Police say I have a Problem Riding Quebec on Austraian plates
 

I'm riding Canada and USA on my Australian Reg bike. Today in Quebec the police stopped me and told me it was illegal in Quebec to ride my bike. They let me go but fined me $350.
They told me to check USA States ... I've ridden in 200 countries and never has this happened

Is this just ignorant cops or do I have problem...appreciate comments

What was the wording on the citation? Anything to do with not being properly insured? Did they ask for any import documentation?

Maybe RHD vehicles are illegal in Canada :)

Hi Tony

They said my Australian Registion is not legal in Quebec and therefore the bike should not be ridden Quebec. My licence and insurance were ok. My registration is current and valid in Vitoria

The fine which I thought harsh was because I was dodging traffic jam so I can't grumble about that... It's more the issue that they say my Aust Rego is not legal in Quebec and probably illegal in some other Canadian and US States

As said, I've travelled RTW just about without ever hitting this issue.

I presume it's ignorant cops but very worrying... They delayed me two hours...5 cars!

If your paperwork is in order, you have just got an ill informed officer :thumbdown:

What was it your mother used to tell you? More haste, less speed - to which you can add - less money. Bad luck, but at least you are philosophical about it.



By the sound of it, if they could have pinged you for riding without valid rego and insurance they would have, so you could likely keep on riding and just avoid the temptation to ride on median strips or footpaths or filtering too fast or whatever you were doing to merit a 350 dollar fine.

Not exactly what I'd call being let go. Few thousand miles south and you could probably bargain that down a fair bit.

They were emphatic that foreign rego isn't valid in Quebec and advised me to check each state rules for my journey in USA

I assume they are wrong but when you have 5 cars full of Police ( they kept arriving... It was bizarre) telling you you're riding illegally because you're on Australian plates it's rather disconcerting

Is it normal also to insist on Immediate payment? They wouldn't give my passport back till I paid them. Again I was surprised

By the way, I was my charming and humble self so it wasn't in any way my reaction that caused a counter reaction

I'm very confused and a bit concerned this will happen again as I have a long journey ahead

If you have a receipt that is properly filled out and signed by an identified officer then it might be they are able to insist on immediate payment. I've heard of French police insisting on immediate payment by foreigners and insisting they walk to the nearest ATM if they don't have cash.

I'm curious about the high fine. What was the 9 digit driving offence or file number.

Quebec does not list a beat policeman as one of the collecting entities. Can't find any reference to them being able to collect money on the side of the road but could be. If you haven't got an official receipt, you've probably been had.

Suggest you go to a local courthouse and speak to the clerk of the court or equivalent and check up on the traffic infraction and means of collection.
They may also be able to get information from a government department re legality of driving a foreign registered vehicle imported under a temporary vehicle Import Permit or whatever they gave you at customs when you imported the bike.

Or just drive on and chalk it up to experience.

Canada is a signatory to the 1949 Geneva Convention on Road Traffic. Basically, this means that as long as your foreign country plate is valid (so far as your home country is concerned) and as long as you are insured, you can drive in Canada with your foreign vehicle.

You do need to have a white oval sticker with your country code (probably AUS) on the back.

It is unheard of for police in Canada to collect a fine on the spot - absolutely unheard of. I think you have been scammed by the police who stopped you.

Michael
(Toronto, Canada)

PS: FWIW, I helped a UK traveller get his UK plated bike out of customs at the Toronto airport about 8 years ago - he was stopped within 15 minutes of getting on the road. The Ontario police officer insisted that the UK plate was not valid, but I insisted that it was. After about 30 minutes of conversation with headquarters, the police realized that it was valid.

The problem, I guess, is that Canada doesn't see many foreign-plated vehicles, other than USA vehicles.

Here's a link to how the process for traffic offences (or, alleged traffic offenses) in the province of Quebec works. Note that the motorist is ALWAYS given a ticket, and can ALWAYS appear in court to contest the charge.

Contesting a Ticket - Quebec

Here is another link that might be useful for you: Code of ethics of Québec police officers

Finally, here's a link to the 1949 Geneva Convention on Road Traffic that I referred to: 1949 Geneva Convention on Road Traffic

Thanks for this. If it happens again I'll really infuriate them by quoting the 1949 International convention!

One doesn't like to think the Canadian Police resort to scamming foreigners

You expect that in 3rd world countries not Canada so I hope you're wrong!!

Hmmmm!

I really can't see 5 carloads of Canadian police pulling a stunt like this. I would have thought that most experienced travellers would know that in two similar countries such as Canada and Australia - almost identical politically legally and culturally in fact - the behavior of the police force would also be similar.

One corrupt cop - sure. Happens too often. Two corrupt cops - yes, of course. But ten corrupt cops driving around at random all getting together at one place at the same time.

as I said - Hmmmmmm!!!!!!

Hi Branners,

I'm sorry about your incident with the cops. I guess they are just not used to travelers on foreign vehicles besides the ones from USA. I guess that since they could not verify your motorcycle registration in their database, they considered you illegal.

If you are still in Quebec and need any French translation or help, let me know.

Patrick

Q
 

Was curious how you entered the country?

If by Air, then you must have some sort of TVIP or stamp in your passport connecting you with bike? And your bike must be in the Canadian system?

If you crossed from USA into Canada by land border ....then why would Canadian authorities allow you entry if your bike were illegal? Once again, if you entered, then you are in the system ... and legal for ALL of Canada.

Unless the Quebecois separatist's have succeeded, I don't believe Quebec can pick and choose who is allowed in and who is not and make law above the federal government.

So either by Air, Sea or Land, if you were illegal, immigration/customs would likely have informed you and NOT let you into Canada in the first place. doh

I smell a RAT here. I've ridden all over Canada ... including Quebec, on USA registered bikes. Seen many foreign plated bikes in BC as well. (foreign travelers at HU travelers meeting)

I can tell you one thing, those Quebec cops are full of crap about USA ... for USA, as long as you have some sort of insurance, you are OK in ALL 50 US states on an Oz plate or any foreign plated bike that is road legal and registered.

A friend rode his German registered BMW into USA via Mexico border. No problems on entry or from any local Police in US. Dozens I know of have followed suit without problems here.

USA cops pretty much give foreign travelers a break (even when they've done something wrong), as long as they are not wanted, illegal and bike paperwork matches up. All good for the most part.

What exactly were you doing to get fined?

I'd be interested in seeing a scan or photo of the written infraction they gave you. As others have said, there's no provision for a fine based on your Australian registration. Plus if it were really illegal they'd never have let you drive away, with or without ticketing or payment. I think they were just hassling you of plain old commonplace pigheaded ignorance.

On the other hand, there is lots of expensive stuff they could charge you with if you were filtering or in other respects driving illegally. Best check the rules carefully wherever you go--that includes the USA, where filtering of any sort is legal only under certain circumstances and only in California. Driving on the shoulder (verge) to get around traffic is illegal, too. There are specific regulations about all of that, with specific fines attached. If they want, they can always step you up to "driving to endanger" or "reckless driving," or other defined offenses which carry larger and larger fines.

I'd also be interested in seeing the documentation given when you paid $350 cash on the spot. As far as I know that's not kosher anyplace in North America. If it's legal, there's got to be a paper trail accompanying its occurrence.

I'm curious about your experiences riding in "200 countries." I've been riding in only 70 or so, and attempts to extract roadside "fines" are commonplace in many of them. Is this really the first time for you?

Mark

Wow, more than in the entire United Nations.

From:
 

Driving in Québec - Tourists

Licence holders from outside Québec may drive a vehicle on a public road in Québec for up to six consecutive months without holding a Québec driver's licence.

These conditions apply:
your driver's licence must be valid;
any licence restrictions also apply in Québec;
you are allowed to operate only the corresponding class of motor vehicle in Québec.

Beyond 6 months, you must hold an International Driver's Permit, which allows you to operate the corresponding class of motor vehicle in Québec for the length of time the Permit and your driver's licence are valid. You must have both in your possession when driving.

Regardless of the length of your stay, if your driver's licence is neither in English or French, getting an International Driver's Permit is highly recommended. You must apply for a Permit in the country that issued your driver's licence, before leaving.

[url=http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/driver_licence/visitors/]Driving in Qu

Op had an issue with bike registration, not licensing.

Bob

Sent from my mobile

I didn't see an outcome to the OP's citation...

Should have been dismissed.



No. Section 7(1)(b) of the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (MVSA), allows a visitor to temporarily enter Canada with a motor vehicle without complying with the MVSA if the vehicle is used only by a visitor to Canada or a person passing through Canada en route to another country.

Notes:

You alone may use the vehicle.
Any change in your status, such as receiving permanent residency in Canada, may make your vehicle inadmissible and you will be required to export or destroy it.
You may not sell or gift the vehicle while in Canada.
The vehicle cannot remain in Canada longer than the time limits allowed under your temporary entry.


I've driven my USA registered truck and ridden my motorcycle through Quebec without any issues what-so-ever.

This kind of thing is sickening. Quebec sometimes seems like the most corrupt outpost of North America.

I assume it was local cops and not Highway Troopers (who are federal)

Ed March had a very similar problem...

Ed's March across Canada - Quebec - Canada Moto Guide

Highway Troopers?
 

I don't know where you come from however in Canada there are no such thing as Highway Troopers. In the province of Ontario you have the Ontaario Provincial Police (OPP) patrolling the Highway ans in Quebec you have the Quebec Provincial Police. QPP. For the rest of the country you have the RCMP and in Alberta the Provincial Sheriffs Office.

Neither the OPP, QPP or Sherriffs are Federal.

Please if you are going to call out corrupt police officers or departments get the story right.

Riq

Riq is correct in his description of policing in Canada, however, to provide greater clarity, the following is a slightly different (hopefully clearer) way of saying the same thing:

We have one federal police force in Canada, that is the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. The RCMP provide policing to communities and rural areas that do not operate their own police force.

Two provinces that I know of (Ontario and Quebec) operate their own provincial police forces. These happen to be the two most populous provinces. In these two provinces, the RCMP does not have a 'public' presence; the provincial police forces provide policing in community and rural areas that do not have their own police forces.

Any community in Canada can set up their own community (in other words, municipal) police force. This is the normal practice in communities with a population of 100,000 or more. Smaller communities usually contract with the RCMP or (in Ontario & Quebec) the provincial police to provide police services, simply because this is less expensive per capita than setting up a municipal police force in a small town.

There are no 'highway specific' police departments in Canada. But, there is a certain amount of specialization within the federal, provincial, and municipal police forces to do traffic work. In other words, within a big city police department like Toronto (about 4 million people live in Toronto), the Toronto Police force has a specialized division that deals exclusively with traffic. But there is no visual distinction (uniforms, cars, etc.) within these specialized units.

Police officers in Canada are very highly paid. It is not uncommon for a police officer in Canada to make CAD $100,000 (USD $70,000) per year in salary. The entry level qualifications are also very high, at the very least, a college degree, more commonly, a 4 year university degree.

I've lived in Canada almost all my life, and it is very rare to hear of corruption amongst police. Occasionally, a scandal erupts if a policeman has been found to plant drugs in a suspect's car, but exhorting a bribe from a citizen during a traffic stop is unheard of.

I'm not saying that the original poster's story is untrue - just that if it did happen the way he reported it, it is a very uncommon occurrence.

Michael

PS: 'Sheriffs' exist in Canada, but only for very specialized purposes - they deliver court documents and things like that. They are not involved in any way with police work.

More accurately, the police officers who stopped the OP had a problem with their comprehension of the rules that govern foreign vehicles in Canada. The OP himself did nothing wrong so far as his licence plate was concerned... but I do see that the OP has added some information in post #3 explaining that he was 'dodging traffic jam' (whatever that means - lane splitting? passing on the right? travelling on the road shoulder?), and my guess is that he was fined for that moving violation, not for anything related to the licence plate.

For a more thorough explanation, see post #8 above, most especially the postscript.

Michael

Just to correct the correction
 

Just a couple of points of clarification on the information given above so that we are all working off of the same data. The RCMP have the explicit mandate to provide policing in National Parks ( I know the park wardens also perform this function), Indian reserves ( I know we call them First Nations Lands but thats not how the act reads) and all other Federal Properties. Anything beyond that is done under contract.

Also the Province of Alberta does indeed have a Provincial Policing force called the Alberta Sheriff's department who have full policing authority. You can dispute this if you wish however when they pull you over please show them proper deference as they are developing a reputation for over reacting in a violent manner.

Riq

So which countries did the OP invent to make a total of 200 countries visited? The Conch Republic, Panem and Gondor?

That claim seriously casts a shadow on the statement that a full gaggle of poleece demand cash payment for a non-violation.

Could be Police were pissed off because they had trouble catching up to him since he was riding a bike, lane splitting or riding the shoulder. Probably radioed their buddies ahead that some guy on a bike was making a run for it.
Nothing pisses off cops more than a runner.

One point Michael, in an earlier post you said that NO Canadian police or RCMP collect "on the spot" fines. I beg to differ. Perhaps its changed now but 10 years ago (or so) I had to pay a fine in BC and my buddy, who married a woman in Kelwona, BC, got several Pay on The Spot fines riding his ZX-11. On one trip he paid over $800 USD in speeding fines. My fine was small, but also in BC and was RCMP cop. 62 mph in a 55 mph zone. Absurd.

Basically, police there have nothing to do. So chicken shit traffic stops are how they pay the bills. Canada has no crime, no guns and no gangs to speak of, so anyone going a bit faster than the Absurdly LOW speed limits, gets you nailed.
In BC (and everywhere really) Radar is everywhere. And cops everywhere too.
I've ridden cross Canada twice but mostly been in BC.

Maybe it's just foreigners that must pay on the spot? Dunno? or maybe this practice no longer exists? But it certainly DID 10 or 15 years ago. I paid with a credit card, which the cop was set up to take. Any ideas on this?

Apologies; I thought the highway cops were Federal. This makes me even more nervous because which ever way you slice it the Police seem to do more take than give here in Quebec.

Hi Riq:

My apologies, I was not aware that in Alberta, the duties of a sheriff had expanded to include traffic work. Historically, in Canada, the role of sherriffs has been limited to work supporting the judicial system - unlike in the USA, where 'Sheriff' is often synonymous with 'policeman'. I did find a link to the Government of Alberta website that explains the role of a sheriff in that province in more detail, here it is: Alberta Solicitor General website.

Hi Mollydog:

It is possible, I guess, that police may want a visitor from out of the country to pay a fine on the spot, this because there is no easy way for them to follow up if the visitor does not pay the fine after they return to their home country.

I had a similar encounter in the USA about 6 years ago - a policeman gave me a speeding ticket, and explained that because I was from out of country, I had to pay it 'right then and there'. He was very courteous, accompanied me to an ATM, gave me a proper receipt, etc. So maybe this is normal practice when a visitor to a country gets a ticket.

Michael

Nit-picking. A cop is a cop is a cop as far as most people are concerned. Go further south and there will be 5 lots of police/national parks rangers, army, marines and rentacops to sort out and it isn't relevant anyway since they are the ones with the gun, cuffs and citation forms and you are the one in the wrong.

Whole problem right from the start of this topic was that the reported facts didn't stack up against published official procedures and people were skeptical.