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Kyrgystan to Pakistan (KKH) via Kashgar, China
I am planning a southern crossing of Asia next year on my bike and I am formulating Plan "B" in case I am refused an Iranian visa. The Iranian visa sounds like its going to be tough to get as an American.
An alternative route appears to be through the Central Asia "Stans" to Kyrgystan and through a few hundred miles of China to the top of the KKH in Pakistan. I have corresponded with David at Stantours and it sounds like Central Asian visas can be obtained sucessfully (with a bit of work). As indicated in the following thread, a couple of folks make it into China from Kyrgystan sucessfully but there are still issues: http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb...ML/000189.html It appears that I have the following options: 1. Attempt to get myself and the bike into China from Kyrgystan with a Chinese visa, carnet, international driver's license and hope for the best. If its been done before, maybe I have a chance, but how would I know until I try it? 2. Hire a guide to take me and the bike across the short distance of China to Pakistan, I would think this could be done at a reasonable cost, since the amount of time in China would be short. But what about the licensing requirements even with a guide? 3. Hire a truck driver to load the bike onto a truck and drive it through China to the top of the KKH. I would think that plenty of goods are shipped on this route, so maybe this is feasible? If I wasn't "riding" the bike, would the same regulations apply that are typical for bikes in China? How realistic is this option? 4. Ship by air from Kyrgystan to Pakistan. This would be a bad option, I would think. 5. Ride all the way back to Turkey the way I started originally and figure out Plan "C" before the winter sets in. The worst option. Any comments on which of the above options would be feasible? Options 1, 2 & 3 are really the only ones I would want to consider. Is shipping the bike the short distance through China via truck a realistic back-up plan? BTW, I would be shooting for crossing into Pakistan in September or October of 2005. -Dave [This message has been edited by davidmc (edited 21 December 2004).] |
Hi David,
By all means try first to get an Iranian visa. They just may give you one, if they feel like it. My plan B would be to drive Europe - Russia (Moscow), Kazakstan (the easiest of the -stans) and enter China at Urumchi, then south to Kashgar and KKH into Pakistan. You should have no problems securing the required escort through China if you spend money (They will take care of Chinese licence for bike, insurance, and your Chinese driver's licence). Carnet is useless in China. Putting motorcycle on truck is impossible. Who will guarantee that you will not unload it at the next corner. Carnet is necessary in Pakistan and Iran, if you get visas. Plan C could be to make your way from Europe to the Emirates (Abu Dhabi, Dubai) and pick up a cheap flight to Karachi or Islamabad. You don't want to be stuck in one of the -stans, e.g. at the Chinese border, and having to turn back or airfreighting out. |
Hi David
Take option 1 or 2. Option 1 would be a try at Irkeshtam into China. That´s where we got in. Don´t try it across Torufart without a guide. No way. If option 1 does not work, Option 2: contact www.caravancafe.com in Kashgar (greetings to Greg, he will remind Karen and me). Greg made it possible for us to leave China via Torugart pass. The caravan cafe cooperates with Novy Nomad in Nauryn, Kyrgystan. They should be able to get hold of chinese licence plates etc. Good luck Goetz ------------------ ïóòü = öåëü |
Werner & Goetz, thanks for the replies. Any idea on how much the Chinese guide would be from Kyrgystan to the top of the KKH? I have heard $100-200/day, but I am wondering what other costs may/will be involved. And any estimates on how long the journey would take?
I know that in China much is possible with lots of money, but we are on a pretty tight budget. $100-200/day for the guide is feasible if the trip only takes a day or two. Thanks for the help. -Dave [This message has been edited by davidmc (edited 22 December 2004).] |
David
The guys at Caravan Cafe will be able to tell you about costs. They have organised hundreds of crossings of western china and WILL be able to organise a guided trip across that section. |
I have been corresponding with Steve from the Caravan Cafe and he tells me that to cross China from the Krygyzstan border to the Pakistan border at the top of the KKH via Kashgar will require about $1200USD and 70 days advance notice. This includes the cost of the guide and all the Chinese documents and permissions for the bike only. It doesn't include any daily living expenses like food or lodging.
Not cheap, but sounds like an available option. Has anyone organized anything with the Caravan Cafe...in other words, how is their reputation? -Dave |
To save money David, you might try and get a few other people to go at the same time. The cost of a guide for a group is going to be much the same as a guide for 1 person. If you split it 3 or 4 ways, its not much.
