XT 660 R & Z info wanted
 

Hi all - looking for some info please.
Looking at a couple of bikes for long trip - prudent to both be the same.
Thinking about the XT660Z for me but I think the R would be better for my wife as a lower seat height and 25KG lighter.
Wondering how similar they are? And weather the usual spares taken can be shared.
Many thanks for any info from you technical types bier
FF

Same engines, a few electrical components. They are different bikes though.

I liked my R. It was much lighter than a Z so feels quicker and easier to ride. It does suffer with limited ground clearance though. Depends on your riding.

If you go for an R, avoid 04/05 models. Bad fueling and rough runners. Later models have o2 sensors in the exhaust for better running.

Thanks Ted.
Electrical components are handy to share but I assume then that the chassis are different- cables etc.
There will be no hard core off road - typical gravel tracks in South America, maybe the odd one more difficult but we will not take any risks.
FF

BTW - do you know if late model Zs have 02 sensors, there is a lot of talk about the ‘Kev mod’ to stop low speed surging.
Thanks again

The Z models do have O2 sensors. Avoid 2009 models as there are a batch of almost 2000 bikes that are prone to break third gear with total engine failure as a result.

I have now been on the road almost 5 years on an around the world trip with my Tenere and my bike has passed 200 k kms a couple of weeks ago. To be honest the bike has been a utter piece of garbage. I would not recommend it at all if you ask...

- Says bike is utter piece of garbage
- Rides 5 years around the world on it.

K

Theres many things I could have mentioned but you still wouldnt have the capacity to understand but here are a few things...

1. If you give up you have lost...I dont give up that easily...

2. If you take a bike into a country in another part of the world YOU HAVE TO TAKE THE BIKE OUT OF THE COUNTRY whitin the given time frame. So bring it in - take it out.
3. After 200 k kms - I can truly from the bottom of my heart say this bike is an utter piece of crap! I belive I have adequate experience to say so. 200 000 kms and 5 continents and 5 years should be enough I belive...

Thanks for the reply. A shame about your bike, these are a popular long distance travel bike due, at least I thought, to their reliability. Maybe I’m mistaken and people take them because of their specifications and then have problems - although I’ve always heard good reports from owners about trouble free high mileage.
Do you think your bike might just be a Friday afternoon one or do you have info from many other XTZ riders about bad reliability.
I’m keen for any knowledge you can offer as reliability and comfort are my top 2 priorities.
Thanks again bier

I certainly hope other Tenere riders dont have suffered the same amount of problems that I have. However have a look on the Facebook site of Yamaha XT600Z Tenere and its quite obvious that this bike certainly has its fair share of problems - if not more than fair share. Ask the young brit Mark Waters which bike broke down in Mongolia last year and that to the extend that he chose to. ship it back to England. Ask the belgian guy Djonas Ananas whos gearbox blew up in Mexico and he had to truck the bike here and there and then get it fixed. Not an easy or cheap task when youre in another part of the world than youre from. I also know an aussie guy who spent a fortune on his bike in Salta Arentina and lots of time only to find that his bike broke down again 200 kms down the road - and he hava had it at that stage. Trucked the bike to nesrest port town and shipped his bike back to Australia.

The socalled reliability of these bikes are imo highly overrated. Gearbox potential issues on ~ 2000 bikes, Regulator/stator failes on many bikes, cush rubber drive are absolutely rubbish, a huge single cylindered bike that are set up very lean with only 520 chain and sprockets - it eats chain and sprockets for breakfast, lunch and dinner! Convert to 525 makes it a bit better though.
The heaviest single cylindred bike ever except the old Suzuki Dr big 750/800 set up very lean - how does that sound of user friendly???

Thanks for the quick reply. Certainly food for thought - my research will continue. Perhaps I should have kept my 1100gs, I did 170,000 miles on it and it never broke down - perhaps a bit heavy for a long overland trip, I do need a very tall bike though - hence the XTZ.

My point is that I guess after 100.000km you knew it was crap, then why did you ride another 100.000km on it?

