50cc Mopeds - UNLAWFUL expansion chambers!
 

Is it my imagination or has this problem got much worse?

Every morning at 04.30 hours my partner and I are being woken by a moped being furiously driven past our house at excessive speed!

It has one of those damn expansion cans fitted and makes the most annoying noise - like a HUGE Bumble Bee... We hear the thing coming from a mile away...

That idiot must be waking thousands of others including small children in their beds.

This kind of exhaust fitment is without doubt UNLAWFUL yet the local plod around here seem to not to care. The police do possess considerable powers in these cases.

I'd like to know why these expansion chambers (cans) are being lawfully imported and sold in the first place to all these little twats.

Nearly all these automatic scooters / mopeds are ridden by youngsters. They fly around the streets taking enormous risks taking into account their riding ability etc.

I consider ALL motorcyclists who fit unlawfully loud exhausts to be ruining the good name of the majority decent, responsible, law abiding riders.

Most importantly, why would anyone wish to wake & upset people they have never even met let alone know? :(:(

It's becoming the bane of our lives around here. doh

The police (Toy Town) are bloody useless.

Alas- one of the answers could be " because they can and don't care"

Youth is often wasted on the young just as wisdom is wasted on the old!
Noise pollution, alas, is the bane of the modern world. Not just scooters, parties, arguments, trampolines, leaf blowers, sunday lawnmowers...the list is long...
Blessed be the noise cancelling Bose earplugs, your own choice of music (or none at all) and the open road.

Sounds like you need to go for a long ride Neil!:smiliex:

Buy an MV Augusta and join him/her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJUaSKz8R3I

I had a loud exhaust on my moped when I was a teen and still like loud exhausts.......... "Loud pipes save lives" :oops2:
I do sympathize with you being woken at 4.30 though :(

it's not just the mopeds unfortunately. Some wee scrote (the mate of the boy that parked across the end of my drive blocking me in one night!) goes up the hill past our house in his crappy little hatchback at excessive speed making excessive noise through the ridiculous 'performance' exhaust he's fitted (which probably does little more than stop the exhaust gasses being efficiently ejected!!)

but then, when I was that age I didn't give a shit either, it's only now I'm a grumpy old man that I do!

Understand just how you feel - I never needed an alarm as a guy used to go down the road about half a mile from my place (a nice twisty one) on a Ducati with loud pipes - regular as clockwork, Monday to Friday at 7am on the dot !

Best bet might be to get up early and pull him over for a 'chat' one morning. Perhaps see if any other neighbours fancy getting up and being there with you ! Being young he probably does not realise how he is upsetting people and thinks the sound of the bike is 'cool' whatever the time of day.

Perhaps explaining to him that he can repack the silencer might help as well ! But, like others have said, we were all young and offensive once, so don't be too hard on him .........

noise
 

well, to my knowledge ,there is no real limit, except for common sense !! the government backtracked on noise limit as deaths went up !!
I have to say, as a young person !! how many of us did have common sense !! lol but I do understand ! ear plugs ! beer

Ah the noisy scooter problem, we have just the same thing. I doubt you'll get any help from the police, if they're like our local force they've been scuppered by health and safety regulations that say they cannot pursue youths on motorbikes in built up areas for risk of the youth having an accident.

Crazy I know, the local scrotes all know this so go belting round residential areas on their stolen 50s with no helmets on safe in the knowledge that there's very little chance of them being pulled over.

Earplugs are your only answer.

An interesting post as, to a small extent, I've been seeing it from the other side. Last year, via a circuitous route, someone gave me a mid 70's Suzuki B120 two stroke which I've now done something like 5000 miles on. For those of you that don't remember / know them the B120 was designed to be a low powered inoffensive commuter bike intended to take you a few miles to work / to the station etc and most certainly not to stand out in any crowd. The problem is that these days it does stand out.

