|
Single..twin..triple??
My story is I am looking for a bike to some commuting in the city, some highway trips and ultimately a trip to Alaska next summer as a 40th birthday, mid-life crisis kind of adventure. I have been reading about bikes like crazy (I almost feel obsessive) and have narrowed things down a bit. Here is a list of bikes I am considering:
1) BMW F650 single 2) Suzuki V-strom 650 or 1000 3) Triumph Tiger The bikes I am looking towards would be late 90's to early 2000's models, hopefully spending less the $5000. My motorcycling experince is limited over the last 20+ years, I grew up riding dirtbikes and such but really nothing much since then. As such I want something pleasant to ride and not too unwielding. A quirk of mine is I like different stuff (not the run-of-the-mill) hence the reason for looking at the Tiger. So, I guess what I am asking is for some input into these models. There seems to be a lot of experience on this forum, might as well take advantage of it. |
Have you thought about an Elefant, some very good mid-90s examples about. In europe they were Cagiva but I believe they were sold in the USA as Ducati E750 or E900. Great bikes, great engines and much better handling (IMHO) than the tiger and a lot more character and better sound than the F650 (is that a sewing machine coming up the road?)
|
I have never heard of it. Isn't Google great though? It is a nice looking bike, not sure how many of them are around these parts, but I will do some searching.
|
Bearing in mind the availability and pricing of bikes in Canada -
Probably your best bet is the VStrom , 650 for economy ,1000 for power . Much cheaper than a Tiger [ the Tiger is a good bike but you'll have to buy an older bike for the same money ] . Avoid early F650GS they have front forks that are dodgy and are expensive bikes for what you get . KLR 650 or DR650 would be a good choice if you want to do mild off road or lots of gravel . Buy as new a bike as you can ,there should be some good trade-ins coming on the market about now [ or maybe not - recession blues !!!!!] . |
First of all, get out and test ride all of these if you can: you might decide that you like one model so much that you can live with the downsides it may have...
Secondly, if you can test ride others too, even better. Still, purely at face value, I would say a twin of some sort. They develop respectable power for their engine size, good torque (fewer gear changes) and are generally economical (more so than a 4 cylinder equivalent, as a rule of thumb). For your uses, I would say that no less than 600 for a twin: makes higways a lot easier... If you want unusual, then have a look at brands like Aprilia, and Moto Guzzi, although I am not so familiar with their range at the moment. Having said that, if you want something easy to live with then I would say you can't go far wrong with any in your short list, even if they are not rare and exotic... |
Quote:
|
I have thought about the KLR and DR but have since decided against those. I suppose the F650 is in the same category, but from reading, they seem to be a little better on the highway, less buzzy.
I like the V-strom, it just seems that because of their popularity and the limited selection in Canada, they seem to hold their prices. It is tough to find a decent low-mileage one for less that $6-7000. I like that there is good support for them as far as accessories though. From reading about the Tiger, people who own them seem to like them (a bias I suppose). I read a trip diary from a guy who made the trip to Alaska on his and he never made any negative comments about his bike throughout the trip. I don't know much about the triple, so I should do some more reading. |
Tiger every Time
Hi :mchappy:
I'm a big Pan European fan, but after using this Tiger for a couple of months, I'd recommend it over your other choices, as it does everything really well and the three cylinder engine gives it great character. Good looking bike too and I can squeeze over 220 miles out of a tank at 80MPH, with a few blasts through the twisties! Keep the battery topped up and run it with fully synthetic oil though. Cheers Chris http://pictures.autotrader.co.uk/img...a?id=885322207 |
What do you mean by "character"? Is it the sound, the performance? Personally, I think it is a nice looking bike.
|
5 pints later!
It's the sound and soul, Hic!
Night all. |
Is there a definite advantage to the post-2000 bikes versus the pre-2000 Tigers? What kind of mileage is acceptable for a bike to be considered in good condition? I read a comment someplace about how a lot of used bikes go up for sale around the 20,000 mile mark, possibly due to boredom, but maybe also due to bikes needing maintenance. When do valves need to be set on the Tigers and is that type of maintenance difficult &/or pricey?
|
Quote:
Alan Kelly went round on his blog 'poor circulation' with Blue88 both with 2007 tigers , Alan's developed an oil leak once he got to the US, it was also big and heavy so shipping was expensive. Pre 1997 the triple engine was carb , I forget when exactly they went to FI, FI of course will cope with high altitude better but FI is more vulnerable due to the sensors all over the bike, and carbs can be fixed easily at the side of the road but will have problems with altitude and need jets changing. Bikes get sold around the 20K mark because people consider motorcycles to be disposible much like cars. YouTube - One Last Journey Big Japanese 4 have twigged with this and post 2003 all Japanese motorcycles are not designed to be taken apart and fixed by their owners as they are virtually disposible. Watch the video and the can't be bothered mentality exists in our decadent societies. But engines are designed to run at least 100K miles , there is a video on the tube where a CBR600F does 100K. The issue is that parts you wouldn't consider to be consumables start to become consumables. My old bike went to 138,000 miles before I sold it (only have room for 2 bikes) , in its life time: At 40,000K The reg/rec went The starter relay went Wheel bearing went A caliper pin broke Its fork seals and bushes needed replacement At 50,000K One of the carb rubbers perished Its head stock bearings needed replacement (though I did wheelie it hard sometimes) At 55,000K It caught fire due to the loom wire rubbing and decaying At 57,000K The indicator relay packed up At 63,000K One of the coils packed up At 65,000K The airbox cracked At 71,000K Needed new exhaust gaskets as they leaked Etc and so on and so on, all of the above repairs cost me under £20 to fix but many people wouldn't have bothered and scrapped the bike. The best example is David Lambeth's XT600 which has done half a million miles. Although its often said low tune engines last longer ie the Transalp engine which goes into the NTV,GT,transalp and africa. Sports bike engines last even longer (the tiger post 2000 is based on the daytona engine) as it has to be designed for the seldom used 13000+ RPM red line. My CBR is generally used around the 5-6000rpm mark, 2-3 weeks a year I take it to the 14000RPM red line. |
If you can find one at the right price in Canada, I'd definitely recommend the Honda TransAlp 650 V twin:thumbup1:, as these bikes are virtually unbreakable and Honda's build quality is the best.
We rode one from the UK to Romania & Bulgaria and it never missed a beat. After 26,000 miles it still looked and went like new. Comfort is a big issue on long trips, and this bike is like your favourite armchair. It is also possible to do long journeys on smaller bikes - both on and off road and with luggage - too. Check out 'Land Of The Long Wild Road' for an 11,000 km marathon on two Yamaha Serows! Timbuktu Publishing - Home |
Quote:
Excellent link and all very true. I have often changed my bike just because I wanted somehting new, and all bikes sold were in good working order, so they will get used, not scraped, but with a change in job, I don't think that is financially viable for me any moreso we shall see when the bike becomes un-ridable/unfixable! |
So, what would be better...a single with 5,000miles on it or a twin/triple with 25,000miles? Is a bike with 25,000miles still a good bike to buy, as long as it has been properly maintained, etc? It seems in my price and age range, most of the bikes have roughly that mileage, regardless of model. I just feel if I am going to start going above the $5000 mark, I might as well look at new as the price of used bikes doesn't seem to drop much in the first couple years.
|
D-Fuzz
That is an impossible question to answer. You are asking people on here to decide which bike you would be most happy with: and only you can answer that. Put it this way: A bike with 5K on the clock but owned by an apathetic numpty would be a worse buy than a 25K bike owned by a judiscious and caring owner.... I would say, though, that lower the mileage the better (on two bikes of similar condition and ownership...), but judge any bike you see on its own merits. Go and test ride them. See which model you are most tempted by and then keep your eyes open. If you find a bike that looks tidy, regardless of the mileage and seems to have been well looked after and the price suits you, then go for it. I, personally, would not worry over a bike with 25K on the clock, especially any of the models you mentioned. If you get a good feeling about a bike and the price suits the condition/age/mileage...Buy it. If you have a mate who knows engines, bring him along for a bit of peace of mind. If picking a bike is a concern for you, go to a dealer. You'll get less for your money, but you should be able to negotiate some sort of warranty period. |
Test riding any used bike outside of the cruiser &/or crotch rocket category in my neck of the woods is tough. There just aren't many (read: any) around. The Suzuki dealer is town has new V-stroms and I can test those when the snow finally melts. However, any other bike is likely a 6-8 hour drive away, so it kind of limits my options for test rides. I am not trying to get anyone to tell me which bike I am going to like, I am just hoping to tap into other people's experience to help me narrow down my list of options. Thus far, my short list of bikes is:
1) 1999 BMW F650 (Funduro) - 5K miles 2) 1998 BMW F650 Funduro - 20K miles 3) 2003 KLR 650 - 20K miles 4) 1997 Triumph Tiger - 20K miles 5) 2001 Triumph Tiger - 25K miles Basically, all these bikes are a weekend commitment to drive, test ride, load and bring home, hence the reason I would like to trim the list down a bit. The only reason I have included the KLR in the list is it is the closest (2.5hr away) and is a couple thousand dollars cheaper than the other examples. I have a friend with a KLR and he really likes it. I'm sure he would let me test ride his, but my concern is loading the bike up with kit to go to Alaska, and finding it too underpowered on the highway. I am sure once you get to the rough stuff up north, the KLR would be great, but up to that point is what I am not so sure about. The 1998 BMW is a little further away (about 3.5hrs), while the 1999 BMW is about 6hrs away, in the opposite direction of course. My concern with these bikes again comes back to the single, will the have enough comfortably haul me and my kit down the highway? Are they significantly different from the KLR (more refined, quieter, less buzzing)? The prices of the bikes seems a little high given the year, but are they more expensive for a good reason or strictly because they are Bimmers? The Tigers are the furthest away and it may likely be more economical for them to be shipped than for me to go get them. The 1997 Tiger is cheaper than the 2001, but is the 2001 a better bike overall? I am not concerned about the power of the bikes and their ability to haul me and my stuff around. As far as handling, given my limited riding experience, how much am I going to realize during a short test ride? If the bike was a total pig, there would be plenty of people on the forums telling about it. If I don't like the way it rides, I can always sell it and try again. This is a pretty long post with lots of questions, but hopefully it will clarify a bit as to what I am looking for. Thanks. |
OK. two things. Firsty, I didn't intend to criticise you for asking advice, its just that this will end up being someone else's view based on their likes, dislikes and priorities... They may not be the same as yours.
To illustrate this there is a good thread in this forum, here that shows that regardless how much you research sometimes you might end up on a completely different bike and be thrilled for ever more!! The second point is wanting to be able to spot a dog yourself is a useful skill, such as checking wheel and steering bearings, checking chains, tyres, discs, and pads for wear and even recognising unhealthy engine sounds or symptoms. On this second note have a look here (don't just look at this page, but all the basics to give you an idea: very easy to read and follow): a great resource. Make notes and use them as a checklist if you go to view a bike.... Unfortunately, I have no poersonal experience of any of the bikes you mention. I'm sure others do and will answer soon. However, based purely on what I have read: ie anecdotal evidence, I believe they are all capable bikes. My guess is that the KLR will be best off road, the F650 will be better on the highway, and of course the tiger will be smoothest and most powerful of all 3. I expect the singles to do best on fuel and component wear due to the lower power and cc. HTH |
I wouldn't dismiss the KLR ,try your friend's bike and see if it is what you want .
I live close to the Alaska Highway and the KLR is one of the most popular bikes that I see .So yes you can load them up to the gills and head north without a problem ,you won't have the speed of the Tiger but you knew that already . If you are looking at bikes as diverse as 40 hp singles and near 100 hp multicylinders ,you really haven't decided what kind of riding you want to do . Maybe it would be best to get that sorted out before you buy. If you have a Suzuki dealer in town, it might be better to buy locally ,it'll be a whole lot easier getting parts . |
Quote:
|
Well, I think I have made a decision. I have found a used KLR and a used DR650 fairly local (within a few hours drive). The prices on them is considerably lower than finding a used Tiger or V-Strom. I have decided to go that route, ride the bike for awhile to see how it suits my needs and go from there. I haven't ridden in several years, so the biggest thing is to get out and do some riding. The trip we are planning is over a year away, so if I find the single doesn't do what I want, I will look for something else next spring.
|
I don`t know if you have these in the States, but I bought an XTZ660 Yamaha a few months back and have been riding it every day (including today!) and I really enjoy it. It is great for the potholed back roads around here and I have done a few trips of 200 miles or so and found it very comfortable. It will sit at 80 on motorways, but I feel happier at 70 on it. It has slowed me down and I am enjoying the view more! I reckon it would make an excellent bike to do a trip on as long as there is no really serious off road stuff.
|
Quote:
|
I think the biggest dual-purpose bike available from Yamaha in Canada is 250cc.
|
[quote=Dodger;235478]
If you are looking at bikes as diverse as 40 hp singles and near 100 hp multicylinders ,you really haven't decided what kind of riding you want to do . [quote] Of all the very good advice in this thread, I think this point really needs to be addressed before a decision is reached. |
If it possible to be even more confused, well I am. I went to have a look at a '01 KLR the other day and all it did really was muddy the water for me. It was easy enough to ride, I liked how light it felt, but a 15 minute ride around town didn't tell me much.
It has been mentioned that I need to figure out what kind of riding I want to do. Well, this is what I want to do: - commute to work - do daytrip rides around home that would likely include a couple hours on the highway in order to get to gravel and dirt roads. I live in a place where the majority of roads are gravel &/or dirt but you have to ride some highway to get there. - ultimately I am wanting to do a trip to Alaska next summer which will include several solid days of riding on highway during the trip. When I began looking for a motorcycle, I was hoping to spend $5000 or less. It seemed that a thumper of some kind was about the only thing in that price bracket. There are very few "adventure" type bikes for sale in this area and the ones that are seem to be quite high priced. (a 2006 Wee-strom with 20,000km = $7500CDN??) Unfortunately for me, I have to rely on the experience of others to help me in my search. I have spoken to some friends who ride a lot and their advice is to stay away from the thumps unless I plan to trailer the bike on the highway and ride it on the gravel roads. I know it is important to get something and get some riding in as I don't think it is practical to buy something next spring and expect to ride to Alaska. I was hoping to be able to buy something sooner than later with the "fun money" I have socked away. (Wives can put a damper on spending too much on these things.) Am I better off waiting a bit until I can squirrel away some more money or would I be better served buying something like a KLR, getting some riding in over the summer, and the selling it if necessary to buy something bigger in the fall or next spring? If I did that, I would basically have 2 months next spring on riding before doing the Alaska thing (May-June). |
D-Fuzz.
I have owned a few singles: some trailie types and others not. Its perfectly possible to ride highways on a single: its just not fast and a bit more vibby. If you can live with that then you have nothing to worry about. Based on what you are saying the highways are a means to an end, rather than the trip themselves, so I say buy a bike that will make the parts you are heading for the most fun possible. You want to ride dirt tracks; so get a thumper, and live with a slightly slower drive too the dirt tracks. Regardless how capable the DL and Tiger are in the dirt, if that is the terrain you are aiming for a single will beat them hands down.... It's that simple. Same with commuting: thumpers, typically, are a lot cheaper to run on tyres and fuel, and they are nimble in town. Do you need 70-100 bhp to commute? My best commuters were between 25-40 bhp, but small, nimble and cheap to run! Finally for the big trip, same logic as above: dozens of members here have done BIG trips on singles and not suffered for it. Cheaper to do the whole trip and as Grant and many other seasoned travellers can tell you: the slower you go the more you see and the more you do. In a nutshell, if Highways are the only thing stopping you I say don't let them. Buy the bike you enjoyed, pocket the money you didn't spend and keep it for the trip next year and go nuts on some dirt tracks in the mean time with a bike built for the job!! My 2p. |
Quote:
The type of usage you are stating D-Fuzz means that really the only difference the extra bhp a twin or triple will give you is the speed you travel at on the open road, but in town you could be on a Honda C90. I am now on my third thumper, an MZ Skorpion, MZ Baghira and Royal Enfield 500 Bullet and love them all. The MZ's will keep up with motorway traffic and the Bullet is now residing in Kazakhstan after an aborted attempt to get to Mongolia. Riding that bike fully loaded up made me realise that it isn't always the destination that matters but the journey getting to where ever you end up. 50 / 60 mph gives you so much time to see your surroundings slowly change. Comfort is probably the most important factor on any long haul, and don't forget handlebars can always be changed, unless you find that you also need to cover the miles as quickly as possible. Sometimes it really comes down to what your heart says when you see a bike. Short comings can always be overcome or overlooked if you really like the machine. |
If you live anywhere near Vancouver ,I saw a Transalp on Craigs List today .
It might be what you are looking for . |
I live in Saskatchewan, smack dab in the middle of nowhere.
I saw that Transalp. There are also a couple in Toronto. I think that would be an excellent bike, not too big, not too expensive. The problem for me is getting a bike from Vancouver or Toronto to Saskatchewan. It is too cold and to early in the year to make a big ride, and shipping seems to be a problem for everyone when you ask. Any ideas? |
Is $3500 a fair price to pay for a Transalp with 35,000km(20,000miles) on it? How many kms is considered a lot for these bikes? Is there a benfit to a 1989 vs a 1987 model year?
|
20,000 miles on a NTV engine (what they used in the TA and NTV Reveres, as well as a similar design to the AT) is negligible. Unless it was owned by a heathen, previously, that bike should see 100,000 if maintaned, IMO.
No idea about model differences, but at that age, I would say go for the one in better condition. (check the contition of the exhausts, brakes, tyres, panels hoses etc) Note that TAs are not light bikes 205kg.... Capable, dependable, but not light, so my guess is be prepared to work for it off-road on anything worse than a gravel track... Happy shopping... |
After a whole lot of searching and debating, I finally pulled the trigger on a used DL650. It is a '05, single-owner bike with 12,000km, in very nice condition. It is basically stock with a centre stand and some handguards. I bought it through out local dealer who had taken the bike on trade. I am very pleased with the choice and look forward to getting out and doing some riding.
|
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:37. |