two-up, which bike?
 

i know this has been discussed before but, which bike to go a lap around south america 2-up with the wifey? we'd have tons of gear. some dirt roads probably. anyone ever used an ST1100? dont really like GS's. parts availabilty? ease of repair? tank size. 2-up comfort? trailer? (see next post) tom in dallas

For two up ,on mixed quality roads , I'd go with a VStrom [and leave the trailer at home ].

I just got one for that purpose .
It's agile for a big bike and reliable .

We did it on a GS 1150, but if they are not your cup of tea, then I'd say:....

Go on! Live dangerously!!

Ural Motorcycles Europe | Ranger

:D

Whilst I offer this suggestion somewaht tongue in cheek, I have just bought opne for overlanding, so I have put my money where my mouth is: they are a laugh, off-roading's a doddle, and they can carry the kitchen sink too, should you really be attached to it...;)

Hello Warthog,

Sorry, I don't get sidecars....
All the disadvantages of a bike . . . . and all the disadvantages of a car :confused1:

Have I missed something ????

'Fraid so!!

Don't get me wrong. I love bikes and if I had to choose, I'd go bike 90% of the time, but combos are a real laugh. Not something you'll understand until you've riddne one, coz I thought the same as you did before having a go.

As for advantages? Well the carrying capacity is huge, and off-road its obviously got an advantage over bikes, stability wise. We did 7,500 miles in Argentina and Chile on a GS. A great trip, but for me, on a bike weighing about 450kg all in, off-road was very tough.

In those circumstances a bike like my 1150 is defnitely a lot worse off than a car or combo, otherwise they would not build trail bikes so light...

Mud, snow, ice: all of these are perfectly manageable on an outfit, whilst on a bike, you'd be stranded, unless you're a very competent off-roader: and I am not...

As for better than a car? Well, I've always loved bikes because you sit there on an engine and you are really part of the world around you: not in a metal coccoon, in much the same way that Ewan described it and Ted Simon before him. I enjoyed overcoming the diffiiculties of a tough bit of off road, but my journeys are not a personal challenge, so if I can see the same scenes without busting a gut, or having a coronary event: woohoo!!

I'm still riding a motorbike. It just happens to have a large bolt-on on one side. If all else was equal, I'd do my next overland trip on two wheels, but its not. I have my other half to consider and her safety was a big worry for me, when I was doing 50mph down a dirt track: always thinking don't bin it. Plus now we have a dog that will be coming with us.

In a nutshell, this combo will make a lot more routes possible for us than would have been the case on a solo.

I don't think solos are better or worse than outfits, and I cetainly am not suggesting people are worse of on two wheels! Just horses for courses. But I would say, have a go if you can you may be as surprised as I was!!

Go on, you know you want to really...;)

PS Wildlands: sorry this is not a post hijack, but you might find it interesting. The rest of you lot: answer Wildlands' question!! Go'dit? :)

You do still get some of teh advantages, like being outside rather than in your steel box. Also you can carry all your gear easily. Only thing i really have against those is teh fuel consumption. sadly higher than a car. Maybe they would be better with a diesel conversion?

i am not a dl owner (but considering buying one 650), but, many people use dl650 or dl1000 v-strom nowadays. feedbacks are quite good. good for 2-up and for a bit of off-road.

many tourer bikes like st1100, bmw rt, etc... are not suitable for offroads...

2 up.
 

I was never a fan of GS's.
Till I took a test ride.
And bought one!
So 2 up, with gear, south America.
Hmmm! Take a test ride! Why not?
Dave.

Don't know about other outfits, but the Ural can deliver 40-45 mpg, which is as much as my GS did, and more than many modern twins and fours out there. Only down side is a realistic constant top-speed of 60mph.

Wildlands:

As djorob just posted, don't discount the GS out right: have a look, have a go. Having done a very similar trip I can tell you I cannot think of another bike I would have done it on. Varadero? Linked brakes, side radiators. V-strom? vulnerable oil cooler. Both chain driven. Don't get me wrong DL owners...I'm sure they are very good bikes: Indeed I saw some out there, but these are the reasons I had for not considering them.

Weight will be an issue, but you sentenced yourself to that the second you decided to go two-up (as did we). This means an extra body and all the equipment for that extra body, too. All on a single bike that you will have to point up crappy mountain tracks, or muddy trails.

One option that I did not have but is now available is the 800GS. Its lighter, more compact, has conventional forks and a 21" front wheel (IIRR), so all this is better off road. However, the jewel in the crown is that it has that sweet 800cc lump from the S and ST models. That motor makes more power than my oil-head 1150, and is not far behind the 1200, all in a lighter frame.

You'd have the power to carry two, but not all the weight of the bigger bikes. Also economy on those engines is supposed to be very impressive.

If you budget can stretch, have a look into those...
I would have loved to.

As a 2 upper on a 650 Vstrom having crossed central america just recently & currently heading south & in Peru ...

The vstrom is a good bike but the saddle needs some sorting to be comfortable on long days or you get hard ars3 used to it - we're the latter :)

All in we're probably around 400kgs incl bike, and the 650 is sound & solid for reasonable roads, good for poor roads, but off road the clearance is an issue; I let the tyres down a little to get more traction on the canyon del pato & stuffed my aftermarket centre stand - fixed now tho due to top Peruvian mechanic :)

The Vstrom is a fraction of the price of a BMW [like half but unfortunately still sounds like one] & spares are reasonably available throughout central & south - great in Guatemala, like 24hr turnaround, but longer elsewhere - 2 weeks in Mexico near the border with Belize !

