Go Back   Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB > Equipment, Travel > Camping Equipment and all Clothing
Camping Equipment and all Clothing Tents, sleeping bags, stoves etc. Riding clothing, boots, helmets, what to wear when not riding, etc.
Photo by Stephan Hahnel, Kradwanderer, in Northern Argentina

I haven't been everywhere...
but it's on my list!


Photo by Stephan Hahnel,
www.krad-wanderer.de,
in Northern Argentina




Like Tree1Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Greece
Posts: 109
Tent waterproofing doesn't last?

Hi fellows!

I am a bit disappointed about the waterproofing ability of the tents. I have a Marmot Swallow. It is a very practical tent! I love its versatility, space, ventilation and high quality in general. It was absolutely waterproof, even when the rain was so heavy that a flood of a few centimeters was formed on the ground.

I bought it 6 years ago and I have used it for 230 nights approximately in any kind of weather: a lot of sun, downpours, strong winds and a little bit of snow. The last time I used it, I noticed that it's not waterproof any more. Water was leaking through the fly and it was getting in the inner tent through the roof. It seemed it was not leaking through any seams, but straight through the fabric! I could see the drops of water.

I visited the outdoor shop from which I had bought my tent and I was very disappointed when the shopkeeper told me that this is absolutely normal, because the UV radiation polymerizes the tent's plastic. He said that mountaineers use these tents only in one expedition on the high mountains! High-altitude speeds up the polymerism of the plastic. Maybe half of the times I 've used my tent, it was on high-altitude, I should say.

When I bought such an expensive tent (430 euros), I expected it to last many years. Unfortunately, according to that shopkeeper, I should buy another tent and waterproofing sprays won't make any difference on my tent. I have never treated my tent with a waterproof spray. Maybe the worst is that the shopkeeper told me there isn't any kind of fabric which will be waterproof after many years of camping. According to him, we should buy a new tent every once in a while, but I hope that's not true!

Do you have any experience with that? Is there a tent that you have used a few hundreds of nights and it's still absolutely waterproof on heavy rains?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,131
Red face Nothing lasts for ever

Very expensive tents are Silnylon

yours is probably ripstop nylon with a PU coating
Silnylon is the same with a silicon coating ...

As you say they 'go off' with UV exposure. So keeping them away from sun over long periods is a good idea. The fly will cop most of it - so either a cover over the fly (a fly on a fly ? ) or expect to replace it.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-...hread_id=67310 has a discussion on treatments - inconclusive.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11 Nov 2012
Genghis9021's Avatar
Gold Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Chiang Mai, Thailand
Posts: 193
You need a new tent . . .

UV destroys man-made materials very quickly.

And it's not just tents. All that nylon and polyester being used by motorcyclists for their jackets and pants . . . should be retired, too. The tear resistance declines precipitously with sun exposure.

Your tent served you well - less than 2 Euro / night.

Sure, you could find a canvas tent that would resist the sun better. It would weigh 5x as much, if not more, have spotty water resistance unless it was specifically shaped (and then would offer much less usable space).

In the end, it's always tradeoffs.
__________________
Orange, it's the new black.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11 Nov 2012
Super Moderator
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bellingham, WA, USA
Posts: 3,953
Yup, there are more UV-resistant tents and less UV-resistant tents. Pitching at high altitudes or in arctic summers, particularly in direct sunlight, will trash fabrics and waterproofing alike at accelerated rates. What the salesman told you is true: in cases of extreme UV exposure, most tents last only a month or so. If you shop wisely, increased UV resistance is one of the little-known features which make truly expensive tents (Hilleberg being my favorite) a better deal than cheap ones.

It probably won't console you much, but in my experience when they start to leak like that the fabric is already sufficiently weakened that you don't really want to trust it to protect you against wind or snow-loading anyway. You'd be astonished how easily it'll tear.

Depending on the degree to which the fly covers the tent inner, you can sometimes get away with replacing the fly alone, since it tends to take the brunt of the exposure. On the other hand, if you've had it pitched out in high-altitude sun a lot you might find that the floor seams (which are often exposed just below the lower edges of the fly) have weakened so much that you really need a whole new tent.

Hope that's helpful. Of course, this is about the time that someone comes on here to describe the several decades of flawless service they've had from their 20 quid special, which has withstood hurricane winds, year-round arctic UV, incalculable snow-loading, and who knows what else. Take my advice and theirs with whatever grains of salt you deem appropriate.

Mark
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 14 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Greece
Posts: 109
Thanks, guys, for the useful replies!

Unfortunately, it seems there is no tent to last forever, indeed.

