CRF250 Rally
 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Pwrk49kDCZ0

Another concept while you're waiting for the mythical True Adventure! :innocent:

Quite like the look of that but it still looks like it has a small fuel tank!

Wayne

As much as I like 250s, I cannot fathom why they don't pull out the CRF450X in a production rally guise. It'd probably sell bucket and loads, don't you think?

You mean like this one?
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-w...66394280_n.jpg

Honda (HRC) built the 450 Rally Racer a few years back. Shown above with the Honda Dakar race team riders from a year or two back.

Word is you can buy this bike, but must have racing credentials and race resume'. Cost, IIRC, is around $100,000 USD.

The new 250 Rally shown is a good idea for Honda ... sort of ultimate poser bike. But who cares? It looks the part. Lots of nice "Bling" there. Be interesting to see if it will become a reality. I doubt the engine is anything special, probably stock CRF, suspension probably basic too. A new CRF is about $8500 usd. I'm guessing $12K usd for that Rally.

To keep the bike affordable for mortals Honda will have to limit it ... IMO, a nice effort nonetheless. But the CRF250F motor would not be my choice in any sort of travel/ADV bike. Neither of the Honda 4 strokes (250X or 450X) have been reliable among many friends who have owned (or own) them. I have personal experience with both. Disasters for any sort of serious high mileage ... but GREAT race bikes or local enduro racers/rally bikes.

Yamaha should know their timing and introduce their WR250R in an affordable rally set-up. Great engine, reliable and cool :)

Yes, Yamaha (like Honda) also have a Dakar Race bike to copy from. But the bike I'd rather see from Yamaha is a WR450R. Would not be hard or expensive for Yamaha to produce this bike ... and thousands of fans have begged for a 450 version of the WR250R for years, so buyers waiting.

IMHO, a WR450R with some work & adaptation, could make a good travel/ADV bike. For me personally, I won't pay for a Dakar "look alike" Bling machine. I don't need that, prefer something strong, simple, light and practical for long range travel ... not a pseudo Dakar Wanna Be.

The big four already did exactly this in the 1980's ... Remember? Suzuki DR BIG 800, Yamaha 750 Tenere', Honda Africa Twin/Dominator, KLR650 ... all Dakar inspired and only the KLR made it to the USA.

Agreed - a WR450R would be the ultimate bike for a lot of purposes. I like the rally set-up with extra tanks, nav tower, even longer suspension travel,and whatnot. But then again I like bling :)

Why use a high powered enduro/MX engine to power a RTW machine?
More important to have reliability and low fuel usage.
Just because the Dakar specifies 450 4t thumpers doesn't mean everyone has to use them, better to have a bigger less stressed engine than a small light low oil capacity one.
Oil capacity in the WR is 1.2 litre or so?
600 mile oil changes.
10 hr specified change interval for the small end bearing?

IMO they are tuned for performance not long term reliability but if you fancy one work away.

Despite what CCM have done I agree a 450X or -R would not make a real-world overlander, but a 450L would - and if rally styled then so much the better. I like that look.
As has been said - 1980s Dakar look-alikes were the original 'adventure bikes'. So let's do it all again.

Just saw Honda Argentina have a 'limitada' Rally-styled XRE 300 (pic below). Based on the old air-cooled 250 Tornado, not modern CRF - but now injected.
So they’re getting the picture.

Honda - XRE300 Rally Special Edition

Honda Linha 300
Cant see price in Arg but 16,500 Bz reals for the ABS = 3300 quid.

I actually prefer the older carb Tornado 250 to the CRF: less weight, same power / mpg, better springs.
But never sold worldwide and if anything, being withdrawn here and there in place of the all-conquering CRF.
Noticed they're even calling the new Africa Twin a 'CRF1000L'
So let's hope H start filling the gap between 250 and 1000.

I think you may be mixing up the two versions of the WR Yamaha's. With the WR250 you have the "F" model ... A RACE BIKE. I recently sold my '07.
But Yamaha also sell the WR250R dual sport bike, which has reasonable oil change intervals and very long life.

A totally different bike than the "F" model ... and presumably, if Yamaha did a 450 version of the WR450F ... it too would be a more road worthy, long distance capable machine as the WR250R is. Many WR250R's have done LONG TOURS.

A mildly tuned WR450R dual sport version could make a decent travel bike, but like ANY bike would need serious set up to go long distance with a load.
bier

Yes! An "L" version would be great. We always wondered why Honda never made an "L" version of the XR400 ... at least not in USA. They also never upgraded the XR650L. But the CRF250L gives us hope. Good little bike, eh?

The old XR250R had an "L" version going back to early 90's. Of course the 600/650 had "L" versions too ... XL600R, XL650L ... all street legal dual sports.

If Honda do an "L" version of the CRF450R I would hope for a modern, low maintenance, liquid cooled, F.I. de-tuned version. (to pass EU and EPA regs). I like the Rally look too ... but not keen to pay extra money for non functional bling tact onto a poser bike.

All this may be so much fantasy. After all, we've waited since 1992 for Honda to upgrade the old XR650L ... that's a long run for a model with so many poor engineering choices.

Honda drove a stake through the heart of the entire XR line with the CRF line ... and lost THOUSANDS of loyal customers to KTM because of it. They then shifted production to Brazil and Thailand for the small non race bikes and the rest is history.

Early Honda CRF race bikes were an unmitigated disaster ... took 10 years for Honda to dig their way out of that hole. :oops2:

Always merry and bright! ... lets hope for the best!
bier

Chris

The Hondas XRE 300 are Made in Brazil in their Factory at Manaus, all the XRE 300 are based on the 250 Tornado. Its same engine with +40cc, same frame, shorter suspension but instead of carb, injected and new plastics, also rear disc brake and few things more are updated. Price here are ARG$ 90,000.- (Argentinean Pesos) like 10K U$D at official exchange. Bz reals are in Brazil there are like half the price WOW!!!

Here (in Argentina) the XR Tornado still on sale. Honda says is made here but only are assembled with few argie bolts, most parts still coming from Manaus Factory. I love this bike (had one) but compared with the new 300 the Tornado is slow (from GPS never more than 127,5 km/h with back wind). Have seen a Brazilian traveller with a XRE 300 more than fully loaded that show me his GPS from day before to arrive to BA in Uruguay roads at 141 Km/h (wow???). Price in Argentina of the Tornado, stay very expensive at U$D 6500.-

CRF250L made in Malaysia? from 2014 but new 0Km is possible to find here but I fill ashamed to says at how much…

For small 250s around South America even when I don’t like it is better the Yamahas XTZ250s, in Brazil is call the Lander or they have the new Mini Tenere.
Her frame has thin and weak tubes, wheel rims are in steel and all bike looks like an enlarged 125. But is very economical on fuel (good injected), is faster than the Tornado and cheaper to buy..

The CRF250 Rally looks spectacular very similar to the official 450s that I have seen and touch last Dakar around, the picture from Mollydog is an older model (have to find my pics and video).

I would kill or die for a normal human version of that 450 but for sure the price, and more around here will be only for millionaires kids.

Would love to see a new CRF650L “Dominator” (old NX) updated but simple and cheap but I’m sure never will happen. Like the Tenere 660 but not the latest with ABS.

Caramba! I saw that in an Arg review of the Rally bike and assumed it was a typo.

Perhaps they should rename the Arg peso: ARGH!$

ARGH!$ HAHAHA

It hurts more to us than to visitors, at least you can take the benefits of the “Dollar Blue” (street vs official markets) by now.

I will keep riding my old bikes, all pre-Y2K. Maybe in 10 or 15 years I can buy a well used CRF1000L “Africa Twin”.

I love the Tornado; it's a solid choice for a budget S.Am tour. You can gun them all day and they never complain. I met an Argentinian group of bikers mostly on GS800's but one of them rode the XRE300. He loved it and gave me a go. It felt much lower than the Tornado and smooth to ride though I only drove it a hundred meters or so. Seemed like he kept up just fine with those big twins. The "Falcon" NX400's look great too. Only thing about the XRE would be it had a lot of plastic on it to get smashed up.

To avoid any confusion, the CRF250 Rally concept bike in the original post is built around the CRF250L dual-sport, not the enduro model CRF250X.

It therefore ought to make an excellent rally-styled adventure bike, albeit rather low powered compared to a genuine competition 250 or 450cc machine, but with sweet low maintenance engine and great economy.

The detailing on the show bike (in the video) looks essentially production ready, and I wouldn't be surprised if we see this on sale soon - I imagine Honda are banking on finally winning the Dakar on their factory 450s this coming January, which would be the perfect opportunity to launch this more cooking model in celebration.

Jx

Yes, clearly the L model. I hope they continue on with these replica Dakar bikes win or no. It's a great little bike.

Honda is up against it in the Dakar, so much serious competition. Not just usual KTM & Yamaha power houses ... now we see privateers on Kawasaki and Suzuki bikes. Add in Husqvarna (KTM), Sherco and Beta too!

I've never seen so many truly odd ball antics as in recent Dakar events. Some very poor sportsmanship, cheating (questionable) and God know what other weirdness has gone down.

Happy to see many NEW, young and very fast riders coming up to displace the old guard. Mostly S. Americans. Only 5 Americans, and just a few Brits. Whas' up?

I believe Honda have a lot on their plate ATM, so perhaps this is why no special edition CRF250L Rally bike release? A 450 is the obvious next step.

Question is, why hasn't Yamaha done this when they've done so well selling the WR250R? Isn't a 450 version the obvious next move? :innocent: Tough times for Yamaha me thinks.

If their not careful, Suzuki could trump them both: "all new" DR Big special DRZ450 (based on RMZ450). Stranger things have happened. A project leader from Suzuki Japan promised a "new" DRZ400 back in 2007! :rolleyes2:
Suzuki are broke now, not doing well. (Moto GP costs big money)

Honda are making money in Business Jets. KHI has more money than Honda, Suz and Yam put together ... but won't spend a dime on bikes. (relatively speaking based on their massive holdings) :rofl:

Every thing y ou might need to turn a CRF to a rally bike..

Well except for the $$$$$$$$$$$$doh
[url=http://www.crf.boano.com/index.asp]CRF Boano Parts For Race - serbatoi, paramotori, grafiche, accessori, special parts, rally parts, supermoto parts, CRF Honda

Just saw it at my local Honda dealer. It looks great ! But...


1 - It is stupidly tall (89.5cm seat!)
2 - It is stupidly heavy: almost 150kg wet! For a 250?!
3 -Over £5,300 pounds! Argh!




I guess I will keep with my old, Japanese import, small, light (108kg according to the V5!) and unbreakable XT250.


The only bike that has suffered no damage at all in my "delicate" hands over 3 months travel across Russia and the "Stans"! That says something :D

ehm, that's actually not very high at all.

Ok I will come clean... I am a hobbit!

wonder who is honda marketing this "rally" bike to...

Honda's new Rally version of the CRF250L will do well IMO, will be marketed to the ever expanding Dual Sport segment.

Lots of older former Sport bike or big adventure bike riders may pick up on this new Honda.

It's linked aesthetically and design wise to the all new Honda Africa Twin and Honda's "real" Dakar race CRF450RR.
The little 250 is just a Dakar "look a like" replica so to speak, but will fill a gap for some riders and certainly looks the part.

IMO, it's a GREAT looking bike ... but the excess weight of this new bike knocks if off the radar for me, but will suit many others. Perfect for commuters, students, weekend warriors and more.

Honda will continue to produce the CRF250's in Thailand and profits should be high based on lower production costs in Thailand vs. Japan.

Interestingly, so far I have seen NO ad campaigns here in USA for this new CRF Rally version. This bike will have to be aggressively marketed to be a success IMO.

So far, no ads in magazines that I've seen. Mistake.
But then, NONE of the Japanese companies are doing much advertising in the Dual sport segment save for the new Honda Africa Twin.
Perhaps we'll see a similar campaign for this new Rally version of the CRF.

Meanwhile both KTM and BMW continue to push hard with great ad campaigns.

The Yamaha WR250R continues to pull away from Honda's CRF in popularity with more and more riders switching over and more and more riders dropping down from big GS's, KTM's and such to ride a smaller, more fun ... and cheaper bike.

Call it a poser bike or whatever but fact is ... it will sell well if Honda make the effort and get behind it. bier

that's very true, Dakar is no longer what it used to be. Only money and sponsorship count theses days, no honor no sportsmanship. Sad. :(

Crf500l
 

What I find fascinating is reading back threads like this which is well over two years old now and peoples comments and views on what they want and desire from a manufacturer and as the paying customer the companies should listen and act. BUT they never do, do they..!! I may be pointing out the stupidly obvious here but really..!!


I have found so many Honda related threads in this last week purely because of the intended project I'm about to undertake. For quite a number of years now folk have been pondering why not only Honda but the others as well have not bought out a mid sized dual sport machine. If there ears were real instead of painted on then they could of coined in huge sums of revenue from this massive gap in the buyers market, afterall surely that's why they make machines in the first place, to make money..??!!!!


Anyway, sod them all, i'm building my own mid ranger and fun will be had when its finished...!!

IMO, outside our adv echo chamber I think Honda know exactly what they're doing with the 250L Rally bike: flash for the kids but not especially all-road functional as built to a price.
The largely converse alternative: CCM GP450 - has been discontinued.

Just as with SUVs, actual use of these types of bikes for overland travel is minimal.
But luckily for us, the trend's popularity has given us masses of online know-how and gear, etc to convert whatever you got into a useful travel bike.
Everything except, perhaps, a light, modern Jap single between 4-500cc which isn't a dirt racer.
Maybe the Chinese may get there first.

You mean something like this? Thread on ABR. Looks great.

Crf500l
 

That's Scutty's one there, yes indeed not exactly like that but almost. I want twin cans on mine though....

Wow - wow thats something I have had wet dreams about....:thumbup1:

Wish Honda could make something like that...

I've never ridden a CB500X, so no idea what bikes like nor the character of engine. Jenny says it's silky smooth with enough power. OK. But it's no feather weight engine I'd guess.

Fantastic build by Skutty though ... inspiring. Serious innovation and skills. Hope he is able to make good use of it ... and get out of the UK for some exploring.

Agree regards Honda. The 250L Rally should do well world wide, helps that it's linked to Dakar Racer. Honda could easily do a 450 version of the CRF250L but like with the Yamaha, 450's would not sell well in Asia and other world markets Honda is targeting: Too expensive, taxed heavily and for USA ? Our market is too small to justify the investment. It's a no go AFAIK.

And YES, the Chinese may get there first (if paying attention) and bring in some great bikes within the magic 300cc - 450cc range.

In that range, I'm very impressed by the new BMW G310 GS. I may have to blag a test ride on one soon. If they can keep costs reasonable ... it should do well ... at least here in pricey San Francisco Bay area.

Let me come back to this conversation after a few years, as it is about the Suzuki DR BIG 800. I think this bike has aged well since its inception, still responsive, rideable, and pretty good looking. I don't know if it's a bike you can use for a winter trip. For example, I regularly go to cool places in Europe. I went to the Alps, and I wonder if this kind of bike could be really safe (I would like to have it for nostalgia, my father had one in the past) What do you think about it? I was looking for 2000's clothes last time, and I came across this y2k shop when I wanted to get a biker jacket. Otherwise, I found some nice accessories to complete my bike, I find that the y2k decoration gives a little extra :scooter:

Unfortunately it seems as our mate is not with us anymore…..

https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hu...oriarity-97549

Gosh, I'm so uncomfortable... May God forgive him