I've noticed on many occasions when riding it sedately through town that I get looks of annoyance from people walking nearby - something that doesn't happen when I'm riding one of my other (four stroke) bikes, even those with louder exhausts. The bike is completely standard and the exhaust exactly as Mr Suzuki intended it to be yet it does seem to annoy a certain number of people. My guess is that there is something about the timbre of a two stroke exhaust note that is intrinsically annoying and that as two stroke use has declined the few that have survived stand out more.

One kid on a sports 50 wouldn't have stood out 30 yrs ago and you'd probably have had a hoard of them buzzing / screeching their way past your window each morning; now you want to strangle the one remaining one. Probably won't help your sleep pattern but maybe you could think of him as an endangered species. :rofl:

Morning,

a few years ago, when I worked in the bike trade, there was a fatality on the housing estate, near to our garage. The scooter was a 50cc Gilera and the rider was 16. We were asked to inspect the bike, to see if it had been modified at all, as witnesses said it was doing well in excess of the 30mph speed limit, when it crashed.

So we checked it out and found it had been fitted with an 80cc conversion, with a matching exhaust etc.

What hadn't been uprated were the brakes or suspension.

The rider was killed in the accident and no other vehicles were involved.

It appeared that the bike had been bought as a second hand 50cc model but the new owner, and his mates, bought the parts with his mums credit card (with her permission) and the rest is history.

Sad loss of a life and it show's that the parents were either ignorant of the motoring laws, or they ignored them.

Regards

Reggie

Wellllll
i seem to remember that Allspeed , Kerker and Winning exhausts were all avaliable in the era that the complainent policed in , they were EXTREMELY loud and the old bill did bugger all about them ?c? Moving forward we now have lots of middle aged guys whizzing around with loud cans on their bikes , upsetting all in sundary with the excuse " loud pipes save lives " ( dont make me laugh ) , i get another 5bhp ( oh really ) and the standard can looks rubbish ( no comment ) . Im pretty sure an unsilenced super duke will rattle your windows much more than a moped with some shite baked bean can on the end , yet people still buy these pipes .
In my area 50% of all complaints about bikes are about noise , the rest is divided between riding like a twXt and speed ?c?
If you think you can use another 5bhp on top of a S1000RR then you are either full of it or a contender for Wsb - most people i come across would struggle with 100bhp let alone double that .

All that will happen is legislation or even more mobile radar sites - which is exactly what started to occur in Sussex last summer due to all the twXts from elsewhere using our roads like a motogp track - problem is an awful lot didnt make it home as they lacked the road skills to keep them selves alive eg 145mph in a 60mph :thumbdown: And if you ride like that and kill yourself then the only person i feel sorry for is your wife / parents / kids etc or the poor sod whose window screen is caved in when you obliterate your body across their car - personally me and the missus are sick and tired of dealing with whats left after something like that happens - Rant Over XX ?c? Oh and in case someone blames car drivers most of the accidents were down to the riders - full stop !!

Fact: loud pipes save lives!!!
Fact: Riding like a twat..... kills!!!

So when you are driving along in your Toyota Prius with the window down so you can feel the breeze on your face, spare a thought for the biker who loves the NOISE the smells and the look of his chosen motorcycle:thumbup1:

Loud Exhausts do NOT save lives, they do piss people off! - How about taking the time to research the subject in more detail. There are plenty of reports carried out which prove exhaust noise levels have little or no bearing on bike accidents.

The ONLY effective thing that will save you from an accident is driving/riding in a defensive manner - Such as, taking a wide line at road junctions where a motorist is waiting to come out.... This is something I always do in town if it's safe to do so.

I will concede that being seen in the first place may improve your odds too - High Viz jackets, Helmets and strips of day-glow patches are a good idea. This is why the police have adopted the high-viz yellow jackets (although to be honest it's often daftly over-used in normal policing).

I always advise riders to get hold of a copy of the excellent "Motorcycle Roadcraft" published by the Police Foundation. It's the handbook which police riders use as their bible. Currently on sale in most larger W.H Smith's for £16. It's well worth the time to read up...

In my experience most rider injuries are down to ONE factor - excessive speed. This is also often the case when car drivers pull out and T bone riders. Second must come running out of road when cornering too fast.

