Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB

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-   -   Budget Overland Vehicle Choice (UK) (https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/equipping-the-overland-vehicle/budget-overland-vehicle-choice-uk-73950)

TheWarden 7 Jan 2014 19:29

have a look on that forum for buying advice, they know a lot more than me :). There are potential issues with cooling systems mostly on autos, easily prevented with simple checks on the system and maybe a new rad.

Although I have had trouble with my LC the only maintenance parts have been 2 new rear shocks and a 2nd hand alternator.

For you power supplies look at getting 12v car chargers for the laptop and cameras, much easier and more efficient than inverters. They do come with twin batteries but for long travel a proper split charge system might be better than my cheap isolators

JacobJames 7 Jan 2014 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWarden (Post 449500)
have a look on that forum for buying advice, they know a lot more than me :). There are potential issues with cooling systems mostly on autos, easily prevented with simple checks on the system and maybe a new rad.

Although I have had trouble with my LC the only maintenance parts have been 2 new rear shocks and a 2nd hand alternator.

For you power supplies look at getting 12v car chargers for the laptop and cameras, much easier and more efficient that inverters. They do come with twin batteries but for long travel a proper split charge system might be better than my cheap isolators

Thanks again mate, I think you may have swung it :thumbup1: As an aside, what was the approx total build cost for your colorado including everything to get it up to scratch?

TheWarden 7 Jan 2014 21:52

the truck cost me £5k with 5 new BFG AT Tyres in 2011 (I then sold it and bought it back for £1300 less lol)

The platform/storage about £100 for mdf and screws carpet etc, £10 on window tint, £50 on a cb, £70 for a leisure battery, £10 for battery isolators and maybe £150 in spares for the truck.

All in under £6k based on the original purchase.

From my thread linked above you'll have read about the trouble I had with the rear axle (worth checking these as the brackets rust). I had the axle repaired in Morocco to get me home and then done properly back here last summer. This cost about £300 but I got all the mounting points on the axle strengthened so should last the truck another 170k miles

JacobJames 7 Jan 2014 22:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWarden (Post 449519)
the truck cost me £5k with 5 new BFG AT Tyres in 2011 (I then sold it and bought it back for £1300 less lol)

The platform/storage about £100 for mdf and screws carpet etc, £10 on window tint, £50 on a cb, £70 for a leisure battery, £10 for battery isolators and maybe £150 in spares for the truck.

All in under £6k based on the original purchase.

From my thread linked above you'll have read about the trouble I had with the rear axle (worth checking these as the brackets rust). I had the axle repaired in Morocco to get me home and then done properly back here last summer. This cost about £300 but I got all the mounting points on the axle strengthened so should last the truck another 170k miles

Thanks again, seems like my budget is definitely doable then for a car like yours :thumbup1: Especially if I can source a bargain solid base vehicle.

moggy 1968 8 Jan 2014 01:39

Sorry, just read this back and it became a rather long post!!

you budget is definitely doable.

You absolutely do not need to spend thousands on preparation, a good base vehicle could easily tackle the trip stock, don't be lured by all those articles in the off road press telling you about all the expensive kit you need!!

have a look at post 14 here
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...277#post447817


I bought an old Toyota Landcruiser H60 for travelling, a good one would be within budget but they are getting old and thin on the ground now so would be tricky to find a good one, but they do come up occasionally. That budget would get you a shabby 80 series, but most haven't been abused so the damage would be mostly cosmetic and they don't rust like the 60s do/did. The prado is ok, but not as tough, but it really depends just what your intentions are, most of the world is accessible in a suitable 2wd car these days!

Hilux's are now going for silly money, getting a good one for that budget would be tricky, a surf is the next best thing but be aware that some models are prone to blown cylinder head gaskets and cracked blocks. hpoc.co.uk is a good source of info for surfs even though ostensibly it's for Hilux owners.

A cheap landrover is a contradiction in terms! One that is cheap to buy is cheap for a good reason and although parts are cheap and plentiful they can turn into a financial bottomless pit. Better to spend a bit of money in the first place and get one that has been well looked after and not caned off road. TD5s can look a good buy compared to a 300tdi, but that's because they aren't suitable for this kind of thing and, IMHO are a terrible engine. When you handle Toyota parts, you see why they are a lot more expensive than landrover ones!

I know you have modified it now but, looking at your original list:

Upgraded shocks/springs for weight
If you need these travelling alone, your carrying too much weight. Generally, standard is best and more than capable of doing the job. Fit standard new ones. Heavier duty springs and shocks can cause other components to fail such as your chassis! A blown shock is easier to replace than repairing your chassis that's broken in half! Even vastly overloading 2 H60s with donated school books and our own kit/spares etc standard was fine. The general concensus seems to be, if a component is going to fail, it will be a non standard one. Carrying too much weight puts significant additional strain on all components of the vehicle, not just springs and shocks, for example engine and drivetrain. treat the disease, not the symptoms, reduce the weight!!
Roof rack
If your travelling alone you don't need a roofrack. If you do your carrying too much kit!! The only thing I use a roofrack for is fuel. Although that puts the weight up high which isn't ideal it keeps the fumes out of the truck. Halfords came to the rescue with a heavy duty ladder rack for about £100 rather than the £1000+ you'll pay for a proper rack, although keep your eyes open and you may get a second hand bargain. I recently sold a good solid steel expedition rack for 50 quid on ebay!
Roof Tent
Roof tents are expensive, and will muller your fuel consumption. I have always used a ground tent with no problems and it offers greater flexibility. If you are going to be travelling alone you could rig up a sleeping system in the rear of the vehicle for when you need/want a bit more security.
Side awning
not essential, take a tarpaulin if you think you might need something, but I've never needed one. An old tarp is useful anyway though for using as a groundsheet for working on the vehicle etc, you could use an old army poncho or 'basha'
Safari Snorkel
not needed, just tap out your airfilter regularly and carry a spare!
GPS device
I'm only just getting the hang of my tablet, but they are probably more flexible than a GPS, and can be cheaper for the 7 inch versions.
Dual Battery System
Don't bother with a split charge system. Make sure you have a good battery to start with and, if you intend to travel alone, maybe take a solar charger for if you accidentally flatten it. It just means you'll be parked for a day charging the batteries!! even if you are alone, take some jump leads, someone will probably be around!
Rock sliders
not needed, vehicle preservation is the name of the game in expedition driving, it's not a challenge event!!
Front bull bar + Spots t
there is complex legislation around the purchase, fitting and use of bull bars in the uk (I don't know where you are based) and they aren't really necessary, and can increase the damage to your vehicle rather than reduce it. Having said that, I am fitting an ARB winch bar to my truck after hitting a cow in Africa!! (if you fit a winch bar, you have to fit a winch to make it legal BTW but a winch is rarely needed!! Educate yourself in the art of self recovery instead!)
Diff guards
As above, not needed on most 4x4s if you drive carefully, although some areas can be quite rocky so if you have the money and you can get them for your particular vehicle maybe, but I never have
2 x spare wheels
I do carry 2. Also, use steel wheels. You might get away with one spare wheel and an extra tyre. It depends on the vehicle though. If you are taking a standard car I would definitely take 2 spares. You wouldn't believe how many wheels you can break on tarmac African roads!! To that end, don't use low profile tyres either, fit a nice tall tyre (that also gives you better options for airing down). Those 33 inch swampers may look great in Tesco's car park, but will be a lot harder to find out in the boonies than a 7.50x16 if you rip a sidewall!!
Fridge?
A fridge is a (expensive) luxury, not a necessity. If your shooting digital you don't need to keep film cool. Bottles of water wrapped in a wet towel stay surprisingly cool, and I found my el cheapo Halfords coolbox was adequate!!

Extra Fuel & Water would be in jerrycans or similar rather than a dedicated extra tank (again to save £)
DIY storage/draw system (could be built in by my dad)
Storage is one thing I would like to do better. I inend to go for a wood rack with plastic boxes mounted on it. Drawer systems are horrifically expensive and difficult to do well for a decent price if you DiY. bottled water is widely available. I just carry 20ltrs spare in an ex army black water jerrycan for emergencies


Spend the money on a good base vehicle, then get it thoroughly checked over and serviced by yourself if you can (which will help you get to know the vehicle) or by someone you trust and get good wheels/tyres. get some waffle boards, a good shovel and some decent recovery ropes/straps. If the vehicle can use a hilift then get one, an airbag jack can be handy.

Good preparation isn't about buying lot's of goodies, it's about making sure your vehicle is in the best possible condition for the trip ahead.

Read.
Chris Scotts Overland Handbook is a mine of information and is particularly good on budget vehicle choice and preparation. Me Dad and the Plymouth Dakar is a good read on antipreperation! (but it's my book so I'm biased!). Roaming Yak has also done some good stuff travelling extensively in a beat up old landy.

Read the tales of people who have done a similar thing, avoid the ones by people who have sold up or rented out their house, quit their job in the city and spent a fortune because it will just make you believe you need all that rubbish as well!!

finally, don't lose sight of the end goal when prepping for the trip. Youthfull enthusiasm will overcome any adversity or obstacles! Some people become so involved in the prep that it becomes the goal and they end up never actually going on a trip!

JacobJames 8 Jan 2014 07:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by moggy 1968 (Post 449540)
Sorry, just read this back and it became a rather long post!!

you budget is definitely doable....finally, don't lose sight of the end goal when prepping for the trip. Youthfull enthusiasm will overcome any adversity or obstacles! Some people become so involved in the prep that it becomes the goal and they end up never actually going on a trip!


Thanks for all the incredible detail and information! I really appreciate the time you have spent going into it for me! Can I just ask you a couple of points:

1) How much extra fuel/water is necessary for a stock trip?

2) Without a dual battery set-up what would be the best way to charge all my gear such as my laptop?

3) If I was to travel with a roof rack, what would be the best way to carry a 6th wheel?

Thanks in advance

Jake


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TheWarden 8 Jan 2014 10:58

Some good advice from Moggy :0

I normally carry 40l spare fuel which is about half a tank. This gives me a range of easily 600KM before fuel gets to the point where I think I need to find some more. In reality I'll get over 700km range. I also carry 20l of emergency water supplies which is only for emergency situation. Day to Day water is separate.

IMHO twin batteries would be the best way forward, whether it's with a fancy split charge system or not. This would allow you to disconnect one battery when camped so you can always start the truck and then use the 2nd to charge your laptops etc.

2 spare wheels, a lot of different opinions on this, but if you carry a 2nd spare on the roof think about how you will get this on and off the roof rack safely on your own they, are very heavy. Maybe take a 2nd spare tyre rather than a full 2nd wheel and tyre combo

JacobJames 8 Jan 2014 11:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWarden (Post 449571)
Some good advice from Moggy :0

I normally carry 40l spare fuel which is about half a tank. This gives me a range of easily 600KM before fuel gets to the point where I think I need to find some more. In reality I'll get over 700km range. I also carry 20l of emergency water supplies which is only for emergency situation. Day to Day water is separate.

IMHO twin batteries would be teh best way forward, whether it's with a fnacy split charge system or not. This would allow you to disconnect one battery when camped so you can always start the truck and then use the 2nd to charge your laptops etc.

2 spare wheels, a lot of different opinions on this, but if you carry a 2nd spare on the roof think about how you will get this on and off the roof rack safely on your own they, are very heavy. Maybe take a 2nd spare tyre rather than a full 2nd wheel and tyre combo

Thanks mate, I was thinking 40-60L should take me a pretty long way without refilling so that's good to hear I was on the right track.

I will definitely be doing a multiple battery set-up, just trying to find out the best solution which would allow me to work remotely for a couple of days at a time :thumbup1:

I'm also thinking a 6th tyre rather than a 6th wheel might be the best idea, I just may end up with a tyre change in the middle of the day in a worst case scenario (which won't be fun but hopefully not too regular) :thumbdown:

Surfy 8 Jan 2014 14:26

Start with new good tyres and carry just one spare. Take a tyre repairkit and a small aircompressor instead of a complete 6st tyre.. To saving weight looks like the most important point!

Steel rim or aluminum rims - dont care about. Take that what the car comes with.

You go travelling, not abusing your car. For shure they have to be legal for your car and rated for your travel weight. I had also aluminum rims in africa.

Also look at this topic: The top 7 overland equipement

http://english.4x4tripping.com/2014/...-4x4.html#more

These lists are very individual, but helpful. Many blogging travellers have their own list online. I strongly suggest to do a little research :-) Mostly the people write too why they was important, what will help you to decide if it is too that important for you.

I had no camping experience in the last 20years as i start my buildup and bought my equipement in 2011 for crossing africa.

I did mostly just learn from the blog of other travellers, what they did like or not like on their eqipment. I spent much time for - but at the end our setup just works well for your plans.

Surfy

JacobJames 8 Jan 2014 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Surfy (Post 449599)
Start with new good tyres and carry just one spare. Take a tyre repairkit and a small aircompressor instead of a complete 6st tyre.. To saving weight looks like the most important point!

Steel rim or aluminum rims - dont care about. Take that what the car comes with.

You go travelling, not abusing your car. For shure they have to be legal for your car and rated for your travel weight. I had also aluminum rims in africa.

Also look at this topic: The top 7 overland equipement

http://english.4x4tripping.com/2014/...-4x4.html#more

These lists are very individual, but helpful. Many blogging travellers have their own list online. I strongly suggest to do a little research :-) Mostly the people write too why they was important, what will help you to decide if it is too that important for you.

Surfy


Thanks Surfy, appreciate the advice mate and will check out the link now


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moggy 1968 8 Jan 2014 14:30

lap tops don't pull a lot of power so not too much of a problem parked up for the evening. How about one of those rechargeable power pack things? charge it up in the daytime and use it for your night time supply? Your unlikely to discharge your main vehicle battery using your laptop in the evening but power useage is easy enough to calculate. You can also get a solar charger for laptops, phones etc. If you want to power a laptop off the car a suitable DC lead or inverter will be needed.

I have carried spare wheels on the roof and also in the vehicle. Unless your using split rims or something it's not too much of a drama. A lot depends on the size a type of vehicle. Split rims are heavy, car wheels aren't. It's unlikely you'll break a split rim, it's very likely you'll damage a car wheel. Don't underestimate how difficult it is to change a tyre in the field! Don't assume a tyre will be repairable, I suffered irrepairable damage to 2 tyres on the way back from the Gambia. I was glad I had 2 spares and finding a replacement, even in 7.50x16 was difficult in Mauritania. Our second vehicle also managed to bend a steel rim. An alloy wheel would have probably broken, but being steel we were able to hammer it back into shape.

fuel is dependent on the vehicle. where you are going, your range etc etc. I generally aim to carry enough to get me between expected fill ups +50%. Once the tank reaches half full I start thinking about topping up.

JacobJames 8 Jan 2014 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by moggy 1968 (Post 449601)
lap tops don't pull a lot of power so not too much of a problem parked up for the evening. How about one of those rechargeable power pack things? charge it up in the daytime and use it for your night time supply? Your unlikely to discharge your main vehicle battery using your laptop in the evening but power useage is easy enough to calculate.

I have carried spare wheels on the roof and also in the vehicle. Unless your using split rims or something it's not too much of a drama. A lot depends on the size a type of vehicle. Split rims are heavy, car wheels aren't. It's unlikely you'll break a split rim, it's very likely you'll damage a car wheel. Don't underestimate how difficult it is to change a tyre in the field!

fuel is dependent on the vehicle. where you are going, your range etc etc. I generally aim to carry enough to get me between expected fill ups +50%. Once the tank reaches half full I start thinking about topping up.


Thanks again mate, it seems I have a couple of calculations to do with regards to power usage and fuel consumption to work out what I'm going to need to carry.

The information in this thread has been stellar so far so thanks to everyone who has contributed!


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tacr2man 8 Jan 2014 19:35

twin batteries are easy to set up, all you need are a couple of HD cables, and a hella or other cut off switch , the switch is used to separate the batteries when not driving/charging . You wire the aux battery to run anything that you need when parked , that stops your start battery from getting flattened.
It also gives you an instant jump start if your main battery dies or goes flat . In 40+ years Ive never had both discharged at same time . You just need to get a routine that you switch together as soon as started , and separate as soon as stopped . If you want a bit more sophistication , you can fit a relay that joins them via a fused wire for charging when ign live. HTSH

JacobJames 8 Jan 2014 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by tacr2man (Post 449620)
twin batteries are easy to set up, all you need are a couple of HD cables, and a hella or other cut off switch , the switch is used to separate the batteries when not driving/charging . You wire the aux battery to run anything that you need when parked , that stops your start battery from getting flattened.
It also gives you an instant jump start if your main battery dies or goes flat . In 40+ years Ive never had both discharged at same time . You just need to get a routine that you switch together as soon as started , and separate as soon as stopped . If you want a bit more sophistication , you can fit a relay that joins them via a fused wire for charging when ign live. HTSH


Thanks for the info mate, I just need to tot up the total consumption for all my camera gear and electronics now!
A

moggy 1968 10 Jan 2014 00:36

so, you have probably realised now, there are as many solutions as travellers out there!!

ultimately, it depends what works for you. read a lot, try and draw out what may be useful and ditch the rest, then...................travel, do some little shake down trips because I guarantee you, what you think will work won't be right first time and it will evolve and change over time.


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