself permission to drive the vehicle. Silly, but that is the way it works.
Any vague excuses for discrepancies in paperwork or situation No discrepancies so no excuses required
Any seller that makes assurances such as "She'll be right" or "No worries" or I've checked it all out and …" Sorry, no 100% guarantees possible, but together we should be able to cover all bases.
Any vehicle without a valid Temporary Import Permit or equivalent document It will be valid on the agreed handover date and have time remaining to leave the country safely. Depending on the country it should have several months to a year of validity.
Any suggestion that valid Liability Insurance isn't available to cover you, the new driver. Liability Insurance IS required by nearly all countries and this is YOUR responsibility so we put you in touch with someone who can arrange it for all S American countries from Peru, Brazil and south. Other countries you can get it at the borders (eg Colombia) or online (eg Mexico)
Owner wanting full payment before it has crossed the first border We can negotiate this to suit both parties. Bond holder, and/or some down, some when picked up and some after a certain time or ???
Current owner not contactable. As long as that proverbial bus doesn't take me out, I'll either be there in person when you arrive or on the end of the phone or email..
Vehicle not in legal roadworthy condition To the best of our knowledge it will be – after all, Betty and I are fairly risk-adverse and we have just finished another three or four months driving it in several countries under all sorts of conditions.
Vehicle without all "extras" required in that country Yet to pay any bribes or tips and all the usual scam-target extras such as first aid kit, warning triangles, fire extinguisher, speed sign, reflective strips, hi-viz safety jackets, country of origin sticker are on board and it will be in that country under the authority of the Vienna Convention on Road Traffic, but it still sometimes comes down to how stubborn you can be vs the corrupt cop. Anti-corruption forms for most countries are on board. Read up on all the scam avoidance tips and tricks you can find and be prepared.
As I said, it can be done but as the title states - if it goes wrong, it is your problem. Best of luck trying to get Consumer Affairs involved. If you find any or these items apply to your planned purchase then make sure they can be answered and fixed before you hand over any significant amount of money. At the very least insist on retaining a substantial part of the purchase price until you get over the first border and into the next country with all paperwork and registrations in your name. Head must rule, not the heart. If the current owner is 100% genuine then he will be more than happy to share the risks. If not, then now is the time to walk away.
We have personally been through this process three times without problems and have sensible suggestions and advice to help your purchase go off without a hitch too – and I am happy to share the risk of following those suggestions and advice. However, if you have another method you know is a sure thing, then feel free, but since the outcome is then out of my control I will want all of my money before you get final possession.
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  #4  
Old 18 Jan 2018
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And in chile its the same story or we should do it there(punta arenas)
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  #5  
Old 21 Jan 2018
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There is a guy on the pan American Travelers Facebook group that gets cars registered in Washington state for foreign or even Americans who are not present. So , you agree to buy a US car in Argentina, you send the title signed over to you to the guy, he registers it in your name. Seller leaves Argentina, cancelling his TIP. You enter Chile with car in your name, different plates. No problem.
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