Go Back   Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB > Regional Forums > North Africa
North Africa Topics specific to North Africa and the Sahara down to the 17th parallel (excludes Morocco)
Photo by Ellen Delis, Lagunas Ojos del Campo, Antofalla, Catamarca

I haven't been everywhere...
but it's on my list!


Photo by Ellen Delis,
Lagunas Ojos del Campo,
Antofalla, Catamarca



Trans Sahara Routes.

Like Tree21Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Registered Users
New on the HUBB
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 5
Quote:
if you can be kidnapped sitting in a restaurant in a city in broad daylight, then what?
And that is what's so startling about the Timbuktu attack, that they were able to get in and out again in broad daylight. The charge of complicity is a bit hard to avoid, isn't it? Unfortunate as that is, it feels like somebody allowed this to happen either voluntarily or under duress.

Or do people think that's unreasonable? Could a strange vehicle drive straight to the Amanar (it is conveniently right on the northwest edge of town) grab the victims who just happened to be there at the right time, and leave again, without anyone helping them or recognising them?

Richard
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Chris Scott's Avatar
Super Moderator
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 4,811
I think most of the grabs since 2003 have involved some sort of tip offs and then turning a blind eye (how the Austrians got from Tunisia all the way to Mali in 2008 is a good example).

But IMO 'Timbuktu' [ie: the event last Friday] seems to have either broken the rules or changed the game, and its unlikely to think they would have - or will - get away with the former.

Ch


[speculative discussions on this post moved to here]

Last edited by Chris Scott; 29 Nov 2011 at 08:08. Reason: clarified
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Titbird's Avatar
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Back in Europe
Posts: 181
According to this Dutch article the Swedish and South African guy where motorcyclists:
Vakantie in Mali eindigt abrupt met ontvoering – een reconstructie :: nrc.nl

The Dutch lady was just getting something out of the rooftent of the car when she saw her husband been taken away and the german, who was just in the wrong place at the wrong time being shot.
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/1012/Binnenla...htmerrie.dhtml
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 292
Some years ago the Americans had a permanent military base in Timbuktu. I once knocked at their door and then the first question was: how you know we are here? Rather stupid, because I just had to ask some Malians for the right directions. Are they still there permanently, or are they mostly moving nowadays?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: London, UK
Posts: 57
I travelled down through Mali 2 weeks ago. From the description of the people abducted, it sounds like we may have travelled with them through Mauritania. We entered Mali together then went our separate ways.

I'm desperate to find out if they are ok, I've emailed them but so far they have not replied. I've emailed the UK's FCO and SA' DFA but no response.

Any ideas on what I should do next?

Thanks

Russell

P.S Guys, you now who you are, if you are you reading this please get in touch.
__________________
Pikipiki Safari - UK to South Africa, Argentina to Colombia 2011/2012
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,460
Swedish guy, 36 yo biker from Stockholm, driving with a pal to South Africa. They split up temporarily as he wanted to make "a tour of the best country in WA"...
He met the dutch couple, the brit/SAn and the german and they went together to Timbuktu. And then.....really bad luck.

UPDATE here are the names!
maliweb.net :: * Enl�vements, dissidences * Etat de guerre au Nord-Mali * Kidnapp�s * Assassin�
"...a little past 13 hours. Toyota BJ station outside the hotel with four men in turbans and trellis. Of "white skin". Two rush into the hotel and close the gate.

Outside remains the driver and another standing guard at the gate, but not for long. The attackers emerged less than ten minutes later with the three tourists they throw handcuffed in the back of the car. They are: Stephen Malcolm Gown* é January 28, 1975 in South Africa, Columbia and South Africa: Nils Johan Viktor Gustafson, Swedish born April 18, 1975 in Karlstad: Jacobus Nicolo Ruke, Dutch, born February 11, 1960 at Beverbuk whose wife owes her salvation to the fact of having hidden in a tent. That's when the German tourist, Martin Eugen Arker born May 18, 1953 in Berlin, comes out of a shop and the terrorists motions him to get in the car. He refuses to comply.

Wrangling. The German is tough and fights well. He receives a bullet in the chest and collapses. Heroically, he pulls himself up and holds on to the car, and then tries to grab the terrorist, who shoots him fatally in the head. It's over. The lifeless body lying on the ground but the brain particles stick to a van parked on the premises advertising the horror. Tragedy: the kidnappers leave as they came.

At eighteen hours, twenty army vehicles under the authority of the Commander Ag Kamo Minini begin proceedings before a disgusted population and in two directions: Taoudeni and that of Gundam. They return, empty-handed, the next day to 18 hours. The day before, the hotel is emptied of tourists staying overnight at the police before being "exfiltration" the next day on Mopti and Bamako.
And Sunday, but sounded decent, Karl Flitner, the German Ambassador in Bamako accompanied by a member of the Malian government, by bringing the body of his compatriot. Already, the Quai d'Orsay had pulled out his red felt he bar across Northern and central Mali. We can not blame him. There are now six French, one Swedish, one Dutch and Anglo-South African who is in the hands of terrorists in the Sahel. AQIM? For the hostages Arlit, for sure, since the nebula has claimed. But for the abduction of Hombori and Timbuktu, there is no for now to criminalize men Belmokhtar. The signature is always good likeness but AQIM claimed or denied. But this is not the case.
But if it is confirmed that AQIM, then there is no doubt that the jihadists who generally avoid abduction on Malian soil, declared war on Bamako. Why would AQIM do this when there is a sacred covenant against it in the sub-region? Perhaps precisely because of this. But let's see. The president, visibly upset and called all his indignation to avoid confusion."

DID IT TAKE 4½ HOURS TO GET THE ARMY GOING???


* 'S M Gown' - actually S McGown? Ch

Last edited by Chris Scott; 22 Apr 2021 at 13:49.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 28 Nov 2011
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: London, UK
Posts: 57
Damnit, thats him. He was on an XT600 and we travelled together for a week entering Mali together. Really nice bloke. No mention of the guy he was traveling with.

Asolutely guttered right now!

Is there anything I can do apart from wait for the FCO to maybe get back to me?

Guttered...
__________________
Pikipiki Safari - UK to South Africa, Argentina to Colombia 2011/2012
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 28 Nov 2011
nomadic's Avatar
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 46
Dutch news mentioned the names of the 4WD overlanders today on TV / Radio.

I think the name mentioned above "Jacobus Nicolo Ruke" is in fact Sjaak Rijke from Woerden - The Netherlands. He's a train driver for the dutch railroad.

A cached version of his weblog. (as long as its there)
__________________
Arno
Overland by 4x4 truck
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 29 Nov 2011
nomadic's Avatar
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 46
And here's the report about the unfortunate German, shot while resisting being kidnapped.

It seems he traveled in a convoy of two overland trucks

Berliner Tourist in Mali ermordet

The translated version with Google Translate
__________________
Arno
Overland by 4x4 truck
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 29 Nov 2011
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Piraeus
Posts: 53
RIP Martin....

hope the best for the other travelers
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 30 Nov 2011
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 921
Spent some time chatting to the Swedish guy just before Diama about a month ago...

Small world, Sam.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 30 Nov 2011
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,460
Another eyewitness account. And Bamako blaming MNA.
http://www.maliweb.net/category.php?NID=83952
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 3 Dec 2011
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 42
Hotel Alafia ... I know the place: a small establishment, protected by high walls on all sides, situated on the NW edge of town. The first dunes are some 500 metres west. You park a toyo in front of the gate and nobody gets in nor out. Used to be swiss or italian owned (had another name then, forgot which), but was recently (2011, maybe 2010) bought and renovated by british folk. Nice place, nice personnel in our experience. Small yard, big enough for three, maybe four vehicles. Ideal for kidnapping, come to think of it.

Kidnapper car a toyo BJ??? Odd, wouldn't you think? Not exactly a race car.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 3 Dec 2011
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 42
Aha, maybe the old name for the Alafia hotel was Amanar, anybody has any knowledge on that? The hostages couldn't have been dining in Alafia as it has no restaurant, at least it didn't have one until very recently.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 3 Dec 2011
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,460
I think the restaurant was Amanar and the hotel Alafia. But could be wrong.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


 
 

Announcements

Thinking about traveling? Not sure about the whole thing? Watch the HU Achievable Dream Video Trailers and then get ALL the information you need to get inspired and learn how to travel anywhere in the world!

Have YOU ever wondered who has ridden around the world? We did too - and now here's the list of Circumnavigators!
Check it out now
, and add your information if we didn't find you.

Next HU Eventscalendar

HU Event and other updates on the HUBB Forum "Traveller's Advisories" thread.
ALL Dates subject to change.

2024:

Add yourself to the Updates List for each event!

Questions about an event? Ask here

HUBBUK: info

See all event details

 
World's most listened to Adventure Motorbike Show!
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)



Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance.

Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.

Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.

Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!


 

What others say about HU...

"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia

"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK

"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia

"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA

"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada

"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa

"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia

"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany

Lots more comments here!



Five books by Graham Field!

Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook

"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.



Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!

New to Horizons Unlimited?

New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!

Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.

Susan and Grant Johnson Read more about Grant & Susan's story

Membership - help keep us going!

Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.

You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.




All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:03.