Anyway, what bike would you chose now with all the knowledge you have?

So you still didnt get point 2 in my post above? Ship my bike home to Norway from Indonesia or Australia? Do you think its cheap or even possible? First major problem came around 70 k kms and of course I didnt think I would have a lot of more major problems. Next major problem at ~ 110 k kms. I still didnt think I would have much more major problems. Next again at 130 k kms - and that time it took 6,5 monts to get it fixed! Would you take a bike around the world that would potentially take 6,5 months of your precious time and life to fix? Now answer that please?!?
After that the bike has died in Colombia, Guatemala and Mexico - which all have been electrical problems - but still a PITA and a lot of time and money spent to get it sorted. A broken water pump that needed to fixed twice, a blown rear shock and a front rim that was bent to that extent it couldnt be fixed and new was needed do also belong to the picture although this is things that also could happen to any bike I guess.

I havent taken any other bike around the world so I dont know what bike to recommend - but I did buy a Suzuki Dr650 on the New Zealand leg of my RTW trip (as the Tenere stood broken down waiting for spare parts in Australia) rode it 10 weeks/12 k kms and sold it again) and that was a much better bike in all aspect of better than the Tenere. And the most noticeably feature is that it is 35 kilos lighter then the Tenere. 35 kilograms - place that weight in your left hand and feel it. Its a LOT! But as we know the Dr650 is not available in Europe so if youre european its not available there. And a Dr650 will need many upgrades to be a pro overland bile.

For most part of the world a 250 cc bike would be the best imo. Light, cheap, light on fuel etc etc - = best! A Honda would then be my choiche but Kawasaki and Yamaha also has 250 cc that would be great overlander bikes - a bit worried for the Yamaha though after my Yamaha experiences...:rolleyes2:
Usa, Canada, Australia and Europe would be a bit different as a 250 would be a bit too slow for most roads there.

If I only wanted a travel bike and I wouldnt intend to ride much gravel roads other than a firm and ok maintained one I guess my choices would be a Suzuki V-Strom 650 or the newest edition of the Honda CB500X.

Or maybe I would be crazy and choose a Royal Enfield Himalayan...:clap:

No I would not. What was broken that took 6.5 months to fix?
Then again, 130k+ km is a lot for such a bike. Especially if you do a lot of offroad riding. IMO the later Tenere's weren't really that good offroad bikes.

Uhm, DR650 is definitely available in EU. Cheap as well...

https://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/s...=KW&scopeId=MB

Just in the interests of balance i’ve had a 2014 Z since mid 2016 and done a few trips on it in Africa and love it.

It is heavy for a dirt bike, i have a small ding in the front rim from hitting a pothole at speed in Zimbabwe and in dusty conditions i need to clean the air filter regularly. Otherwise i have had no issues.

For me it had proved comfortable, reliable, and good on the typical dirt & gravel roads i am riding, plus able to carry luggage, run electrics etc.

I could send you to a thread of pals of mine who have had a nightmare with a dr650. Every model will have some bikes with more issues than average.

On the Z and R question, I rented an R for a pal and did a shorter Z & R trip in South Africa last year. Quite different feels. One of each may not be a bad shout as the Z is physically a bigger beast (for context i am 6ft and 16st/100kgs+); the R is much lighter and with smaller tank, which worked for my lighter friend.

Good luck with your search.

20 year old beat up Drs with lots of milage maybe but not new ones as in other parts of the world. Thats what Im talking about...

Gearbox and clutch broke down. Impossible to find a mechanic down in Patagonia, took out engine and trucked 3500 kms to Santiago for repair. Came back after more than two months but with a new set of problems. Had to truck the whole bike back to Santiago. Ordered spare parts 2 times - they never came. Had to improvise a good bit. Order more spare parts - wait, wait wait. Finally when bike was running TIP had expired and spent several weeks to fix that too. All in all 6,5 monts.

Luckily I had a mate in Bolivia with a Suzuki Dr 650 he offered me to ride. So had a go on a decent bike there for 6 weeks in the meantime.

