European Tour - 2 UP!
 

Hi all!

I am currently in the tail-end of planning a year long trip through Southern Europe and beyond, and have almost gotten to the point of actually having to buy a bike. As a long time lurker trying to pick up bit of info as I go I thought this would be a decent place to ask.

There will be two of us on the bike, plus as much of my girlfriends wardrobe as we can fit on the back :rolleyes2: so I suppose the main issue will be weight and maneuverability. The route will begin in London (where the bike will be bought) before travelling through France, Spain and Portugal, Italy, the Balkans, Greece and perhaps Turkey and beyond if we make it that far. Back roads will be the aim so it doesn't need to be particularly fast though it will probably need decent power once its all loaded up.

Does anyone have any experience 2-upping for a long haul and pros / cons on the bike you did it on? The two main bikes we have been looking at were:

• Kawasaki KLR 650
• Suzuki V-Strom 650

We are looking to do it on the cheap, although we understand its a fine line between cheap and not getting a reliable bike, not looking to spend much more than $4,000 USD but please let me know that's unrealistic.
Appreciate any comments! :mchappy:

I cannot comment on either bike through personal experience but have read many good things about the V-Strom both here and on other forums, the Kawasaki is also a good bike but not as good two up.
You do not say where you are from but as you give a value in US Dollars that may be a clue, while it is possible to buy in the UK as long as you have an address the problem is getting insurance as a foreigner so many people buy in the Republic of Ireland where it is much easier, hopefully others will be along with more information about this.

2 Up Around Europe
 

My girlfriend and I did most of the UK, Wales and Scotland over a 3 month period last summer and start segment #2 in June. Will be leaving London for Ireland and then to Portugal, Spain and the Balkans. I would suggest at the very least the V-Strom 650 and a bit bigger if the funds allow. I am in Charleston - let me know if you need any other assistance.

Michael

We used a Honda Transalp to travel two up trough Europa: Motorcycle Balkan Tour - Slovenia, Croatia, Montenegro, Albania & Greece

Of the two bikes you have mentioned the V-Strom would definetively get my vote. More powerful than the KLR, better comfort two-up, better fuel economy as its EFI versus the carburated KLR. Very solid and reliable bike overall. The KLRs have the «doohickey» upgrades needed.

Have a look at Kawa Versys 650, Honda Transalp 600, 650 and 700. Maybe BMW 650/700 GS (the two cylindred model) or the 800. There are others as well...

When travelling alone I prefer my trusty old Beemer with 50 hp (37 kw). It has a drive shaft and is easy to service. But two up with luggage is a different story. Although - remember Grant & Susan, travelling for decades on their R 80 G/S :mchappy:
IMHO the small V-Strom would do the job. It's known to be reliable, has smooth engine characteristics and is easy on fuel. Bigger bikes are, of course, more comfy, but far too heavy....

The KLR is a good bike, but too heavy and definitely underpowered for two up with luggage.

I had a V-Strom 650 for a 2-months ride in New-Zealand lately and I really enjoyed this bike (despite I am normally riding a Beemer). It was 8 years old with 100,000km but had no problem with it except a burnt stator. I was solo rider but bought it from a couple who traveled on this bike before I bought it. I would definitely buy one again.:thumbup1:

Suzuki v-strom definitely can take it, very comfortable bike.
KLR lacks of power, verys 650 is too short for 2up IMHO.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...7b8f6b2313.jpg

I've noticed that the wheelbase of the DL650 appears to be longer than that of the 650 Versys. Not that I have checked the figures.
The Vstrom seems to have a longer seat squab (does anyone else still use that word now?) for the pillion passenger.

My views of the 650 Versys are in this thread from a few years ago:-
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...s-thread-65709
It is not the only 'budget" bike that is fitted with budget suspension.

There aren't many KLRs to be found in the UK nowadays; they went the same way as many of the other old technologies produced by Suzuki, for instance.

For all of Europe, the current basic specs of a bike are fuel injection engines, ABS compulsory and a catalytic exhaust, as a minimum.

