$210 for me and the bike is definitely expensive!

Perhaps the drive to Iguazu is warranted. I'm currently in Cordoba, so it's definitely a bit of a drive. Plus, my plan is to head to Ushuaia as soon as the bike situation is in order. But if the border is as lax as you say it could be the perfect place to cross for this sort of thing. I hope I have no problems returning with the same VIN but different plates the next day (possibly at a different border crossing)!

Do you guys know how difficult the Brazilian visa is to get as an American? Ie, how long does it take, how expensive?

I appreciate all the advice!

There are three ferries. Prices vary widely by date, time, phase of the moon, advance purchase, etc. My information about fares is several years' worth of inflation out of date, but you can research as well as I can--better, I presume. It's not expensive if you're paying with black market pesos and you choose your boat wisely. It's fiendishly expensive if you try to travel on short notice during a popular holiday weekend at the same time of day as everyone else.

I think there's a Brazilian consulate in Cordoba. I think I heard it's an easy one. My memory is highly suspect, so again you'd do well to run the information down yourself. But it's going to cost you about as much as--or more than--the ferry fare, so you might as well be prepared for that.

Of course there are dozens of other options. Think about taking one of the passes into Chile, where immigration facilities are sometimes a hundred miles apart. Those are more interesting routes anyway, since you're heading for Ushaia. You'll just miss the fuss and bother of the Dakar racers, who tend to jack all the prices skyward as long as they're around.

All this information is available via search on this site.

Hope that's helpful.

Mark

All transport boats are owned by Busquebus which in Brasilian owned by Randon the truck trailer maker.

All boat payments are USD only and in hard cash, no Credit Card, you pay your USD cash at the official rate not the blue dollar rate so at a Peso rate of 8.5 not 13.7.

So they have closed the door on any advantage.

If it were me with Ushuaia in mind hightail across to a Chilean mountain border, Paso Vegara could be a good choice or Paso Seco north, trouble is you are in the system with Arg and contrary to popular belief 99% of the time you pop straight up on their system so you are going to have to have a well rehearsed story or they WILL ask for money .... but some money at the blue rate might be your cheapest option over all.

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Cheers Andi & Ellen .... https://twomotokiwis.blogspot.com/ Two Moto Kiwis Alaska - Argentina - April 2012 -> Somewhere

We crossed at Paso Sico the first time - where the border posts are widely separated (the Chilean Agricultural checkpoint counts as one of the posts because they record your details there and supposedly pas them on to San Pedro dA - and we definitely needed the PODER to satisfy the army people in the Argentinian post..

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Tony
Click here for Travel Photos & Travel Map

I'm happy to stand corrected on the ways the three ferries have apparently adjusted to the Argentine financial mess since I was there. I remain curious about the quoted fares. I got as far as noting that advance internet fares still vary by about 300% before I lost interest in checking further last night. If I was planning to use the ferries, I'd sure be studying those advance fares carefully.

I'm not clear what's being said about the border crossings at the various Andes passes. The OP needs his poder no matter where he crosses--or, for that matter, no matter where he rides. He's got a legal transfer of ownership waiting to be put into play, including new title, registration and plate (tag). The question is will the Argentine aduana communicate with the Chilean aduana in such a way that he won't be able to get a TIP for the bike under its new ownership after leaving Argentina. Having crossed at a few of the high Andes passes it's difficult for me to imagine that level of coordination and professionalism among the aduana personnel I encountered.

Note that I'm describing my own imaginative abilities, not established facts with solid predictive value. As always, mileage varies.

Mark

Heya Mark

Yeah we got prices in advance and asked on the day (23rd) with a friend in BA who wanted to ferry his van, we were astounded at the prices, we were there 23rd December so maybe take that into account but this is still "high season"...maybe a Dakar factor???? .. just guessing, either way it was a hell of a cost for two of us and a moto.

We took the long way through Frey Bentos from inland Uruguay, I would always prefer to spend our cash of fuel and tires rather than a ferry like that....unless time is burning your arse.

Cheers Andi

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Cheers Andi & Ellen .... https://twomotokiwis.blogspot.com/ Two Moto Kiwis Alaska - Argentina - April 2012 -> Somewhere

"I'm not clear what's being said about the border crossings at the various Andes passes. The OP needs his poder no matter where he crosses--or, for that matter, no matter where he rides. He's got a legal transfer of ownership waiting to be put into play, including new title, registration and plate (tag). "

Seems to be three distict layouts of border crossings.

First - is where both adunas are in the same room, which given the possibility that one or both sets of officers may want to physically check license plates and VINs, means that physically replating the vehicle is not possible even if mild shuffling of paperwork is possible inside the room.
Second is where posts are within sight of each other. Same problem with physical swap of plates.
Third and most desirable is where posts are miles apart and in between is deserted. Paso Sico is one such place and Iguazu Fall are another. At least three others between Chile and Argentina.

Yes, always need a poder if driving another's vehicle unless you are entered on the TIP as authorised driver. If convenient to a border post then that can be cheaper provided the current ownere is still there as a poder isn't needed PROVIDED a change of ownership/plates can be effected at the border.

Those who have just a poder and continue through multiple borders without changing title are likely to eventually come to a border they can't cross.

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Tony
Click here for Travel Photos & Travel Map

if you are still in Cordoba, why don't you cross into Chile at the PASO AGUA NEGRA?
There you have 180KM!!!! between the arg. and the chilean border posts and the pass is just brilliant!!!!

Groschi

Ok - so I took some of the previous advice and went to the Iguazu crossing. The things I read about this crossing were absolutely correct! While crossing, I never even saw Aduanas (and I was looking for it so I could hand in the TVIP). I only stopped at Immigraciones, where I had my passport stamped to leave the country. Oddly enough, the Immigration guy also asked for my license plate number (which I gave). After entering that into his system he asked if I was from Ecuador (the previous owner has dual citizenship in US and Ecuador and used his Ecuador passport to bring the bike into Argentina). I told him no (pretended to not speak Spanish well) and he sent me on my way. I made it out!

Now my question is: will I be able to get back into the country in a couple days with different papers and different license plate? I never handed in my TVIP, though the Immigrations official checked the license plate and saw the info from the TVIP. If they only check the license plate for a new TVIP when I return I should be fine. On the other hand, if the VIN gets flagged there may be an issue.

I guess I'll find out in a couple days. Will update again to let people know how it goes. Again, thanks for all the info!!

Unless something has changed recently with the system of how Arg Aduanas does TVIPs, you have made a big mistake. The last time i crossed at Iguazu, the ARG Aduanas was in a different building than immigrations and was about 100m or so from immigrations. It was on the righthand side of the road, a bit off in the trees.

You must return the TVIP to Aduanas. Otherwise the vehicle will not be granted a new TVIP ever. It will be considered to have never left Argentina. The computer system which all TVIPs are entered into contains both plate and VIN numbers.

I recommend you drive back to just before the border and find the ARG Aduanas. Tell them you were planning on returning to Argentina same day as you exited, but now you changed your mind and will be out of Argentina for 6 months or more. This is going to b rather difficult since you will have to exit Brasil immigration to do this, but they should stamp you back into Brasil without issue.

Must be a reason why the aduana building is in stealth mode - no signs, no boom gates, nothing. And I was looking hard for it. I stopped 100m past immigration and walked back and found the aduana man lazing in the shade and handed the TIP to him since he reckoned it was his job to take them.

This is the bit in my earlier post that was relevant The previous owners of my first vehicle found they had four uncancelled TIPs on the computer when they entered the last time prior to handing it over to us. Luckily they had to sort it out because I wouldn't have been able to.
Their system is obviously pretty slack, especially when vehicles come in over the isolated border crossings.

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Tony
Click here for Travel Photos & Travel Map

With all your paperwork you could always try the above board approach if the flag you on re entry, just tell them you were told to change it at the border as that is where all the official stuff is done ... then play dumb.

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Cheers Andi & Ellen .... https://twomotokiwis.blogspot.com/ Two Moto Kiwis Alaska - Argentina - April 2012 -> Somewhere

Back to the original post, where to swap license plates. I can't say for sure, but my gut says, turn in your TIP papers in AR and swap the license plate in the parking lot like you do it all the time, then cross the no man's land (or on the ferry, you will have time to swap plates, trust me.)

The key concept, you aren't doing anything illegal. I guess you are concerned that you will be confronted or get in trouble. If someone goes nuts on you, then ask calmly for clarity on the infraction. If you are getting no where, then again calmly ask to talk to someone at higher level. There are usually plenty of those at a frontier.

You can always show your documentation, which is valid and legal, and tell the story of what you are doing. At worst, you put the old plates back on and change them when you get into the no man's land or the other side.

Coming from UY to AR on the ferry, the immigrations officers for UY and AR were sitting next to each other, but the importation of the bike didn't happen until the bike was on the dock in BA. My advice, make the swap on the UY side. They are more laid back and more likely to simply nod. In all cases, act like you know what you are doing. You would be surprised what you can get away with. In Latin America confidence carries the day.

Why don't we do it in the road?
No one will be watching us
Why don't we do it in the road?
The Beatles (1968)

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Peter B
2008/09 - NJ to Costa Rica and back to NJ
2012/13 - NJ to Northern Argentina, Jamaica, Cuba and back to NJ
2023 - Peru, Brazil, Paraguay, Argentina, Chile, Bolivia...back to Peru.

Blogs: Peter's Ride