40 000 miles are not exactly very much. 95% of all new bikes will roll their first 40 k miles without any issues. Come back please when you have 100 000 miles on it...:rolleyes2:

The Ten is NOT a reliable bike. There are for example potentially almost 2000 bikes with gearbox failing. The 2009 (and early 2010?) models. Now everybody likes to give shit to BMW, KTM, Honda etc when they have recalls on their bikes - Yamaha doesnt even recall or fix anything on warranty even though they have admitted that there was a failure when producing gearboxes that year. Do you still have faith in Yamaha???
I have mention names on persons with Tens and their problems - where they broke down etc etc and I could have mentioned many many many more. Have a look on the Tenere forum I mentiond above and see what the huge plethora of problems Ten owners have...

Wether you love the Tenere or not doesnt make it a good bike. And «a few small trips» ANY bike would do without problems. If the persons taking it around the world get serious problems then we should pay attention. I have mentioned a few earlier on. Have a look at those stories and have a look at the Tenere forum I mentioned earlier on for a plethora of Tenere problems. Notably those nearly 2000 bikes with potential gearbox failure....

Hi Snakeboy, not looking to get into a bun fight here, clearly you have put way more miles on your Z than most of the rest of us here and as such represent 1 very relevant data point. Your note on 2009 models and Ted’s on 2004/5 R models are great insights for the OP.

But if we tell everyone asking questions that a particular bike model is rubbish because one example had issues over a 200,000kms life, or there are some weak points for a model that emerge over time, then there’s going to be a seriously short list of feasible bikes that make the grade. This was the point I was making by citing my pals with big DR issues.

Cheers
Andy

The "problems" of the 660 is pretty well known, in regards to the rectifier and cush dampers, and the lean conditions. Theres pretty cheap fixes for all of it. This should be no surprise.

- Theres a "kev mod" to fic the fuelling issue (which just about and FI thumper has)
- Theres guides to fill the rectifer with dielectric grease and/or relocate it.
- Theres a guide to mod the sprocket carrier to fit a bigger bearing, making th life of the cush rubbers easier.
- You can fit polyurethane cush dampers for +40.000 miles trouble free use (with the above mod)
- Cush rubbers can be filled with spare pieces of innertubes as shims.

I know this, and I dont even own the bike.


When I think about, all the bikes I've ever had has hat some sort of "common failure point"

2000 "potential" bike isnt a lot, how many Lc4's has had rocker arm failures? How many wr250r has had fuel pump and stator failures? How many wr450f has had gearbox failures? How many transalps have had cdi box failures? How many dr650 has 3rd gear explode, how many xt600's had 5th gear failures, how many klr650 had the doohickey spring brake? How many dt125rs had headgasket issues? ect ect ect.....

Seems like someone was just unlucky, most of this could have been avoided with a couple google searces. Its a pretty common round-the-world-bike for a reason.

Good day :D

Please man - I have mentioned several other Tens, their owners, their problems, where the problems occured (all on RTW-trips) and in addition I have mentioned the most used Facebookforum for Teneres where you can have a look. My experienses are not at all the main thing here. But if you dont want to understand theres nothing I can do about it. Dont say that I didint try...

There are way way more common problems than the one you have mentioned. For example ignition barrel problems, it locks totally or as on my bike you can remove the key when ignition is on. Tacometer needle goes off, water/moisture in speedometer, final drive nut disengages just to mention a few. And what about an idiotic high gearing it has? What about only a 520 chain/sprocket set up on such a heavy lean set up single thumper? Even the Dr650 has a 525 set ip. What a windscreen that creates insanly much turbulence for an average tall rider?
No you obviously havent owned such a bike Mr Eskildsen - its shows very clearly!

