I'm not sure which other bikes you compare with when you say that the F800GS "lacks" torque.

This graph is a comparison between F800GS, F650GS, V-strom, Versys and Transalp.

You listed all bikes that are road bikes, not suitable for proper off road conditions ... and all twin cylinder bikes. You need to compare with big single cylinder engines. If you want to know what to compare it to - thats your answer.

I did say in my post that I felt the engine was not suitable for serious off road touring ... so you show me a graph of equally (or actually MORE) unsuitable for off-roading bikes? :confused1:

And how much torque you have at 5000 - 6000 rpm is also irrelevant when talking about how much torque a bike has for off road riding (which I think is clearly what I was talking about) ... you need to know how torquey it is at 1500 - 2500 rpm - straight from idle - not what is the maximum torque figure up at 6000 rpm.

I was interested in getting the bike. I tried it. And I came to the conclusion, the engine is no-where near as suitable for dirt roads and off road riding as the big single cylinder bikes (and its too heavy).

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One does indeed not find much information on the GS 800.
First of all I suggest you have a look at this link: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=377088 Plenty of info.

I owned a 1200 GS and I switched to the GS 800, I don’t regret it. Much easier to maneuver, feels much lighter on and off road.

I am just back from a trip to Kinshasa. I used my KTM 640 Adventure because of its off road capabilities. If I had to start again I don’t know if I would use the BMW or the KTM. The latter has a clear advantage on rough pistes, but there was plenty of tar as well… The BMW is reliable, one can use it off road with the right tires and if you are 2 up you definitely should go for the BMW.

Albert

Hi!

Had dinner awhile ago with a couple of guys who took their F800GSs Cape to Cairo. Ok, mostly tarred roads, but had (mostly) only the same trouble as most other heavy bikes - blown main shocks. They also, IMHO, completely overloaded the bikes: something in excess of 80kg stuffed into panniers and top boxes.

The catalytic converter can be cut out of the exhaust system, easily done, and that solves your poorer fuel problem.

Two issues that may prevent me from buying another (apart from money):
(1) On the mentioned Cape to Cairo trip the guys had trouble with the fans getting sand into them resulting in overheating issues.
(2) Fuel range: For a bike that can do what you can do with the F800GS the tank is simply too small +-330km range. The Touratech tank is available and although pricey I think it would definitely be worth it. Especially on a long trip away from street lights and pedestrian crossings.

For more info, Google "Wilddogforum", a South African site, and search for "Levensgevaarlik" (theme of an interesting thread).

You won't be doing the Roof of Africa or the Baja 1000 on it, but you'll have great all round fun. Had so much fun on mine, it's in bike heaven... I was still smiling when I woke up in hospital!

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"The fates lead him who will; him who won't they drag." - Anon

It seems that my previous post was misunderstood. The graph was to show that the bike doesn't lack torque - nothing else.

Well I compared with bikes more or less in the same class.
If you compare with big single cylinder engines the F800GS looks even better. When it comes to torque there is no substitute for ccm and multiple cylinders also help.





At 3000rpm the F800GS has 50% more tourque then a KTM690 and maybe 40% more then the Tenere. Which single do you have in mind with more torque then the F800GS?



The graph was to show that the F800GS doesn't lack torque, you seemed to miss that point.


Which numbers you read from the graph is up to you. Hopefully you don't stay at 1500-2500 RPM for a long time. Designing a twin is to much compromises.

It's to high geared and the swingwheel is a tad light.
The weight is 6,8 kg more then a Tenere

I'm a boxer-fan and will stick to old BMWs but if I should buy a non-boxer for longer trips it would probably have been the F800GS. Shocks and fuelrange might be the worst issues.

It lacks torque where I feel the torque needs to be - from idle ... you seem to miss that point.


The roads I find most interesting, you dont see 3000 rpm too much - those are the roads where you need the torque. So to be honest, I hope I do stay below 3000 rpm for maximum possible time. Because that means I am on the most interesting roads. If by chance you like long stretches of asphalt and sitting at 4500 rpm thats great ... and I never said the bike was not great for that. As for me, when I am on roads above 3000 rpm (and just cruising around), strangely enough I don't really need much torque anymore.

Designing a single is also about compromises. Designing a tennis racquet or even a fishtank is about compromises for that matter. Designing anything is about compromises. Its all about finding the characteristics that do the job for you, and I'm sorry if you don't want to accept it, but for me, the characteristics of the 800 engine are not suitable for serious off road touring. And for me, its way too heavy.

I am not against the bike. I began wanting to buy one. And I began my first post emphasising that I felt that durability and competence of the 800 wasn't an issue for me. I backed that up by saying people I knew had done long travels on them. However I went on to say I tried it, with the intention of buying one, and didn't like it, and explained to the OP why I walked away, and why I felt it was inappropriate for my needs.

And the Tenere is 40 kgs too heavy ... I think the Tenere is even the heaviest single ever built ... so thats hardly a reasonable comparison (lets just compare it to the heaviest single ever built as if that will prove any point). On the other end of the scale the 800 is 50kgs heavier than KTM 690.

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If you find any single with better torque at any RPM please let me know. I have started to design my second high-torque engine and would be very interested to see how they achieved this.