I agree with everything Chris Gale says above.

Getting back to the dreaded "Bumble Bee cans" - I still think these things should not be sold in the first place. They are an anti-social nuisance and shouldn't be imported at all.

As far as older classic bikes go, in general I have no problem with these loud exhausts because their riders normally respect those around them and avoid upsetting people by closing the throttle where it can be a problem. The offence is committed when you change the OEM exhaust to a louder one.

Here's what the law says about the matter of illegally loud exhausts -
Proof indeed that the authorities (police) already have ample powers to deal with the problem. Perhaps they are just unwilling to use it?????

I often see police officers turn a blind eye to this kind of incident. In my day our section Inspector would expect us to attempt a stop and then issue guidance (friendly advice) or a ticket (summonse).

Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

The Department currently has no plans to tighten the regulations referred to, although this position is kept under review. Regulation 54 already requires exhaust systems to be maintained in good and efficient working order and prohibits modification to increase the level of noise emissions. The regulations as they stand are therefore adequate for dealing with noisy vehicles.

Q. Whether they (Government) have a strategy to tackle the problem of the fitting of illegal noisy exhaust systems; and, if not, what plans they have to develop one.

A. Powers are available to tackle the problem of illegal noisy exhaust systems. Under the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986,

Regulation 54 requires that
"every exhaust system and silencer must be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not after the date of manufacture be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases".
Regulation 97

It is also an offence "to use a vehicle in such a manner as to cause any excessive noise which could have been avoided by the exercise of reasonable care by the driver".

Enforcement of these requirements is by the POLICE and in the case of maintenance, at approved MOT stations.

Powers are also available to local authorities to prevent or abate noise nuisance from any vehicle in the street. These powers are generally applied to stationary vehicles but there is no good reason why they can't be used upon moving traffic (with police help).

EC Diktats

Decibel Reductions
1970. 86 decibel noise limit introduced for motorcycles larger than 125cc (not implemented until 1982)
1980. 77 decibel limit on Mopeds first used after 1/10/80.
1982. EEC 86 decibel noise limit implemented.
1987. EC 87/56 stage one (82 decibel) noise limit becomes Euro law. Stage 2 (80 decibels) planned for 1993.
1993. EU proposes 'Multi Directive'. Contains 80 decibel upper noise limit, anti tampering and emission limits.
1995. UK implements stage one of EU directive 87/56 and reduces maximum noise limit to 82 decibels
1997. EU Multi Directive becomes European law. Maximum noise limit set at 80 decibels. Europe wide implementation July 1999.

MOT Requirement –

1. Examine the condition of the whole exhaust system, including the silencers and mountings, for security, deterioration and completeness. a. a part of the system missing or excessively deteriorated b. an exhaust system mounting missing, or in such condition that it does not fully support the exhaust system

Note: An alternative mounting deice is acceptable providing the system is secure and the system is not likely to fail prematurely. 2. with the engine running a. check the exhaust system for leaks

Note: A durable repair to an exhaust system which effectively prevents leaks is acceptable providing the system is structurally sound a. a major leak of exhaust gases from any part of the system

Note: A minor exhaust leak from, for example, a connection joint or a pin hole, is not a reason for rejection b. assess subjectively the effectiveness of the silencer in reducing exhaust noise to a level considered to be average for the vehicle b. a silencer in such a condition, or of such a type, that the noise emitted from the vehicle is clearly unreasonably above the level expected from a similar vehicle with a silencer in average condition.

Exhausts:
· The vast majority of large or big bore exhausts are illegal for use on public roads. The fact they may have passed an MOT test is irrelevant as this only checks for exhaust gasses and emission legislation compliance.

· Big bore and sports exhaust systems are usually fitted to increase the sound emitted and this contravenes the Type Approval of the vehicle, which is an offence.

There is no requirement for police to measure the sound level from the exhaust system, it only requires an opinion that the system is not standard and that it is noisier than a normal vehicle of the same specification.

THIS PROVES THE POLICE HAVE AMPLE POWERS TO DEAL WITH THE PROBLEM AT THE ROADSIDE. THE NEXT TIME THEY TELL YOU IT'S NOT POSSIBLE TO TAKE ACTION ON THE SPOT, JUST REMEMBER THE ABOVE QUOTE FROM A SENSIBLE CHAP AT NORFOLK POLICE.

· It is not an offence to sell these exhaust systems, but it is an offence to fit one to your vehicle and drive it on a public road. Motorists who do so would be reported to court and may face a fine and court costs.

Akrapovic
 

kentfallen,

Bikes are my profession, Bikes are my life.

I know every rule of the road and every text book inside out. I train riders in advanced riding techniques on a daily basis..

I still like them loud!

at the end of the day it is a bike not a prius and i want people to hear me coming!!!

So what's the situation with that horrific sounding,American built pile of junk that comes from new like it?...

Hi Lynch
I like bikes loud too - in the right enviroment :thumbup1: Loud cans wont save you - look at all the drivers who wear earphones , windows up on mobiles , stereos turned up etc etc . The only thing they are going to cause is legislation , as the voting public , who dont like them ring their mps and cause a fuss .
But i do like your style :funmeteryes:

Even if it is at 0500 in a built up area!

MarcM
Think you mean screamin eagle pipes . Well my friend bought a harley with those fitted and was told by the dealer "bring it here when its mot d " so am guessing they are illegal .

Totally, there is a time and a place for loud exhausts............4:30 am is not one of those times but when filtering through traffic and riding past a truck where your view is blocked a blip of the throttle could alert pedestrians there is a bike filtering:scooter:

or, when your view is obscured you could slow down!

It is for the pedestrians benefit doh nothing to do with my speed :thumbup1: It hopefully gives them more time to react instead of blindly walking out in front of me:thumbup1:

I find it kind've remarkable that a skills instructor defends this position. I sure hope you don't clobber some hapless pedestrian who doesn't hear you coming due to inattention, hearing loss, headphones, hat and scarf, competing noises from any source, or whatever else.

I'd add that it's certainly possible I'm mistaken in my interpretation of what you're saying here, which appears to be that you feel ok about filtering at a speed which would not allow you to stop safely should a relatively common event (a pedestrian stepping into the road between stationary vehicles) occur. If that's the case, you might think about the fact that others appear to be misinterpreting too…which suggests you might not be as good a teacher as you appear to believe.

Take it for what it's worth to you.

Mark

One thing to bear in mind in the noisy moped vs noisy big bike argument is that it is possible to ride a big bike with a loud pipe on quietly when necessary (low rpm/small throttle opening).

On a moped the throttle has only one position ..................

Blimey ive started a war :oops2:I only posted to gently take the pxxs out of the posters comments on law and order non action doh Will lock my self in the toilet with the construction and use legislation and not come out until i can spell ackropovic !!

I filter at a speed that that I can stop in the distance that I can see to be clear, making noise as I ride through traffic gives me one more possible advantage of being heard by pedestrians before they step out in front of me :thumbup1:
If another road user could benefit from that signal, why not use it?

I am not on here to coach anyone nor have my spelling checked but thanks anyway:thumbup1:

There is something particularly annoying about the whine of a 50cc CVT scooter ridden at top speed at 4.30 am. Its akin to the single mosquito inside your tent. I'm fairly certain that the majority of the doodlebugs buzzing round are 4-strokes and that the only modification done to the exhaust system is a few extra holes caused by the mild steel exhausts rusting out.

In all likelihood, one of these going past a house being ridden gently and considerately at whatever tome is unlikely to be a nuisance. The problem is when it's ridden at full tilt, possibly on the back wheel alone past your windows for seemingly hours on end.

Mind you it's still a more pleasant noise than the buzz of 50cc scooter, followed by the jump in revs as it gets air off a speed bump, then crumpling metal, smashing plastic and splintering bone and then the long silence broken eventually by the ever increasing sound of sirens approaching.

