|
Land rover defender or Toyota land cruiser for Africa?
Apologies in advance if this question has been asked before!
Hello everyone! I'm new to the forum and this is my first post. I'm planning an overland trip through Africa and am still trying to figure out what vehicle to have. I've narrowed it down to Land-rover Defender or Toyota landcruiser Can anyone give any helpful advice or opinions on which is best? Thanks africaman |
This will start an argument, so I'll get the first punch in.
If you like Land Rovers specifically, like fettling with low-tech engineering and can live with the gearbox / engine problems that the various models are prone to, go for a Land Rover. If you want something that is unlikely to break down, is found in very nearly every country, and is altogether better engineered and more refined, go for a Toyota. |
troopy or 70 series
maybe 79 series with alu-cab good luck kp |
heart vs mind
Hi,
If I decide with my heart I would again choose the Defender (like the one I'm traveling with through Africa now). If I decide with my mind it would be a recent Toyota Bush Taxi. Happy travels, Gee |
If I decide with my body/soul/mind/wallet/desire for proven reliability etc etc
There can be only one- The Toyota Hilux- Anyone who says any different is entitled to their wrong opinion!!!! :Beach: Lock 'n load! |
Quote:
Do you travel with a Hilux?? |
Have you any experience of either ?, or any other 4x4 for that matter ?
If not then its mostly down to personal preference , all have pos and neg , and how important each of these is will decide which one you plump for . I am a Landrover person , but that doesnt mean a land cruiser is rubbish . A defender or cruiser take your pick , a hilux isnt in same area . Which ever you decide needs to be diesel , and neither will walk on water, also dont think that you can take the kitchen sink , as the heavier it gets the more problems you will have. The biggest factor for reliability is its previous life , and how well it was serviced and maintained . In both makes you dont want the latest , as the more modern you get the less suited they are for remote travel , to the point that EU emission vehicles may need modification to even run on 3rd world diesel. HTSH |
Quote:
Even rigged with a hot shower heated up from engine- Life's a :Beach: One recommendation is to feed it clean diesel- a Mr Filter helps keep the crud and the water out from some supplies... Modern common rail Toyos are sensitive to and do not like debris-filled fuel-! (bring your own water and cough up 3 euro if you want a hot shower ! ):blushing: |
Quote:
|
Much as I like Land Rovers, the Defender is cobbled together with poor build quality, weak running gear and chassis' that should have been galvanised from new instead of rotting badly like they do. As mentioned, if you like fixing and tinkering with things, the Land Rovers will do it, if not buy a Toyota.
Also which market (country) are you buying and preparing a vehicle in ? if you are in the UK, Defender parts are pretty cheap, I wouldn't bother trying to build a Defender in North America as parts here are bloody expensive. |
Thanks for the info and opinions guys, keep 'em coming!
I LOVE the Toyota Hilux, always have, I had one back when I lived in Kenya and would love to get one for when I'm more settled. But I didn't think it was the right choice for this kind of trip, perhaps I should reconsider it in the runnings. . . . I wasn't planning on getting a new model, older models are better to find spare parts for and besides, the older they are the better they look. I've driven both vehicles but don't have a massive amount of experience with either, most of my experience was with the Hilux, so I know Toyotas more than the Landy's. Am hoping to get the vehicle in South Africa rather than UK. Last time I checked it was a little cheaper out there and they're already kitted out for off road travel. But I haven't looked into the red tape of buying one in SA yet. My feelings right now are that I'm leaning more towards Toyota. I'm no mechanic, and although I'll be brushing up on my mechanical knowledge before I leave ideally I want a vehicle that is mechanically sound as possible! I'll have to be really picky when I purchase, make sure it's an older model, but not an overused vehicle. Thanks again people! |
If you want to go on an expedition, take a landrover, if you want to come back again, take a Toyota!:thumbup1:
Toyota parts are eyewateringly expensive compared to Landrover, but then, you'll need less of them! a good 80 series TLC is probably the best buy in the UK, a 70 series elswhere. Landrover is probably only worth thinking about in the UK because of the massive number of specialists and aftermarket bits available. 200 or 300tdi is the only landie worth considering IMHO. A lot of Toyota drivers have had landies in the past (me included). very few go back to the landie. |
To drive an well maintained car, to drive at a weight who the car is designed for too the suspension is designed for, looks like the more important part than the brand itself.
Any well well maintained car should be able to handle a journey through africa. If something goes wrong, that car is better where do you be able to buy spares on a local market. Because you dont have to flight in these spares. Guess this speaks for toyota. :innocent: We was glad to find a new Windshield in mauretania at sample, without spending much time for searching or shipping. But i still would choose that car who fits my needs, not the brand who is possible easier to repair. Focus in direction of travelling, not repairing... Surfy |
I'm speaking from an unbiased point of view. I've used LR and Toyota but own neither. I have respect for both but in very different ways, which follows just about all the previous replies.
You say that you are not a mechanically minded in an earlier post, that answers the question for me. Toyota. For some it's as much about the preparation and the vehicle as the journey. If I'm wrong and that is you then LR. Of course there is a 3rd way:innocent: Mercedes G Wagen. Combines the durability of a Toyota with the iconicisum (yes I know it's not a word) of a Defender. |
Spend a few hours sitting in a defender and a few hours sitting in a landcruiser, then decide which one you want to spend a few months in.
Add in the reliability issues and I think the Toyota wins hands down. |
Both are good and both have equal advantages and disadvantages. I'll weigh in from the landy side of things to give you some balance in amongst the Toyota fanatics ;-p
You need to look at all of your factors first: - like how long is your trip - will you drive primarily off the beaten track, or just stick to the main roads. (hard to know until you get there imho) - West coast or just the east coast? - Do you want to know how to fix your vehicle and be involved in its prep? - do you want to look cool or like a UN worker? ;-p - do you care about resale value afterwards? - how much do you want to modify the vehicle? Defenders are easier because of their square shapes and ability to fill any holes in afterwards with a rivet. Mods are often cheaper for a Defender compared to a modern LC etc - how much load capacity do you need? Bulk v weight, both can carry a lot, Defender has more natural storage space (hardtop). Troopy is good though. My last trip was 112,000km, 3 years, around Africa, West and East Coast. Land Rover Defender 1991 200 TDI. Full mechanical rebuilt 1 year before departure: Only time I couldn't drive was due to a broken fan belt in Ethiopia, fixed in 10 mins. I spent about £3,000 during the trip on normal servicing (timing belt in Cape Town etc) and maintenance along the way - always replacing anything that was half worn etc. Nothing Land Rover on the vehicle failed abnormally bar the stop solenoid on the rule injection pump, easily fixed. With a Defender its best to buy an old ruined one and give it to Matt Savage or Foleys to rebuilt for you, run it in for a year and it should be brilliant if you didn't scrimp on the rebuilt. Budget £10-15,000 for that and you will get good reliability, then drive it sensibly when in Africa, read: slowly! Landy parts are no problem in Africa, and the independent garages usually cheaper than the official Toyota dealerships. Those big red neon Toyota signs when you come into a big city look so welcoming but be aware that they sometimes won't service or stock parts for older models and that the specs for Toyotas changes from continent to continent, so your European model might not take the locally stocked part. Happened to a German friend of mine in Windhoek who needed a new rear differential (yes, a major component failure on a troopy! ;-) He had to get one flown in. With my landy I had a lot of people help me or not charge me because I was driving a landy, the 'Land Rover Brotherhood' so to speak, they are a well liked vehicle and you be treated well driving one... If you have any kind of accident a Defender is much easier to patch up afterwards and continue. Spend enough time in Africa and somehow something will give you a few dings ;-) From my experience people with newer or fancier cars are much less adventurous in Africa, missing out on a lot, because they are worried about the body of the car. With a Defender it looks cooler the more scratches and dings it has on it! "Spend a few hours sitting in a defender and a few hours sitting in a landcruiser, then decide which one you want to spend a few months in." For me a Defender wins hands down. With the Toyotas I've been in you get a lot more sun on you when driving - with the Defender its very little, much more shade, so it depends on individual preferences.... ;-) Very tall people struggle in Defenders. And so on... ;-) I'm sticking with my Defender, I really like it. I owned a Toyota (older HJ60) for a while but didn't like how big it seemed, the sun on me, the curved nature of the rear for organisation, the extra fuel consumption (Defender does 10l per 100km), the lack of decent overland garages (better now) and the more expensive and reduced market for sensible overland mods and gear vs bling. This is from a UK perspective. I hung out in overlanding places a bit in Africa and saw plenty of Toyotas with problems as well as Landies. The mechanical engineering quality of Toyota is much better for sure, but thats not the only factor to consider, just one of the important ones. Many of the landies I saw had always been maintained by cheaper parts and home mechanics. This hugely reduces the reliability of any vehicle. Only buy genuine LR parts. Anyway, either one will get you there. The better you prepare it, the less hassle you will have in getting there. The more you trust your vehicle, the more you will enjoy the trip. ( back to the unadventurous Toyota Sunday drivers to rip all of the above apart ;-p ) |
A little unfair to label all dissenters of the landrover myth as unadventurous sunday drivers, but here we go!!
I love landies, I've owned a 90, a 110, a 130, a 101 and 2 series 3 SWBs, but now I have 3 Toyotas! I agree re the above in terms of landrover modifiability (why should roamingyak have the exclusive on made up words:D) the square shape and range of aftermarket bits is definately an advantage, especially in the UK. I don't think the original post was looking at a new Toyota compared to an old landie though so I don't think some of the comments re new landcruisers (and image if that matters to you) really apply. An 80 series looks the part if thats what matters and there are a good range of blingy and not so blingy useful accessories available. You may survive the sun better in a landie, except your right arm (in a right hand drive) because it will be hanging out the open window all the time so you can fit in!!:rofl: If I was to take a landie, and had the money, I would do like the Yak suggests. I would rather buy a 200 or 300tdi and spend the money on getting it really well sorted rather than buying a new one. Electronics and Landrover are 2 words that should not appear in the same sentance together. Taking a new landrover would be like playing Russian roulette with 5 chambers loaded (or with a revolver:rofl:) If I didn't have a landcruiser, I would definately look at the G wagon, but they are chuffin pricey, and hard to find over here. here's a left field alternative, if you are buying in SA, how about a rebuilt 40 series landcruiser:innocent: be warned though, leaf springs in Africa are not a comfort option, but it does force you to take your time!! In terms of size, there isn't a vast difference. A defender is probably ultimately better off road but then, you probably won't be looking for extreme off roading. http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...ps2b0ed7f2.jpg |
Quote:
|
The question you ask is almost like getting the answer "42" as there is no definitive , in the end you will just have to make your own decision , and get the maximum enjoyment , from either , both in prep and making it "yours" , and then using it . :thumbup1:
|
Quote:
very true, the most suitable vehicle is the one that suits you best. although crossing the sahara in a morris minor traveller may be pushing it!! http://www.amazon.co.uk/Trek-Paul-St...s+minor+sahara |
I own the latest generation Defender. At work I run Lc 100 Lc 200, Troppy 70! S DiscoS and Range Rovers.
I live and work in Ethiopia. Toyota Is more common, spares are more readily available and they are reliable. however, where I put LC 200S, some soft skin, some armoured. They break in the terrain. Defenders go where they cant. so be sensible, how tough terrain will you be going on? If it is not full on, wet season off rosd, then take the toyota. If u cannot maitain a car, take the toyota. That being said, mt Defender is the family car, does have electric windows and air fon, and goes just about anywhere, with a very precious cargo aboard, my wife and 3 children. modern Defenders by the way are as technilogical as any other make. Alan l. |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 13:56. |