XTZ 1VJ 1986 No spark

[leo56]

Hi all,

Need your help to get some specs for measuring possible faulty parts.

My old bike just died on me while driving. Had to bring it home by trailer.
Anyway, there is no spark what so ever and I thougt you guys have the specs and how to measure Ignition coil, cdi, stator and pick up.

CDI is 1VJ-51, 070000-1521 QAB52
So if anybody out there possibly have some tips and tricks what to measue and how I would be very happy.

BR
Lars-Erik

[steveloomis]

Does your bike have a side stand switch? I do not have a wiring diagram for your exact bike but I think an 86 USA XT600 may be about the same.

Let me know about the side stand switch or not and we can go from there.

Steve

[xtrock]

Yes switches have to be checked, next is coil.

[leo56]

Nope, no side stand switch.
There is a kill switch, but since the electric starter runs I presume it is ok.

The bike have both electric starter and kick start

[steveloomis]

Mezo, do you know if that model has the side stand switch? For the bike to just quit running with no spark does not sound like a CDI, but could be a coil as you say or a wire pulled loose or corroded connection that gave up.

[leo56]

I agree that it sounds like a wire or similar since it just happened like that. I have checked the wiring and I can't find any lose ends.
But next step would be measuring.
I know tha the coil could be measured by measuring th ohm, but I don't have the specs.

What if I measure orange wire to the coil and earth/black wire while running the starter or kicking. What reading would I get there ?

[xtrock]

On my 3TB on coil test its Primary 3,4-4,6, secondary 10,4-15,6kohm

[steveloomis]

Originally Posted by leo56

I agree that it sounds like a wire or similar since it just happened like that. I have checked the wiring and I can't find any lose ends.
But next step would be measuring.
I know thae the coil could be measured by measuring the ohms, but I don't have the specs.

Coil ohms above from another. Keep in mind that even if a coil is bad, it can still measure ok, others have found that. If you can, see if you can borrow a coil from another bike for testing.

What if I measure orange wire to the coil and earth/black wire while running the starter or kicking. What reading would I get there ?

If you have a volt meter, set it for AC volts and about 100 volt scale. This is hard to get a definitive reading since it is a pulse, however, you should see a voltage kick of some substance. If measured and viewed on an oscilloscope you should see a 170 volt pulse or so.

Measuring the ohms of the stator coils is a good thing too. When measuring ohms disconnect all wires to the device being measured.

The CDI charge coils in the stator outputs on the red and brown wire. Put your volt meter on AC voltage and about 20 volt range. Kick and observe the voltage. You should see a good kick in voltage.

You can check the trigger coils too, there are two of them.
Colors are white/Red and green white/green and green. You should see a good voltage kick.

If everything test ok with ohms and voltage kicks then it is probably a coil or the CDI.

[jjrider]

I would suspect a wire pulled apart or shorted, then maybe the coil for it to be a sudden shutdown. Stator or cdi should have intermittent issues or problems leading up to shutdown. I'd check the wires going to the pulse coil to see if there is juice there first, then after it, ect... Start from the source then work back to find where the juice stops.

[leo56]

Hi again,
Done some measuring now and this is the result:

Coil seams to be inside spec.

Brown between Red 160 ohm and approx 27 V when running starter

Trigger measurement:
Green between Red/white 117 ohm
Green between Green/white 117 ohm

Green/white between Red/white 232 ohm

No voltage in any combination

And as you could expect, no voltage in the orange wire to the coil.

Sounds like the trigger to me, or any other suggestions ?

[Markyce]

a long shot but, your bike is only 2 years younger than my 43f xt 600, so its 28 years old.
Yamaha never designed these things to last nearly 30 years, I had a bunch of weird stuff going on with the electrics a year ago, finally traced it to insulation breaking down and wires shorting in the loom as it leaves the frame area and goes around the headstock, this gets constant movement and with a circa 30 year old loom its rather innevitable that there could be problems.
Just carefully strip the plastic tape back in that area and have a look. I lost left side indicators, horn and kill switch functions during that fun episode. I just soldered the wires back and put electrical shrink sleeves over the soldered repairs. Been fine for 12 months now

Good luck

[steveloomis]

I've seen broken wires there too.

Good that you can measure the coil resistance indicating a good electrical connection. I assume you attempted AC voltage measurements with the leads disconnected as in Ohm readings?

I know it is messy but take off the stator cover and look at the trigger coils to see if they came loose and maybe too far from the rotor magnets to induce voltage into them. If they came loose then that would explain the sudden stop. Like Jim said, a faulty CDI usually complains before failure.

Not likely but the magnets could have come off too, however, there are two of them so probably not both came off. Just giving you something to check for.

Check the gap between the magnets and the trigger coil. I don't know the gap specs but something like a business card thickness would be a good guess.

Steve

[leo56]

Yep, wires do come loose sometimes, I have had some wire issues as well. But this smells a bit different.
The voltage measuremnt was peformed in AC setting.

Yes I do realise I have to take off the stator cover and have a look inside.

Not designed to last for 30 years ? Hahaha. Even if they were not meant to last for 30 years, they do. They are bullet proof simple machines which runs and runs.
This is my go to work bike specially purchased for that. It doesnt matter if it rains or snows on it. It usually runs quite good. Even though the starter only manage to fire it up during summer.
I bought it some years ago and God knows what the the other owners have done to it. I managed to get everything working and so far it has just ran and ran, from the snow melts away in March/April until it starts snowing again in Dec.
I have changed some stuff like handle controls, speedometer and some wiring which was poor due to age or poor workmanship. But no major issues.

I plan to run it for many years more, just to see how long it would last.

[steveloomis]

Very interested in what you find. Let us know. Yes indeed these bikes are tough.

[jjrider]

Why stop just because it starts snowing ?

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