Mark, that's exactly what I was wondering about. I 've read so many comments about people using their fabulous tent for decades which still serves them as if it was new. That's why I wrote about the amount of nights somebody used his tent. Of course, if I would use it for 20 nights per year, it would last more than 10 years.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 14 Nov 2012
Gold Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London
Posts: 404
I'll add a bit here.
Many years ago I bought a high-spec bicycle-weight tent, all modern synthetic material.
I camped in it for 101 consecutive nights.
But I wonder, is the number of full days that the tent was erected more relevant?
Riding from place to place, staying one night only each time, your tent won't see much sunlight.

I'd estimate that on my 101-day ride, my tent saw about 30 to 40 complete sunny days (it was sunny the whole journey - wonderful! And I never bothered to search out shade as temperatures weren't high most of the time).
And when I came to use it again some time after that trip the fly had deteriorated a lot. Sort of, very thin patches of surface material peeling away. The manufacturers said that was to be expected.

So now, I carry a thin opaque tarp to put over the fly if I'm doing a lot of sunny camping.
All the very-lightweight tents I see these days carry a warning about sunlight exposure.
__________________
TTR250 - London to Cape Town
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 15 Nov 2012
Genghis9021's Avatar
Gold Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Chiang Mai, Thailand
Posts: 193
McCrankpin (fantastic handle) I think you're on to something.

Somewhat akin to an airframe (hours rated) or a even a race engine (hours rated) that's the key metric - hours of UV exposure with a factor for altitude (if that's relevant). Latitude should also be a factor (it is in many engineering texts).

People in California generally consider the sun strong there. After living for 6 years in India . . . the California sun seems quite tame. T-shirts faded super quick, bicycle tires were destroyed if left in the sun, etc. The difference - 40 degree's latitude vs 12 means ALOT more direct (high sun) light per day.

LOTS of people are now using a tarp to shade their tent for the reasons you've stated.
__________________
Orange, it's the new black.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 15 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,131
UV index world map - my exposure is more than ?

Lets not get into a 'mine is more' argument ... some data

This map shows world levels in 2009.

UV Index Worldmap | UNEP/GRID-Arendal - Maps & Graphics library

You can see the relative levels. Light blue = most UV. You can see the southern hemisphere gets more when compared to the northern hemisphere (explains why photo exposure levels are very different from one hemisphere to the other).

From Sun Protective Clothing | UPF Clothing | UV Protection | Arthritis Today Magazine

Nylon (as used in tents/flys/tarps) absorbs UV fairly well, darker colours look to do it better than lighter colours. So maybe a tarp over the tent will extend the tent life. Of course this only applies in day light hours. So the number of nights may not be a true indicator, possibly he number of days the tent is up during the day?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 15 Nov 2012
brclarke's Avatar
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Posts: 812
You got 6 years of usage out of it... That seems pretty good to me.

Me being thrifty (cheap) I always buy a cheap tent, spray the snot out of it with waterproofing spray, and just assume that it'll only last a year or so. If it lasts any longer without leaking, that's just a bonus!
__________________
Bruce Clarke - 2020 Yamaha XV250
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 16 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Greece
Posts: 109
Now comes another question: Does any tarp and any kind of fabric over the tent protect the tent from UV?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 16 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,131
It follows from

As the tent material it self absorbs UV then tent material would protect another tent under it ...

A few feet of lead would be better ... but I don't think you'd want to carry that around with you. Similarly other materials will be heavier than ripstop nylon with PU coating ... or silicon coating if you want to go to that expense.

Note UV is only 2% of the suns radiation, the other bits are evenly divided between visiable and infared.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 17 Nov 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 62
Hang on a minute, if it's UV-light/radiation that is causing the early demise of the fabric, is there not a UV-barrier-coating that can be applied before (and maybe during) each trip?

I'm not suggesting you smear it with a dozen tubes of factor-100 Ambre Solaire or try to cover it with 3000 pairs of RayBans, but something MUST be available on the market to defeat or minimise the damage.

I'm surprised the manufacturers aren't adding a coating for UV-resilience. Actually, no I'm not - that would surely be akin to the fabled 'everlasting lightbulb' or the premise behind that classic 'Man in the White Suit' film.

In answer to the question about what is required as a screen, I don't speak from experience but the answer would be 'just about anything as long as it shades the tent'... Provided, that is, that you're not camping next to something significanltly light-reflective, like snow or a b ody of water - in which case you might consider shielding the tent-walls from that as well.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 17 Nov 2012
g6snl's Avatar
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Home in Essex GB
Posts: 564
What if the tent was covered in one of them foil survival blankets ? Maybe everything should be covered in foil, may last for ever then ! Might get a few funny looks going down the road on a foiled covered bike with foil covered kit.

