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  #16  
Old 12 Aug 2011
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I hope for Canard's sake that the BMW he bought in the UK is fault free as otherwise I suspect he'll find out that the only difference between there and here is the salesman's accent.

Good luck with the bike but "better the devil you know" is not a buying philosophy I'd have followed in his position.

Maybe he won't need to reflect on the truth of "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me" but based on what I've seen of the BMW experience I wouldn't bet on it.
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  #17  
Old 13 Aug 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backofbeyond View Post
I hope for Canard's sake that the BMW he bought in the UK is fault free as otherwise I suspect he'll find out that the only difference between there and here is the salesman's accent.

Good luck with the bike but "better the devil you know" is not a buying philosophy I'd have followed in his position.

Maybe he won't need to reflect on the truth of "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me" but based on what I've seen of the BMW experience I wouldn't bet on it.
I can see the logic behind some people's comments.

Why did I buy another BMW..... firstly it was my wife that originally convinced me to buy a GS. My first bikes were all Yamaha's and I managed to get a good deal on a BMW Dakar in 2007 after not riding for a few years. Absolutely lovedd the Dakkie - but 2-up (I'm 6'4 & she's 5'11) -with luggage... in Africa, we were going nowhere fast and teh Dakkie was not capable of carrying us around!

My wife fell in love with the look of the GSA.... (she's a marketing designer) and the comfort of the bike which we test-rode numerous times.
In fact the bike itself is not the problem here... rather the political crap the EU have come out with for their emmission control laws.
So running the GSA in SA with poor fuel and NOT adjusting the ECU to compensate... this was the real issue as well as BMW-SA's failure and cowardice to insist that Germany supplies the SA clients with alternate fuel mapping...... IN FACT - even pointing out that on BMW's Marketing Brochure there's mention made of "optional poor fuel mapping available" - did not get them to sort out the problem.
For those of you that still have those glossy pages... have a look under the specifications section where this is clearly mentioned....

The problem for BMW-SA was that .. if they did change the mapping - they would technically be admitting there's a fuel issue. THIS is what they did not want to do... and they literally bulldoze their client's or should I say BULLSHIT - into thinking the problem is not serious.

So to make a long story short - the vehicle is not the problem - it's like a race-horse with one of it's legs being shackled... by BMW!

The volcano eruption in Iceland pumped more carp into the atmosphere than any of our vehicles do....

The fact that I bought another GSA - well I'm hoping that being closer to Germany... if I do indeed have a problem, I'll feel NOTHING to ride over there and take the bike back to the factory (obviously being reasonable ..) and we do so love the actual bike and love touring on it.

I have always believed that any product is only as good as the service or support backing it receives.... here BMW in SA failed their brand!

I'm willing to try again... same bike , different country... however if it fails here as well... then I will sell the bike and replace it with either a Yamaha... or showing my age, a Triumph scrambler... maybe even a Norton!
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  #18  
Old 14 Aug 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canard View Post
I can see the logic behind some people's comments.




The problem for BMW-SA was that .. if they did change the mapping - they would technically be admitting there's a fuel issue. THIS is what they did not want to do... and they literally bulldoze their client's or should I say BULLSHIT - into thinking the problem is not serious.

The problem is not serious because you bought another bike from them. It would become serious if you sent them a photocopy of an invoice for another brand of bike to replace it.
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  #19  
Old 25 Apr 2012
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Question 2011 R1200GSA pre-ignition and pinging

Hi, I came across your post via Google. I am aware you have a 2009 model but I am experiencing something similar on my 2011 GSA. I have a post on ADVRider, do you think it is the same thing you referred to? Has your issue been resolved?

See:
2011 R1200GSA misfire or stall? - ADVrider

Kevin
Cape Town /\/¯¯¯¯¯\/\ South Africa
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  #20  
Old 25 Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbmw View Post
The problem is not serious because you bought another bike from them. It would become serious if you sent them a photocopy of an invoice for another brand of bike to replace it.
I wish, but BMW are not interested in single, individual customers.
They are not alone in that; in this day and age, manufacturers and service providers will react best to mass media coverage, lobbying and that form of activity that represents a body of people - the more the better.
Apart from that, I believe that BMW can still sell every 1200GS that comes off their production line.

Your BMW May be a LEMON, and don't expect help from BMW!


Quote:
Originally Posted by CandyMan_ZA View Post
Hi, I came across your post via Google. I am aware you have a 2009 model but I am experiencing something similar on my 2011 GSA. I have a post on ADVRider, do you think it is the same thing you referred to? Has your issue been resolved?

