Why not a back-pack?
 

Hi all,
I'm a newbie on this site and pick up my new pride and joy (06 Yamaha TTR250) Wednesday.
After all the research and dredging all the available websites it was down to that or a Suzuki DRZ 250. Smaller machines have a peculiar appeal.
So my first question:
Given the popularity of small adventure style bikes and the availability of light weight clothing, tents, sleeping bags etc Why do people not use a back-pack to store all their gear?
Given the TTR is small I will be looking at a bumbag (tools etc) a small rear dry sack and a waterproof back-pack.
Given all that I still have to try and pack it all in...and yes I would like to be self sufficient and carry cooking gear.
Travelling small and light in Oz is a real option. Also intend to carry fishing gear (another passion of mine)
No trips planned as yet as I need to get the bike (and myself) prepared.
Oh yeah, the GPS is purchased and ready to be wired up, as is the auxiliary 12v power supply.

Cheers.
Julian.

I travelled around Asia with a backpack strapped to the rear of the bike, it worked great but I was only carrying 20 litres and no Camping equipment.

Sounds like you will be carrying more, if the weight builds up you need to carry it as low as possible.

Pack everything and go for a few test rides, see how it feels. Hard luggage gives added security but you can always arrive at your destination and keep your backpack with you or dump it in the hotel then go off exploring. When you stop for food keep the bike in sight.

backpacks
 

Hi there
I assume you mean a pack on your back....
I can think of several reasons backpacks aren't used often.
You are raising the center of gravity and making you and the bike more unstable.
You will be putting much more strain on your back muscles, and your arms.
If you fell off, the extra weight would add to your mass, and perhaps cause you more injury, and more damage to the equipment in the backpack.You say you would carry cooking equipment, I wouldn't fancy landing on my back on top of a stove.
Traveling in any hot weather would make your back sweaty, and cause chaffing and sores where the shoulder straps rubbed.
I guess few other travelers use backpacks for the same reasons.

cheap and light traveling
 

cheap and light traveling gear is exacty righy... less is more...
considering a max weight pack of 20Kg may 25Kg incl 9L. of water strapped to a parcel carrier on a 250cc to 650cc class Enduro bike is perfect. A Rucksack of 34L. to 45L. will do just fine.

I use one of this water tight £30 as 34L. army style rucksack (one main compartment with two added side pockets) "strapped flat" on the parcel carrier that is extended by one of this "Turatech parcel-carrier ally plates" on my KTM LC4, a bumbag for my personal stuff like camera and small tools, a 3L. Camelback on my Back and a 6L. MSR water sack straped some where else. The rucksack contains a "Shimano exage ax stc mini telescopic spinning rod 2.1m" incl a small box-4x5inch for all that fishing hooks, Basha, cooking gear, food like sugar, tea, oil and dry stuff is stored in "platypus" folding bottles, one bottle of all purpose liquid soap for all your needs like "washing up, bath/shower, helping tyres on to the wheel", and the best of all, it even fit a Hennessy-hammock that way there is no need for a tent or sleeping mat, no pegs or poles are needed, bugs and mossies can't get you either at night. The sleeping bag is strapped on top of the rucksack. That way it will give free movement riding off road with ease let you have all the movements you need like standing up on the pegs and drifting not even noticing the gear you carrying, and you need less fuel, being more air-dynamically compare to this big chunky ally coffins.
Tyre tools like long leaver and air pump are wrapped water tight in a peace of old rear tyre tube and cable tied to the rear frame.

Now the benefit of having a small pack is that "if" and that can happened easily, "if" you come of your bike or it just falling over some how, there would be no damage to your gear, no dent in your expensive pannier boxes any more and easy to pick up again. Specially riding in the heat and sand it will make a big difference being on a "small-foot-print" without getting exhausted instantly or need to rely on a helping hand. Nor do you need to alter any suspension setup just use the std. as you would ride as normal for a quick spin....
If you worried about security... just take every thing off the bike at ones and park your bike bare naked over night if you rest in a small hotel or hostel... the rucksack with 25Kg is easy to carry on your back if not riding like any other backpacker would run around, that way you travel light and easy. I would not even think about riding and having a big rucksack on my back, rather let my bike carrying the load just fixed by a few straps... but consider extending the parcel carrier a bit to prevent the rucksack from sliding and wiggling around.

