With all respect but a Prado is not a real Landcruiser, its basically a Hilux with a hardbody.
The real Landcruisers have beam axles in front, even the very modern and up to date 100 series still has a beam axle. So I think the Prado should not be dragged into the comparison between LC and the Defender.

Cheers,
Noel

exploreafrica.web-log.nl

Noel sorry to correct you mate but the new 100 series has IFS with torssion bars which has now been superseeded by the even newer 200 series which has dropped the torssion bars and is now similar to the Prados IFS, it has not really been released long enough to know if they have any problems with the new 200 series yet. I am not 100% sure but I think the solid axle 105 series cruiser is also out of production, maybe it is available in some markets for the UN etc, but I think not as all the UN cruisers that come through Dubai nowdays which get fitted out are the newer style LC70 5 door troppies.

They are no doubt a fantastic vehicle but look worse than my mother in-law, which takes some doing. The ute versions with a decent bullbar looks OK apart from the front axle being wider than the rear.



You can even see in this photo how the front axles is wider than the rear, how the normally level headed Toyota let this happen I don`t know, wheel spacers on the rear solves the problem, but I am not sure of the legalities of running wheel spacers and if over time that maybe it may increase the loadings on wheel bearings etc possibly leading to a failure on vehicles which have spend most of their life heavily loaded.

__________________
An aussie escaped from london, now in Dubai.

nibshis - I hav eexactly the same reasons as you for choosing my Defender. With my heart. OK the head says get a very profitiant LC (more money mind) but as you say everytime I turn the key, or jump on the roof I get an amazing sense of happyness.

And to tell the truth, everytime he breaks down (only twice!) I smile, pat him on the side and tell him I love him!

I'm much happier going with my hear tthan my head. People who go with their, by definition won't understand why us fools go with our hearts, because it's not a rational decision

Good luck anyhow. I love my 180k mile, 200tdi.

__________________
Ollie

www.jollyfollies.com

Land's End to Sydney 2009

I know my LC120 has front IFS coils (indipendant front suspension ) and rear solid axles, on coils.
This makes them so strong in my opinion.
Also they ride on coils all round, and if Toyota were concerned about the use of IFS on the front's then I am sure they would have thought long and hard about the newer 100 seies, and the newer 200 series.
All of which have the very same suspension as the PRado ( Land Cruiser 120 series )

I don't know much about the other Toyota's, but the LC 120 would probably take a "real good hiding" before she went down on her knees.

All in all, I believe the 2002 and onwards Land Cruisers are pretty hard to beat as an on road, and an off road vehicle.

On the road, the 3.0 liter D4d will cruise effortlessly, loaded up in the rear.

Fuel consumption at a steady 60mph, (100km/h) on cruise control, is a respectable 30 mpg, with about 300kg load in the rear.
With the 87 liter tank (19.1 gallons) has given me 500 miles with quarter tank left.

So, perhaps the older land Cruisers were thirsty, I know, because my son in law has one, but the newer ones are very economical, as far as 4x4's are concerned.

Graham

Yup - unfortunately the beam axle 105 is out of production and the last ones were scarce as hen's teeth: I know because I was trying to get one for company fleet use. This is a bugger as effectively the only rigid axle LC now available in a station wagon format is the "Mother in Law" 76 series :-) Very nice car (apart from the looks), but for ferrying our staff and visitors on bad African roads it won't win any favours with a shorter wheel base than a troopy but the same rear leaf springs. The new 200 series is also about €35k in it's basic form, so more than €10k more than the price we used to pay for a std 105 series. A bit more than we are prepared (or my MD will let me!) to pay. So we were pretty much left with no choice (assuming we stick with Toyo) but the Prado. No doubt the Prado is good, but 4/5 years pounding the potholes will I am sure take a heavier toll than on a rigid (i.e. non-IFS) axle L/C. If nothing else the front wheel alignment on IFS vehicles can be quite a problem to keep right in the bush. Yesterday I had a shot of a Toyota Tundra V8 Petrol double cab... wow! And the really crazy thing is in the USA they are paying about €18,000 for a very well equipped monster of a p/up. Less than we have to pay for a crappy SA built 3.2 Nissan D22. Some things are just not fair. Although consumption might be a 'small' issue! Interesting to note there is quite a market in USA for dedicated off-roaders converting their Tundras and Tacomas to solid front axles for better articulation.
Gil

