Advice on first ever trip abroad (Europe)
 

Firstly hello everyone, I have been a lurker for a long time and I've have found all the stories very inspirational and have at last plucked up courage to go on a trip myself.

Reading all your rtw adventures i guess my adventure is a little lame but for me its a big step into a new world!

So do you have any ideas where I might go based on the following.

I will be riding my beloved Vespa GTS 250cc which will happily sit at 70mph.
I will be going in May from Friday night for 8 nights.
I will firstly be going to the Hook of Holland and into Amsterdam.
And my way home will be Calais back to London.
I will be staying in hotels, hopefully as cheap as possible.

I'm thinking Holland (at least Amsterdam jeiger, Germany (though i think the great roads are to far away), Brussels - Bruges, France - Dunkirk, not sure where else? Or what I'm missing?

I would be happy to ride around 100 - 150 miles a day and prefer if it was a fun ride.

Happy to go on the motorways when I need to get somewhere but would like some nice roads to ride on based bearing in my I have a scoot.
I do love the twisties be it country roads or just riding along the coast.
On occasion i'm happy to go through a jammed pack city as its fun to filter through, though not for to long though!

I would like to stay in some nice cities, Koln ? etc? and do a little sight seeing during the day their or elsewhere and at night have a little drink, live music and maybe the odd night at a club. I'm ready to meet some sexy European ladies lol

I wanted to see some of the historic war memorials etc in France.
I wondered if I could get to the Nürburgring ring and hire a car or brave it on the scoot - now that would be legendary if I survived.

It would be nice on occasion to stay at biker, scooter hang-outs?

Sorry for the long mail, but don't laugh I'm so excited, i know its not rtw!

Any suggestions or comments would be great.

thanks

Just pack your scoot and ride bro !! It will all be gravy !! :thumbup1:

As ted says, and at least you are planning on comfortable daily mileages, don't forget to post a trip report when you return, travelling is not all about RTW.
And :welcome: to the HUBB

Hi Dave:

Congratulations on getting started on the first step, which is making your plans.

Although I ride a Honda ST1100, I don't think you will have any problem at all doing your tour on a 250 cc Vespa. The only practical restriction you will face is that you should plan to stay off the motorways - not because your scooter won't do 70 MPH, but because it will be kind of 'wound out' at 70 MPH, and it is no fun riding a motorcycle that is 'wound out', regardless of whether it is a Vespa at 70 MPH or a ST 1100 at 135 MPH.

Besides, motorways are the antithesis of enjoyable motorcycle touring - there's nothing worth seeing on a motorway, and everything that is enjoyable and worth seeing is on the secondary and tertiary roads. I only use motorways to transit between two points that are far away (e.g. Switzerland to Saxony if I am going to visit the Dresden area, for example), I never ride motorways once I get to my area of interest.

Considering that you have 7 days available, I suggest that you concentrate on doing one or two regions only (e.g. Flanders, Bruges, Dunkirk) - drop Germany off your list, it's a bit too far away. Nürburgring is way too far away.

The problem with being too ambitious about hitting a large number of destinations that are spread far apart in a short period of time (7 days) is that all you wind up with at the end of the day is a sore butt, a dirty windscreen, and an empty gas tank. I have spent a month or so riding in Europe every summer for the past 10 years, and without a doubt, the days that have been most enjoyable have been the days that I have covered 200 km (120 miles) or less on the odometer, and probably 100 km (60 miles) or less straight-line distance. Those are the days when you just poke along on the secondary or tertiary routes, get off the bike frequently for a coffee, or a meal, or just to look around, and check into a simple hotel or pension around 5 or 6 in the evening, rather than riding late into the night. Likewise, the days that have been the least enjoyable have been the days when I rode at highways speeds for 6 or 10 hours and covered a lot of miles. I once did Luxembourg to Poland in one day - but I can't tell you what I saw between those two points, other than a yellow stripe on the road directly in front of my motorcycle.

So, to sum up, my suggestion is that you get off the ferry at Hook of Holland and turn south - poke your way through Rotterdam (if you like big cities), head down towards Antwerp, then perhaps Gent - Brugge, Diksmuide, Ypres, perhaps even Vimy, then head back northwest to catch the Calais ferry.

A route like that would give your tour some congruity and a common theme. You would see 3 different countries and a whole lot of different cultures, but you would not be 'transiting' (riding at highway speeds on a motorway) all the time - instead, you would have the luxury of poking along the secondary and tertiary motorways.

