Himalayan or Honda CB500X
 

Royal Enfield Himalayan. 300 miles, 69 reg
Or
Honda CB500X. 9000 miles fsh with Honda panniers.
Both the same price £3700!!!!!!

The Honda, I have got fed up with fixing things.

I guess the first question has to be "What for?"

Is this a run-around, weekend toy or travel bike?

I don't know much about the RE (read "next to nothing"), but I can say my father had a CB500X as his run-around and liked it. He'd had a TA 700 and wanted something lighter and this was it.

As a travel bike in more populated areas, I suspect the CB would do well. I'm not sure how self-serviceable it is, as seems to be the case with newer bikes these days.

Unless things have changed, REs are supposed to be easy to work on.

To be honest, and speaking personally only, I'd go with the Honda. I just think it's more useable, day to day.

?
 

Honda.

dont know what you want to do. but you could give me two RE and I would still take the Honda.

enjoy your ride.

mika :mchappy:

Never has there been an easier question to answer.

Royal Enfield VS Honda.


I'd rather ride the Honda with 100,000 miles on it than a R.E with 69.


To be fair, the Himalayan has a cult following. And there are people successfully riding it around the world. But that's because its REALLY cheap. And it's design does tick a lot of the boxes for a good Overland bike.

Look up "Itchyboots" on youtube. She's riding hers around the world and not had many issues.


The earlier models were horrendous with frames snapping etc. The suspension and brakes are AWFUL on all of them. They're also really heavy and they're really slow.

Did I mention how cheap they are. That's their only saving grace. And it has a cool name. It's the same reason I bought my first Africa Twin twenty years ago. I'm just lucky it's one of the best Overlanding bikes EVER made.


Anyone with half a brain would buy a second hand Jap bike for the same price which is far better in every way and will still outlast the R.E by decades.

I didn't know you had a Himalayan.

Tell me about your experiences. doh:innocent:

Japanese over Indian tech any day of the week, even a classic Jap bikes pisses over anything India can come up with.

Mezo.

I was in the same dilemma recently - My brain said Honda CB500X but my heart said Royal Enfield Himalayan.

I bought a Honda Crf250 Rally...:mchappy:

Thanks for the replies.
I get it the Honda is bullet proof reliable.
But it needs revs. Is soul less.
The RE looks the part, feels under stressed.
Nora Lee has given one a workout.
A bit similar for me in head says Honda, heart says RE. Had a crf.
Glad I didn't buy a baby gs Ted.
A few horror stories. Ok while in warranty

It doesn't have to be that Honda.

I know what it feels like to hanker for something on an emotional level (the marketer's favourite leverage).

I mean, if you're really in love with the RE, get it. It's your money. It'll be your bike.
Just do so with open eyes as a number on here have already told you what to expect.

Ride it and tick that off.

Maybe you'll keep it, may be you'll sell it, but as you can see from the current prices of the two models you've been looking at, the Honda holds its value more, so if you decide to sell the RE once you've got that bug out of your system, expect to take a bit of a hit.

Or go back to the drawing board and look at what's around.

However, I know what you mean about the soulessness of a revvy parallel twin.

For me, for a 500cc to be charismatic means a single.

My Transalp is a twin 600 and even that can't be described as characterful (namely as it has no quirks and starts every time!).

Have you ridden it?

I rented a CB500X for an eight-day trip. It was great. When you're traveling, you don't care so much about "soul" as you do when just doing a weekend ride. You care about the bike not impeding your travel and letting you do what you want, every time.

I rode the Honda about three years back. I guess it didn't leave me enthused.
Probably pitched the wrong bike.
The NC700 on the other hand, I really liked.
Now the 750. Therefore I would like to change the 500 for the 700/750 NC
I rode the RE last year. I liked the engine. I didn't find the front brake that bad. Hard suspenders on the rear! Feet sit back a bit to far. Seat is uncomfortable.
What I do like is you can work on the RE as it is more simple

My 22 month old CB500 will turn over 14000 miles this week. Oil changes are one drain bolt and the spin on filter. The valves were all in spec at 12000, there is a Haynes manual. The closest thing to a fault would be the paint on the brake pedal starting to look a bit thin. Might take ten minutes with a rattle can to refresh.