See:
2011 R1200GSA misfire or stall? - ADVrider

Kevin
Cape Town /\/¯¯¯¯¯\/\ South Africa
I have struggled a bit to understand the problem here because way back in this thread Canard says that you are using 95 octane fuel in SA which is commonly in use here in the UK, with no obvious detrimental pinging reported. Thereafter, does the reported issue come down to the higher ambient temperature issue that is mentioned (I haven't waded through the link to the SA website)?
It seems that Canards' solution to the problem was to move to the UK and buy another 1200GS - a newer model with less problems in the cold, dank, wet UK??!
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  #21  
Old 26 Apr 2012
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Kevin - my issue as well as the problem with the other GS/GSA's that requested that BMW resolve the issue was merely met with total indifference.
Even the fact that the GS/GSA Sales brochure that they provide, states that there is a free optional "Poor Fuel Map" for the ECU listed under extra's - met with no response and I was told they could not do it as the bikes had to leave the factory with settings and emmissions that complied with the EU-standards.......... bugger the fact that we live in SA, have very hot temps, poor fuel etc.

I was also told catagorically by Steli Momos from BMW-SA that I was "just one client" and that there were too few of us to warrant them approaching BMW-GA to change or resolve the issue........... so much for customer relations.

There is a very long thread also dealing with these issues on the Wilddog.za.net website in SA........... have a looksee and good luck matey!

Issues like these will ONLY ever be resolved when the consumers stand together and affect their pockets,... then they will listen.

In the meantime....as Walkabout suggested.... I sold my GSA in South Africa beginning of last year........ bought a brand new DOHC in the UK for R20k less than I sold my 2009 GSA... (figures that we get nailed in SA) and my 2011 also came with all the bells & whistles and free Alu luggage (try getting that in SA).
The 2011 is perfect and runs like a dream......... on decent fuel and colder climate.

During my visit to Cape Town the past 2 months ... I bought myself a REAL bike (and I feel 17 again) ...... this 30yr-old XT550 is in pristine condition, starts first kick, DOES NOT PING and made me realise that my GSA would probably not be around in 30-yrs time (My mate has an old R75/5 Beemer that still runs sweet.... but then it doesn't have all the electronic crap the new bikes do)

So when visiting SA......... I'll be riding this beauty!



Quote:
Originally Posted by CandyMan_ZA View Post
Hi, I came across your post via Google. I am aware you have a 2009 model but I am experiencing something similar on my 2011 GSA. I have a post on ADVRider, do you think it is the same thing you referred to? Has your issue been resolved?

See:
2011 R1200GSA misfire or stall? - ADVrider

Kevin
Cape Town /\/¯¯¯¯¯\/\ South Africa
Attached Thumbnails
BMW R1200GS/GSA "pinging" leading to possible Engine Failure!-26778jh_20.jpeg  

BMW R1200GS/GSA "pinging" leading to possible Engine Failure!-p1080070.jpg  

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  #22  
Old 26 Apr 2012
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Usually down to mods-like K&N filters + fast flowing exhausts etc all very nice but these will hugely increase the 'bike running lean' problem.

Some mods are perceived as not 'sexy' yet are some of the most important ones- such as changing the suspension and fitting a fuel controller in the case of the R1200GS.
I fitted one on my 1200 and never had a problem as I was able to fine tune the fuel flow across the whole rpm range.
The only downside was a slightly increased fuel consumption-
Solution: Fit a Fuel controller -

Lovely XT Canard !
Attached Thumbnails
BMW R1200GS/GSA "pinging" leading to possible Engine Failure!-pic001-copy.jpg  

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  #23  
Old 22 Jun 2012
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Post R1200GSA pinging, knocking, pre-ignition, detonation, stall

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
Usually down to mods-like K&N filters + fast flowing exhausts etc all very nice but these will hugely increase the 'bike running lean' problem.

Some mods are perceived as not 'sexy' yet are some of the most important ones- such as changing the suspension and fitting a fuel controller in the case of the R1200GS.
I fitted one on my 1200 and never had a problem as I was able to fine tune the fuel flow across the whole rpm range.
The only downside was a slightly increased fuel consumption-
Solution: Fit a Fuel controller -

Lovely XT Canard !
Unfortunately fitting such a device will void the BMW 2 year warranty

I have this discussion on the Air/Fuel running lean, pinging, knocking, pre-ignition and detonation on our R1200GS DOHC bikes going at the forums below as well, makes for some interesting reading, pop over and browse around, it will be worth it

2011 R1200GSA misfire/pre-ignition/knock/ping/detonation? | BMW Motorcycle Club Cape
R1200GSA erratic idle, misfire, pre-ignition, detonation, ping, knock and stall
R1200GSA erratic idle, misfire, pre-ignition, detonation, ping, knock and stall - ::. UKGSer.com .::
2011 R1200GSA misfire or stall? - ADVrider