Some of the fixes on the Ten might be easy and cheap, but for example the rear hubb one is neither easy or cheap at all! If you cant machine one yourself it will be very costly. And taking a new bike and start to fill innertube rubber in the rear hubb - nah that is - excuse me - not how a bike should come out of a factory. And the same goes for both of the socalled Kev mods. There are both an O2 mod and a fuel mod - didnt you know that? And you will need a wuite expensive aftermarket airfilter and ditto exhaust to get a decent result out of this. Cheap you said? LOL

And to compare fuel pump issues or headgaskets on a twostroker with the gearbox issues on the Ten is excuse pure nonsense. Both can be fixed in less than an hour for a small cost. The gearbox issues on the Ten can cost shipping home to Europe from Mongolia and then find a replacement engine. Cheap and easy my ass!!!

2000 bikes isnt a lot you say? It would be interesting to know how many bikes you consider a lot? 100 000? 999999999999? Imo a single bike with a potential failure is too much. Other brands makes recalls and take responibility - Yamaha gives a god damned shit about their bikes and customers....

I put about 80.000km on my XTZ660 and know its wek points and pitfalls. Wouldn't hesitate to use it for rtw travel. I would now however go for the XTR over the XTZ, for weight and handling, even with a large aftermarket tank on it.

Only reason I traded the Ten in for a Terra was my wife and I wanted to leave on identical bikes to save on toolkit and spare parts to carry. The XTZ and XTR were to high for her so we went for the Husqy TR650 which was lower and has a much lower centre of gravity with the underseat tank.

If your choices are between teh XTZ and the XTR I'd go for the R. Kit it out to your needs and go. There's so many people using these bikes for long distance travelling that nightmare stories are inevitable. It doesn't make them bad or unreliable bikes.

XT 660 R & Z info wanted
 

I am not trying to avoid understanding Snakeboy; I am very happy with my bike and understand perfectly well its strengths and weaknesses.

What I, along with others in this thread, am doing is trying to provide the OP with a bit of balance to your ‘only I know best’ views (is it really credible to condescendingly dismiss someones 40,000 miles of experience of riding a Z as irrelevant because they haven’t done 100,000 miles, yet hold out your opinion on the DR650 based upon a 6 week trip?), whilst attempting (and now failing) to ignore the rude and condescending way you make your points.

Really, it is not a very nice way to behave.

That’s me out of this thread, it is not why I use forums like this. My sincere apologies to the OP that this thread has degenerated in this way - don’t get talked out of the Z & R based upon this discussion alone.

Wanted to like snakeboy too, guy's got some miles under his wing, some of his problem points actually concern all the XT series in my expereince too, but if you insult people and act like like a proverbial you know what, it's not an interesting discussion that anyone would like to contribute to.
can fully understand feeling pissed when stuck in the middle of nowhere, but happens all the time really.... good friend had to perform a pretty complex and costly salvatage operation from the Amzonas when a stupid ign pickup sensor gave up in the middle of nowhere on his DR Big....

Complaining about windscreenheight is just... well, funny.



Just about every other oldschool thumper has 520 chains, i bet a 525 chain is harder to find in remote places, so a 520 could be a + to some people

There's 525 sprockets sets you can buy, from off-the-road.de if you wish, so again, if its a problem, buy theese and be done with it. Just search around and look what fits, its not custom made for the 660. Use a tdm850 sprocket, which is 525, and fits directly. Im pretty sure thats what my friend used when he rode to Australia on the 660z.



As for gearing, people want different stuff, I change my gearing on all my bikes from time to time, depending on where im gonna ride. Sometimes taller, sometimes lower.



For me, I love to search around, find stuff from different models which fit. I have a couple different yamaha dualsport and offroad bikes, most parts is only listed for the on model but fits the other aswell. Sometimes the same part is cheaper when buying it for one model, eventhough it fits both, and so on. Knowing this out on a big trip can prove very usefull.



A xt250 with 18hp have 520 chain, but a dt125r with 30 hp have 428 chain, so theres not always logic to it.




I didnt say you needed to shim the cushrubbers from new, youre just making stuff up as you go, to try to make things fit to your experience.
Yes, you need to pay people to machine the hub to fit the larger bearings. Things like that costs money, so does riding, surprised? I bet is still cheaper than a brakedown, or replacing the cushrubbers all the time. As i said, thers also cushrubebrs made from a different material on the marked, as a direct replacement. The way you make it sound like the worst problem, one would think you would gladly have payed to fix it before it got to be a problem in the first hand...



