OK, chief, whatever you say.

As I thought I made very clear in my post, I'm not arguing about what is more likely or not to break down--I'm saying that if an older bike breaks down, chances are good that a shade-tree mechanic in Russia (much less deepest Africa) won't be able to fix it.

only saying that an air head GS is a fairly simple bike to work on. Can only be a few things. Could be something with diode board or stator ... or broken wire somewhere in the harness, bad switch, faulty ground or intermittent short? Been there, taken apart on the side of the road ... in the dark. Coils rarely fail on air heads.

Oh, crystal clear! But wouldn't it depend on what the fault was on the bike?
One good thing about common, older bikes is sometimes parts are around or can be borrowed from other bikes. If the fault is a relatively simple one ... a local guy might get lucky, no?

If the piston's seized or it's sucked a valve or you've busted the case ... you're done. But sometimes it's just a blocked jet, torn diaphragm, bad switch, shorted wire, crud in fuel, clogged filter,
bad wheel or steering head bearing, broken cable, cracked frame ... sometimes the local guy can help with these minor issues .... Sometimes not.

Early in this thread I posted a pic of a KLR broken in half. Did you know that guy had a local welder in Baja weld up the frame? He put everything back on the bike, rode it back to USA. He then bought a used KLR frame, transferred everything over ... then rode the KLR back to Mexico, continued his trip.

It was a month long interruption ... and cost some money, but the welding was cheap and much cheaper than a truck ride up to the border. (1000 miles)

Some local friends here crossed Russia in a Ural side car rig. It broke down many times and locals always got it going. They were hit (rig mostly destroyed), bought all new parts for like $500, had it rebuilt. The girl is Russian ... lives here in San Fran Bay Area, so language was no problem. They had the ride of a life time, by their account.

From reading Walter's ride reports I got the feeling there are a few decent mechanics in Russia? Dunno. Africa? I think you're on your own there ... but you never know ...

Yes, but it is pretty much the same with modern bikes...

Sure, and maybe a unicorn will show up with whatever parts the locals don't have...

Great story. GuiltyParty did pretty much the same somewhere rather more remote than Baja, with his Triumph 800xc, which I suppose counts as a modern bike: Going Walkabout on an 800xc through Russia & Central Asia...and maybe beyond... - ADVrider

I usually stay out of "my brand of bike is better than yours" conversations, but....

In the 90's I had a R100GSPD, and found it too heavy for what I wanted to do. I decided to buy the best street bike of the Japanese dual sports, which, in my opinion was the KLR. This was in 2001. I have used this bike mainly for trips, I use other bikes for daily transport. Currently, it has about 83,000 miles, maybe 2/3 of those south of the US border in various Latin American countries. It has puked two of the OEM rear shocks, I now have a Progressive brand unit, so far, so good. The only other significant failure was the speedo drive gearbox in the front hub, and a loose baffle in the muffler that restricted airflow (try diagnosing that one). I have done some prophylactic maintenance, like wheel bearings, clutch plates, water pump seals, and the infamous doohickey, but I have never had a serious breakdown on the road. I reshimmed the valves at 8,000 miles, and have checked them several times since then, but never adjusted them.

Does any of this make it a "better" bike than anything else? It all depends on what you want. I ride very conservatively when far from home, so horsepower per cc means nothing to me, and if I need more suspension, then I am going too fast. I understand carburetors, so a fuel system breakdown doesn't hold any terror for me. If I understood EFI better, maybe I would prefer that.

I am curious what kind of longevity people are getting on the more high strung bikes, KTM 690 enduro and the like. I know someone with a CBR1000R who has 100,000 miles, and the engine has never been apart, so I suspect it can be done.

The KLR has been a good choice for me. Knowing what I know now, I might have chosen a XR650L, just because there are so many more Honda dealers in Latin America.

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Andy Tiegs
https://new.horizonsunlimited.com/ts...lsouth-america

so with far less experience in RTW'ing than many of you, i'm still gonna chime in here with what i have observed in 30 years of riding all manner of beasts.

simple = better.

electronics are fantastic until they take a shit.

i have two fairly simple bikes, a dr650 and a dl1000. both ARE bulletproof, until they are not. but there is no doubt amongst those that know these bikes: the dr650 is light years easier to diagnose and likely cheaper to fix.

the dl1000 is fairly reliable as big efi bikes go. it has it's known issues and those have fixes. but every once in a while, one pops up with a problem that confounds the "experts"--the dealers, those that truly know the machine, and the masses that have ridden it for many years. sure, all of them get fixed eventually, but at what cost? after how long?

compare to the mighty dr. old skewl, carbed, thumper with just about no electronics (does the cdi count as electronics?). no ecu. no fidigity, persnickety efi. no fancy anything. when they breakdown it's a matter of usually one of two things: carb/fuel issue (as in that damn in-line fuel filter), or the stator. no water pump issues. no ecu issues. dead basic. dead simple. and dead cheap.

if someone freighted a dr??? out of mongolia because of a broken carb needle, well, i dunno what to say, except maybe they shouldda taken a basic moto mechanics class before riding off into the nether-lands.

old and basic, but they are also tried and true.

