looking for a UNIMOG 404
 

Hello all,

can anyone help me to find a unimog 404? I would like to transform it into a camper.

Anyone experience with this? Did anyone used a unimog for travelling in Africa : your opinion please.

Kar El

WOW! You may want to check out http://www.besko.nl/.

How will you take enough petrol to keep a vehicle doing 3km/l running? Perhaps better to look out for a diesel with BIG tanks. Apart from their high point of gravity Unimogs must be terrific off-road vehicles I reckon.

Good luck with your plans.
Camiel

You can get a 404s in Germany for €1,500. This is the "Funkwagen" version with a "box" on the back measuring 2.00mx3.00mx1.70m. The only disadvantge is that they are petrol engined. It is possible to put a 240,300 or 300 turbo diesel into it and there is also a book available (in German)on how to do this. It is also possible to buy converted models but they are more expensive.

They are probably the best off road vehicle that you can buy (if you can afford them) apart from a full truck 6x6 or 8x8. It is also possible to put them into a normal sea container. With the 300 engine (88bhp) there are no major problems in sand dunes and the "box" is unbreakable.

Try the following

www.mobile.de go into "wohnmobile" then type in "unimog"

www.nordtruck.de

www.philipp-aus-der-hanfbachtal.de

I dont know if I spelt the last one right but try it anyway he also has links to other German web-sites on Unimogs like www.unimog.de.

I dont have the list here but I will try to post some more two orr three days if you want.

Yep,

thanks Camiel and Kevin for your info. Ofcourse I will transform the unimog with a diesel engine.
Can anyone help me with pictures, ideas how to transform the box into something camper-like?

Karel

Karel you are a brave man! Mogs are generally formidable off road, and have equally formidable fuel consumption. I recently went and watched a Europa Truck Trial event where they were climbing things I wouldn't attempt without a rope! They got over the high C of G problem by filling the tyres with water...hmm! The portal axle design means that if you drop a wheel into a hole, or it digs in it will do so deeply; you'll need another Mog to get it out. The floor of any box you put on the back will be at least 1.5 m off the ground, add to that the 2 m box height and it starts to feel ponderous and evilly tall. Take one for a couple of hours test drive, with a box on the back. They're very slow and noisy. Then reconsider just how much SERIOUS off-roading you're going to do in your adventures.
A guy called John Speed wrote a really comprehensive book on the preparation of an overland 'van. He had a Mog expedition vehicle but preferred a Merc 4x4 panel van about 6 m long, I've seen it, it's lovely. check out http://www.020.co.uk/travelvans/ it's pricey but worth it. I also found http://www.unimog.org.uk/ while looking for the ideal base for a 4x4 camper van. I had the luck of finding a fully overland equipped Iveco Daily 4x4 (even a generator on board) which, although it's no dune buggy, is surprisingly capable off road (diff locks et al). It is also very well behaved on long hauls and returned less than 15l/100km over the last 20000km in Maroc and Europe.
For the stuff dreams are made of look at http://www.actionmobil.at/english/e_index2.html and go weak at the knees. My conclusion on the ideal base vehicle with low C of G and manoeuvrability etc. it's either the Supacat HMT (http://www.supacat.com) or even more fun the Gaz Vodnik (http://www.vodnik.com/index_en.htm) ; barges and ferries, broken bridges and water holes no longer a problem http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb/smile.gif
Oh well it costs nothing to dream.
Happy trails
Luke

As another alternative, how about a Gaz 66? Available for £3,000, check out www.tanksforsale.co.uk/gaz66/Gaz66.htm. I read somewhere that some of them have a gadget for altering tyre pressures on the go.

Hi all!

Luke,thanks,exelent links,i realy got weak at the knees!

Enyway has enyone considerd a UralAZ 6x6,I saw one for sale last year in german magazine for 7000 euros in excelent condition and with a 'box' at the back.
As I heard of they are the best in price/performance,and they work in -50*C sibiria with no problem(altrough oil heater could broke but thay got an woodburning thing)

www.uralaz.ru

Does somebody knows something about TAM trucks model T7 150 with 6x6 drive,and 'short' version T7 110 with 4x4(similar to unimog by dimensions),it's produced in Slovenia(factory is now called TVM)
When I was in the army we used to drive in the back of one and I liked it wery much and it had a great offroad ability.

seeyaa

jondoe

Does enybody have an idea of prices on MAN KAT1 8x8 or 6x6
Check it out: http://www.aignertrucks.com


[This message has been edited by jondoe (edited 16 September 2002).]

[This message has been edited by jondoe (edited 16 September 2002).]

Kat´s start at about €9,000 for a 4x4, you used to be able to get a good 6x6 for €15,000. You can try www.truckmobiles.de which is a German magazine for used trucks. The problem is that they rarely have the prices, you usually have to contact the seller directly. Go into the green "truck" symbol, ignore the top two, click on "hersteller" (manufacturer) and then "typ" (type!!! e.g 4x4 or 1017 0r 404) then click on "suchen".

Luke,

thanks, indeed nice links. In my opinion what can be more noisier and slower then a Series III with dieselengine? We took one of these to The Gambia and I can live with the lack of comfort, the noise and slow progress.
You are right when you state that one doesn't really need a 4X4 for travelling even in the desert, but on the other hand if you are driving one, so much more beautifull places not to be reached by 2WD can be visited.
In the end everything comes to taste. I really like the design of the unimog and then you are more eager to forgive its downsides ; don't you think?

Greetz,

Kar El

Hey Kar El,
rummaging around the web looking for something else I fell upon this http://www.burgdorfernet.ch/Military.htm
Just what the doctor ordered.
I can't really fault the off road ability of the Mog; what I really meant to say was that the boulder fields that require the amazing ground clearance and articulation of a Mog make up such a small part of one's total adventures that I would choose a lesser vehicle that presents advantages elsewhere (comfort, speed and fuel consumption mainly). Also, in accomodation terms for a camper, anything with a bonnet is an inefficient use of the length of the vehicle. You only have to look inside a LR 101 and compare the space available with that in its longer brother the 110. Bonnets are good for access, but hopefully with a Mog you won't need to spend too much time in the engine bay (unlike for LRs http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb/wink.gif
Happy trails
Luke

Hi all,
I guess you guys are getting carried away a little. I encourage you to peruse the relevant pages in Tom Sheppard's VDE Guide. He makes a comparison of various vehicles looking at engine power, fuel consumption and load carrying capability. If I remember correctly, Landrover FC comes on top. Other aspects, like reliability, availability of spares and ease of servicing are also relevant factors but more difficult to gauge. But I'd never attempt to drive a Gaz or Ural outside Russia, no matter how good they seem on paper.

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Roman (UK)
www.polandrover.com

In 1983 I met a couple of german guys in a unimog 404 in Algeria, they had cleverly built a small camper body within the dimensions of the soft top canvas on the back. It was small but comfortable and very discreet. The best bit was that they had bought it very cheap as an ex military cast off as its diesel engine was knackered(though the vehicle was imaculate). Unable to scource a decent diesel engine they fitted a straight six petrol from the old mercedes SL sports car!
Boy did it go well! When I asked what the fuel consumption was like, the reply was 'very high!'

Roman,

Even as a Landrover owner, I have to say that Tom Shepperd's book is ever-so-slightly biased towards Landrovers...

Is the 101 REALLY better than a Mog? I know which I'd go for...

Ollie

Hi all!

I agree that we'r getting a bit carried away,but keep on dreaming,some day it might get real!

Enyway,I never concider'd looking for a perfect overland truck in my own country,I just cheked out this site and remember'd a home-made 8x8 and 6x6 wich yougoslav army uses for transport and misile carrier,a FAP 2632,8x8 allroad 50,000 ton tank transporter.
It's suposed to be not that costy(as MB or MAN)and i'm gonna see if it's posibile to get a used one from the army.
I'v also heard that Saudi Arabia army uses them with sucses.

Check it out: http://www.fap.co.yu
click english/trucks/special vahicles/

SeeYaa

jondoe

P.S: Action mobile MAN 8x8 looks like +500,000 EURO,and since we'r not sheiks...!

[This message has been edited by jondoe (edited 20 September 2002).]

>If I remember correctly, Landrover FC comes on top. Other aspects, like reliability, availability of spares and ease of servicing are also relevant factors but more difficult to gauge. <

The only thing that stops me (for now) from buying a unimog right now, is the fact that they are petrol (2,2 or 2,8) and it seems not so easy to swap it to diesel. I looked at most interesting sites about dieselasition but can anyone tell me firsthand how difficult it is?

That's one of the advantages of the LR FC : engineswaps are very straightforward.

Convince me to buy a FC and not a unimog (as I am a LR-fanatic aswell)!!!!!!!

Kar El

Hmmm.... LR fanatics need convincing that a Unimog is not a better idea? What a strange world ... On the other hand, having read the litany of problems in Karel's other post I am not surprised he is looking at alternatives.

I still think the bottom line is how much fuel you can load in the vehicle on departure and how far it can take you taking into account the weight of this fuel and engine efficienty required to carry that load. All the rest is bells and whistles. If you need a lorry, you are carrying too much unnecessary stuff. Am I right, Andras?

------------------
Roman (UK)
www.polandrover.com

Came across some guys last year in Djanet who were in an ex German Army 4x4 truck - multi fuel. They drove the first 600Km from Germany on used oil from a fast food restaurant at their university!! Apparently there was a 1000m radius of fried fish smell as they went! They had EXTRA tanks for fuel and water of 1000 litres each! The two spare wheels they had each weighed almost 300Kgs. Top speed was 60 kph, and they wore ear defenders whilst driving. I thought it was great, but the Land Rover felt like a Lexus afterwards!

You can, it's whether you want to!!

Sam.

Kar el

There is a book available on how to convert the 404S from petrol into diesel. I bought it and think there is no big difficulty involved. The new parts cost about €1,500-€2,000 not including the motor. The only problem with the book is that it is in German. It is/was possible to buy it at Daerr´s (overexpensive) shop in Munich. I think it cost DM40 (€20)last year.

You could go one better and convert a 101. I met some Germans a few years ago in Libya with a 101, two SIII and a 110, all ex British army and all with Mercedes diesel engines.

Having taken a LR 101 FC from UK to Ghana I would say that there is no better vehicle. The combination of room, power and carrying capacity is hard to beat and the off road ability is awesome. Far better than any other Landrover even.
But do not take my word for it. Neil lawson took a 101 from UK to SA and his website makes very interesting reading. In particular look at the Mission Impossible feature at http://www.enableafrica.net/features/archive.html
where he was travelling in somewhat difficult terrain in company with a Unimog. I understand that the Unimog driver is now looking for a 101.

Malcolm

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Roman:
[B]Hmmm.... LR fanatics need convincing that a Unimog is not a better idea? What a strange world ... On the other hand, having read the litany of problems in Karel's other post I am not surprised he is looking at alternatives.


The problems mentioned in the other post were not with my Series. 90% of that kind of problems are related to bad preparation of the vehicle (LR or other)before you set off.
So that's definetly not the reason why I'm looking for a unimog : go with a bad prepared unimog and you will have problems aswell.
I'm still convinced that LR's are the better choice for the job, but (for me here in Belgium) looking at the practical (and financial) side of it, unimog wins.

LR-greetings,

Kar El

Hi; a few thoughts to throw into the discussion: The size of vehicle is a decision based on a trade-off between one's desire for creature comforts, how much you can afford and how desperate you are to go; there are those who will go without money or vehicle because the urge to travel is stronger than all else. Everyone is different.
Mog/LR: Take two theoretical candidate vehicles, ex-military; one a LR, the other a Mog, both have about the same age. The LR will have been treated as a car, driven hard, probably everywhere. A standard lwb LR with a load of armed equipped soldiers is already working hard, a 20+ year career even with regular servicing adds up to a tired vehicle. The Mog on the other hand cannot be driven fast, it just doesn't happen. If it's a troop carrier or a radio box it will never have seen its maximum load capacity exceeded, it may have a quite a lot of km on the clock but for the reasons above it should be less tired. Then there is the fuel question, besides the safety considerations, after how many kms does the difference in fuel price and consumption pay for the conversion? I did the sum for a pickup I have; for a £2000 conversion at 10p a litre difference I would have to drive over 130000km at 15l/100km before the saving is worth it!
Roman wrote "If you need a lorry, you are carrying too much unnecessary stuff."
Probably, but not necessarily; if you have a lorry you can take stuff to make you even more independant. More importantly if you have a lorry you can live inside it, rather than outside and on top as with a smaller 4x4. A TLC/LR or equivalent prepared and loaded for an overland trip will be close to its maximum load and thus work harder than a lorry which should have load capacity to spare (unless you overdo it; look at the motorhomes section of http://www.robgray.com :0 )
If one only wants to do short "raids" it's another argument altogether.
This might provoke a debate about "goldfish bowl tourists" but it is sometimes a relief to shut out the harassing sales people and the "you, you, you, you" (no countries mentioned) and still have room to breath.
These are thoughts I have been chewing on throughout my search for a vehicle in which to escape, for a long time.
Luke

Hi all!

Just seen a 'auto motor und sport' on VOX tv
on sunday,and a was amazed with a GEOCAR ALBACO,what a beauty!A bit silly from the back side,but it looks as it's from a sience-fiction movie(wich is wery good,er,not a case with saharan bandits,thay will love it too! don't u think?)

Enyway check it out(just in german)http://webplanet.lion.cc/venus/390088/

seeyaa

jondoe

Few thoughts on the whole truck argument. Driven across Aus and across Africa in LR110, now thinking about truck but positive: can create far greater fuel capacity, overland trucks going uk - cape spent less on fuel for a truck carrying 40 people than we did in a LR because they could fill up at the cheap countries and not bother in more expensive places. 2) we had to take dodgy fuel in a remote part of chad because even with 240 litre capacity, we couldn't go all the way from ndjamena 0 Khartoum on a back route without taking it. Had 10 days of hardwork as it gunged up the fuel system. Ended up needing a new fuel pump. A MAN 4x4 truck came though, looked at some dodgy fuel and just turned it down because they had 1100 litres capacity and could do with out. 3) can carry toys as well - kayaks, rafts, inflatable boats, motorbikes, paragliding rigs, dive gear (even compressors), etc.
Downside - rocking up in a LR or Landcruiser already makes you rich in the eyes of the locals. To rock up in an actionmobil US$500,000 8 wheel conversion puts you in another world. Heard of a guy in Libya who was on a practise run before taking his US$300000 creation to India where he hoped to park up and live in a village and get to know the locals - from his fully inclusive vehicle including plumbed in washing machine, etc. To a certain extent, the compromise must be between extended range, capability and comfort v even more of a target for crime and even more removed from the local populace. Given one of the major enjoyments of travel is meeting the locals, this can be a major impediment.

Speaking as another 101 owner I love them

They are a good compromise between size and carrying capacity and manoverability. Mine also has the added advantage of a diesel engine so is relativly economic aswell. For expedition use the out and out off road prowess is not normally the issue so you can easily compare 101's to Mogs. For someone based in the UK 101's make sense as they go thru on the ferrys as High cars whereas a Mog would be a truck so attracting alot higher ferry costs.

For more info try the mog groups on yahoo groups (www.groups.yahoo.com) - they are very helpfull even to a Landrover owner :-) when I was looking for mog tyres and wheels for my 101

Have you also thought of other 4x4 truck options - Ex British army bedfords are cheap and diesel (and lhd), man trucks from germany or daf 4x4

I will dig out an email address as the guy I bought my tyres from did have a diesel 406 he was selling.

I think the engines are fairly easy to change in a 404 mog for a merc diesel. Remember also that mogs are more complex to work on (on a 404 the gearbox is installed before the body in the factory so its a pig to get to the gearbox)

There is a fully equipped expedition bedford for sale in my home town for 5500 UKP so that shows how cheap they can be



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Rich
LR101 300Tdi Ambi 'Tiggurr'

interesting literature, the mission impossible incident. You don't want to happen that when travelling alone.

I did not sort it out yet, but now that I have my Series back and drove it again, it's a hard choice.

And, thank you Sam for trying to put me back on the right track concerning Mogs and Landies : it started me thinking (again).

Kar El