|
4x4 vehicle with another motor
i'm interesting in building my own vehicle for overland trip (maybe RTW). It need to have strong and reliable diesel motor and have carrying capacity 1-1.5 tones. I heard that one guy built lada niva with mercedes 220D diesel motor. I was thinking to put diesel motor from mercedes 250 TD with 147 HP ih 4x4 like Mitsubishi Pajero 85' (long), Nissan Patrol 87' long, Defender 110, Land Cruiser. Built large tank.. about 400L, tent on roof and things like that.Do anyone have any idea or experience how to make work mercedes motor with 4x4 gearbox and transmission sistem. Thanks on any suggestions
|
why bother? I'm sure it possible one way or another but it'll cost you more in parts and time then buying a 4x4 that already has a decent motor.
Most brands (Toyota, Nissan, Land Rover, ...) have perfectly reliable strong engines that are actually build to be in those cars. |
2CVFred,
I could be wrong but it looks to me like the build might be half the fun for the above! http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/ubb/smile.gif And fair play to him! matt |
Mgagro,
As mat said,if it's the challange of doing the conversion you want then go for it! I'm not completely sure but i'd have a good guess that a 4wd gearbox from a Merc GE wagen would fit the motor,but quite where you go from there as far as propshafts,etc are concerned....well you'll have to find out! An easier way if you really love the Merc engines is just to get a complete GE wagen.Job done.The running gear on these is all made by ZF and is very very strong,and i think most models have difflocks on all 3 differentials(all the ones i've serviced have anyway).The downside is they're terribly heavy.... As 2cvfred said,personally i'd stick to something thats already had $ millions spent on testing by the factory,and save the money of a conversion for your trip. Best of luck anyway! ------------------ Just going for a short ride on my bike.... |
I said Mercedes because i know that theirs engines are reliable... they are spinning for over 500 000 km without any "big" repairs, have fuel consumption about 5-6 L/100 KM (in 4x4 that will be little more). I was thinking in tanking large tanks for little price and save more money with that. If you said that will be hard and expensive what you suggest for me. I need: light wehicle like new defender (about 1200-1400 kg), large loading space, strong roof that can be loaded with 150kg, be good off-roader, reilable and strong (100-130) disel motor with little electronics and need to spinning for over 150 000 km without touching a machine. I think the new 110 Defender is sth i need but it cost >19 000 euro (5 years old) and i dont have that money.... for me is better take sth old fix that (like general reparation on machine, new transmission parts if needed), do body and then i know what i'm driveing... you know what i mean
btw i can do body myselfe and have mechanic who do me reparation for free so i need to pay only new parts tnx |
I once put a perkins phazer (4l turbo diesel) into a Land Rover 110. It drove like a beast, but i would not do it again, too much stress, and if i costed my time it would probaly be the most expensive landrover ever built!
Good luck. |
You could get an excellent 110 or LC, with a similarily performing engine with change from 8k euro 'ready to travel'. Or you could buy good one to fix up for less than half that.
Those big ugly toyota lumps go on for 400k miles without much worry (apparently). There's one for sale on the site. Still, a merc-engined 110 - could be cool... [This message has been edited by Richard K (edited 01 September 2005).] |
So... what did you suggest... maybe put new 2.5 TD from new defender into old one like III series 110? How new turbo disels react on bad fuel from third world countries? How much is fuel consumption of toyota's 4.2 disel engine in LC? I saw that peoples travel with pick-up's like hilux and vehicles like that. Can one pick-up like hilux be compared with one LR 110 on sand and havey terrain? I havn't any experience with that so any help will be good
Tnx |
Quote:
------------------ Cheers, Julian Euro Landcruiser Owners Club http://www.landcruisers.info/lists/ |
Most of the time, diesel is of good enough quality. At least if you choose to get fuell at branded stations whenever possible.
There's more chances of getting a good overlanding vehicle together if you buy a standard vehicle. Second hand there are good deals to be done on older Nissan Patrols and Landrover Discovery's. The Nissan probably being technically more robust, the LR better of road. There are loads of high-luxes driving around in Africa. I don't think it's the coolest Car, but it cerainly does the job. Overlanding very seldom is about extreme off roading as you tend to see in magazines. Reasonable off road capabillities and robustness is what you're after, not extreme off road capabillities. |
That's what i need...capability and robust off- road vehicle... i know what you mean with extreme off roading and magazines..thats not it!
I saw on page.. http://www.elphick-pooley.co.uk/htm/index.htm ..this guy travel with Toyota 4Runner but 90% of traveling was on road.. stueydo daid that ne put 4L TD in LR 110 and that caused him much stress...why.. i think its not big problem to put another motor and all another components that belong to that motor (cooler and others)..its true that it takes some time but its worth it Here in Croatia its hard to find old 2nd Defender in good condition for low price.. i look sth on www.mobile.de but i can't bring in Croatia defender older than 8 years and younger Defenders cost too much. Than its easyer to find defender, patrol or landcruiser older then 15 years for less then 3000eur and find motor from mercedes for 1000eur and for 5000eur i'll get sth i need.. |
Dear mgagro,
You can obviously match anything with everything and make it run. The question is for how long? For weekend off-roading it doesn't matter if something breaks down - you just put your not-so-successful vehicular creation on tow and go home to sulk. When you are on a trip in the middle of nowhere you don't want suddenly to find out that despite all the effort you put in it your project is not working exactly as you expected. This is why you won't find many cars as you described above in places where mechanical reliability is more important than engineering ingenuity. The fact that your project can be build for less money than a proper vehicle doesn't matter really - when it breaks down you'll spend a lot more money on recovery and fixing it than you have saved by avoiding a car properly built and tested by the manufacturer. Good luck with your project - you may need it! ------------------ Roman (UK) www.overlandcruiser.info |
2nth hand defenders are expensive about everywhere. A 200Tdi def with 150K on will catch like 10 000€, a similar disco or classic range will go for 5000 or so in Belgium (and they are pretty much the same car, but with comfort). Patrols can also be found cheap. There was a 200tdi engine for sale for 1800€ on the belgian landrover forum, that can be fitted in an elderly 110 but then, I still believe your better of just buying a disco, RR or patrol and go from there.
And why the 4L conversions go wrong... The LR gearbox is not built for a 4l diesel, and down the line, there are the diffs and half shafts that don't like all this torque. [This message has been edited by Robbert (edited 03 September 2005).] |
Robbert and I spent some time in Africa accompanying a series LR with a Ford Transit engine last year, I don't recall any transmission problems.
Chassis was shot though I think they got to know EVERY welding shop on the route!!! My suggestion to Mgagro: when you're ready to set off, buy a small hatchback in Croatia, load it up as you would, drive to Germany, France etc. and pick up an old 4x4. (there are plenty around, for ex. I believe Matt Savage is trying to sell a HDJ80 at the moment, which are a great overlander) You can transfer all your gear and discover that the vehicle is wonderfully lightly laden!! (even set off with just a rucksack) My experience of packing the vehicle at home is that you always put in more than you need; unless you're disciplined like Gipper who travels well light (apart from his GF's make-up kit ;-) You could get your carnet in the country of purchase, and not have to fart around with Croatian import regs. It's also possible that some of the overlanding accessories are more easily available further west in Europe. Good luck whatever you choose to do |
Yep,
That was a transit engine, not a 4L diesel. And the engine conversion was reasonably well done. but... Chasis was shot, brand new springs ruind in no time because someone moved a springhanger in the wrong place somewhen during the last 30 year, ruind springs ruind the polybushes that would last for half a century, and the timingbelt snapped in Gabon because someone thought he'd save some money not changing the tensionner. Unfortunatly, there are no fords in Gabon, so parts had to come from GBR, which inludes passing Gabonese customs... And then, there's a lot of engergy you need to enjoy the trip going into sorrow. |
Didn't know about the belt, Rob's right; sometimes you save time and stress (not to mention money) by doing a bit more before you go; even though most of the preparation is overkill (I make the distinction between overlanding and playing around on a fast week's break in the desert/tundra/mud etc.)
I had my engine rebuilt before setting off even though the specialist said it wasn't necessary, and had a mechanically cool trip. Mgagro, whatever engine you end up with, make sure its timing is mechanism is turned by a chain; it's noisier but copes much better with dust and crap, because it's inside the engine! |
to Luke...
i was already thinking about buying old 4x4 in Germany (maybe RR Classic with 3.5L petrol engine and put 200 or 300 TDI motor inside). I saw RR Classic on www.mobile.de for 1500-2500 Eur) BUT what with papers.. i can't bring RR in Croatia and drive it weith Cro regs because is older than 7 years and second problem is if i drive it with Germans regs (with international driving licence) that can bring me big problems on boardes and police patrols..like stolen car and sth like that) Do anyone know how registrate car for 3-4 years in Germany? |
"Right, last chance.
£4000. Buy now or it goes in auto trader next week. I'll even throw in a free packet of Maryland cookies (unopened!). Cheers, Matt" Mgaro -- why not buy Matt's LC and keep it registered in the UK? Cheaper than buying an old rangie + a TDI lump and (probably) a lot more reliable - if uglier. Plus, think of all that extra time you can spend on the road... (Keep It Simple) ; ) |
Seems like a reasonable deal, the cookies are the clincher.
80's are still in the 15000 euro range here in France, just bad timing for me; expanding family means my 2 berth Iveco camper's going to have to go next year and a good chunky 80 would have a been nice replacement. Mgagro, I have to agree with richard; take a break in the UK, buy Matt's car, he'll help you get it ready (probably) and drive off into the horizon... As long as the reg papers have the same name as your ID papers the borders are no problem. The auto box (lovely!) means that it's not difficult to learn to drive RHD (I prefer RHD, even in France) and parts for the 80 are pretty globally available. Good luck Hey Matt, I deserve one of those cookies for that plug :-) |
Just one consideration with RHD.
They are illegal in Nigeria (and I think Gambia too). You can talk youselve out of it most of te time, but maybe not always... . better to sell in SA though |
i think that is inposible...
"..As long as the reg papers have the same name as your ID papers the borders are no problem.." I can't just go to UK..buy there 4x4 and change papers on my name (it's inposible because i 'm not living in UK)... i was thinking that one my friend in GER buy 4x4 for himself (i give him a money but car is on his name and he give it to me to use it...car is his but i'm driving it with international driving licence) Btw i don't need cam now...maybe for 2 years...now i makeing calculations and others preparations |
As long as you have a friend whose address you can give, it's OK.
I haven't lived in the UK for 5 years, my camper is still registered there, and each time the licensing authority sends something to the registered address my dad scans it and sends me an e-mail so I can deal with it. (Id doesn't have to be family as long as they're reliable). That can easily go for most countries, although in France the licensing authorities ask for a utilities bill, d'oh! RHD in other countries, to clarify Rob's statement; they're not illegal to transit the country as a tourist, just to sell. A carnet is the best way of convincing customs that you don't want to sell in their country... It's something you're going to have fun mulling over in the next two years, by which time oil prices will be even more stupid and Emperor George will be bombing the Inca ruins because they represent a threat to global security, or because Babs has PMT... |
Well Luke,
It appears that for Nigeria, RHD cars are illegal on the road (i.e. including transit). The carnet is impressive enough to convice road police though, and customs don't really care. The same is trough for Aux lights and tinted glass... |
Yes Luke you was living and they still have you in computers (countries ar not conected) so if car was on your name once you can came every year and pay registration and stuff (or your dad can do that for you)...but they didn't have my name in comp....thats problem...so i have to do that on way i was talking about... "ilegaly" but who will know :-)
|
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:22. |