To find a second/third/fourth owner KLR in good condition will take time and effort and an amount of good fortune while you wait for that particular bike to come up for sale.

Look on, for instance, UK ebay and you will see what types of bikes are commonly for sale in the UK.

You didn't mention your budget ?

I hate to say it. But you can do far worse than an older R1200GS.

You can get a mint ten year old bike for under £5000. As long as it's been cared for (most have), then it will serve you well.

I used to slate the 1200GS's on here until I went out and finally bought one for my Two-up touring needs.

Mine is ten years old with 60,000 miles. I bought it from a dealer with an AUB warranty and EVERYTHING is covered on it. You even get 18 months Euro cover which includes breakdown and recovery. They'll even give you a hire car/bike.

I don't think id own one without a warranty as when they do go wrong, there is no such thing as a cheap fix on a GS. But get one with a BMW warranty and stay within Europe and there is very little to beat it.

I would NEVER own one as a solo rider, but for a bike that can carry two people and their luggage in a great deal of comfort with plenty of grunt and power, it really is a hard bike to beat.


I never thought Id ever write this post... :rofl:

P.S. I've had a 650 V-strom. Good bike. But for two up it was a bit cramped and didn't have the grunt of the bigger bikes It's certainly no featherweight either. But it will certainly handle your trip .

Cramped ??? come on, wheel base of R1200GS is shorter, 1507mm vs 1555mm on v-strom. Suzuki seat is huge, I believe even bigger then on GS. My wife said it's like a sofa :)


BTW suggesting GS you are kidding, are you? bier
Although for Europe trip you are close to service shop all the time :Beach:

I'm dead serious. BMW's have their limitations of course. But I've yet to own a better two-up European touring bike. And I've owned about 100 bikes over the last few years. Especially if you have the BMW warranty/breakdown cover.

Im no BMW fanboy. That's been obvious from my posts on here over the years. But I've also been a BMW tech for five years and my opinion has been changed a lot. But not entirely.
Those oil cooled 1200 motors are incredibly robust. If you know the bike well and it's maintained and checked before you leave, it will be just as reliable as any Jap bike.

Or just throw an AUB warranty on it, don't leave Europe and put your feet up in a 4 star hotel while BMW fixes your bike or gives you a replacement. They certainly know how to keep their customers happy in Europe.



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Europe touring
 

From what you initially posted it seems that most if not all your riding will be on road, if so why on earth would you want a trail/dual purpose bike? After riding many styles and sizes of bikes i'm now riding a BMW 2012 1200RT. It is a good size, enough power for all day cruising and able to carry a load and can handle lite dirt roads. Also, being in Europe, BMW's are serviced all over.
Just my 2 cents.

ok, but all that insurance coverage cost money doesn't it? and OP was talking rather about budget solution if I am not mistaken. Even though, I rather be riding then waiting with my girlfriend for assistance vehicle to come over, usually it takes time anyway.

If he bought an older 1200 from a dealer it would come with the AUB warranty and be fully serviced. Budget is subjective to an individual. But yeah, he'd be paying a minimum of £5000.

You can buy a BMW a lot cheaper privately and buy BMW Insured warranty and breakdown which I 'think' starts at around £350. All done online.

Check a bike is eligible before buying it though. As older models aren't always.

A 650 Vstrom from £2000 will also serve him well too as you say.

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I'm currently doing South America to USA two up on a KLR. I've also previously used a Vstrom 650 for the same role in Australia. Both will do the job, but for Europe the VStrom is an easy winner - more space and luggage capacity and more power for the generally faster roads. Also because the KLR hasn't been available on Europe for wire a few years of day the VStrom is likely to be easier to get repairs done.

I won't enter the BMW debate

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I promise next time I'll reread what's written before posting to correct the horrors that auto-correct has done. That garbage sentence above should say:

"Also because the KLR hasn't been available in Europe for quite a few years the VStrom is likely to be much easier to get repairs and maintenance done".

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Cheers everyone for the informative and prompt responses!