Also keep in mind that it is not sensible or realistic to plan to ride every day. You are going to encounter some rainy days, or some windy days, or some days when you just want to stick around wherever you are and explore. So, out of 7 days total, plan to actually cover ground on only 5 of those days. If it turns out that you experience 7 consecutive sunny days, great, you can use the two extra days to do 'hub and spoke' exploration from a central place, and return to sleep in the same bed two nights in a row (saves all the headache of packing, checking out, finding a new place the next day, etc.)

To assist you in planning, I suggest you get a Michelin map of the Benelux region. I find that Michelin maps are the best for pre-departure planning.

Michael

Thanks for the suggestions so far, please keep then coming.

Also I know I said Amsterdam but what if I gave that a miss and started and finished in Calais, would that change the options I had available?

Michael, great reply thank you for the time you took to write it.
You have mentioned some very good points, I assumed I would be riding every day and didnt even think about the weather! Now for an English guy thats a school boy error as thats all we are supposed to talk about lol.

I will google all the places you mentioned and see what they look like and see if I can pick up the map you mentioned.

I do have a few questions,

Are there any good roads to ride on or I'm i totally in the wrong area? Or do I set a destination on the gps to avoid motorways and off I go. I can use the map to get an idea but my memory of where to head is really poor also I would be happy to go off the route if I have the reassurance of the GPS to help me if I got lost.

Are there any other places worth riding to or places to go if I do have these '2 days spare' dependent on weather.

In regards to hotels do you think I can just ride to each place then look for a hotel or do you suggest that I book a hotel from an internet cafe before leaving each town as its my first trip?

I see you mentioned about 7 places, is it the case of staying in each or are some of them just for a few hours wander around before moving on?

I've never been one for doing anything solo so I wont feel comfortable initially but will also enjoy the challenge. Do you think I will end up chatting to people as I go around, any tips?

Thanks guys

Hello Again Dave:

Concerning route navigation, I suggest you get an inexpensive GPS and affix it to your handlebars in such a way that you can easily refer to it. You don't need to spend a fortune to do this. Then, get some kind of plastic cover (those sold to the sailboat crowd work great) that can hold a folded-up map. You then decide where you ultimately want to go that day, set the GPS to "avoid motorways" and "automatically re-route", and then head off down the road.

If you see somewhere / something / some route that looks interesting, just follow it. The GPS will then try to re-route you towards your destination - you can either ignore it or follow it as you wish, depending on how much you are enjoying the road you are presently on. The position depiction of the motorcycle on the GPS will enable you to spatially orient yourself to where you are on the paper map, and that in turn will give you all the confidence you need to do your navigation. Keep in mind that the whole purpose of the trip is exploration, not arrival at a destination. Therefore, except for the last day when you need to turn up at the Calais ferry terminal, it really doesn't matter what route you take on your trip.

Once you get the Michelin map of Benelux, you will easily be able to see where the interesting roads are - Michelin highlights the especially scenic roads with a green line down one side of the road. That will enable you to do preliminary route planning.

You asked if there are any 'good roads'. That is a very subjective question - do you mean a good road in the sense of the Sustenpass in Switzerland, where you have 10 hairpin turns every kilometer? Or a good road in the sense of one that is flat and straight, but leads you through a series of interesting villages in a fascinating and historical part of a country? So far as the latter is concerned, there will be no shortage of 'good roads' in the region your are planning to visit.

Concerning hotels, I never book ahead. Booking ahead means that you have to get to a 'destination' at the end of the day, and that creates stress. I just ride along and when I figure I have had enough riding for the day, I look around for somewhere to stay in the nearest village. You won't have any problem finding places to stay in the area that you are headed to. I usually stay in 2 to 4 star hotels. In the regions you plan to travel, there are lots of pensions, small village hotels, etc. - again, no problem whatsoever just showing up at the last minute and asking for a room.

You will have no problem striking up conversations, etc. wherever you go, be that in a hotel, a historical attraction, a cafe, whatever. One of the nice things about riding solo is that you can be as introverted or as extroverted as you want, depending on how you feel that moment.

In principle, avoid the tendency to 'overplan', which is a common error when people are planning their first motorcycle tour. If I was setting out to do what you are planning to do (Hook of Holland to Calais in 7 days), I would probably plan things in no more detail than the following:

Day 1: Explore Rotterdam. Maybe stay there overnight.
Day 2: Go south towards the Belgian border.
Day 3: Drift west towards the Diksmuide (Flanders) region.
Day 4: Explore Ypres, First World War historical sites.
Day 5: Explore more of whatever you found interesting on the first few days.
Day 6: Start heading towards Calais.

I'm not suggesting that you follow that itinerary, I'm just giving you an example of the (lack of) level of detail that I use when I plan tours.