When are you planning on making the crossing? ------------------ www.TokyotoLondon.com [This message has been edited by colebatch (edited 02 January 2005).] |
Yes, I have thought about splitting the cost with another group also. We will try to get an Iranian visa and take the southern route from Turkey to Pakistan, but as Americans, it may be tough. So the China crossing will be part of "Plan B". We want to make it across the KKH in Pakistan well before it gets snowed in, so we will be shooting for an August/September 2005 timeframe.
-Dave |
One more thing...out of the $1200 cost, about $700 is just for permissions, permits, etc, with the Chinese government and the guide cost is around $500.
I would think you could split the $500, but the $700 may be something you have to do on your own. -Dave |
hello
i put some info on my website, i was in central asia russia mongolia iran pakistan (not china neither burma) in 2002, it may have changed a bit though : http://vincent.danna.free.fr/infos/index.html good luck, enjoy |
What a coincidence. I'm thinking of making the same trip as you this summer. I keep my bike (2000 GS) in Rome, and would possibly ship it to Baku, ride the "stans" into Kashgar, and then Pakistan, and leave the bike there, or India, or Nepal, Bhutan, etc., then come back next year, and ride east for another month. I may have another rider ready to do the trip. Do you have some flexibility for dates? Still looking for company for part or all?
[This message has been edited by tonygs2000 (edited 29 March 2005).] |
Tony, we haven't yet decided yet if we will go from Turkey to Pakistan via Iran or Central Asia.
If we go through Central Asia, we would expect to be in Baku around the beginning of August and the China/Pakistan border on the KKH in late October. Should we decide to do the Central Asia route we may end up going through Turkmenistan via David Berghof and Stantours as Turkmenistan is a real hassle to go through. I am not sure you can save much money with the transit visa when you take all the hassles into account. If we get some other folks to join us we could get a decent deal on the price. Stay in touch, my email address is on my profile or you can contact me via my website. ------------------ Dave www.mototrekker.com |
I sincerely recommend you to drive through Turkmenistan with David. My ten days last year were probably the best on my 17'000km trip altogether. You get to see fantastic canyons not accesible by public transport, i.e not even mentioned in Lonely Planet. But getting visas may take a while so you should probably make up your mind pretty soon.
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Hello Malmo,
I am entering Turkmenistan next week. You speak about beautiful canyons: where are they? I would be glad to have some tips about where to go in Turkmenistn. I plan to enter in the South of the country from Iran, go to Merv and then to Ashkabad, cross the Karaku desert and exit to Uzbekistan. What do u think? Henri, french traveller, 600xt, paris to PhnomPenh. ------------------ More info? www.electaunavia.org (french) |
Hi, Goetz,
I've read of your experiences getting into and out of China from Kyrgyzstan with interest. I'm based in Tashkent and have been thinking of trying to make a bike trip to Kashgar via Fergana Valley, Osh and Sary-tash. As far as I know, the roads are asphalted although not in great shape from Tashkent to Sary-tash. Can you advise on road conditions from Sary-tash through the border and on to Kashgar? Also, is 93 octane or higher fuel available on that route. I'm riding (don't laugh) a BMW R1100S, not the ideal bike for the conditions in Central Asia but then I didn't know I would be transferred to Tashkent when I bought the bike in Vienna. James |
see the interesting china posts on the southern asia forum
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Hi, I rode from Kashgar to Sary Tash about one month ago. The road from Kashgar is all good bitumen except for one washed out section (just a river crossing) which has probably been repaired by now. However, the other side is a different story. From memory it's about 70 or 80kms to Sary Tash and apart from a few kms of bitumen (they're working on it) the road is a dirt/gravel track with some pretty rough sections (deep rutts). Just ride slow and take some travel sickness pills and you'll be fine. I was on a KLR650 and it took about 3hrs to get to Sary Tash. I wouldn't like to try this in the wet or snow though.
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hello adrian,
how did you manage to enter china ? from where , officially (with guide etc ...) or unofficially ? cheers, happy trails |
Hi - I entered officially with the help of Caravan Cafe and had a guide and driver.
I entered at TaCheng from Kazakhstan (not a common entry point). I've written a blog about it at; www.users.bigpond.net.au/AdrianScott see Trip Reports and there are some photos too. I did consider just turning up and trying to enter but I didn't have time to mess around if it didn't work out given my overall journey timeframe (i.e. 3 months from Magadan to Istanbul). |
hello, i keep receiving emails from this company : http://www.edelweiss.elcat.kg/
maybe, they can be usefull. good luck, |
me too. They send email christmas cards en masse. They can help with CHina-Kyrgyzstan travel and I think they are based in Bishkek. Anyone used them?
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I recently spoke to the Chinese Embassy here in London and they said that I would be unable to ride in China. Ideally I would like to try and ride from Mongolia through to Hong Kong. Has anyone got any suggestions, ideas, contacts, etc
Ken |
Greg at the Caravan Cafe in Kashgar organised my trip thru China and it was all above board and worked out well for me as it was part of a bigger trip across Asia. You can contact them via www at www.caravancafe.com
I wrote about my trip, including China and photos at www.users.bigpond.net.au/AdrianScott any questions let me know. Adrian |
Well, we are now in South Asia, and we ended up going through Central Asia, China and into Pakistan per my original post and I can say that it was an amazing experience!
Greg from Caravan Cafe organized the China portion of the trip and was very helpful and professional the entire time. We had no trouble organizing everything between us online. The only advice I have is this...don't go too late in the year...we had to load the bike into a truck over both the Torugart and Khunjerab passes due to heavy snow and ice on the roads. This was in mid to late October. If you are planning on taking this route, get into Pakistan prior to October 1. Putting your bike on a truck over an international border crossing can be quite expensive as there is usually some paperwork and bureaucracy involved. And the normal cargo trucks crossing borders are usually full and have no room for a bike, so these are not really an option. The original cost to arrange the paperwork, permissions and guide ended up costing around $1100usd, but the extra cost of trucking the bikes through the snow ended up costing an extra $500. Not cheap, but going through Central Asia was an unbelievable experience and one I can highly recommend for anyone seeking a route that's off the beaten path. We will have more information on our HU blog sometime in the near future... ------------------ Dave www.mototrekker.com [This message has been edited by davidmc (edited 12 January 2006).] |
Lhasa-Golmud-Gansu Province-Mongolia
Hi
I am planning to ride with my friends from Nepal-Lhasa-Golmud-Gansu Province to Inner Mongolia and cross over to Mongolia till Ulan Batar. Has anyone donethis route, any advise and suggestions will be greatly appreciated. Can anyone recommend a Travel company in China who can arrange paperworks and logistics. Cheers Drukasia |
How many times I need for way from Kyrgystan (Bischek) to Pakistan (Gilgit or Rawalpindi) across China?
Thansk you for answer! |
july-august 2007
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We want start around 5 July ,ride thru Ukraine,Rusia,Kazachstan,Kirgistan,China(Irkischta m pass,Kashgar,KKH),Pakistan,iran,Turkey and back to Poland. 3 riders from Poland,on Africa Twin,BMW 1100 and DR 650. +/- 15 000 km and 6 weeks. I was last year there(not by bike),but this time I want to go on My motorcycle and ride KKH. Maybe We can go together thru China,maybe will be cheaper arange parmissions and guide? How meny riders in Your team? |
Unless you want to have a mind-knumbing experience through China then I suggest you try real hard to not get or use a guide. That may sound a bit hard but guides are such a drag. Western China is a wild place and potential stomping ground! Once inside China the police don't usualy care. As an individual or member of a small group it is possible to pull up to a remote border, make chummy chummy with guards and they'll let you through. A little passing out of cigarettes never hurts either.
As always though I think the reason why it's not consistent and there are no clear rules is because there basically are no clear rules. How easy or difficult sometimes just depends on who you meet or what time you show up. Are they busy? Are they bored? Round and round spins the wheel of fortune! If you go there lookin' like money though...they'z prolly gonna rake you over the coalz! CHA CHING! Be sure you're lookin' all fugged up by the time you get there.:nono::innocent: CC |
Hi James
Did you ever make the crossing from kyrgystan to China? Would be great to hear how you got on as planning trip from UK to India via China next April. Cheers Martin |
India via CHN
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With the recent killing of 10 police in Kashgar by Muslim terrorists/extremists/freedom fighters, (call them what you will), I can only presume it will be even harder or impossible to "sneek" in with your bike. My blog is at bikerbytes.com/txp Great place if you can get in though. John |
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