Must have be tried surely....................
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 17 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Greece
Posts: 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigfoot 2 View Post
Hang on a minute, if it's UV-light/radiation that is causing the early demise of the fabric, is there not a UV-barrier-coating that can be applied before (and maybe during) each trip?

I'm not suggesting you smear it with a dozen tubes of factor-100 Ambre Solaire or try to cover it with 3000 pairs of RayBans, but something MUST be available on the market to defeat or minimise the damage.

I'm surprised the manufacturers aren't adding a coating for UV-resilience. Actually, no I'm not - that would surely be akin to the fabled 'everlasting lightbulb' or the premise behind that classic 'Man in the White Suit' film.

In answer to the question about what is required as a screen, I don't speak from experience but the answer would be 'just about anything as long as it shades the tent'... Provided, that is, that you're not camping next to something significanltly light-reflective, like snow or a b ody of water - in which case you might consider shielding the tent-walls from that as well.
Sure, there is UV-protective coating. Most tents come with it and you can renew the coating with products like Nikwax. The thing is that for people who travel for many months in a row and camp often, it's a problem to carry cans of Nikwax. I 'm wondering how often I would need to renew that coating. If renewing it every few months is enough, I think I will end up doing this.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 17 Nov 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Greece
Posts: 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by g6snl View Post
What if the tent was covered in one of them foil survival blankets ? Maybe everything should be covered in foil, may last for ever then ! Might get a few funny looks going down the road on a foiled covered bike with foil covered kit.

Must have be tried surely....................
I found something which seems interesting:
Emergency Camping Shelter, Ideal For Runners, Hikers etc. 2.5 m x 1.5 m: Amazon.co.uk: Garden & Outdoors

but this material is so thin, I am afraid it may be ruined easily by the wind.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hilleberg Staika €800 tent that leaks!! Brian and Tanja Camping Equipment and all Clothing 25 9 Apr 2014 20:18
How important is it to have an easily hidden tent color masukomi Camping Equipment and all Clothing 36 11 Mar 2014 00:54
Sale: Brand new Nomad (now Redverz)Tenere Expedition tent (series 1),London/Surrey UK Bobduro TRAVEL Equipment for Sale / Wanted 0 3 Aug 2012 11:14
Terra Nova Laser Competition 1 Tent (UK) NEW Griffdowg TRAVEL Equipment for Sale / Wanted 2 16 May 2012 19:52
Rooftop tent + equipment for sale aa2012 Overland Vehicles and Equipment for Sale / Wanted 0 25 Feb 2012 08:10

 
 

Announcements

Thinking about traveling? Not sure about the whole thing? Watch the HU Achievable Dream Video Trailers and then get ALL the information you need to get inspired and learn how to travel anywhere in the world!

Have YOU ever wondered who has ridden around the world? We did too - and now here's the list of Circumnavigators!
Check it out now
, and add your information if we didn't find you.

Next HU Eventscalendar

ALL Dates subject to change.

2024:

  • California: April 18-21
  • Virginia: April 25-28
  • Germany Summer: May 9-12
  • Québec: May 17-19
  • Bulgaria Mini: July 5-7
  • CanWest: July 11-14
  • Switzerland: August 15-18
  • Ecuador: August 23-25
  • Romania: August 30-Sept 1
  • Austria: September 12-15
  • France: September 20-22
  • Germany Autumn: Oct 31-Nov 3

2025:

  • Queensland is back! May 2-4 2025!
  • CanWest: July 10-13 2025
  • France: September 19-21 2025

Add yourself to the Updates List for each event!

Questions about an event? Ask here

HUBBUK: info

See all event details

 
World's most listened to Adventure Motorbike Show!
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...

Adventurous Bikers – We've got all your Hygiene & Protection needs SORTED! Powdered Hair & Body Wash, Moisturising Cream Insect Repellent, and Moisturising Cream Sunscreen SPF50. ESSENTIAL | CONVENIENT | FUNCTIONAL.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)



Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance.

Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.

Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.

Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!


 

What others say about HU...

"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia

"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK

"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia

"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA

"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada

"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa

"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia

"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany

Lots more comments here!



Five books by Graham Field!

Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook

"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.



Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!

New to Horizons Unlimited?

New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!

Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.

Susan and Grant Johnson Read more about Grant & Susan's story

Membership - help keep us going!

Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.

You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.




All times are GMT +1. The time now is 14:24.