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'07 DL1000 '08 DR650

Everything in life is relative.

To someone with points it clearly is. CDIs were abused as new fangled electronics when they came on the scene too. Cant adjust them, cant check them, bla bla bla.

Why would CDI not be electronics?? Its a black box just like an ECU. Its closed. You cant fix it if it shags itself. You cant diagnose which circuit within it is faulty and repair that by the side of the road in Malawi.

Why is CDI ok to you but ECU isnt? Seems a bit hypocritical to me to slam one and love the other. I would be curious to hear your justification for that logic.

I have had EFI cars and motorcycles for 30 years. Since the mid 1980s. In half a million miles on all vehicles since then, never once have I had to "fidget" with a single injector on them.

What car do you drive?
How often does its injection need "fidgeting"? (maybe you can compare with how often your carbed motorcycle needs "fidgeting for reference, and how many miles each does between a good old "fidget")
How often does your EFI car break down?
When was the last time your car's ECU failed?

I am actually not being rhetorical. Lets try and put the answers out there so we can really have a more informed discussion on the fidgetyness of carbs vs EFI.

I will throw some info in for comparison sake ... My cousin keeps an old 1970s muscle car - with carbs and points. I have a BMW EFI V8. Both produce around 300-350 hp. By engine has done 150,000 miles. His less than 50,000. I have never once had to "fidget" with the EFI in 150,000 miles. He has to adjust his carbs (fidget) every few outings!

The fact that he enjoys it, doesnt make it less fidgety. In fact, he has a Hyundai EFI car, just cause he doesnt want to have to fidget with his old donk every time to goes to work or down to the shops.

So my personal experience with old simple tech vs newfangled EFI and ECU tech is that old tech is about 1000 times more "fidgety".

I am happy to do my next blast across Siberia with me on my EFI ECU X-Challenge and put Austin Vince next to me on his DR350 ... if someone wants to put up the money for this fidgetyness challenge. Lets see who has to fidget the most with carbs / EFI. Me or the DR350. I would bet any amount of money on the answer .... would you?

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i think it's foolish to compare the efi systems in cars to those in bikes. are you doubting the existence of efi problems in bikes? i don't think so, but comparing them is unfair as those in cars are less likely to fail for who knows how many reasons--exceeds my knowledge for sure.

i can speak only to my experience with any degree of certainty and it's been as follows:

dr650: 4 years of hardcore off-road travel through central america (mostly nica) using local gas--for better or worse. not a single carb issue. no adjustments, no stumbles, starts and runs better than new. no other issues.

Dl1000: 4 years of easy florida riding (boring) using local gas. throttle bodies out of synch 3 times, throttle position sensor out of adjustment twice, throttle body boot popped off twice.

now, you could say that the DL is a shitty example of ancient efi technology and you may be right. or you could say that jap bikes suck compared to the bavaria beasts and you may be right (doubtfully). but my experience doesn't lie.

i'm active on three vstrom specific fora and there are literally 1000's of posts regarding efi issues. i'm active on advrider and read legions of posts of problems of all sorts with fancy, big, "overland" bikes by the bavarians--problems that sometimes cannot be fixed even by the dealers located in the countries these poor folks get stranded in. one of the 12,000,000 sensors goes bad, a microscopic something or other messes with something or other, what would otherwise be an innocuous voltage issue shitcans the entire bike etc etc.

is older and simpler better for all purposes? no. does it reduce the number of problems and more importantly, does it make fixing more straightforward? imho (with aint worth much!), yes.

i drive a 2012 mazda 3. 24000 miles not a stumble. but for modern automobile engines 24000 miles is nothing. i also live in the 1st world where gas is generally clean and free of 12 lbs of contaminants per 100 gallons so...

i think the point is this: take a 2014 GS1200 and a 2014 KLR. go out into the boonies. you have a choice of having to deal with one of them breaking down with limited resources available to you. which one would you choose?

p.s. you may be right about the cdi--i said i wasn't sure. and i've only heard of a handful of ecu's going south. the larger, more common problem with efi bikes is, from what i have experienced and read, related to electrical issues and sensors going bad--neither of which would necessarily put an older design carbed bike out of commission.

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'07 DL1000 '08 DR650