DRZ400S intermittent starting issue

[hsinclai]

For the last two and a half months since I entered India my DRZ has been going through streaks of being very difficult to start. Starter turns fine but it doesn't ignite. If I pull out the choke and twist the throttle hard it'll eventually start chugging and catch with a puff of black smoke, and then I have to leave the throttle on or it dies immediately. I seem to be flooding the engine with my attempts to get it going, but just pressing the button doesn't start it.

Things that make it worse
- Cold engine
- Bad petrol (and in India it can get very bad)
- Cold weather/higher altitude (the only places it's been cold have been 2000m so I'm not sure which it is)

But other times it starts right on the button, and will be fine for weeks. Sometimes it'll come and go in the same day.

Cleaning the carb seemed to help for a while but now it's back. Plug when checked were black with carbon and cleaned. I haven't tried cleaning the tank/fuel screen yet. Valves were checked back in malaysia (so maybe 8000 km ago?). I've taken it to a (good) shop who did the carb cleaning but since nobody's familiar with the bike and the problem is intermittent it's difficult to really get it resolved.

(FYI I'm still a novice when it comes to mechanical stuff but am trying to catch up, so forgive me if I missed something obvious)

Thanks!

- Heather

[docsherlock]

Air filter?

Sounds rich to me; cold and high altitude exacerbation also point to an intake issue.

New plug and air filter should sort it; not sure what type of filter is on your bike but it might be cleanable; if a paper filter, you could try blowing it out with an air compressor - put the nozzle inside the filter and blow out or the opposite way the air enters. If a foam filter, rinse and squeeze in petrol and allow to dry; add some (a little) oil to moisten the filter.

Could also just be shitty gas, but the black plug tells me the bike is running rich and the commonest cause of that is a dirty air filter.

Good luck with it - let us know how you get on.

Regards,

Sean

[hsinclai]

Hmm I cleaned the air filter recently, but because I can't get foam air filter oil here I've been using k&n. Is it possible that is not letting enough air through or that I used too much. Alternatively is there any other reason it might not be getting enough air?

(Edit: Thumpertalk, contrary to the standard instructions to have a 'well oiled filter' seem to recommend squeezing out as much oil as possible after application, so I'll try that, change the spark and not just clean it, and drain/clean the tank anyway and hope for the best. I'm mostly worried if it's an indicator of some part failure - I've heard anything from starter to float - as it'll take about a month to get parts over here.)

[Tomkat]

I have read elsewhere that the DRZ can suffer from wear and fretting of the wires in the ignition pickup where it passes through the case. This could cause intermittent shorting or a weak spark. This may not be your problem but it could be worth checking. You need to take the outer case off to look at the wires inside.

[docsherlock]

Yup - too much oil could be the problem.

Originally Posted by hsinclai

Hmm I cleaned the air filter recently, but because I can't get foam air filter oil here I've been using k&n. Is it possible that is not letting enough air through or that I used too much. Alternatively is there any other reason it might not be getting enough air?

(Edit: Thumpertalk, contrary to the standard instructions to have a 'well oiled filter' seem to recommend squeezing out as much oil as possible after application, so I'll try that, change the spark and not just clean it, and drain/clean the tank anyway and hope for the best. I'm mostly worried if it's an indicator of some part failure - I've heard anything from starter to float - as it'll take about a month to get parts over here.)

[hsinclai]

Okay so I cleaned the air filter (again), changed the spark plug, drained the tank and cleaned the screens and it was still happening, so I handed it over to the local mechanic in Nepal that replaced the battery, rebuilt the starter, tried a new ignition coil from an avenger, cleaned the carb, adjusted the fuel screw, checked the valve timings (with no shims, so using a saw blade and eyeballing it) and fixed some random loose screws and other things - which may have fixed it; but can't be sure yet especially since the rebuilt starter has tight bearings still and every so often needs to be tapped with a screwdriver to get going again

On the upside once it's going it runs a lot better.

[buyarbi]

4 of us ride DRZ 400s. My buddy had similar problems with starting and then stopping on the highway. We went through bad gas, dirty carb, electrical ,and after 2 days of lets try this, we cut the 3 inch hole in the top of the breather box and it ran fine. He did not have a k and N filter.

[docsherlock]

I'm not sure if your starter solenoid was jacked before the mechanic was at it. Sounds like you need a new one; see here for diagnosis and repair:

Starter Solenoid: The Definitive Guide To Solve All the Solenoid Problems

"Checked the valve timing" with a saw blade?? - presumably the valve clearance.....never heard of that bodge but presumably he knew the width of the blade and subbed it as a feeler gauge?

Glad it's running better.

Get a new solenoid or repair the one you have - the tap it with a hammer trick may stop working at some point....

Originally Posted by hsinclai

Okay so I cleaned the air filter (again), changed the spark plug, drained the tank and cleaned the screens and it was still happening, so I handed it over to the local mechanic in Nepal that replaced the battery, rebuilt the starter, tried a new ignition coil from an avenger, cleaned the carb, adjusted the fuel screw, checked the valve timings (with no shims, so using a saw blade and eyeballing it) and fixed some random loose screws and other things - which may have fixed it; but can't be sure yet especially since the rebuilt starter has tight bearings still and every so often needs to be tapped with a screwdriver to get going again

On the upside once it's going it runs a lot better.

[hsinclai]

Originally Posted by docsherlock

"Checked the valve timing" with a saw blade?? - presumably the valve clearance.....never heard of that bodge but presumably he knew the width of the blade and subbed it as a feeler gauge?...

hah yeah the saw blade was his substitute feeler gauge. Apparently all the bikes in Nepal have a "tappet" that doesn't need feeler gauges? The saw blade was the one he used to gap spark plugs.

[Fern]

the enfields have tappets, and good enfield mechanics can tune them by sound... Raju at the Bullet Base Camp for example. The modern 4 strokes should be done with feeler gauges though! When I frequently went to the official enfield dealership in Pok, 2nd biggest after KTM, they marvelled at my multimeter and socket set, they had an AJ, a hammer and that was about it.

They were asked to secure a reg rec back to the frame, they wrapped it in newspaper and tucked it into the tool box nearly setting fire to the bike. They will also hard wire fuses rather than spend the money on a new fuse.

[hsinclai]

Originally Posted by Fern

Raju at the Bullet Base Camp for example. .

Haha well small world; the mechanic I was talking about above was Raju

[hsinclai]

Originally Posted by buyarbi

4 of us ride DRZ 400s. My buddy had similar problems with starting and then stopping on the highway. We went through bad gas, dirty carb, electrical ,and after 2 days of lets try this, we cut the 3 inch hole in the top of the breather box and it ran fine. He did not have a k and N filter.

That was without rejetting the carb for the full 3x3 mod? So weird that worked - I'm a little nervous to start hacking into the bike in case it's not that, as I'm not going to get a new jet kit out here to match.

[Two wheels good]

I'd be inclined to try it with a clean, dry and un-oiled filter. I'd also test it without a filter - briefly and not during a sand-storm - and having first cleaned the airbox with an oily cloth.

[docsherlock]

What would running without a filter achieve?
So much has been done to this bike at once it is impossible to know what the problem is. All we know for sure is it is running rich and hard to start.
Has it got the right grade of spark plug in it?
Is the filter clean and properly oiled?
Are the valve clearances correct?
What fuel is going in?
Too many variables now to offer decent advice IMHO.
If it was my bike, I would put everything back to stock and see what happened, but that may not be possible for this traveler at this time.
Shitty gas would be quite high up on my suspect's list, though....

Originally Posted by Two wheels good

I'd be inclined to try it with a clean, dry and un-oiled filter. I'd also test it without a filter - briefly and not during a sand-storm - and having first cleaned the airbox with an oily cloth.

[hsinclai]

Originally Posted by docsherlock

Has it got the right grade of spark plug in it?
Is the filter clean and properly oiled?
Are the valve clearances correct?
What fuel is going in?

- spark is correct (we put back in the old lightly used pre-trip NGK that I had been using as a spare)
- filter clean and oiled (and it was tried with no filter at all)
- valve clearances.... Maybe? Without feeler gauges it's impossible to say, but it hasn't been that long since they were checked last
- Petrol? Definitely iffy at best.

The problem is happening again so I feel like I probably need someone with a multimeter but I don't think I'm going to find one here....