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North Africa Topics specific to North Africa and the Sahara down to the 17th parallel (excludes Morocco)
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Trans Sahara Routes.

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  #1  
Old 4 Jun 2009
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If the statement by AQIM proves to be true, my thoughts are with the family of the victim. This does however raise serious questions about the British government's refusal to pay ransom money or negotiate.

While I am not suggesting that paying ransoms is appropriate in all situations, it seems that the vast majority of recent kidnappings of westerners in North Africa (ie Austrians in Tunisia etc) have been successfully resolved by the payment of a ransom. This suggests that either AQIM, the GSPC, or whichever local variation of these groups is responsible, is primarily motivated by money, rather than political means.

Where hostage death have occured they have generally been by dehydration / stress caused by capitivity, or due to a shoot-out with government forces. This would appear to be a rare case where the hostage takers have executed the hostage.

As travellers we all know the risk of entering regions where the politicial climate is not stable, and therefore we don't necessarily expect a government to bail us out, but it would still be nice to know that government policy is not so inflexible as to rule out negotiation / ransoms, where this may result in successfully freeing a hostage.
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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Originally Posted by Matt Roach View Post
...but it would still be nice to know that government policy is not so inflexible as to rule out negotiation / ransoms, where this may result in successfully freeing a hostage.
I find this approach rather selfish, as paying a ransom to free you--who basically decided to go joy-riding in a potentially dangerous location--puts others at risk, including those in the same area for a better reason (government service, charity work, etc.).

I don't know the particulars regarding this hostage, but it is very possible that he was kidnapped precisely because of the example set by the ransom paid for the Austrians or other kidnap victims.

If you want to go to these areas, more power to you, but I don't think it is reasonable to expect your government to pay for your release.
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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Click the links above: it was not as simple as just paying up to release Edwin Dyer as with the other hostages who were let go. In his case they wanted a guy called Abu Qatada released from a UK prison.

Ch
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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They were kidnapped last February provably at Niger by locals tuaregs and then sold to ALQMI for MONEY!
ALQMI are introducing in Sahara being useful the bad situation of tuareg and with money from Arabia Saudi.
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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Chris,

Agreed, but it is worth noting that the hostage takers of the Austrians in Tunisia also initially demanded the release of prisoners held in Algeria & Tunisia, as per the attached BBC link.

BBC NEWS | World | Africa | Chancellor urges hostage release

Whilst every case is clearly separate, a consistent theme seems to be arising. Kidnap a westerner, demand the release of militants from jail, accept this wont happen and then settle on a ransom in exchange for releasing the hostage.

Motoreiter - my point wasn't whether we should expect to be released by our governments paying a ransom, rather it was that the outright refusal by the British government to pay ransoms is not helpful, and removes a potential bargaining chip, which has successfully been used by several European governments in the past to obtain the release of their citizens.
Last edited by Matt Roach; 9 Jun 2009 at 21:01.
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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... a consistent theme seems to be arising. Kidnap a westerner, demand the release of militants from jail, accept this wont happen and then settle on a ransom in exchange for releasing the hostage.

Yes Matt, that seems to have been a pattern before. I do recall that when the Austrians were grabbed I believe it was said that they were disappointed they were not Brits/French/US - possibly because they have more guys like Abu Qatada in custody?

Also, unless it's been verified somewhere (by the already released hostages in Europe who experienced the transaction) I must say do find this 'selling on by Niger Tuareg [rebels] to AQIM' angle a bit fishy. We heard similar with the Austrians.

Either way it is depressing that a regional precedent has now been set to kill the hostage when they don't get what they want.

Ch
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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I must say do find this 'selling on by Niger Tuareg [rebels] to AQIM' angle a bit fishy. We heard similar with the Austrians.
Ch

You can certainly imagine the Malian/Niger Govt. taking the opportunity to ladle heat onto rebel factions. But on the other hand – a handful of Islamists on tour from Algeria acting alone? Perhaps there is no simple truth, money does a great job of blurring ideology and motive.

Sad news indeed. Sympathies to the family.
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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how safe do you think it would be for a yank alone in a baja bug? especially if i have to keep my plates of origin on my car? marko
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Old 4 Jun 2009
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The englishman was kidnapped together with the three other europeans near the Niger border.
The involvement of tuaregs should be questioned - most tuaregs will deny that tuaregs are involved in the kidnappings. Have the canadians that were kidnapped told their story? The Niger and Mali governements are always likely to blame tuaregs,

This was the first killing of a hostage held for ransom in the Sahara I believe. Perhaps this will change the laissez-faire attitude of the French and the Malians.

Apparently there is no advantage having a US or UK passport.

A very sad development.
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