No matter what I might feel about them that's not an experience I'd like to repeat.

The solution? Better upbringing for the kids so that there's a far greater understanding of the responsibilities we have as citizens and far less focus on "my rights".

I blame the parents.

Lynch
Whose been checking your spelling :eek3:

heehee ...I could bite... but I won't!:innocent:

I presume this comment was aimed at me doh......Akrapovic as I had spelt in a previous post was the correct spelling:thumbup1:

Not me mate , i thought id spelt it wrong too lol . Anyway to finish off this post Loud pipes are officially pants at 0430 am

I agree..........there is definitely a time and a place:thumbup1:

Why just don´t you take the time once to block the street with your car just in time and tell that guy in no uncertain ways what you think of him and his steed. Then get out of the way and send him his merry way.

As far as unlawful and the police are concerned, well I grew up in a middle class neighbourhood in the sixties and seventies. Yet unlawful and dangerous are great terms to describe a fair amount of our fun activities in our misguided youth. My kids think I had an awesome time as a youngster. :cool4:

You might want to leave the cops out of the equation. One day your kids might scream down the street where your current miscreant is living with an expansion chamber you helped them to fit on their 50 ccm. :mchappy: Maybe this thought can help to brighten your day/night.

Take care.

Pete
That is a really bad idea :thumbdown: Never mind the road traffic issues , you are potentially committing an offence of unlawful imprisonment - dont do it !! However i understand your frustrations.....................................

Wearing my liberal hat there is something in that if you have the patience to survive it. About ten years ago (ish) we had similar problem with teens / early 20's on noisy bikes (and some cars) - although admittedly not at 4.30am, but it eventally went away when the kids grew up / moved away / got married. These days all we get is their pre school offspring demanding "sweets with menaces" at Halloween.:rofl:

fair dos quoting legislation, but the problem is the government cut backs,, police don't police anymore. How often do you see traffic cops patrolling? Mostly they travel from incident to office to incident..

Tis true - but they certainly would travel to that one if said kid told his mum and she then complained . Whilst there are cut backs "fire brigade" policing has been going on for years im afraid .

no..they don't.
ever hear of a little property called 'the dopler effect"?...at speed your actualy ahead of your sound by feet (or meters) based on speed of course. You end up a hood (bonnet) decoration before your heard.

those kind of pipes are to boost as much power as possible and to hell with what people think.

:welcome:

Read back on my posts, I am not explaining my reasons again.

also, when you skim past a car with those pipes you can shock the driver, causing them to swerve. loud pipes has absolutely nothing to do with safety

Lets dispel the stupid (mindless) MYTH that loud exhausts save lives! It's complete twaddle - NONSENSE!

I believe the person who has it about right is EvilNerdLord above.

These loud (unlawful) exhausts are, above all designed to increase power and TO HELL WITH ANYONE WHO DOESN'T LIKE IT.

These things are becoming the bane of many people's lives and the law needs to be changed to STOP their import. I would go further and make it a criminal matter giving the police powers to seize the vehicle and crush it (sect 165 RTA).

Our roads are NOT properly policed the way they used to be, that's a fact. What we need is more plain cars and REAL Traffic Coppers who love busting the BAD guys (not criminalizing law abiding Joe Public). What we have in place at the moment is a bunch of self-serving police chiefs appointed by their political masters to recover as much revenue as possible from the law abiding people they are supposed to be serving.

Police officers now often have great difficulty working out what constitutes a real criminal offence (one where there is an injured party). Many of our laws have been designed by our political masters to seize revenue from easy touches out there (law abiding citizens are the only people who pay up easily/instantly).

I don't doubt there are very good Coppers (thief takers) still out there, but from what I can see they are getting pretty thin on the ground. Sadly they are slowly being replaced with robotic revenue collectors who have no problem criminalizing innocent hapless motorists.

It's all about TEACHING US WHOSE BOSS!

Well the good news is that our political masters in Europe were legislating to prevent the modification of motorcycles using any non-homologated part. MAG and its European counterparts were fighting hard against this but but it's all gone a bit quiet on the news front recently.

