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Up to date advice please, fuel in Bolivia
Anyone got up to date advice on the current situation in Bolivia with fuel? Best thread I found on HU ran 2012 to 2013 so about 2 years out of date now. Is it still a problem getting fuel if you are a foreigner and is it still leaded fuel? Gonna reach there in about 3 weeks, entering from the south working our way slowly to La Paz then into Peru. Many thanks.
(riding an R1200GSA 2011) |
Hi Pip and Mouse,
please post your experiance afterwards, I am looking for the same info, also entering the country from Chile/Arg. but only in about 6 weeks time. saludos, Groschi (I will be looking for Diesel and Petrol prices, traveling with both, camper and bike!) |
Up to date advice please, fuel in Bolivia
It's hit and miss sometimes. In my experience;
La Paz area; pretty bad, but possible if ask around. The 'sin fracture' trick does not work here. Lowlands & Santa Cruz; outside of Santa Cruz ciudad never a problem, usually paid local price too. Uyuni, salar and aliplano areas; usually get it for around six or seven per litre, just ask for sin fractura. Otherwise I bought gas in villages - going rate between 5 and 10 depending on remoteness. Yungas - no problems usually at local price too. NB - sometimes I think they genuinely don't have the special receipts or just don't know how to do it and don't want to get fired; if you're really stuck they often will fill up a bidòn (jerry can) if you park your bike around the corner! As a general rule of thumb less modern more rural stations will sell it and for local price. Busy ones in cities not - people have outright lied to my face claiming there is none and after seeing them full up the next vehicle that arrives they then say they don't have any of the special tickets left. Sometimes this is frustrating but I've never ran out of fuel and local people have helped me out. It's a really badly implemented and time consuming system so not really the attendants fault. The gasoline is not leaded here as far as I know but it's pretty low octane and I'd highly recommend you clean out your tank, filters, lines after leaving if the crap that came out of my tank was anything to go by! Gasoline is subsided here through taxation (hence foreigners paying more) and I suppose this is why it's pretty awful quality. If you can stay away from the main routes you'll probably have a great time here, it's been my favourite county so far in Latin America. I found the lowlands to be amazing and great for biking. A little patience is required and at times I've really had mine tested but overall I've found it a great country for adventure biking and found people on the whole to be very friendly and helpful. RTW |
Agree with the great country and nice people.
We used diesel so at least were were never on the tail end of a queue of 30 local motorbikes each taking a couple of litres, but as stated there is no rhyme or reason to it. Five stations in a row in one area flat out refusing to give us fuel at any price followed by one that fills the tank at local price and then a couple with soldiers on duty standing right next to the pumps - that at least fill you up at the gringo price with receipt, then a couple who charge the full price but refuse to provide any receipt except for locals price. Pretty soon gave up my idealistic notions that we should pay full price only because it was obvious that anything over the local price was not getting beyond the attendant or the boss. As long as you can get fuel the price really doesn't matter simply because fuel is a similar price in adjacent countries anyway so why fret over a price we aren't entitled to. Anyone from Britain or Europe or Australia won't even blink at the gringo price in Bolivia At least there are a million roadside sellers with a few litres available and as long as it is in a reasonably clear bottle, or you can decant it first, you are unlikely to get stuck except in really remote locations such as the Uyuni to san Pedro route. |
You can buy gasoline discreetly from the 4x4 drivers when they drop off the tourists at the hotspring bath on the southwest circuit - I did and met another guy on a Vespa who did also - and there is black market gas at Quentana Chico or whatever that village is called east of Laguna Colorado. Of course better just to carry enough to arrive at SPDA but there are options available to you if you fancy exploring that amazing region. Expect to pay 10B per litre, arguably a fair price given the area.
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the price of adventure
You can usually find gas in any little town, but not every little village or cross road. You may have to ask around to find who sells gas. Recently in the mountains of Peru on a tour we bought gas from a shack that bore no resemblance to a gas station. Gas was brought out to our bikes in large metal pitchers.
An hour south of Oruro I stopped in Poopo, a small town within sight of the PanAm. Bought 10 liters of gas in a dusty little store. Around La Paz I was turned away from modern stations that claimed to not have gas. Sometimes I believed them, sometimes I didn't. Truth be told, not all Bolivians like tourists. The locals have been exploited for generations and for some this is their small measure of payback. I don't blame them one bit. If you knew you were going to sell all of your gas before the next shipment, wouldn't you save some for your countrymen and let the outsider go packing? Don't forget, its a very poor country and the locals have been kept down of decades. Check any notions of entitlement at the border and enjoy the raw and powerful beauty. Stop for gas when you see a station. Carry extra with you and if you have nothing else, fill up large soda bottles as spares. Once you get to Peru it is such a relief to buy gas from friendly attendants... The price is a touch more than you might pay back home, depending where you are from. But here in the US gas prices are currently very low. I live in New Jersey which has one of the lowest state taxes on gas, so the prices are low in general. On January 3, 2015 I saw regular unleaded for $2.26 a gallon. Which is easily $1.00 less than 6 or months ago. Buy the ticket, take the ride...and if it occasionally gets a little heavier than what you had in mind, well...maybe chalk it off to forced conscious expansion: Tune in, freak out, get beaten.” ― Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas |
Up to date advice please, fuel in Bolivia
Peter, do you really think that people think like that? I'm very surprised you came away with that impression. I've been here 3 months, worked here, travelled and studied here - I've never encountered any apparent resentment myself for being obviously foreign nor the calculated spite or jealousy you spoke of. I don't think it's true at all that Bolivians would hold it against you for colonialism or the ravages of US drugs policy or WTO neo-liberalism. I don't think most people really care where you might be from and the ones that were cheaters, liars general scumbags were so for much the same reasons people cheat, lie or generally **** others over as they do in the states, or anywhere else. Maybe you were just projecting your own stuff there?
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Ellen was robbed and beaten, fuel was anyones guess at gas stations (easy in the small tienda in the little towns) and pretty much Bolvia was the low of our trip, Bolivia is beautiful ... it is just full of Bolivians. We found so much negativity there it started binging us down so at the end of 3 months we were happy to hit Brasil for normality and as long Bolivia have Capt Handout leading the place they are ****ed and with time and progression will make a 4th world. Sorry we don't present a shinny picture, we are Kiwis and we say exactly has it was, no sugar coatings or BS, Cheers Andi |
YMMV mate :shrug
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Manythanks all
Dear all
many thanks for the info and sorry for a late response having posted the question. Been staying on a farm near Santiago for a week and had no internet connected. We seem to have mixed opinions but a consensus that getting fuel can be problematic to one extent or another. Two Moto Kiwis - we're going to be on our guard and trust our instinct. We have anyway on this trip but in honesty we've been getting a bit relaxed in AR and CH because travelling is generally easy and safe. Thank you one and all for taking the time and trouble to answer. :) |
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Stick to the smaller towns and it will be a lot easier and don't wait till you REALLY need fuel then it will allow you some leeway. And yes, Arg and Chile is a breeze compared to Bolivia, Brasil is very easy too, amazing what one border does. Enjoy Bolivia as best you can, just be prepared to have to go further for semi normal things to happen. Cheers Andi |
What is the longest stretch in Bolivia without fuel stations?
What would be recommended range with a bike over there? I know, I need to fill the tank whenever there is fuel station... :scooter: |
Wewere there in August 2014. We were on a Vstrom 1000 and never went more than 150 miles before being able to fil the tank.
You can frequently get gas in "Gomerias" and avoid the haggling at the gas stations. . We normally paid between 5 and 7 Bolivianos a littre. Hope that helps. |
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Did you go to Atacama? |
If you mean from Uyuni, no. We met a Colombian guy who rode across. He arranged gas, food and transportation of his luggage with one of the many4x4 tour companies. Noidea what they charged him.
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The only place to tank up would be from Uyuni to SPDA. Cheers Andi |
yup
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You might want to read up a bit about President Evo Morales. If get a chance, watch the movie Cocalero (2007) which documents Morales' campaign to the presidency. Its available on Netflix. There is a segment filmed in Santa Cruz, where there are more people with European heritage. The hostility expressed by the old guard toward the indigenous reminded me of the racial tensions in US circa 1960's. Some will argue things haven't improve much, but I digress. There is clear evidence of hostility between the classes within Bolivia. That some hostility would pour over onto tourists, well, its not too surprising. To be clear, I said, "...not all Bolivians like tourists." In my experience some do, some don't. If you spent months months in Bolivia and never felt even a drop of tension from any of the locals, then you are either blessed and very lucky or oblivious. Sorry, I don't mean to be harsh, its just inconceivable to me that you did not experience what many others have. You were never turned away from a gas station without your gut tell you they just didn't want to service you? It happened to me enough times to draw an intuition based conclusion. Why bother ranting on about this? To prepare travelers and suggest they be understanding. Lead with a smile and take what comes. On the flip side, I experienced Bolivians that were friendly, helpful and very generous. Its an amazing country, raw, breath taking and changing radically on many levels. I look forward to returning there one day. |
It's a new law, passed recently. I have a copy of it on my iPhone. Basically, foreigners have to pay a much higher rate for gas, and most gas stations either don't want to deal with it, or don't have the equipment (computer codes) to deal with it.
It's frustrating to be turned away before you even pull up to the pump, but gas stations around larger towns are usually accommodating. Good luck!! |
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we've used one fuel station in Tupiza in the south and one in Sucre. Prices for gasoline are 3.5 Bolivians for locals and 8.5 for foreigners. In Tupiza I asked for a 'Sin Boleto' price and no joy he just grinned at me but in Sucre the lady gave me a price of 7 Bobs instead of 8.5. Diesel is a shade cheaper. Hope that helps. |
It´s not all that hard, but you have to give it a chance.
I´ve been living here for 8 years now, so I guess I know what I am talking about.
Usually Bolivians are very willing to help you BUT they are bound by silly laws and every fuel-station has a bunch of cameras, so they are (rightly so) afraid for their job. Yes they might lie about it, usually because the customers insists. To avoid a discussion he/she will simply say there is no fuel. (Which by the way can also be true as supply is random) Gasoline is a major substance in the production of cocaine. In the governments fight against cocaine, this makes it a controled substance. Very annoying, but that is simply the way it is. Luckily you can buy gasoline just about anywhere. Just ask. Most small villages have a guy that sells it for 5 or 6 Bs. Fuel-stations can often NOT sell fuel to a vehicle with a foreign license-plate simply because they do not have the permit to do so. They need a permit and special invoices (facturas). Most systems are semi-automatic and need a license-plate, a ID-number and a name to get the pump going. :frown: Here the only option is to bring a jerrycan and fill that. At fuel-stations that do have those permits and invoices you pay about 9 Bs. (That is the official price for foreigners), so it is best (cheapest) to avoid those and find the guy who sells from the barrel. This is often cleaner as well. When in doubt, simply ask. Yes there are ass-holes in Bolivia, but they are in every country. Don´t mistake ignorance, uneducated and scarred for their job for ass-holes. They are not. They are simply not as sophisticated as you because they only had 2 years of school.:oops2: I do motorcycle-tours in entire Bolivia (for years) and in my humble opinion people who have bad experiences only have themselves to blame. Change you attitude and your approach and wonders will happen. Even with police and fuel-stations. :thumbup1: I hope this helps you to understand this country a bit better. |
Thank you and latest fuel advice Bolivia
Ok all, many thanks for your help. We are now out of Bolivia and into Peru. This is what we found in the last 3 and a half weeks travelling through on the route Villazon, Tupiza, Sucre, Cochabamba, La Paz, Copacabana. The locals rate is 3.5 Bobs and the tourist rate is 8.5 bobs. At some stations they didn't serve us but then 200 metres down the road they did. Once we paid the locals rate, twice we paid the full rate and once we got a discount (Copacabana) to 7.5 bobs. Always ask for 'Sin Boleto' and see what they say. It just an impression but it seemed as if the mainstream service stations like YPFB (an offshoot of the Argentine main petrol company YPF perhaps?) were the strictest and the 'rougher' looking stations less strict. There is also fuel widely available from little shops at the sides of the road from drums (although we had no need to use them). The fuel we got does not have it's rating showing but I think it was 84 Octane. Other than the fuel we got in Sucre which caused our bike to not want to start for about 10 turnovers of the engine we had no problems with any of the fuel we bought.
A general comment if it's helpful - in our brief experience we found the Bolivians notably different from the Argentinians and the Peruvians. They are more reserved and quite traditional it seemed to us. That doesn't mean less friendly, far from it, very polite and helpful but more reserved, less 'smiley' and somewhat shyer and less likely to openly look at you and the bike or come up and chat to you. However, on a 4WD tour we went on our Bolivian driver and cook once we got to know them over a few days were as chatty and friendly with us as anyone in South America. The roads are mixed, the scenery is stunning. There are very few places out on the road to pull over and get food (e.g. cafes) just plenty of small stalls selling fizzy drinks like Coke. Grab some bread, make up some rolls for your lunch and find a scenic lunch spot! Bolivia, not to be missed! (& that's from someone who had a dodgy tummy there for 3 weeks so it must be good) :D |
...and
Sorry I meant to say before closing off re fuel - we are on a BMW R1200 GSA which is fuel injected, no carbs.
Also, if you are considering riding into La Paz be prepared for extremely congested and fume choked riding down very steep hills into the city from El Alto above and then of course reversing that and coming up hill on the way out. Riding into La Paz is not for the faint hearted, it's challenging. We paid a taxi driver 30 bobs to lead us back out because we got thoroughly lost - but that's just us! |
having the same experience as pip and mouses: people are a little bit more reserved but definitely friendly all the time. you need to know them better (was on a tour too) to be chatty and start joking, but not cold people at all, love bolivia so far.
also, starting to chat a little yourself at service stations helps to drop the price (some even wanted 9 BOB / litre), just complain about it in a friendly way, it might help (or drive to the next one). noone refused to serve me so far. the fuel is very bad though, best to have some leftovers from other countries (arg/peru) to mix it like 1/2 when entering (e.g., get some infinia in argentina before heading into bolivia). highly doubt that stuff is anything above 80 octane. |
coming from Peru...
My gas tank was getting low before I hit the border but I'd been told gas was cheaper in Bolivia so I waited. That proved to be a bad idea. All of the gas stations in the Bolivian side of the border were permanently closed. After riding around searching (and wasting gas) I stopped at a military checkpoint on the way out of town and asked the guard how far out was to the next town with gas. He told me that it was really close. Probably a ten minute ride. Feeling relieved I headed out of the dingy border town along lake Titicaca. Right on schedule and just after I'd switched to my reserve fuel there was a town with two filling stations. Both were deserted. At another military checkpoint I asked how far it was to the next town. Close they said. With a service station, no less. By now I was anxious about my fuel and wasn't looking forward to pushing the bike along the side of the highway but what the hell. I needed gas. When I pulled up to the pumps at the lone filling station in tiwanaku they were taped off. No gas. A man was running some kind of pump next to the building so I asked him what the deal was. No gas. Did he know anyone in town who had gas? Nope. So I rode around through this little town trying to find anyone with gas. No luck. Back near the highway I parked beside a building housing a small market. The woman inside had no suggestions and I knew that if I tried to reach the next town some 40km away I'd be screwed. I stood there for awhile and asked a few passers by if they knew where I could find some gas. "At the gas station. Tomorrow."
Shit. Well. At least I was near a place with food. There was a big field between the market and the filling station. I figured I could pitch my tent there for the night. Not ideal but not the end of the world. Still, it was only about 330 and I wasn't ready to give up yet. Gradually a number of cabs gathered nearby, closer to another brick building. Next to that building was a circle of folks passing around a beer. Or beers, but just one at a time. That's the south american way apparently. In any case one of the cab drivers, a stout woman with long black braids and a colorful traditional getup wandered over to me. How much gasolina did I need, she wanted to know. I said about for liters should do the trick. She wanted to know if I'd pay 15 bolivianos per liter. Sure I said. On the one hand I had no idea what the going rate for gas was in Bolivia. On the other I didn't give a shit. I knew that high octane gas in Peru was about 13 soles. That worked out to about $4/liter. Expensive by us standards but... It usually cost me about $20usd to fill the tank in Peru. At the border I'd changed $100usd for 690 bolivianos. I didn't do all of the math at the time but 15 bolivianos seemed reasonable. And so the cab drivers scrounged up a couple empty 2 liter did bottles, jacked up one of the cabs (a Toyota coruna if I recall correctly), and proceeded to fill the bottles directly from the gas tank under the vehicle. It was hilarious. They thought so and I thought so. I paid the woman whose Toyota had been my blood donor 60 bolivianos and waved goodbye. Still at 4000m above sea level and now with some pretty low quality gas mixed with a little coca cola the klr sort of sputtered along those next 40km until I reached the next town and- no shit- the filling station had gas. The guy told me that because of some government bullshit it was really expensive. Whatever. I was watching some dark storm clouds on the horizon and thinking about how nice out would be to sleep in a bed in la Paz... He also wanted to know how much I needed before he pumped. Some sort of rationing I guess. The tank held about 20 liters so that's what I told him and that's about what she took. 160 bolivianos. So I'd paid double for my for liters from the cab ladies. Oh well. Assuming one us dollar is about 7 bolivianos that means I paid her about $8.50. Well worth it to not sleep in a tent during a rainstorm at 4000m. Tldr; some nice folks sold me gas directly from their tank... For a premium. |
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