I think the main takeaway here is to avoid the KLR and lean towards the V-Strom out of the two I talked about initially, while doing a bit more research on other options such as the Transalp. The fact that the VStrom has a lot of (cheap?) part availability seems like a massive plus in it's favour.

Regarding options such as the BMW, I'm trying to get the most value for money and try to keep the costs low as I'll be heading to Europe with a set amount of savings, so everything I don't spend on the initial bike purchase I can spend on the trip itself + repairs and services. I'm planning on putting some serious mileage on this thing so might see a bit of wear and tear, and have hopes of getting off main roads and into the backcountry to do a bit of village hopping. £3,000 would be approaching my absolute maximum if within reason.

For a bit more background I'll be travelling over from New Zealand (@RichM hope you had a great time here BTW!) with a lot of family in the UK, so I'm hoping I can use their addresses for the purchase and insurance and the like.

For 3000 Quid you would probably get a well running 1150 GS, so I personally wouldn't consider the 1200 GS. The old Beemers are reliable and easy to service, no hassle with the chain, lots of space for two, sufficient grunt and good to handle even on dirt roads.

Stay with the market for chain driven machines??
 

Perhaps.

There are 61 of them (all models of beemer fitted with the 1150 engine) for sale on UK ebay at present.
The road-going models are always better value than the GS version in their asking price, all other things being equal for second hand bikes.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...50&_sacat=9800

(123 DL650s for sale).

I am assuming you may want to sell the bike at the end of your trip. It's not as easy as it used to be to buy a bike and take off. You can probably buy a bike in London, but it may be difficult to register in your name and insurance to take it out of the country on an overseas driving licence is virtually impossible if you are not a resident. You may find insurance but the cost will be very high, especially with 2 up. Why not go for a purchase and sell back in the EU with a registered company? I've recommended this guy before, because I've known him for several years, he's well known to HU and he's totally legit with an excellent reputation. He'll find what you want in terms of a bike, like a V strom or a TDM or a BMW or whatever, buy it for you within your budget, and register it in your name at his business address in France. It will be prepared and serviced, & he can arrange European Insurance. At the end of your trip , he'll buy it back at an agreed value. Contact Laurent Dozias at Ride -in -Tours, he speaks fluent English.

Motorcycle travel agency in France - Ride in Tours introduction

Here's what I did.

I ride two-up most of the time. The VS was a little short winded two-up with gear and touring. I bought a Triumph 1200 and now have a VS 1000, my second, and love it.

I'm also American and I bought my bikes from Americans, tagged them in my home state (no inspection required) and they stay and we're purchased in Germany. Look at a website Knopftours.com in Heidelberg, Germany. He's a great guy and can help you buy a bike and get the green card insurance for the bike. They also have a for sale page on the website. I've ridden most all on Western, Central and Eastern Europe, over 35,000 miles. We camp and cook also on the road so space is at a premium. Eastern Europe still is our favorite.

Have fun.

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With regards to insurance I've done some poking around other threads and it seems its easy enough to get Green Card insurance from a company in Europe itself (saw ADAC mentioned), and for much cheaper?

Worst case scenario, I have British citizenship also as well as names and local addresses I can register bikes in.

Suprised at how cheap some of these used BMWs are as well, but some have raised issues regarding reliability in this thread and to be honest, breaking down as little as possible is a high priority seeing as a lot of the time I'll be in countries with very little english being spoken.

EDIT: after a bit of research it looks much harder to get Green Card insurance if you don't have a European drivers license - looks like I may have to post in the paperwork subforum for this one.

I am from the US and have my international drivers license and never have a problem getting green card insurance. The costs can vary though depending on where you get it from. Polly at MotoCamp Bulgaria can help you with that for a good price.
Have fun, and remember, you can never get too lost.

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What is an AUB warranty?:oops2:

Approved Used Bike.
Lots of BMW riders in the UK won't use one of these machines without that warranty scheme sold to customers by BMW - to cover the cost of repairing the final drive alone.
(was about 20 GBP per month last time I heard talk of this).

As an aside, sales staff in the showrooms of all manner of vehicle dealers are paid on the results of selling financial products as much as they are paid to sell the base vehicles.