Hi nibshis

My Two pence worth: I drove Nairobi to Cape Town and back in the following vehicles:
Landrover series 2a 109 - 1972 - Three times
Suzuki SJ410 1992 6 months round trip
Bedford MJ
Landrover 110 turbo (and later with a Nissan 2.8 conversion engine)
Defender 200Tdi pick-up, converted to a safari vehicle.
I also have varied travel experience in an 1984 Range Rover, a Mitsubishi Pajero and 78 Landcruiser mostly on severely bad roads in Kenya and Tanzania.

One thing I do know is that you shouldnt exceed the weight limits in anyway at all. The worse the road the less you should load the vehicle.

If I can do six months and 24,000 in a suzuki jeep without overloading it, then you can and will do London to cairo in your Defender.

Its an attitude thing, My '79 Landrover Station wagon was an ultimate overlanding machine, slept 2 in the back, 2 on the roof in real comfort, two 40 litre tanks under the front seats and the 80l in the back, winch and welding machine run off the altenator. The original straight 6 2.6 petrol engine is surprisingly great, I took this vehicle everywhere, on every terrain. From up muddy tracks on Mt Kenya to along the sand-dunes on the beach in South Africa. and it diddnt ever not get me to a destination.
However in difficult times I experienced a few breakages, but nothing I could not fix. And certainly nothing that shouldnt have broken given what it went through and how it was loaded.

The Suzuki jeep was small but very capable, in fact other than the very small part, it was unstoppable.
The Pajero (Shogun) is alright, but really not in the same league.
The Range Rover is thirsty, but enormously capable, throw a fridge in the back, and spare wheels and jerry cans mounted on the tail gate and your good to go anywhere in comfort.
The Defender in various guises is my preferred choice, provided you dont overload it. The 4 door stationwagon with rear seat removed or a pick up with a suitable rear are great.
I modified all of mine heavily to suit the purpose, and having the pick up section with a lockable box was really great, but possibly less practical in cities.

If I could make one suggestion it would be a low mileage 110 HCPU 300Tdi, then modify a suitable rear section for your needs.
There are some former national electricity / water board vehicles which have pretty much been prepared for you with side access, these would eb great alternative.

The HCPU Landies are stronger, have a steel rear tub with much wider tailgate making rear access easier.
The 300Tdi engine with modified zeus gears larger capacity iintercooler and you pay landrover to fully service it. i would also consider an additional electric fan wired to the dash board
If you build a rear frame and mount the roof top tent on top of it, with aluminium panel sides or canvas covering steel mesh. The top of the tail gate should be similar to a range rover. It should be completely lockable.
I like having rollup canvas covering steel mesh in frames that can be removed for a more out there feel, that sort of looks like a rear tub tilt, but is practical.

You can also remove the rear window panel to gain access to the front of the tub section.

Ultimately a roof top tent is the perfect sleep solution, one that swings out over the bull bar is neat, because you dont need extra ladders and can move the landy with it up. But one over the side, allows much more scope for a shower tent or additional shade.

In truth you will not have any problems, provided you dont drive like a hooligan, or over load it. Remember; use Low ratio in advance.
Oh and keep the vehicle running cold. dont switch the engine off without running it for a while, preferably faced into the wind, if really warm

Parabolic springs on a series 3 would do just fine, if a little slow.

Enjoy living the dream!

G

Anyway, back on topic , with a 110 SW (which i've also got), you can remove the rear panels (with the slidy windows) and bolt in a pair of 'series' (as in, series 2 or 3) plain side panels, they fit straight in, and hey presto, you've got yourself a 110 commercial (As available from the factory),

This will eliminate the side windows, better security etc, and when you get home you can bolt back in the original side panels and get the true station wagon back again.

so you'd gain a kind of "half van/half SW", rear end will be a bit darker inside, might be better for sleeping etc.

Linky to some pics of converted 110's