Kevin
/\/¯¯¯¯¯\/\
R1200GS-WP
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  #24  
Old 22 Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canard View Post
Even the fact that the GS/GSA Sales brochure that they provide, states that there is a free optional "Poor Fuel Map" for the ECU listed under extra's - met with no response and I was told they could not do it as the bikes had to leave the factory with settings and emmissions that complied with the EU-standards.......... bugger the fact that we live in SA, have very hot temps, poor fuel etc.
your dealers diagnostic system will have this map on them, obviously as you have bought the bike you will probably have to pay for them to put it on.
If you ask their aftersales department they should be able to activate this map.
this is available, as far as im aware, on all current bmws with programmable ecus.
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  #25  
Old 22 Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonylester View Post
your dealers diagnostic system will have this map on them, obviously as you have bought the bike you will probably have to pay for them to put it on.
If you ask their aftersales department they should be able to activate this map.
this is available, as far as im aware, on all current bmws with programmable ecus.
Nope "no such map available"
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  #26  
Old 23 Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonylester View Post
your dealers diagnostic system will have this map on them, obviously as you have bought the bike you will probably have to pay for them to put it on.
If you ask their aftersales department they should be able to activate this map.
this is available, as far as im aware, on all current bmws with programmable ecus.
The dealership as well as BMW-SA themselves have indicated they had no knowledge of this "Optional Poor Fuel Map" ............. amazing - as their brochure clearly advertised the fact that it's available - see attached!

Worst part is that even AFTER we pointed this out... they still refused to load it whether we paid or not!
Methinks that they know very well what the problems are but have dealt out so many excuses and crap to their clients - that if they now actually do something to help, it would be tantamount to admitting they have in fact been wrong all along.

My BIGGEST problem was always that there are too many people that love the roundel-badge whether good or bad........ and too few willing to admit there might be a problem and actually stand up for their rights. Dunno what it is.... maybe "lemming-syndrome" to just follow the pack . or maybe their ego's will take a knock if they admit they actually bought something that might have a problem.

Until we stick together as riders, bike-lovers, clients and consumers against the bullying of BMW.... we might as well throw in the towel!
Attached Thumbnails
BMW R1200GS/GSA "pinging" leading to possible Engine Failure!-bmw-brochure.jpg  

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  #27  
Old 23 Jun 2012
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Well dealers in the uk have it on their systems, which should be the same as SA, and have never been told not to load it onto bikes if asked. Maybe they just dont realise its there. Either that or BMW AG didnt load in onto SA systems, which is kinda stupid.
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  #28  
Old 24 Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonylester View Post
Well dealers in the uk have it on their systems, which should be the same as SA, and have never been told not to load it onto bikes if asked. Maybe they just dont realise its there. Either that or BMW AG didnt load in onto SA systems, which is kinda stupid.
I agree with you.... but you must remember that the Saffers are a really arrogant bunch!
To admit they are wrong or perhaps missed something or that an outsider can come and show them how/what to do .... is sometimes not acceptable.
We would have thought that BMW-SA would do everything in their power to avoid negative PR and that to have client's singing their praises, would be one of the priority reasons for getting the problem solved, but as you can see - not only from Kevin's post, but all the links he's given on numerous other forums - it's easier walking into a brick wall that getting them to resolve the problem.

........... in fact I lie - they did try suggest one way of solving the problem.... (which I was flabberghasted about as we're always pre-warned not to use aftermarket additives) .... we were instructed to add Octane booster to every tank of fuel (obviously at our own cost) . but it SA it added 25% to the cost of a tank of fuel
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  #29  
Old 24 Jun 2012
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Angry R1200GS erratic idle and intermittent stalling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canard View Post
........... in fact I lie - they did try suggest one way of solving the problem....
Wait! Here is another way to solve the problem is, I quote BMW SA, "ride around the problem" even if that means "change your riding style"
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  #30  
Old 24 Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canard View Post
The dealership as well as BMW-SA themselves have indicated they had no knowledge of this "Optional Poor Fuel Map" ............. amazing - as their brochure clearly advertised the fact that it's available - see attached!

Worst part is that even AFTER we pointed this out... they still refused to load it whether we paid or not!
When I asked if they could load a different fuel map, possibly one with a richer mix in the low revs I was told, "it is not possible, we just plug the bike's computer into the MOSS computer and press the button, it automatically verifies with BMW and checks for updates and does a diagnostic test, we cannot change the fuel map, we cannot change anything" ::
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