Hope this helps,

Michael

Learn some French ??!!??
:biggrin3:

There is a bit of a difference between Holland and Belgium and France that might be worth you knowing. Dutch geography means there are only two types of road, motorway and the equivalent of UK B-roads. France is bigger with a more widely spread population, so you have the N-Roads. These are the tree lines routes built by Napoleon for his armies. You get decently quick touring routes with traffic that isn't trying to do Autoroute speeds with the odd town to break up the journey. Belgium logically varies, the French N-roads filtering into Dutch motorways as they cross the country.

This means deciding where you want to ride and why. Holland and Belgium have the sights and cities (Amsterdam, Arnhem, Brussels, Waterloo etc.) while Northern France and the Ardennes has scenery, small towns with good food, empty roads etc.

Andy

Make a stop in Ghent on your way from Brussels to Bruges! You won't regret it.:thumbup1:

I rode to the black sea coast in Bulgaria and back, did it in two weeks. My biggest mistake was that I planned the whole route!

My advice would be to make a list of places you want to visit and then just see how far you can get before you have to turn around. Some days you may want to travel the extra 50 miles other days you may only want to travel 50.
The most important thing is that you give yourself the choice to stop whenever you see something interesting.

One route I have always been thinking about doing is the western front from WW1, you can search the old images of the maps online and superimpose them onto a modern map, hey ho you have it preplanned.

There is always plenty of motels throughout europe that you can stop in and loads of campsites as well.

Please oh please dont do what I did and overplan, in the end I had to ride straight through Cambrai (first ever tank battle and quite interesting)doh

Good luck and enjoy!

Amen. The above is extraordinarily wise advice.

Every year (bar 1) for the past 10 years, I've taken a month off and gone riding in Europe. The first few years, I used to plan things intensively - make up daily routings to load into my GPS, draw lines on the map with a yellow highlighter, etc.

Nowadays, I just say to myself "I think I will go and look at this country" (or, "This particular part of this country"), and when I have used up 2/3 of my planned vacation time, I turn around and go home. Life is so much simpler and more enjoyable now... plus, I spend less money replacing tires.

Michael

thanks for the advice, you have changed my perspective on the trip in a positive way. My plan of action so far is..

1. Buy the michelin maps and explore a little.
2. Buy a camera
2. Buy a long life battery for my GPS
3. Buy a waterproof bag and work out how to tie my car gps to my handlebars
4. Choose a start point of Hook of Holland or Calais.
5. Pick out a few sights I want to see and have some extras for back up.
5. Book my first hotel in advance and leave the rest to book as I go.
6. Go where I want, when I want and just ride, relax, and chill. No rush, no pressure, and little planning.

And my last questions if anyone know the anwers ! :)
Is their anything I should take with me for a weeks travel? An yes I am taking spare pants lol

e.g. money, visa card , petrol can (i have a very safe 100 mile range). I heard lots of petrol stations are unmanned and dont take credit cards !!!

What breakdown service do you recommend?

Do I need to take hi viz and spare bulbs, triangle?

Do I need to alter my bulb and how?

thank you

good luck with your journey!
If you need any inspiration, source a copy of "Vroom by the Sea" by Peter Moore - he travelled a lot of Italy on a 1972 Vespa Rally 200. Taking my copy with me on my forthcoming tour of Italy !

Thanks are you going on a scoot or a bike?

Headlight and tail/brake light bulbs are a must, forget the rest you won't get caught. I do carry a hi-viz vest for the hard shoulder and a FAK for my own use (hangover pills etc.), but leave the firefighting kit and things to get boy scouts out of horses hooves to truck drivers and the plod.

UK cards can be a PITA especially on a Sunday in rural areas where the petrol stations go automated from about 5.30 on Saturday. I carry enough cash for a days ride, fill up on Saturday and try to have a rough plan for getting where I want to be via the bigger roads. I've never had trouble finding fuel in sensible places. Faced with an automated station that won't play, just wait for a local and ask them to fill up for your cash. Horrible Gherkin etc. sell a nice little 500ml fuel can if you think it will be good for your mental health.

I used RAC for years, but recovery via your insurance can be better. They seem to argue less should you need a full recovery back home. Given the age and book value of my machinery, I just have a credit card with a limit big enough to hire a van. No point fighting with a company who'll want me to take a cheque for fifty quid and walk away.

Don't let this stuff worry you, this will be a great trip on the road to wherever you want to go.

Andy

Dave:

Assuming your scooter is in good mechanical condition, I really don't think you need to bring anything out of the ordinary with you, because your planned trip length is not excessive (probably less than 1,000 miles total), and you will only be away for a week.

Let's look at that first assumption (the mechanical condition of the scooter) first:

1) Do the tires have at least 1,000 miles left on them? Be aware that treadwear is accelerated at higher speeds and with higher loads carried.

2) Has the scooter had this year's scheduled maintenance service? By this I mean oil change, lubrication, spark plug(s), brake components inspected, whatever the manufacturer calls for?

If either of the two items above need attention, get the work done now, well ahead of your departure. You don't want to have major service done and then depart on a long trip the same day - you want to be able to ride around locally for a couple of days after the major service just in case any consequential events arise (e.g. leaking tire, whatever).

So far as "what to take on the trip", be aware that everything that you take with you will be a burden (you have to carry it), so, be minimalist in this respect.

Here's a short list, perhaps it will help:

1) Cash - take enough to keep you going for a couple of days at least (hotel, food, fuel). You can replenish your cash supply from ATMs in Europe, that will give you the very best exchange rate.

2) Bank ATM card - Bring an ATM card that works with one of the major ATM networks (Cirrus, Maestro), and make advance arrangements with your bank to ensure you can use the card abroad.

3) Credit cards - take two, and make advance arrangements with your credit card issuer to let them know you will be using the cards in Europe.

4) Don't bring a petrol can. That is a safety hazard of the first order, not to mention a logistical headache. Just fill the bike up before you get down to the 1/4 tank level. It only takes a few minutes to do, plus you can combine the fill-up stop with a bathroom break or coffee stop. I would not worry about fuel availability, you are visiting very densely populated areas, if you have a credit card and cash, you will always be able to get fuel.

In a worst-case situation, if you stop at a petrol station at 3AM on February 31st during a full moon and you can't coax any gas out of the pump (can't read the foreign language instructions, can't figure out how to work it, credit card doesn't work, etc.), you just wait for a local to come along to fill their car, and give them a 5 Euro note and ask them to pump 5 Euros of fuel into your tank before they shut off the pump. I've done this a few times, people are always willing to help when they see the out-of-country licence plate.

5) Ensure you have a white oval sticker on the back of your scooter that says 'GB'.

6) Don't bother with a triangle. The scooter is light enough you can push it well off the road if anything goes wrong - it's not an articulated lorry. The high-vis vest is a good idea. I really can't see the point of having breakdown cover - what is your worst-case exposure? Having to ship the scooter back to the UK by truck? Breakdown cover is nothing more than insurance, you are probably better off to self-insure (i.e. just take the risk of having to ship the bike home if anything goes terribly wrong). Plus, I don't think that breakdown cover policies are really tailored for motorcycles (I could be wrong here).

7) I doubt that you will have to alter your 'bulb' if by that you are referring to the LHD / RHD beam pattern of the headlight. It is unlikely you will be doing much riding at night, and it is also unlikely that the scooter has a unique RHD beam pattern. Besides, you can't change the beam pattern easily - you have to change the whole reflector mechanism, or apply a prism to the lens.

Easiest way to investigate the headlight issue it to research it at home: Take the scooter out at night, aim it against the wall of a building from about 10 yards away, and see if the headlight has a significant up-tick to the UK nearside. If so, experiment with putting a bit of black plastic electrical tape on the front of the headlight lens to obscure that uptick.

For what it is worth, I never bother modifying my ST1100 beam pattern when I visit the UK - I just aim the headlight further down than normal, and minimize the amount of night riding I do.

8) Pack one set of outer clothing only, based on the weather forecast a day or two before your departure. Ensure that you can 'layer' the clothing to deal with minor ups and downs (e.g. add a jumper, or remove a jacket inner liner). Be sure to have a rainsuit. You don't need to buy a $300 rainsuit that an Ironbutt rider would use to do 1,000 miles a day in a monsoon - just get a cheapie "rider boils in the bag" two-piece rainsuit. You'll only use it to keep you dry until you can get to shelter and wait out the rainshower.

And - on the topic of rainsuits - don't forget that you always have to put the rainsuit on BEFORE it starts raining. doh If you wait until the first few drops fall, it's too late.

Michael

on a bike, but that book contains so much useful information on some of the places I hope to visit. It's a good read, too.:thumbup1:

Take advantage of the completely different attitude that exists towards bikes on the continent to that in the UK.
For instance, an enduring memory of one of my early trips to France, was finding a very nice village, with pavement cafe, just at the right time for lunch.
Being a French village, the road was very narrow and I wasn't sure where to park. I hovered a bit at the kerb by the inviting pavement tables looking for the nearest place where there was room for the bike.
Straightaway, a waiter saw I was pondering, nipped over, completely removed one table next to where I was stopped and beckoned me onto the pavement to park in the vacated space....... :welcome:

Still being a bit new to 'the continent' I was stunned, but took advantage of it thereafter.
Sadly you're too late for my favourite, being able to ride on the pavement all the way up and down the Champs Elysees in Paris (although the beer at the tables was the most expensive in the world I think!) They stopped that quite a few years ago :( , but elsewhere is still OK.
But even then the French attitude persisted - when the Champs Elysees was being re-modelled large signboards were erected on the pavements, saying, roughly, "To the bikers. Sorry. After September you'll no longer be allowed to ride on the pavement. But we'll be stopping cars parking on all the side-streets, you can use those instead." Can you ever imagine that happening in Westminster?? Take advantage of these enlightened attitudes!

For War memorials, the Thiepval memorial is one of the largest and most thought-provoking, maybe on your route back to Calais. From there to Calais there are lots of war grave cemeteries tucked in all sorts of out-of-the way places. The tiny ones outside little hamlets can be just as interesting as the bigger well-known ones. They all have a local history notebook, in English, in a little hatch, that you'll find in a wall near the memorial.
I'm pretty sure you can find maps of France that show where they are. Or just ride around and you'll see signposts to them.

Have a great trip.

Thought I would give all you helpful people an update on my prep, which I have to say i'm thoroughly enjoying.
Got myself a new front tyre as the front was losing air a bit and Ive had it on for good few years. The rear looks like its got about 1000 to 1500 miles left so thats more than enough I'm sure. Worse case I'll get a new one fitted before I go but certainly no need yet and thats a pretty quick fix.

Ive bought myself a stop and go puncture kit, air pressure gauge, little jump leads and a wind up torch. All very small so easy to keep in the scooter and give me a bit of piece of mind.

Good call on the service as I do need one soon and been putting it off due to £££ so I will book one in advance for end of April ready for my trip mid May.

To buy,
A GB sticker as my number plate does not show the Euro flag. I went into Halfords but they only had car ones so I will pop into a George Whites or Hein Gericke on the weekend and pick up one of them as I assume they have them?

I've found a battery extender which I hope means I can use my Sat Nav for quite a few hours so might get this Portable Power Supplies - PortaPow USB Battery

And work out were i'm going & get some maps!

See if I have a suitable bag to use on the bike or buy a cheap one.

Ive told a few people what I'm planning and they all look at me like I'm mad as I'm going on my own. Its like they are saying "thats a shame you must be so lonely" lol As you can imagine they don't ride, I think it will be great.


A question I forgot to ask, for the ferry home do I need to book this in advance or can I just turn up buy a ticket and come home?
Or if I have to maybe the day before? The reason I ask is i could spend up to 10 night but I'm planning 7. However if Its a trip of a lifetime (so far) I wondered if I had flexibility?

Ok thats all for now. :thumbup1:

Dave:

Be aware that tire wear - especially rear tire wear - increases very rapidly with higher vehicle speeds and higher laden vehicle weights. You will probably be doing a fair amount of highway riding (e.g. 50 MPH or more, far faster than usual city riding), and your scooter will likely be as heavily laden as it has ever been. So, if you have the slightest doubt about that rear tire, replace it now. It is a PITA to replace tires while on tour, you have to wait for the shop to procure the new tire, you have to find a shop familiar with your scooter, etc.

Trying to get the last 1,000 or 1,500 miles out of the existing rear tire is just 'not good economics' in this context. FWIW, I replace the tires on my ST 1100 prior to beginning any long tour if I have the slightest doubt that they might not last all the way through the tour. It doesn't matter if the tires have 40% tread wear remaining - if it won't last for the planned tour, they get replaced.

You don't want to be out there trying to enjoy yourself and at the same time being constantly worried about whether a part (tire) will hold up.

Get the service done early enough to permit you to put 100 miles or so on the scooter before you head out on the trip. That will be sufficient use to determine if there are any minor headaches present arising from the service visit (e.g. something that might need a further adjustment).

My experience with UK ferries is that they price their sailings very much like the airlines. If you book well ahead of time for specific sailings, you can get very low prices. If you just show up and buy a ticket, you pay "full list price", which can be outrageous. The ferry companies don't make any distinction between a small scooter and a huge Gold Wing or Harley-Davidson... they are all motorcycles. I suggest you do some research. One alternative might be to book and pay ahead for a 7 day trip, and find out what the change fee and/or price increase is if you decide to prolong your voyage for a few extra days.

Michael