I doubt it would make much difference though, I used to live in France where it is already illegal to supply non-homologated parts and the 'peds are still noisy as hell. It's a fact of life that 50cc CVT mopeds and scooters make a particularly annoying noise.

Im not sticking up for them but i was young once like all off us and had a honda MT5 for 1 month at 16 until it went bang and had a loud pipe, i think its part of growing up as a kid doing stuff like this but yes i understand your point and now if i was a father and it would be waking my child up i would be alittle angry but also i know i did stuff like this

Nearly all these automatic scooters / mopeds are ridden by youngsters. They fly around the streets taking enormous risks taking into account their riding ability etc. = Well thats because they only have passed a CBT so cant ride a bigger bike hence youngsters 16/17

I'd like to know why these expansion chambers (cans) are being lawfully imported and sold in the first place to all these little twats.= its not a hand gun but a loud pipe you can buy from any shop or from ebay

Maybe its better for kids (16/17) to work and get job to be able to buy scooters ect ect rather than do crack or get smashed on street corners.

A 2-stroke sounds loud anyway and more so early in the morning (my car sounds loud early in the morning when i leave at 4am and some street lights go on as i go down the road)

The push back is a lot of communities are passing noise ordinances and even the feds are looking at all exhausts MUST retain the EPA factory emboss stamp on the pipes to register it (enforced by starting to require smog tests, something never done before...)...at least that was article I read from the AMA a few years ago....

anyone remember that article?...

Dyou know? I too was a bit of a lawless wankrr when I was young but I've never, then or now, seen the appeal of loud, high pitched, buzzing cans. They seem so...geeky, the moto equivalent of being bespattered with acne. Even as kids we preferred something more mature in the exhaust note dept.

same is starting to happen here too now. Supposedly an exhaust that produces more noise or more emissions than factory standard will be banned. IN some countries, virtually any modification to a vehicle from the manufacturers original spec, or endorsed by them is banned and, because of the idiot few, I can see that happening here too.

my apologizes, pipes are a emotionally hot topic around where I live...

I use engine noise when appropriate too! when I leave my house before 07:00 on a Sunday to do out for some fun I am really quiet! very gentle with revs and throttle, on the way back if I think my daughter is out playing or the neighbours kids I hold the gears so they can hear my noisy engine before they see me come round the corner (slowly). This way they are off the road instead of on it! Even at 15 or 20 mph.

when they don't hear me, they have run out in front on 2 occasions now.

Loud pipes are fine provided you are very gentle in residential areas especially during unsociable hours!

Whaaaaaaaaahayyyyyyyyyyyy
This topic is up and running again :scooter: Best dont go thrashing the tits off your AP50 with a loud spanny attached in the Kent area or someone is likely to have an apoplexy :innocent:

It's nothing to JOKE ABOUT. It upsets this Swampie that much he's got CAPITAL LETTERS and he's PREPARED to USE them.

Have you read all the previous posts - apparently trial by combat is going to be resurrected :taz:Still beats a "caution" by miles !!

No, they're not legal.

They're sold as race use only. But no one really cares too much.

At that time in the morning though, you should try and track it down and put a polite note through the door.


Noise pollution is everywhere and getting worse.

I have a loud pipe but I would hate to think I was disturbing people. Within reasonable limits. I wouldn't leave it running on the drive or rev it up in the mornings etc.

The guy who lives opposite me runs his big petrol leaf blower for an hour every evening. Now that's noise pollution. He's got a weird obsession with leaves on his drive. It's like a jet engine going. However, there are times I have the angle grinder or chainsaw going so it's best just let him get on with it..

Best move to the Shetlands for a quiet life.

.

My old local council had community meetings where policing would be discussed, and residents could help persuade the cops what local issues needed addressing... perhaps if you gather a band of merry men and women and shout loud enough then this might move up the agenda.

Have you rung the police to have a chat about this particular issue?

.

Speaking as a moderator, thanks to one poster for editing the above. And thanks to all for addressing comments to the issue at hand while refraining from ad hominem, straw man, red herring, and other overused and abused forms of argumentation.

Speaking as a run-of-the-mill poster, I've got an intense dislike for loud pipes. I can certainly manage to live with them--not much choice, here in the Land of the Free (tm)--but I sure don't have to like it. I am equally irritated by loud leaf blowers, firecrackers, parents yelling ineffectually at their miscreant children, and verbose drunks on the neighborhood sidewalks.

Anyone favoring loud pipes might as well at least understand the opposing point of view, which is common among riders and non-riders alike. Taking steps not to offend people, as Ted describes above, seems to me considerate and common sensical.

Mark

Interesting thread to read...can't help but comment in a limited way; as it is an irksome thing here as well. Mopeds are the same everywhere it seems.....same her in Oz. I dont like loud pipes either; to what purpose are they used. To me it seems the same process of thought we apply to ourselves that it would make our motorcycle safer by informing the motorist and the pedestrian of our presence the same process of thought the moped can apply to himself. The moped here in Oz, is basically for the most part, a bicycle with a damn ancient designed lawnmower engine attached and peddles...I'm supposing it is the same elsewhere. Forgive me if I have it wrong.

My lawnmower has a Db rating that it can't exceed so it is a lot quiter than a LOT of m/b's. Certain M/c' makers don't have to abide by noise level restrictions it seems. Noise can be toxic to community stability.

Mopeds here are driven at speeds [sometimes on footpaths] exceeding the road speed limit by riders that are supposed to wear, but (seldom)don't, a helmet [bicycle type]. They do, I think, fit the description of 'a motor vehcile' under our state Motor Traffic Act. Fortunately there is NOT a lot of them. It is not policed here either, but in order to police it you would need a policeman on every corner of the streets...that's not going to happen. It's interesting fact here in Oz we have one Politician for every 1100 persons (per capita) and one policeman for approx. every 20,000 persons. I think the boys in blue have enough on their plate. They can't police everything and often stuff is just low on the priority list: BUT if it possible and it's not policed through laziness and not doing your job when you have the opportunity to, then that's a different matter. I can make that comment as I too had a career in law enforcement.

So who should be contacted moreso to change laws to pull these things into line because they have the power and there is more of them? The pollies I would say, but that's like talking to a brick wall. But it isn't their concern either...according to them the legislation is in place and it's a police matter. So it goes on the merry-go-round...something like (& I apologise to you scientists out there) the rock strata is dated by the fossil content and the fossil content is dated by the rock strata (???) Mopeds have an engine, are ridden on the road (and footpaths) BUT have no registration or licensing law to be obedient to. It is about time they did, I would think, pay their dues under those legislations (in terms of registration requirments and ability to ride through licensing); and then can be addressed the noise levels more effectively through control of the product. Of course this argument could go on and on infinitum......

Regards
Greg

To be ahead of the sound your engine is making you would have to be travelling faster than the speed of sound; ie Mach 1, or 766mph (approx. 340meters per second depending on air pressure).

The doppler offect is not really this its a change in pitch of the sound (or light) wave, either up or down depending on direction of travel.

I have nearly been wiped out by an electric car coming round a blind bend.... couldn't hear it over the cows in the next field.....

they are bloody dangerous those electric cars.

:offtopic:...maybe?

I was a at Suzuki dealer a couple of days ago getting oil and filter and they were closing shop and moving the bikes in. As I was leaving a sales person moved an electic bike in from the display corso out front and what an amazing thing 'not to see'. It moved so quick it was a blur over a 50 yard dash to the inside of the store - such a blur that I could tell it was a bike, could not tell what brand and vaguely got the color of the jacket the guy was wearing. It was silent and deadly fast.

So whats the answer for these things as far as louder exhausts go?; as they cannot be heard by others on the road or pedestrians crossing it. Perhaps a CD recording of a loud engine playing from an amplifier mounted on front and flashing lights perhaps as a backup 'cause you cant hear them.:confused1: