Avoiding Angola
 

Since it seems that getting an Angola visa is a real problem, what is the best way to get around it to Namibia? Fly across from somewhere north, go through DRC, or possibly get a coastal schooner? While I am not sure why Angola is persistent in denying visas to tourists, it is their country and so they can make whatever rules they want that they believe keeps trouble away, I am not prepared to spend two or three weeks sitting around waiting for a visa application to be processed only to be denied. By the time we get there things might have changed, but knowing there are alternatives allows planning that keeps the head banging stress away.

thanks, joe

Angola
 

Hi Joe!

Angola is a really nice country and you shouldn't miss it!

You know the option of the 5 day Transit Visa from Matadi without waiting at the Border?

We did Angola last year in 6,5 day's (it is a shame i know... you can spend weeks in this country!!! But we had a date with a friend in Windhoek) We met some other travellers on the Transit visa. They overstayed the Visa for 4 day's and it wasn't a problem at the Border.



Greetings from Perth werner+claudia

THANKS! No I didn't know about the transit visa. It wasn't mentioned on the visa web site nor could I see anything about it on the HUBB search. Just a lot of problems. We can cross Angola in two days. Not much to see and we want to get to Namibia in time for the festival there and then to SA for arrival of the penguins.

BTW, what other African countries have transit visas? As I said, I didn't see any mention of transit visas on the web site called "Project Visa" but if we can get transit visas for Togo, Benin and Nigeria that would be great.

For Togo & Benin just pick up a VTE (Visa Touristique d'Entente) which covers 5 countries (Burkina, Cote d'Ivoire & Niger) you should get it from one of the abovementioned countries from an embassy in W.Africa (Benin embassy in Dubai also issues them)

Kira

thanks Kira, that sounds like an easy way to get through those countries.
joe

in 2 Days?
 

Don't count too much on that. Crossing Angola in 5 days is push. And it's beautifull! And as soon as you emerge out on the otherside, you're in a different Africa. You'll miss the other Africa.

Joe, you might want to take a read of Lois Pryce's new book, Red Tape and White Knuckles.

Amazon.co.uk: Red Tape and White Knuckles: One Woman's Motorcycle Adventure Through Africa: Lois Pryce: Books

She covers going thru Angola with considerable detail - particularly road conditions ... and riding flat out, sunrise to sunset and later, manages to make it across the country with 10 mins to spare on her 5 day visa.

I dont know of anyone who has done that 1200 miles in much less than 5 days, even though everyone is just gunning it for the southern border to make it before the visa expires.

(she got her visa in Matadi as well)

Well, I guess if we have to push hard for five days to get across, we will because I won't wait around two weeks hoping for a visa only to be denied and have wasted two weeks. Everything I have read indicates that whatever Angola offers can be found in other countries whose visas are more easily obtained. Even if it is a beautiful and unique country it is not worth waiting three weeks as one of the other posters did and were then denied. If I can't run at 40 miles an hour for 14 hours a day, then I will fly across it. I have ridden many times from daylight to dark, the most recent time was last summer when we rode 900 miles in 13 hours. Would have done better, but stopped to take pictures, eat a leisurely lunch and then stopped again for an early dinner at our next to last gas stop. Yes, it was freeway riding, but When time is pushing, 5 days is a lot of miles even at 30 miles an hour.

Ah yes, Colebatch--but key point in your reply was that you don't know of many who have made it in much less than five days. BUT they did make it less than five days. A lot of it depends on the individual's ability to absorb discomfort and his or her determination. Some riders can't ride for more than 400 miles a day and believe they have accomplished a bunch while there are hundreds of others who have covered 1000 miles in 24 hours and believe they have done something special. Figure if you ride for 16 hours and average 25 miles an hour for 12 of those hours you will arrive with at least one day left on the visa. Riding 16 hours is a cakewalk. If Daylight begins at 5 am and ends at 9, that's your 16 hours. Subtract gas time and a 10 minute break when you get gas with one 30 minute break for lunch and are on the bike for 12 hours. There must be some parts of the road that you can roll for 10 or 15 minutes at 50mph and that brings the average up a little.

Angola roads
 

Obviously you haven't been there yet... count on 10 hours driving a day making 100 miles MAX in the southern half of Angola, unless the Chinese have advanced so far that the situation has improved. That's is 4x4. On bike you could do a bit more but 1 mistake and your f#$@ed!! Potholes the size of swimming pools.


But its still worth going there because of the people, the absence of a tourist industry, its all very authentic!

Also, if you skip it, you haven't made a full overland trip!

Cheers,
Noel
exploreafrica.web-log.nl

Wow, for such authenticity I just guess flying over it or riding through the DRC sounds better all the time. I guess I could hang around for two or three weeks for the privilege of riding through a country that offers nothing except landmines and treacherous roads, but there are better things to do. Ten miles an hour maximum just doesn't carry the thunderous appeal needed to entice me into doing the ride.

Hindu, I hope you get through Angola. I spent some 2 weeks in Windhoek trying to get a visa but failed. I had the help of an Angolan friend but still didn't get it. With summer on the way to the eastern Sahara, I felt compelled to continue up the eastern route rather than continuing to wait. I have met quite a few people from Angola and can say this- they are fun! I rarely make generalizations like that, but it is true. I am starting down the western route in September with no set timetable. I plan to spend a couple weeks chilling on a beach while waiting for an Angolan visa. By that point on the ride I believe I'll be ready for a nice break- and my little bike will be needing some care! I believe Angola will be worth the effort- I'll let you know after I visit! Be steady, Hook.

:-D
 

Starts to get funny.

4 days is probably feasible on a bike. I did it in 5 days in a Landrover in 2004. Lots of driving! But I'm sure you can drive more if you want. And in 2004, there where at least a few 100km's around Luanda with about the best tar you can find in Africa. I'd guess there's more tar these days. Before and after that, there're stretches with about the worst roads in Africa.

Get the transit visa and give it a shot. It will be easier then getting the permits etc to ride trough DRC to Zambia.

Oh, ... and there are things to see in Angola you won't find anywhere else... .

Ask for a 10 day transit visa (because your bike isn't very fast with all the lugage, or anything else that sounds acceptable). You might be lucky and get the time.

Let us know how it all works out!

All the best,

Rob

discomfort
 

Hindu,

Apparently you're not interested in all aspects of travelling through Africa, but just interested in getting to your end destination, probably Cape Town. With that mentality it will be hard to put up with all the other hassle you'll encounter along the way and it will be hard to enjoy travelling in Africa. Why not stay home all together and don't even bother with all the hassle, including the discomfort of waiting a few days and bad roads. By the way, we had to wait 3 days for the Angola Visa (double entry, 30 days!)


cheers,

Noel

Thank you Noel for your hasty judgement, slurring deprecations, and arrogant advice. Nice to know that there are people like you on the forum who can pass that judgement sans any knowledge of what is going on. First, it is not the hardship, nor the struggle. If you knew my history which I choose no to share with you, anything you have gone through in your entire life would not equal 4 years of mine. WHAT is important is time. I have made arrangements to be at orphanges in Kenya, Nigeria, Uganda & Botswana. I can't fail to get through Angola before the rainy season begins. I also have made tentative reservations to see the mountain gorillas and since those have to be made at leasst 6 weeks in advance, again time plays a critical role. Wasting two weeks waiting for a visa throws the whole schedule out of whack. Of course, since you are a world traveler who has never made a reservation or committment to anything but your own self-centered viewpoint, you could never understand that. Another reason we can't waste time is that we can carry only so much medicine at one time. Now if I were wiling to risk running out of the heart medicine my wife needs to stay alive, I could take the chance. If I were assured of getting the visa, then I could wait. There is, however, no such assurance, so we will get through Angola as quickly as we can. There are other places to see and other roads to ride. Hopefully, I won't see you on one of them.

Thanks Robert, getting a 10 day visa sounds pretty good. Less pounding and a little more relaxing. I hadn't looked forward to pushing that hard, but it is critical that certain time elements be adhered to until we turn back north to the east coast. Much of it is dictated by the rainy season, but I have obligations in east central Africa that also mean being there on time. We also have to be in Namibia or Johanesburg where arrangements have been made for tires and heart meds for the Old Woman who rides behind me.

Thanks again for the hint about the 10 day visa

Joe

??
 

Hindu,

I don't think you will meet me any time soon but you will surely meet many like me.

Have a nice life and good luck

Cheers,

Noel

PS; I don't think a 10 day transit visa exists!

[quote=noel di pietro;200420]Hindu,

I don't think you will meet me any time soon but you will surely meet many like me.
............quote]

So true Noel. I often meet people who subscribe to the view that "if you're not doing like me, then you're doing it wrong". They're pretty much everywhere.

Hindu:

I reached Point Noire in Feb. I couldn't get to Brazza because of bandits (two days after we were told this, the train was robbed), so we tried Point Noire. The Angolan embassy there would give us a visa for Cabinda if we had a plane ticket, but would not issue one if we were bringing our own vehicles. Odd, but that's how it was. A catch 22 situation and in the end we ended up airlifting the bikes to Windhoek directly from Point Noire with TAAG airlines (Angolan airlines). Also, southern Angola at the time was impassable due to flooding. The price was very reasonable allthough I cant remember the exact price. As I understand it, time is an issue so this solution may be worth looking into if all else fails. They have two departures Point Nore- Windhoek every week. If I recall, the price for the bikes was about the same as my one way ticket.

But....you will miss out on Angola. And from the (generaly) praising posts on this forum about Angola, that would be a crummy deal. Just throwing a ball here in case you run into impassable obstacles. Good luck

McThor- VERY useful info, I have already added notes to my map in case I fail to enter Angola again. As you say, you never know about roads, flooding, etc, etc...Thanks for the tip! By the way, Joe: I consider my visit to the mountain gorillas one of the highlights of my time in Africa. I don't really care for cats- regardless of their size! Hook.

travel
 

Anybody who has travelled extensively in Africa can confirm that schedules are highly unpredictable, things go always different than anticipated. Travelling on such a tight and precise schedule is just not very practical if not sufficient float is built in! You need to be flexible and adopt a certain "take it as it comes" attitude, especially from a timing point of view. Has nothing to do with "if you're not doing like me, then you're doing it wrong".

A friend of mine got stuck for 8 weeks in Gabon because his bike broke down and he actually had the time of his life.. Doesn't sound like a fun trip when being so tied down on time. Not even mentioning the medicine complicating things a lot.

Cheers,

Noel

angola visa on the spot
 

maby a bit of toppick but last wendsday frends of us got 30 days angola visa without a invitation letter or other problems on the spot 100dollar each in abudja nigeria
succes

Hey Noel, when and where did you get your Angola visa? Thx ~~

Visa
 

Hi,

That was in Libreville (2006) but I don't think they still issue tourist visa there since 2007, only business. Nonetheless, if you've missed the chance to get it in Abuja, as Reinier and Anne suggest, it is always worth checking when you're in Libreville. They turned us down at first too but we were persistent, up to the situation that we were at the reception and sort of refused to go without first speaking to the Consul. Always be nice and friendly and you may win them over. It is local policy what they do with visa and policy may change per day!

Cheers,

Noel

First of all.. Noel thanks for saying what everyone was thinking.
Obviously this guy has never heard that the journey is more important than the destination. Of the 27 countries we have traveled in Africa Angola was one of our favorites because tourists like Hindu haven't taken the time to go there and ruin it.
So Hindu please avoid Angola and just buy a round trip ticket to South Africa and spend a week on the beach and feel like you really visited the true Africa and then come home and tell your friends how amazing you are.
Cheers,
Josh

By the way for better Gorilla viewing take the risk and go to Central Africa Republic to Dzanga Sanga park and have a far better time. The only allow 2 tourists a day to visit the park instead of being in a group of 10 overweight british tourists and it only cost $150 per person. By the way it was a little odd that visiting the orphanages took second place to your "gorilla adventure" on the schedule.
Cheers,
Josh
Welcome to www.quadsacrossafrica.com

Hey Josh, thanks for demonstraiting so graphically that there are pretentious asses like yourself in every endeavor. Had you read my original post, you would have seen that my anxiety over Angola was waiting for weeks to get a visa and then not getting one. It had nothing to do with the ride itself. By the time we arrive in Africa we will have already ridden thorugh Mexico, Central and South America, Europe, The 'Stans, and the Middle East. It was not the hardship of the ride (I have ridden in many Asian countries) nor being in unfamilar surroundings--I have been in all western European nations on both bicycle and motorcyle. You, however, have decided that I am a fat, overweight tourist who is only interested in getting from point A to point B. Thanks for your inane advice of getting a round trip ticket. Do I expect to amaze people with a ride around the world? Nope, not a bit. I just want to see things that 58 years of work have prevented me from seeing. Oh and as to your idiotic observation about the orphanages taking second place--apparently you are unable to read very well. You MUST make the reservations to see the gorillas 6 weeks in advance. If you are not there on your reservation date--welll you just don't get to go. Since this is a once-in-a-lifetime event, and the orpanages are not going anywhere and will accept my work whenever I get there, I would have thought anyone could see that. But then, you are one of those people who delight in flaming people whose ideas are different from yours. If you choose to respond to this post, do it by pm. There is no point in you subjecting the rest of the forum to your infantile, vitriolic pompousity.

Snobbery.
 

I have been following this thread and it has left me slightly saddened to read... can someone tell me when we all started to grade our travel experiences and desires to the exclusion of others?

I thought this was a site for everyone who wanted to travel, full stop! how, why, where, who with, how much money and many other things being totally irrelevant... the only common thing was the desire to travel itself.

A first trip to Spain on his Suzuki Bandit for one man is as exciting as an expedition across Africa for another, they are both as meaningful as the other. Surely we are big enough people to not become travel snobs!

Please people, we all travel in different ways and we should respect other travellers regardless. Remember, there is always another guy/girl out there who will travel lighter/braver/go places you wouldnt etc etc but that doesnt detract from your experiences at all.

Take this snobbery off this site.

Very eloquently put, and I agree 100%. :thumbup1:

Wow I sure struck a nerve. My response was based around your comment about Angola "a country that offers nothing except landmines and treacherous roads, but there are better things to do." That is quite an opinion for a country you have never visited.
My guess is you are going to have quite learning experience crossing Africa especially if you are not willing to wait. In Africa you either have to have a. allot of time or b. allot of money. Sorry your vast expierence in Western Europe and the wilds of Asia aren't really applicable to Africa.
I think you are making a bigger deal of the date for the Gorillas. Having seen the Gorillas it will be a highlight of Africa but you are listening to the hype I met several people who showed and had no problems. Again I would actually skip Uganda and go to CAR and see the gorillas there you will get a more genuine experience.
Well good luck in Africa I am sure with your obvious display of subtly and patience you will fair quite well.
Cheers,
Josh

First thing I learned on internet forums was that when I seem to elicit negative responses from more than just an occasional participant, I need to examine my own postings for the reasons, not theirs.

Next thing I learned was that I seldom get any satisfaction—much less solutions to problems, answers to questions or support in my various journeys—by returning insult and abuse with further insult or abuse.

Hindu, you give every evidence you've not yet learned these lessons. Both have vast applicability to travel in Africa....and to life in general.

This is not meant as a criticism, particularly. It's more of an observation based on admittedly limited evidence. On the other hand, you're obviously intelligent and articulate; turning these gifts towards learning the appropriate lessons rather than defending against them will serve you well.

Happy, safe and entertaining journeys to you and yours!

Mark

hey, Hey
 

Did you hear the one bout the Angolan, the South African and the Cuban?

Just to answer the previous questions form Hindu:
Yes their are more transit visa:
Togo, you can get a 7 days visa at the border (not everey border, but if you take the big one in the south its no problem)
Benin, you can get a 2 days transit visa at the border which you can extent in Cotonou if you want.
Nigeria, i dont think a transit visa exist.
Furthermore i heard rumours about a transit visa for Gabon. We have not been their yet, so i dont know. Can anyone confirm this?

Visas and Angola
 

I did this route in 2006/2007 and got most of my central african visas in Yaounde (Gabon, Congo and DRC). It means hanging aroung for a week, going to each embassy, but makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside when you have them. Apparently, you could get a transit visa for DRC - it was listed on the board in the embassy, but they would not issue me one. I thought about waiting until I got to the border to try there, but decided to cough up the cash for the visitor visa and the fuzzy feeling.

I got my Angola visa in Abuja, Nigeria. It seems I may have been lucky with the window of oppourtunity, but it might be worth trying again. Double entry, 30 day (which you need if going to cabinda).

I would also recommend going to Angola. It was one of (if not the) most beautiful, unspoilt and optimistic countries in the whole of West Africa. New roads have been going down, but there are also long stretches of 10mph riding through bomb craters to deal with.

Back to the point rather an insulting / commenting on each other...

We're looking at getting into Angola about 6 months from now heading south... and wondering how we'll manage.

I can't remember which diary is was, but they were travelling overland, heading south. Couldn't get into the DRC without an Angolan visa, and couldn't get an Angolan visa without getting into the DRC. They ended up flying south, can't remember which city, either in Namibia or SA, got a visa there, then flew back to pick up the vehicle and drive on through. This was July this year I believe.

I'll try to track down the site and post it, but a return flight to somewhere issuing visas is prob cheaper than a single and shipping vehicles too + you get to see Angola! I've read a lot, and not heard a bad word said about Angola, apart from visas and the quality of the roads, both of which are just part of the adventure!

Just came across this thread also... looks like it's pretty much echoing what I was saying:
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...y-2008-a-37389

Angola
 

It was my understanding that you could fly to Windhoek and get visas there quite easily, but other threads have said that they have been turned down in the Angola embassy in Windhoek.

So essentially, try to get them in Abuja (and maybe other places) and if all that fails, go to Matadi and get the transit visa there. Just hope the current situation in Eastern DRC doesn't spread otherwise it could close a large part of the western route.

Tanzania offers a Transit Visa too. Half the price of a normal tourist visa (for dutch this is US25 instead of US$50). Valid for up to 2 weeks.
Officially you have only 1 entry and are allowed to stay 2 weeks(but I have never had problems with the transit visa when I returned within the 3 month period), with the tourist visa a multiple entry, valid for 3 months ;

Is it just me or does someone on this site not realise that nothing hits you quite like Africa does... This is the deepest darkest continent friend... Be prepared to have your wits driven over and beyond... I say if you're worried about a particular country then have a plan B and maybe even a plan C. I've gone so far as to check out shipping routes to skip Angola and maybe Nigeria depending on how accommodating they feel. If they won't let you in then that's it, what can you do.
Good luck to you and well done on your past endeavours.:thumbup1:

Cheers

Thank you Silvie,
In spite of being told that I am foolish for traveling if not willing to endure hardships, along with other belittling comments, there has been considerable good suggestions, yours among them. We have decided to try some of them. Like attempt to get the visa within a week period, and failing that, to just skip Angola in spite of the decent wildlife preserves there. Most other countries in Africa are quite willing to issue a visa without much trouble other than patience and waiting a few days along with parting with cash. We will ask for a 10 day transit visa as well, and if that also fails, we will see if there is a tour group that has an easier time getting visas. If everything else falls through, we will just fly over it. We had trouble getting into Vietnam with a scooter, but finally parked the larger one and rented a smaller one to comply with their rules.

There is always a solution to a problem. Sometimes it is not as satisfactory as the original intended choice, but if it accomplishes the larger part of the issue, it is accepatable.

Thanks for posting.

Joe

Mali
 

Hey Folks,
Reading this with interest as myself and a couple of others are heading to Angola and are struggling for visas. Matadi seems to be the popular option so will probably head for that if the other options don't pan out, ie, making hotel bookings in Angola for the LOI etc.
As for bomb bursting through Africa, getting through as fast as possible for some may be necessary and others totally irrelevant. It is each to their own surely? As somebody said, travel snobbery is a bit crap ain't it?
I'm not bragging or anything but I'm attempting to travel the globe on my XT, hence I'm in Mali and off to Timbuktu in a day or so and I'm having (generally) a ball but there are times where I could just ride through certain places without having even to say 'HI' to anyone just to make life easier. They were the bad times and general meaness of some of the people here that has upset some of the trip, getting robbed by a Policeman brandishing a gun in Mauritania and Arrested for allegedly killing a child in Senegal cos some guy wanted money from us.
I know this is Africa but if these events happened anywhere else in Europe or the US there'd be hell to pay for someone but here...... well nobody misses a beat and just say 'TIA!' (this is africa)
I am enjoying it and am looking forward to what the next thing or challenge is around the corner and if I meet any of you on the road, whatever your ideas are, your welcome for a beer and a chat about your great experiences/moans/bitches and whines cos at the end of the day, your riding a bike in a different/unfamiliar country than your own and on an adventure!

Have fun