I had a 2017 Bullet EFI for 11 months. Changing the failed TPS and snapped chain were indeed simple enough. I hope a Himalayan would have moved up a bit, but I doubt it will equal the Honda.

I think the only reason to get the Enfield would be if you really liked the look of it.

Andy

I would hazard a guess that by now a lot more people have ridden a CB500X to more corners of the earth than people have on a Himalayan... and had a painless time doing it too.

The CB is a proven platform: utterly reliable, low maintenance, very economic, all-day and high-hundred mile/iron-butt comfortable if needs be, and can maintain higher highway (freeway) speeds with ease as required.

It's worth noting that the fact that it makes almost twice the bhp of the Himalayan also makes it much more capable of maintaining speed at high elevation too.

The Honda engine has great fuelling, plenty of low end torque (it is certainly not 'revvy' at all, other than the cruising rpms are slightly higher than a thumper at higher highway speeds, mainly because it's a twin) and has a good spread of gears - making it very easy to ride at slow speed in rougher terrain, while not compromising any day-to-day highway ability.

With the right accessories and upgrades it also makes a killer 50/50 all-terrain bike, again one which doesn't compromise the on-road or off-road ability for the sake of the other - but you certainly don't need to go that far unless higher off-road ability is a requirement. A strong skid-plate and some decent tyres ought to see you handle most eventualities when riding in typical 'travel' mode.

For the same money I'd say it's an easy choice to make.

Jenny x

Thanks Jenny, I guess you are right. I have seen you giving said bike a good workout on ebay. Especially the touratek version with wheels, suspenders etc.
Do you still have it? What mileage has it or had it done?
Many thanks

Just to put it into context.

I did a 20,000 mile service on a kids Suzuki GSX-S 125 yesterday. Valve clearance check. This kid is a food delivery rider and rides this thing like he stole it. Cold starts, red-lining, zero craps given.

100% in perfect spec. The top end looked new. The motor is quiet, crisp and tight. It purrs away in perfect balance.

That's a £4000 bike. Brand new.

A Royal Enfield sounds and feels like a Skeleton pleasuring himself in a biscuit tin. The techs I know who have worked on the R.E tell me of valves needing regular attention and head gaskets leaking. That is either poor assembly or poor manufacturing of components. Neither I want anything to do with.

No comparison whatsoever.

At the risk of self-promotion... Some soulful riding on a CB500X. (Left my panniers at the hostel for this...)

Hi Floyd - oh yes, I certainly do have my bike still - which is why I wholeheartedly recommend it to anyone else of course as I've been very happy with it's all-round ability over the years...

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-...VWNmRz2-XL.jpg

To clarify it's not Touratech, but Rally-Raid Products (in the UK) which make the upgraded suspension and spoked wheels for the CB500X, and if you've followed my adventures in the ride reports section on here in recent years, then you'll know that I helped John develop their upgrades originally back in late 2014/early 2015 - before taking a US bike across the country from Oregon to Virginia; and then returned following the complete Trans-America Trail which had been newly updated and extended into Idaho that year...

I mention this because I was particularly inspired by that trip, and subsequently proud of that ride report - and if anyone is still twiddling their thumbs during lock-down and looking for something to read and some nice pictures, the blog style ride-report I complied at the time has since been condensed here on the Hubb:

Trans-Am 500 - The Seven Year Itch

...together with a follow-up trip a couple of year's later (2017) on my own bike, where I also explore some of Canada, and Montana/Wyoming etc. too:

Northern eXposure

So all in all, I'd say I've covered at least 60,000+ miles on an array on CB500Xs - from bog-standard versions to various iterations of the Rally-Raid upgraded ones - including 35,000+ miles on my personal bike - and all of which has included a mix of terrain, including a high proportion of 'off-road' riding as you might imagine.

If you're interested in the bike, there is an ever expanding owners/riders community online, one with a dedicated forum - out of respect for Grant & Susan I won't link directly to those, but the name of the bike and dot com ought to see you find one useful resource; plus those 'adventure riders' out there have also created couple of huge threads dedicated to the CB500X - again with plenty of useful information and real-world owners' feedback...

Certainly as the model has become more established (since it's introduction in 2013) there are an increasing number of riders who have posted impressively high mileages from their bikes, and all with very few (if any) issues and only modest maintenance requirements.

Please understand I'm not trying to steer anyone away from the Royal Enfield - all bikes are great fun, and the Himalayan has a certain charm (albeit with an ugly headlight assembly ;o) - but as I always say, ultimately you need to decide what what your priorities are, and hopefully choose something which is most appropriate to your actual needs - or at the very least, something you can live with.

And as I always say, don't forget that ultimately these are only bikes - machines - tools to help you move... You don't have to own any bike forever, well, unless you want to of course!

Hope that helps...

Jenny x

Sorry, yes rally raid. It was a while ago. I remember you changing your tyre. Not easy I remember.
What has gone wrong with your bike Jenny in that time?
Serviced regularly?
Valves stayed in spec!!

I get the basic drift.
Honda all the way.

I still think I would go NC rather than CB

Decisions decisions

Hee hee - if you mean Juan's [infamous] tyre changing video, then yes, that was a struggle - ironically changing the tube was easy (15 mins or so) - but it was a right faff trying to refit the rear wheel (particularly on your own) - although it is hampered by the rather budget design the rear axle adjusters on the 2013-18 bikes, fortunately the latest model CB500X (introduced last year in 2019, which also has a 19" front wheel as standard) has chain adjusters which are integral with the swing-arm now.

Absolutely nothing of any note has happened with my bike - other than one of the front indicator running light filaments burning out as I recall (the US bikes have a second 5w filament in the front turn-signals, which act as daylight-running-lights).

Otherwise all I have done is change the oil every so often (the schedule suggests 8000 mile oil and filter changes, and 12,000 mile air filter changes - note. it is a cartridge paper filter on the CB, and very efficient), and I had the valves inspected at around 16,000 miles (again as per the service schedule) and they were all well within spec - so much so that I've not bothered with getting them checked again yet, despite the mileage being over 35,000 now.

As for the NC [750X] - although superficially similar looking, they are quite different bikes. As I replied to a similar question on Facebook recently, if you spend the vast majority of your time on the road, it is a nice bike - however, physically the NC is appreciably longer, and significantly more heavy... performance wise it really doesn't offer much more than the CB does, other than a bit more torque at higher speeds, for more relaxed overtaking for example.

The economy is a touch better on the NC too, but honestly in real world riding conditions, they are pretty much the same. Where the NC offers more is in potential pillion comfort and a bit more room for hard luggage. Plus there is a DCT transmission option of course. You also have the 'frunk' which is handy for small shopping trips or to stow your helmet when away from the bike, although conversely the under-seat fuel-filler is a pain if you have any luggage over the rear seat.

I'd take a ride on one and see how you feel - if you stay mainly on paved roads and do a lot of high mileage runs, it's a very comfortable bike. But it is very little soul compared to the CB which is basically much more 'fun' to ride everywhere, and much less of a handful off-road.

Put it this way, I enjoyed riding the NC for a the few weeks I had one, but I wouldn’t buy one unless I was specifically looking to commute in and out of a city for example.

Have fun choosing!

Jenny x

Definitely try before you buy on an NC. (I've had one of those as well!)

The engine is like a diesel car compared to the CB. No 7000 rpm in third gear stuff. It goes but the technique is to keep changing up. This is why the press will use phrases like gutless. It isn't, they just can't get past wringing the necks of every bike they are loaned.

Andy

I tried the NC700 s and x when they first came out. I thought they were a breath of fresh air. I don't need 10,000 rpm to have fun

Had an early RR 500X
https://adventure-motorcycling.com/h...0x-overlander/

and a Him
https://adventure-motorcycling.com/2...eld-himalayan/

(and briefly, an NC-X DCT too).


Took the 500 and Him to Morocco.
Greatly enjoyed plodding along the trails on the Him, but the 500 was effortless in getting there. It's the usual conundrum (for that destination).

For pootling around the Dales, the Him will be great fun, but try one first.
It's not some crappy Bullet but not everyone gets it.
3000-mile valves and oil (they say).

The Honda eats long miles, less maintenance, probably better on fuel (at matched speeds) but some find them bland. It's the sensible choice.


If Honda made a Him we could all pack up and go home!

Hee hee - they did... they stopped making it circa 1985 though ;o)

Jx

Good morning folks.
Right I have come across a CB500. It was accident damaged on the front end so was classed as a cat n.
It was covered from the road version to the x version. Front end wise.
15 plate. 10,000 miles. I haven't seen it, but advised it was in super clean condition (!!!!!). Good chain and sprockets. Nearly new tyres.
One key.
£2295
Your thoughts you beautiful people

P.s, I can add a link if it is allowed:helpsmilie:

I saw that one yesterday. Looks like a great deal.
But have a look first as it's unusually cheap.

That is an issue Chris, I would have to take a punt. No time and it is a 5 hour drive for me. The pics look good. I know that doesn't mean much.
I have asked some relevant questions by mail a little while ago

Not sure about the "conversion"?

What was if before? If it was an F they've changed the tank, fairing, shock, goodness knows what in the way of brackets and wiring. Two crashed bikes used to make one better one? The conversation with the sewer ants could be long, tedious and in the worst case pointless.

Another £400 gets you a 31000 miler in London that even has a Rally Raid sump guard. I think I'd take one that's just been ridden over one with low miles due to the time Dr. Frankenstein had it. 31K is nicely run in, even if its been dispatched.

Mine will be going next year. The offers for it will be derisory, simply because of the mileage. I've ridden the average number of miles for a 500cc commuter/ learner bike, I've just done it in three years rather than seven :rofl: The prices reflect what else is out there.

Andy

Fair dues trb. Personally I want a bike with around 10k or under.
I do see what you mean though

As Chris and Threewheelbonnie have suggested, I would be cautious... the R model frame does have the welded boss on the front for the headlight/fairing support - which apparently is in the same location as it is on the X frame unless some welding has been done - but I cannot understand why anyone who'd had a front-end crash on an R would replace all the bodywork with X bodywork - faring, headlight, tank, seat, side panels, seat side panels, X forks (and presumably a wheel too if the original crash was severe enough to bend the forks) - to me that doesn't make financial sense at all, unless you have a very cheap (ie. stolen) X to take all the necessary parts from.

To me this stinks of some kind of ringer (not least as the V5 is going to say it's a CBR500R still) even though it is being sold by a dealer... I would certainly inspect it, and get the history on it, and run a check on the VIN too.

If that is too much bother, do what Threewheelbonnie suggests and buy the legit one for £400 more - 30,000 miles is nothing for these bikes - and you might well be able to offer a lower price on the 2013 bike too?

I'd be cautious with that R-to-X bike... that is not to say the conversion hasn't been done well, but you need to know why...

Jenny x

ps. who's to say that dash on the R-to-X bike conversion isn't the X dash (note that X dashes glow orange, R dashes are white) - and that the bike/engine has done more miles than 10,000 anyway, and just had the dash replaced with a lower mileage one as part of the rebuild? - is there any dealer/service history with this bike?

That's out of the window then lol

Yes, like I say, it could be a perfectly legitimate Cat N rebuild - but with any bike like that you need to know the genuine history of the donor bike, plus where the replacement parts came from.

In their defence* you'd have to have a lot of front as a dealer to rebuild a bike using stolen parts and advertise it so openly, so I'm not suggesting that is actually the case here - just you need to be sure that the donor is a genuine 10,000 mile bike (the engine does look clean admittedly) - and that ultimately as you've said, being located so far away from where you live makes a drop in and chat about it before any kind of commitment a bit unrealistic...

I would keep looking - and also consider joining the CB500X (dot com) forum, as there are regularly bikes for sale there, and you're much more likely to find a genuine and enthusiastic owner selling a genuine bike with full history etc.

Jenny x

*edit. having looked at that listing in more detail again, I would be prepared to give them [the dealer] the benefit of the doubt - it appears they specialise in insurance rebuilds, and that the dash panel with the ignition on does appear clear/white (rather than orange backlight) which would imply it is the original speedo from the R donor bike... Still, I do wonder where they got all those X body panels from, and how it could have been an economic repair compared to just a fairing and headlight for an R? I appreciate the X model is arguably the most desirable of the three 2013-on CB500 bikes, but it does seem to be a lot of work for a very modest selling price.

I have binned it.
I like this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/233598711646
Bin the plastic panniers!!!!
What are they worth???
?c?
Or this https://www.gumtree.com/p/cars-vans-...nt=app_android

The NC is a bargain. The result of simply being a workhorse rather than weekend adrenaline toy. Come join us at nc700.co.uk for lots of info.

The plastic boxes are honestly worthless. While Honda did a great job making parts common across two bikes and a maxi scooter, boxes that fit everything are weird shaped and not good value. I'd ask the dealer to keep them and knock a bit off (bet he won't, he knows everyone wants GIVI/soft combo's). Failing that either just use them or you might get enough cash to fill the tank a couple of times.

Andy

Very low mileage on that NC750X - 3139 miles for a 4 year old bike. I wonder what the service history is like.

Skeleton and a biscuit tin I've never heard that before. Thanks Ted you've just made me laugh out loud!!!:rofl:

Hi Ted

What sort of Enfield was it that they were working on? When I went for a test ride on one of the "new" models - the Interceptor 650 - it was really smooth and was pretty well silent valve wise (well compared to my old airhead BMW most things are quiet, but I have developed an ear for valve noises). When I have seen the Himalayan running out and about they have been pretty quiet too, not just demonstrators either.

These won't have been new ones. But not the early frame snappers.

I don't think they've had valve problems per se. They just need adjustment a lot. And head gaskets have been known to leak.

I've had very little to do with them mechanically wise. I've ridden a few and could not understand why anyone would fall in love with one. It feels like something out of the 80's.

These bikes cost under £2000 BRAND new in India. You just can not make anything of quality for that price.

They are firmly in the category of "Cheap Asian shit" in my book.

That doesn't mean you can't buy one and ride it around the world. Many people do just that with even worse bikes.

Just manage your expectations.

With no disrespect to their owners, many people who rant and rave about them do so with very little experience or no other bikes to compare it against.

"Have very little experience or no other bikes to compare them to",

Who weeded on your fire Ted?.

Are you saying Himalayan owners are thick?

Price and geography have nothing to do with anything is this globalised world. Triumphs are made in Thailand from Chinese parts. BMW engines are made in China from Chinese parts, or Germany from Chinese parts using Polish and Rumanian labour. No one casts anything in mass numbers outside China or India and even forgings will use metal from these places unless its way above automotive spec.

They all charge more in Europe because if they went with £2000 they'd have lower margins and lower sales because of the crazy assumption anything they sell for less must have cost them less.

On this logic, are Honda parts that sell for less in the USA lower quality?


I'm no Enfield fan, my 500 EFI was too similar to by Iron barrel 5 speed, but I think you have to look at product not brands. One day the Chinese will make a decent bike. This is where brands might be useful, they won't call it an AJS or Norton.

Andy

I have done a testride on a Himalayan and liked it very much. The test I have seen from a Dutch bike magazine was very possitive ( https://www.motor.nl/motortests/moto...yan-2018-test/ in Dutch but you have google) and I have seen reports of people riding from India to the Netherlands with almost no problems at all. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6sPF1PYPW8)


So I do not think you can compare the Royal Enfield Himalayan with the old Bullet. It is a completely new bike.

Valve clearance check (and adjustment every 5000 kms) on the Himalayan versus every 24 000 kms on the 500X - so indeed a lot more hassle with the valves on the Himalayan compared to the Honda. Basically 5 times as often.
From my understanding the Honda has shims but the Himalayan has screw adjustment of the valves which makes it easier to check and adjust the tappets on the Himalayan (maybe Ted can elaborate on this...?) - but still a lot more work and hassle with the Himalayan.

The Himalayan is tank off, screw out a cover then feeler gauges, spanner and screwdriver. Call it an hour the first time 30 minutes after that. My 1973 Honda has a very similar system.

The CB500 has the tray with the coils in the way after the tank is off and the head cover has to come off after that. Took me three hours. I was OK, nothing to adjust, but if you did have one out you need to remove, measure (add a micrometer to your tool kit?) and order a shim. The removal has the easy if scary looking Honda system of pulling the follower shaft. The shims are a standard size, so a workshop will have a set to exchange, at home you'd be waiting for the Postie. I would not want to do this in the car park of the Holiday Inn Express in Marakech, but then again I'd be pushed to do 16000 miles and not pass a Honda dealer or my own workshop.

It's the shaft versus chain argument all over again, do you want to do a simple job often or a big one less often.

Andy

I have just got back from a test ride on the Himalayan and have mixed feelings about it. What I wanted it for was to do a commute of 50 miles each way of which 35 are on dual carriageway. So the test ride was to see what it was like on a dual carriageway - the answer, for me, was it wasn’t the right bike as it was too vibey and slightly out of breath at 60mph+ so instead of spending an hour on the bike on a big road getting more disappointed I went onto side roads and country lanes. At that point the bike made really good sense - the power (yes, I know it only has 25hp) comes in nicely and it feels nice a light on the move (bear in mind I have a BMW R80) - it takes to twisty routes well.

So it isn’t the bike that I hoped it would be but I can see myself getting the 650 Interceptor for the ride to work.

I would think about the Himalayan for a long trip when I would be going on unmade roads for a significant proportion of the trip but it would mean that I would be close to excluded from larger roads due tot he mature of the bike. And that might be no bad thing - going slower is what I am doing anyway, I don’t really want to sit on autobahns munching miles - I am not in a race. I would have to look at the ergonomics of the bike as well as I found the position slightly cramped until I stood up at which point it felt much better and more in control - for a road exclusive rider that was a surprise for me.

Thanks for posting. I need to get a test ride.

I'm going the other way, no commute and don't like motorways but often find myself with a combination of small road and bad weather where less weight would make life easier.

The Bullet I had felt unhappy above 60 mph until the second or third oil change. How many miles on the demo bike?

If I may ask how tall are you? I'm 5 foot 8 with a 29 inch inside leg so can't think of a bike since my CB100N that I found cramped, but worth asking :thumbup1:

Cheers

Andy

At the start of the test around 180 miles on the clock so still very tight - the engine was very willing up to around 5k rpm and that equates to around 60mph so I was happy to stick to that but it was starting to reach its limit.

I am just shy of 6 foot with an inside leg of 32 inches so not extreme in size (apart from a too large gut).

One thing that I forgot to say yesterday was that the screen for me could have been a little taller and the breeze would have been held of nicely. Having said that I didn’t realise until I got back onto my naked BMW R80 that the screen really cosseted me and I felt really quite exposed (not in a scary way) on the BMW. I am now thinking that I would like some sort of screen for the BMW for longer trips / commuting - not a fairing, just a screen. Hmm food for thought and time to ask some airheads for their opinions / preferred screens.

I see that the Interceptor can come with a screen........ - I think that She Who Must Be Obeyed may have accepted that I am getting a new bike in a little while. :D

Funnily enough, just noticed itchy boots Dutch woman has just switched from her famous Him to 500X.

Himalayan for Asia and Latin America and a 500X for Europe. Makes a lot of sense to me....:thumbup1:

My 2019 CB500X was a great bike but had this slight buffering at highway spend that caused it to weave enough to get tiring over time.

I am sure you could have changed the screen or seat height or something to fix it as it got worse with my daughter on the back.

Great bike otherwise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The CB500X screen is literally starting to do my head in.

Currently on lower setting, 3mm spacer bottom, 6mm top. Going to try this on Sunday.

These spacers on the top setting reduced the point at which is passes my test* from standing on the pegs at 90 mph (private autobahn etc.) to sitting at 50 or standing at 70.

Could decide if it was better with the screen removed.

No weaving though.

Andy

*the test is the ability to hear enough of Vaught Williams Lark ascending to enjoy it, without being deafed by the following tracks while stationary. The CB500F passed at any speed it would do.

Interesting reading the thread I've pretty much ended up at the option of the same two bikes ruled all the bigger beemers out once my rd250c sells.

Thanks for posting the motorway opinion up Jay that's a big help for those of us who are looking at the same bikes. One bike I did consider was an f800gs again had one two years ago which I sold for the 250c.

The Honda does look an interesting bit of kit quite fancying the new shape on myself.