You sound like you knew of all this, but choose not to do the common fixes, and now complain about it, and got brakedowns as a result.



Regarding the fuelling, im well aware. I have a wr250r where you can add fuel in the onboard display. People say you need fuel controllers for theese aswell, i've ridden mine for 20.000km with aftermarked exhaust system, opened air intake sct without problems. Its won enduroraces in the dualsport class, I ride it as a track marshall the same places as the A-class go (just slower) It would have burned up the valves long time ago if it was bad. Checked valves at 20.000km, swapped 2 shims to get them in the upper range, and closed it back up.



Again, just about every FI thumper has some fuelling issues, or something with the fueldelivery that can be optimized atleast. My wr250r needed to have the TPS adjusted, and fuel added, and its still just a hair jerky in slow not flowing traffic.. People install powercommanders and/or different throttletubes to make it go totally away. When riding WOT, its actually rich, even with mods, so the custom maps actually remove fuel from this setting.





You really came bad from the start, not wanting to explain yourself, and told everyone with other experiences that they were wrong. And now more and more comes up as people share their experiences.



Im sorry your trip turned so bad, and I bet all others are aswell. Would have loved to read a ride report, cause I bet there was a lot of good times aswell.


I dont know if I would take my wr250r as a round the world bike, but I use it as my lightweight dualsport, and ride it to countries "next door" and so on. I traveled to 20 countries on my xt600, but bought the wr250r to replace it, to get the weight down for the offroad stuff. Dr650 has 3rd gear issues, which also seems to randomly go bang without notice.


Good day.

Well an interesting discussion and I’m glad there are differing opinions.
I also have a WR250R that I use for green laning in the UK and was thinking that one day I might use it to go down through Africa.
A recent, comprehensive, survey has come out finding Yamaha top of reliability amongst all makes of motorcycles - certainly my WR250R has never given me any problems and my wife had a TDM 900 for 10 years which was trouble free and very economical with both fuel and service parts.
However - we have just come back from a short trip to France which included some light off road and I have decided to take my 1200gs. My wife also loves her 1200gs LC for light off roading and is tempted to take hers. She is going on a long trip in September on a RE Himalayan and will also take a test ride on a new CB500X and 250 Rally.
Looks like Yamaha will have to wait until we can afford 2 x 700 Ténéré :D
Thanks again for all the input bier

If you dont have any other things to mention other than complaining about my behaviour - it seems your pretty out of valid points. And that coming from a person that on the last page said after only mentioning his own relatively short experiences with the Ten concluded with «a very reliable bike». You totally ignore all the examples I mentioned on people who have had their RTW trips ruined by Teneres who failed miserably. If you think my 200 000 is invalid its perfectly ok - but please at least pay attention to the other examples I have mentioned.

What was it you wrote - «not a very nice way to behave» Not a logical one either or mind broadening either for that sake.

Im out of this thread too btw since mentioning real life experiences now is considered bad behaviour...

There's enough rudeness on this thread for everyone to have their share. Fortunately, there's lots of useful information as well.

Here's my suggestion, speaking as moderator: each contributor go back to your posts and look each use of the word "you." Complaining about what "you" said, meant, implied, or wrote is a poor start if hoping to contribute information which will be listened to respectfully.

Calmly stating direct experiences or the results of research works very well, especially if offering a balance of positive and negative; long diatribes not so much. Quality information and tone will convey the message--it's not necessary to tear into someone else's opinions, which, in fact, will tend to make the poster sound less like a source of information and more like an angry partisan.

Hope that's useful.

Mark

:rofl: Are you kidding right now? He literally posted a wall of text with arguments...

Oh come on...

You literally said this as your first reply to me:

Don't kid yourself here.

well i knew that 600-650 suzook DRs had issues with rod bearings, turns out also 3rd gear.... so not only XTs.....


see @ 0:45 and 3:00...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAygQmnOxOw