Just catching up on this sad news having been in SE Angola for a few weeks.

There are many interesting posts on this thread. I wanted, though, to add another angle. I have long worried that the UK Foreign Office would be of no help if a UK citizen ran into trouble in the Sahara. They lack the contacts and an informed approach in these sort of hostage situations. Recall the Iran-UK Navy drama.

But I would not have predicted that the UK govt would simply abandon someone to their death. OK, if their principle is not to pay ransom and that leads to death of the hostage, then why not send in some special forces guys to see if they can do the liberation differently - as the French have done in the Somalia pirate attacks recently. If there's a real threat of death, then they may as well have a go.

Last December I was told if you want goods transported or guidance from A to B you will be speaking to the Berabish and if you want to make sure those goods arrive safely then you may be speaking to the Touareg. Some of the Berabish I've met around Timbuctu see themselves as part of the Touareg community so it becomes blurry (again!).

The French have their base in Djibouti, so you can see how they do what they do in Somalia, but how would the British go about a rescue in Mali or Niger? Via the US in Mali/Niger?

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Pictures, Mauritania 2011

Thanks Ulrich or your infos.
I've also heard that El Para had given declarations to give up terrorism against civilians (but I can't find this link anymore).
RR.

Some of the Berabish I've met around Timbuctu see themselves as part of the Touareg community

Sahara Passion woman's web pages certainly go even further in supporting that interpretation. I read it as simply good for her business, because every LP backpacker loves a real Tuareg but thinks 'Bera... who?'.


If there's a real threat of death, then they may as well have a go.

You'd think so but until Edwin Dyer was killed (we were not even given his name until after he was dead) there had been no precedent for execution in Sahara so maybe FCO/whoever assumed the captors were bluffing as before.
This time they weren't and so it's all changed - but even then I can't see any sort of rescue happening, as with 2003 Group 1.

When these dramatic ops go well it's a PR coup like Group 1 or Iranian embassy siege 1980 or recent French thing (didn't follow it) - but when they dont (as often off home turf: US Iran hostage rescue 1980) - it's a disaster.

Disregarding the US base in Gao (could be wrong here), you'd think Algeria, Mali's new friend in the GWoT, must have some killer desert unit gagging for action. And what happened to this co-operation we heard about in May, or was that more talk to give the impression 'we're on it'?
BBC NEWS | Africa | Algeria and Mali target al-Qaeda

"...The aid includes fuel, weapons and sleeping bags, according to reports in the Algerian media... the operation could start within the next month or two."

The location of this camp must be known, as they must have known with the Austrians and 2003 Group 2. We're even told the same Abdelhamid Abou Zeid is involved in all three events (though he could be an 'MBM-type' general purpose bad guy).

Once an exchange is completed and the hostages are safe, go after them with everything you have, it's not the Hindu Kush out there. Or have I been watching too many films? It never happened after 2003 or 2008, I don't suppose it will happen this time.

Does a govt have a duty to help it's citizens in trouble abroad? You'd think so buy I would not take it for granted - it could even come down to cost/benefit.

It strikes me there is no will/desire to finish off the AQIM unit roaming around in Mali (you could say the same for OBL I suppose) but then that idea leads in a whole new direction...

Either way, I hope that Werner Greiner, the Swiss guy whose wife was released earlier, comes out of it unharmed.

Ch

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Morocco Overland 4 (2025) • Trans Morocco Trail

Actually to read this from Jeremy Keenan
Jeremy Keenan: West's made-up terror links to blame for killing - Commentators, Opinion - The Independent

Regards

Ulrich

Strange guy this Keenan. I liked his book Saharaman, but after that he went a bit crazy, I think. He calls himself a scientist, but when you read his recent articles and books I sometimes get the impression I am reading the Sun or some other rubbish media. He does not in any way manage to prove the statements he's making.

Richard,

I guess you are not the only one to worry. Before leaving for the Gilf last December, we sent a routine email to the UK Consulate in Cairo, just letting them know what we were up to. That would save them guessing in case we followed the fate of the guys kidnapped (and released) in Karkur Talh two months previously.

Upon returning from the trip we found in the mailbox an automated "Out of Office AutoReply", telling us to visit the FCO webiste for foreign policy news and travel advice. No-one ever bothered to read our message.

There's a saying making rounds that when there's a situation out there, the Italian government will send ransom money, the French will send special forces, and the British will send deep regrets.

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Roman (UK)

I agree that there is a clear difference in circumstances between Iran and this sad event. But the point I intended to make was a different one, namely that in my opinion, the UK Government did not handle the negotiations well in the Iran case. In fact Iran seemed to run rings round the UK Foreign Office and Iran was in control until the incident ended. If this was any indication of how well the UK is able to negotiate in these sort of North African/Middle Eastern/Arabic settings (I know Iran isn't Arabic), then you can see why they failed completely in this event in Mali/Niger. The message seems to be that UK nationals are on their own out there. The Foreign Office just takes one strong line and has no Plan B.

This time last year, almost to the day, we were discussing on another Sahara Forum thread
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...ebellion-35973
what the prospects were for kidnappings and worse in N Mali.

It makes very interesting reading.