I guess many people believe they have to carry more than they a actual need at the end.... and I mean "think about what you really NEED" forget your "toys" let the toys at home and reduce every thing to your essentials only and you find that this 20-25Kg rule for your pack is just right.
Well there is one exception to that rule.. "depending on your trip and where you want to go and how long"... a fishing rod is not needed in the desert but very handy in Scandinavia for getting some extra food supplies....

On the other hand... the "Outdoor-live-style-shops" make us believe that we need all this fancy crap, a special item for some special purpose and have to travel styled up to impress other travelers and pose with all that adventures gear.... wonder why so many travelers get robbed and hit by reality for exact that reason.... well... that way it keeps the economy flow of rich countries up and running I presume...

spooky

Backpack will do fine, especially for Oz.

Bill's right, you do need more strength as you'll be supporting more weight, but overall I think control improves because the bike becomes more managable. For explanation of this opinion, consider that standing up on the pegs increases control, even though the CoG of the bike-rider system is now higher.

Depends mostly on what sort of riding you want to do, alloy panniers and packing everything on the bike favours a more long-distance, border-crossing, foreign city, less off-road approach. Carrying a backpack with most of your camping gear in it favours a more off-road, wilderness approach.

I met a man in Warburton who rode the CSR unsupported, on a TTR600. He was carrying all his camping gear and food on his back, a good 30 or 40 kg, and a bumbag tool roll. All he had strapped to the bike was fuel, water, a tent and his sleeping bag (fuel and water strapped low on the sides and the bulky, but light, tent and bag on top).

backpack
 

Years ago when first getting into travel I too thought carrying stuff in a backpack on my back might be handy. After trying it I soon discarded the idea as totally impractical and very uncomfortable. After a short while the constant pressure , pinching and chafing,bouncing around of the load get to be torture.Not to mention the irritation of sweat trapped under the rubbing clothes.Then the part about having to unload it every time you stop, securing it to the bike ..
Best to just tie the backpack to the bike in the first place. Or hoqw about packing all your less frequently used supplies in a waterproof bag or wrap and tieing the backpack on top of that so you can uitlize the various pockets and compartments for the items you need to access frquently. Just leave the tent out of all the packing so it can air out.

backpack on bike good, on back bad!
 

Hi Julian. I made the mistake of carrying a loaded backpack on my back for a long trip only once! It was a long pack so when I sat down, the top was higher than my head, and acted as a wind-sock. At the end of the day, my arms were about 15cm longer....

Truely, if you use a backpack (and plenty of people have) lay it down on the back of the bike either across or in line if it fits that way, to get the weight lower. It DOES need to be low. I have used the excellent Hallmark (now Ventura) pack frames on many of my bikes, and even then, how well you get the heavy stuff low makes a noticeable difference to the handling. If you ride very far off tarmac, you WILL be standing a lot on the footpegs. The extra 20-25kgs will tire you out, and reduce your ability to throw your body around to get over the really knarley stuff. The other advantage of having the pack strapped to the back is that you have something to lean back against.

Even with a pack, I would be looking out for a cheap set of second hand fabric throw-over panniers on Ebay. They work find and really do protect the bike in an "off" without taking your leg with them. I have three sets, picked up for bugger all over the years that I am always lending to new bike travelers.

But the main thing is that you get out there and do it. No matter how you plan it or pack it, someone has done it before the same way and succeeded.

Kind regards

Nigel in NZ

A backpack on the back of the bike is fine. I used it in the past too.
The disadvantage (in my opinion) of all soft luggage is that it can not easy be locked like alu paniers or even a plastic topcase. It is a safe idea that your stuff is not taken away to easy when you are in a restaurant or shop or sightseing a nice town.
If someone realy wants it, it is hard to stop them but I make it less easy so I hope they pick an easier victim.
(When you are chased by a tiger, you don't have to outrun the tiger, just the other guy)

I like this one!

:clap::clap::clap:

Try it ...
 

I toured once from Sydney to Adelaide using a backpack on a 250 trail bike .. I've not repeated that test since.

Consider a fall onto the backpack .. you'll want the contants to be soft, not lumpy with hard bits like cooking gear, food, pens, boooks etc etc. Eitehr that or hard but flat .. I know TK uses a pelican case inside a back pack for his camera gear ..

---- The alternative is soft throw over panniers .. Andy Strapz have a good reputation.

To make it short...
 

....strapping the pack to your back is the most incovenient thing you can do.

4 years ago I went on a 2000 km touring to Mt Fuji (Japan). Tell ya, it (I ???) was hazardous!! Like others already said, you are too much "top^loaded", causing balance problems and much more. Strapping the backpack on the seat works fine, but again, for a couple of $$$ you can get appropriate packs to strap to your bike. To see what my "backpack-experience" looked like - why not check out this: Mt. Fuji Motorcycle Touring

Cheers Guys...
 

Well, i guess the other alternative is the following:
Sealine 40/50L dry bag strapped to the rear seat.
Waterproof Back-pack for valuables, camera, GPS, phone, wallet, papers etc. Makes sight seeing easier.
Tool Roll/Bumbag for tools etc. Tyre levers would be strapped to bike somewhere

Have been minimilist camping before and enjoy the freedom it brings.
Other Items are:
2 person 3 season tent 2kg with poles
Small Tarp
Sleeping mat
Palm sleeping bag
If it gets cold just wear more clohes to bed.
Cooking and eating gear is really basic and I would love to get some of that titanium gear but bloody expensive.
All I need now is some room for the fishing gear:
Travel Rod 3 piece
2500 Spinning reel
Small? selection of plastics, jig heads and lures.

Good thing about Oz and NZ is that you are never really to far from the madding crowd...mind you that brings its own issues and remote area camping/riding is what I like about all this best.

On some of my travels with work I have come across some magic spots that may as well be on Mars but are really not that far off the beaten track.

Cheers.

Julian.

probably no need but
 

apart from all that is stated ,if you go down with a back back you loose the ability to roll and you will be face planted with that monster on your back , a def no, no safety wise

I{m currently using a backpack only to carry my computer. It sucks and i hate it! At less than 5kg. i only last half as long, my shoulders get really sore. I{m up to 800mg of Ibuprofin a day! I sugest loading all your stuff on the bike, not your back.

I used it and had no problems...I put the heavier stuff in my saddlebags and the bulkier stuff in the backpack...strapped it down with crating straps BMW uses to tie down their bikes when shipped from factory...they're free at dealers and can hold down close to 250kgs each...guaranteed...I did it...not a big issue...keep the weight low and as close to center(between the wheels) as possible...

dscn8559.jpg

nice_piste.jpg

I frequently use a backpack on trips, just don't wear it when you are riding - you'll be sore within an hour, and it's very unsafe. If you've ever fallen with a backpack while hiking, you'll know it's much worse than it sounds, and falling off a bike with the thing at any speed would be bad news. Security for your stuff is an issue, but if it's a questionable locale, I just carry the stuff along - it is, after all, a backpack!

You can eventually figure ways to pack most of what you think you have to have.

Cheers Guys
 

Have purchased a 40l dry bag that can be strapped to the seat behind me. Small waterproof back-pack for camera etc and will look into the tool tube idea. The bash plate is next on the list, fitted the GPS and a rear brake cylinder protector at the weekend. New bars with risers,and a few other bits and pieces to come. Also looking at changing the rear/front sprocket for better road speeds.
As said I am in to minimilist camping gear bso fitting it all on shouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for the help and will post pics when all finished.

PS Mollydog...
Great idea with the standoffs for the bags.

Cheers.
Julian.

Just my two penneth -

I too tried to minimise my kit, and the solution I used on my XR650R was as follows:

Small rear rack with a soft tail-bag on (expandable and holds a helmet, that sort of size) - this contained all my food, waterbag, toiletry bag, Jetboil cooking pot, tools, tube, few spares/oil and a loo roll!

I then used a 30 litre dry-bag bungeed on the set between me and the tailpack which contained my sleeping bag, thermarest and tent (cosy two man size), plus a pair of sandles for when off the bike.

Finally all my clothes and the odd book/map went in a narrow 30 litre rucksack on my back, which had the benefit of resting on the dry bag when seated, taking the weight off... and as someone said above, when standing has the effect of lowering the CoG more than if it were strapped to the rear of the bike.

Although I felt loaded up intially, this set-up worked surprisingly well over 4000 miles of mixed highway & byway and desert dirt road riding across Nevada, Oregon and California.

As long as you keep the ruck sack for soft stuff/clothing only, I think it's certainly viable for a few weeks' riding at a time?

JennyMo xxx

Pics of your XR?
 

I guess that XR has a stronger rear sub-frame that I thought!

Hi Mollydog - I haven't got the pictures hosted yet, but hopefully I can upload a link to them below:

I too wondered about the strength of the 650R subframe, but it seems to have held up perfectly well (so far) with what I was carrying. I used the XR's Only billet rack which is a lovely piece of work, if a little expensive - but you do get what you pay for...

They bike handled very well with the load - I do have a GPR steering damper fitted too though. Sustaining 50-60mph on the dirt roads was no problem, and even on the more rocky technical trails I rode, it did not feel particularly unstable.

I stared off in Vegas, headed west though red rock/spring mountains and into Death Valley from the southern end. I'd planned to spend a couple of days there, but ended up heading straight up past Ubehebe and out past the Eureka dunes, as I had to be in San Francisco the following evening.

Went though Yosemite on the 120 (Tioga pass was still open), but exited via the valley floor and the 140 - took the Briceburg Road (dirt road/trails) north west towards Modesto and had a great afternoon in the mountains on the forest trails - the GPS had them all in the map memory!

Spent a few days in San Francisco with friends, then headed via Napa and over the Sierra's on hwy 4 to Lake Tahoe and Truckee. Found some great trails north of there on my way to Doyle and Gerlach - although I did get stuck in the Smoke Creek desert (soft wet sand) and ended up camping out the night next to the railroad in a frozen tent!

From Gerlach and black rock I headed up Oregon - Lakeview and the Hart Mountains / Abert Rim and up to Fort Rock, then China Hat to Bend. Another great OHV trail area.

From Bend I headed south via Crater Lake, down highway 199 into California through the redwoods, then cut inland from Eureka and spent a week criss crossing from Highway 1 into the mountains and forests and back, via San Francisco and Santa Cruz/ Big Sur (found another great OHV trail network east of San Luis Obispo between Pozo and La Panza) and down to LA across the Carrizo Plain and hwy 33.

For the most part I tried to stay of the main highways, and took the scenic or dirt road option - the bike was excellent in those conditions and some of the tarmac roads were just as much fun as the dirt! However, it is drinking oil and the compression is down, so I'm currently back in Vegas getting it sorted under warranty.

All being well, I'll be heading out via southern Utah into Arizona next week, athough I think I'm going to have to cut the Mexican/baja leg of the this trip, as I'm due to fly out on the 27th December.

I've just realised, this has sort of turned into a bit a thread hijack hasn't it?

Still, it proves you can ride all of that with a backpack on...

JennyMo xxx

Wey hey! it does work - here are three more then...

xxx

we all steer motorcycles with our heads, in the end, by looking where we want to go and then transferring body weight. you don´t want anything impeding that freedom of movenent, and a backpack does just that.

high centre of gravity (COG) is bad any time but even worse off road. consider that motocrossers and enduro riders throw their legs out and forwards as they sit into corners in order to have more weight down, forward and inside the corner, to get better front- wheel grip, adn you understand how small changes to COG make a big difference.

a backpack would be even moer hassle if it was loose and able to move around independently of rider and bike. like, dangerous. and who wants a backpack tied tightly to them any time? sweaty and icky. like plenty have said.

when you stand up on the footpegs of a bike, most of the increase of control, especially at speed, is due to the fact that you can keep your head and body stable while the bike wobbles around under you, doing its thing according to road surface and all that. fix the weight firmly to the bike and let it vibrate, slew adn wobble, but keep yourself free of weight and stable.

for other soft luggage ideas, check out andy strapz. well made stuf.
cheers,
andy (not the strapz bloke)

respect to J´mo and piglet, but...
 

man, you are clearly an experienced rider!
but ttrkiwi is clearly asking his question from the point of view of less experience. let´s help him ride safely. every chance he has not yet pulled a wheelie (or might be practicing as we speak!), so let´s not encourage him to ull his first ones with a backpack on.

cheers, nice photos, too.
see you in the sand,
andy.

Andy,
Great description of how dirt bikes work,

Nope. It's lower, on the assumption that the rider is attempting to keep on top of a wobbling bike. EG If the bike was banked over at 30 degrees, the rider would adjust to upright* and apply their full weight at the pegs against this action. If they don't take action and went with the bike then yes you are correct! I suspect you know this :) and meant that the additional weight of the backpack therefore helps to keep the overall CoG lower when stood up, even though it raises it whenever the rider is sitting on the seat / not balancing around. Nit-picking I know!!

*CoG only matters if the object is leaning - eg it doesn't matter in a tower, until it starts to topple. Keep the tower upright, and the weight is still being applied at the ground (and in our example, adding the weight of the rider to the bike at the pegs).

Anyhow, I always wear my backpack/camelpack. Water, maps, a fleece, and my super-important bike docs. I actually don't like the feeling of riding without it! I've taken a few on/offroad tumbles, and I'd say that if you're going fast enough for a small backpack to be a problem, you've got bigger problems.

quite apart from all the other answers why backpacks worn on a bike are not a great idea, i once had the wind blow open my rucksack and suck out all my college coursework, an expensive (to a student) PDA, and my packed lunch.

20 years later i still cant decide which i was more upset about losing......

'been riding for close to 40 years and have ridden through most countries in the world and always use a backpack. Even last year on my ride through China - the backpack dwarfs the little 125 it is balanced on. :)

Looks like we've got two different uses for a back pack here. Strapping it to your bike, and strapping it to your back. The OP doesn't make it totally clear, but to me it reads like he's planning on strapping it to his back. If that's the case, I wouldn't do it either, it's sweaty, annoying, knackers your back, and uspets your bike's balance.

And if the idea is to just strap it to your bike, I'd suggest something simpler like a duffle bag, fewer straps to worry about, and for the short carry between bike and room, you don't need a backpack's complicated framing system. Nowt wrong with a backpack, but perhaps not the best bag for the job.

A backpack pack has one really useful feature; if you need to walk you can carry stuff. You can make a carrying system out of say a roll sack and cargo straps if you need to walk, but they'll never be as good as the real thing.

I have a so called SAS style framed one. The frame is bolted to the sidecar boot lid but can be unbolted. I therefore have the following set-ups available;

Rack for other bags like a roll sack.
Rack with fitted bag which can be removed and used as a day/grab sack (soft rucksack).
Framed rucksack.
Frame for carrying jerry can etc.

There is no way I'd wear one when actually riding.

Andy

Obviously a number of factors have to be taken into account - the rider, the bike, the road surface, the distances, the amount of gear, the design and construction of the backpack....

I carried all my gear in a backpack (Gearsack) on my rides across Australia and wore it on my back.

The first time I had too much stuff and the straps cut into my shoulders, even though the shoulders don't support all the weight.

After learning my lesson I took only the essentials on subsequent rides and had no problems at all.

If you're out in the middle of nowhere on a highway with no bend in sight there's no problem loosening the straps and letting the seat behind you take some of the load. Handling really is not an issue in that situation.

Two advantages of wearing my backpack:

1. It helps to keep me warm on a cold day and stops the wind whistling up my back.

2. The reflective writing and triangles on it make me more visible at night.

This is hardly a ringing endorsement. Aren't there other, more direct ways of providing visibility and staying warm? I mean, which don't compromise handling or comfort? I don't have any problem if you want to wear a backpack (I wear a little one myself from time to time if it's expedient), but surely there would need to be better reasons than this to wear one all day, day after day.....? On long journeys (three months, six months, more) I carry a lot of gear; no way it's all going on my back.

Or perhaps this was your point after all?

Mark

markharf I'm not suggesting those are the reasons that I wear a backpack, they are merely two extra benefits of the particular backpack I own.

I use a backpack because I've found it a perfectly satisfactory way of carrying my gear.

As I said before there are lots of variables, but I'm a tall guy on a big bike and I travel light so comfort and handling are not compromised.