Hope this adds to the maelstrom of confusion ... but if I had tons of dosh & lots of time I'd ride a BMW big mother GS & suffer in the really tough bits due to weight, and chill out waiting for spares to be shipped in :)

Scouse

[QUOTE=Warthog;175012]Don't know about other outfits, but the Ural can deliver 40-45 mpg, which is as much as my GS did, and more than many modern twins and fours out there. Only down side is a realistic constant top-speed of 60mph.

They are claiming 37mpg on their website and a maximum speed of about 60mph. Still much cheaper than taking two bikes :) I have seen a couple of combos, withthe sidecar arranged as a little caravan.. Great for one traveller as no need to carry/erect a tent. One of them erected a little fishermans bivvy to cook in

but my old 2.1 litre estate car would return about 45mpg at 80mph.

What does a diesel landrover do?? is a question, because I have no idea.

My friends diesel enfield does 160+mpg at 60mph

I think I would enjoy ridingthem in the rough, but maybe a tad boring on the better roads (read motorways)

whats an 800gs?
 

never heard of one. probly George wont let 'em be imported into usa i'd bet.

Have a look here:

BMW F 800 GS - webBikeWorld

I hope you're wrong about importation 'coz they are said to be good bikes...

Two up and loaded I would up grade suspension, a minor expense and well worth it.

Landy mileage
 

oldbmw,

"What does a diesel landrover do?? is a question, because I have no idea".


My old 110 2.5 diesel returned around 18mpg and was pretty much flat out at 50mph. I didn't keep it long...!

Wow, I once borrowed an Isuu trooper, and i got the impression it did about 25mpg ( light use on good roads) I just filled it up when i returned it and did not really pay attention. It was certainly quicker than your Landy :)
Why is it modern bikes are so poor on fuel mpg? I grant that they can produce 2-3 times the power for teh same cc as the old bikes, but touring does not really need these high horsepowers. My 1985 800cc BMW normally does 50mpg, i can get more if I baby it. But both my old Triumph twins did better than 65mpg at the same speeds as i use the bmw. I do know that when the shift to lead free came about I had to re-tune my ford car which dropped the mpg by about 10% so is it just or all due to poor fuel? However one of teh most economical bikes is teh lean burn enfield 500 which some owners have reported 90+mpg although the factory gives a figure is 80 mpg. ( 87 with some models) Maybe it is rev related...as my bmw consumption is more proportional to revs than speed. the best mpg i ever got was in the pyrenean mountains with lots of gear work due to tight corners and steep inclines, this was unexpected.

Its all to do with emissions that come from your bike/engine that is one reason why mpg has gone down, also its the way you use your throttle and how you ride your bike.

I have a Yamaha XT660R (yes the jerky type) but if i baby it through my daily commute of 40 each day (10miles in 30mph, 20miles in 50mph, 10miles in 70mph) i can get around 70mpg from it, but if i start to use the throttle as some people say it was intended to be used this drops to around 50mpg when really giving it stick.

On average i normally get 55mpg-60mpg, depending on traffic etc etc

As for riding 2 yep the Suzuki DL would be a good choice, 650 or 1000 is or choice really depends on the amount of off roading you want to do.
BMW GS's also a good choice (i know you said you didnt like them but have you tried one yet)
I dont know but do you's get the Honda Varadero 1000 yet, also a good bike but slightly heavy for off roading.

IMHO,

Twin GSs, Varadero, DL-1000, Africa Twin and most twins with more than 650 CC fits to your needs.

650 and less looks poor for two up.

Two Up ?
 

If you want to do more that travel the BLEEPIN' PANAMERICANA :ban:, get a good on-off 650 single with NORMAL :oops2:chain drive: DR, KLR, or my favorite the XR650L. Nothing on-off is going to be very comfortable for the one on the back so go short distances each day. You don't need all that luggage :nono:, stay in homes and hostels, they are EVERWHERE and only pennies..

Toby (charapa) Around the Block 2007 |

I spent a couple of months in India and Nepal with wifey on back of my R100GS. Some hairy roads on way into Nepal as huge potholes and loose surface adjacent to deep ravines. Some of the back roads in Nepal were so steep that it felt as if the bike could tip over backwards, but it never did. However the bike did motor on up such inclines with ease despite the weight and altitiude ( loss of power as I didn't bother adjusting the mix).I'd say go the old skool BMW GS route and be ruthless with luggage, too easy to just pile it on. I'd wonder about whether an 80 GS would be able to take such inclines with luggage two up.

the lightest big twin?
 

Go for a Cagiva Elefant!! An absolutely mint E900 just went for a few grand on e-bay, lighter, thinner and more useable power than a big GS or AT, as long as you like the Desomodronic valve timing they are great bikes..... too heavy for green laning but great in the dirt

If you have the dollar I like the look of the HP2, but I don't personally like the other big GSs normally

Why not KTM 950/990 Adventure
 

That was my choice some time ago, but I heard it is not reliable enough for longer journeys.

Small V-Strom is realy great for 2up and I did some kkm all around Europe. Now it's time to go south (Morocco or Turkey) and more off-road.
As long as road surface is firm, V-Strom is :thumbup1:. But as soon as you get a bit of sand, you will end running 20 kmph with your legs widely spread...:rolleyes2: So it's time for a change.

I don't like GSs. I did a test ride on new GS1200 and I still don't like it :nono: (not objectively perhaps).
Why does nobody mention large KTM adventure? I'm gonna test it as soon as it stops snowing:stormy::eek3:. Really why? I heard that the seat pre2003 is not regarded as comfortable ;) What else?

most use dealers, which are mostly GOOD around here. Good shopping!:clap: