Go Back   Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB > Technical, Bike forums > Yamaha Tech
Yamaha Tech Originally the Yamaha XT600 Tech Forum, due to demand it now includes all Yamaha's technical / mechanical / repair / preparation questions.
Photo by Daniel Rintz, Himba children, Namibia

The only impossible journey
is the one
you never begin

Photo by Daniel Rintz,
Himba children, Namibia



Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 20 Jun 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Africa,Gauteng
Posts: 27
'84 XT600 high oil usage

Hi Guys,

I need to find out if there is some way of reconditioning the piston rings on my '84 XT600 instead of replacing them. The oil usage on the bike is extremely high (0.5L of oil for every full 28L tank of fuel).

Because I live in SA I cannot find a place locally that stocks the rings and most online shops such as e-bay advertises the required product but the sellers do not deliver to SA.

Thus....can the rings be reconditioned without any heavy engineering work involved?

Please note: I am not a mechanical genius and I am still learning what I can from the clymer manual that I bought for the bike. I have only done minor maintenance on the bike, and have never attempted something as big as opening up the engine or gearbox. Wanna try and sort out the bike....

Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 20 Jun 2012
kentfallen's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Bexhill, East Sussex, England, UK
Posts: 673
Oh dear that does sound as if it's something which needs sorting NOW!

I think most single cylinder thumpers burn a bit of oil but not as much as you describe here. As you know I'm no mechanic but I would imagine it's probably worn/cracked piston rings or excessive engine wear? Not necessarily terminal but something which needs to be sorted out before riding again.

I presume the bike has probably had a hard life / high mileage? On the face of it a little concerning BUT I have known the old venerable XT engine to go on and on and on. I have heard of one old XT600 (1986) engine which has done 200,000 and is still going strong. Not many engines can claim similar longevity.

I wonder if there are forum members near you in South Africa who may be able to point you in the right direction? Have you tried making contact with any through this or another bike/travel forum?

I appreciate it's sometimes very difficult for you chaps in South Africa (and throughout the African continent) to source spares etc and that sometimes instead you need to implement and adapt with whats at hand. I have seen locals in West Africa (Gambia, Ghana and Sierra Leone mainly) sucessfully bodging car engines that are nearly 50 years old. Amazing!

We take it for granted we can always find the right spare parts (often at considerable cost it must be said). I take my hat off to you and all others in the third world who are managing to remain mobile in such a difficult & demanding environment....
__________________
Triumph Bonneville 800 (2004), Yamaha XT600E (1999), Honda XBR500 (1986).


Last edited by kentfallen; 20 Jun 2012 at 17:50.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 21 Jun 2012
R.I.P. 25 November 2021
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quicken View Post
some way of reconditioning the piston rings on my '84 XT600 instead of replacing them.
No, if they are worn, they are worn & half a liter of oil per tank is pretty bad.

I have members from SA on my forum & i don't think they have problems sourcing parts for there 84 XT`s.

You have Yammy dealers in SA they will sell you some rings, but it may be time to go one oversize now? re-bore, new piston & rings, and it will be cheaper to buy an aftermarket kit in that case.

To do it properly & to get long life your looking at $3-500 bucks.

Mezo.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 21 Jun 2012
bacardi23's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: XXX<-Portugal->Azores->Santa Maria (island)
Posts: 1,544
well... it's not easy to replace the piston and rings if your not too mechanically inclined...

150 bucks for a Wiseco 97mm piston+rings+wristpin+c-clips:

Wiseco Piston Kit Yamaha XT600 84-96 97mm | eBay

YAMAHA XT600 WISECO PISTON KIT 1MM OVER XT 600 84-96 | eBay


The first link, the seller says he also sells the top end gasket if you need it..

Three hour labor is more than enough to get the old piston out and fit the new one in NOT counting the time/money for to rebore the cylinder sleeve...


Vando
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 21 Jun 2012
chucky55's Avatar
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 65
97mm bit big

Quote:
Originally Posted by bacardi23 View Post
well... it's not easy to replace the piston and rings if your not too mechanically inclined...

150 bucks for a Wiseco 97mm piston+rings+wristpin+c-clips:

Wiseco Piston Kit Yamaha XT600 84-96 97mm | eBay

YAMAHA XT600 WISECO PISTON KIT 1MM OVER XT 600 84-96 | eBay


The first link, the seller says he also sells the top end gasket if you need it..

Three hour labor is more than enough to get the old piston out and fit the new one in NOT counting the time/money for to rebore the cylinder sleeve...


Vando
Vando,
97mm is about 4th oversize, the early XT's were 95mm bore and then went up in m.5mm sizes.
Quicken,
This is not a difficult bike to work on and should have the barrel taken off and measured before buying the replacement piston, look for oval or badly scored bore.
Like Mezo said,
get a rebore, do it properly and you will reap the rewards with a Great bike.
__________________
I'm not getting older; I'm just progressing through LIFE!! Harleys do not have a throttle- they have VOLUME control!!!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 21 Jun 2012
bacardi23's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: XXX<-Portugal->Azores->Santa Maria (island)
Posts: 1,544
Oh.. Ignore the first link on the previous post of mine.... I thought they were 96mm stock.... my bad... STILL, link #2 is a valid option!
Still, if his engine is burning up that much oil you can surely skip first size up and go to the 2nd size overbore if it's in that bad shape..


WISECO 96mm:

Stock compression: Wiseco Piston Kit Yamaha XT600 84-96 96mm | eBay

High compression: Wiseco Piston Kit Yamaha XT600 Hi-Comp 84-96 96mm | eBay

Keep in mind, +1mm overbore is in diameter! so it's 0.5mm increase from center to wall..


Vando
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 21 Jun 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Africa,Gauteng
Posts: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by kentfallen View Post
I presume the bike has probably had a hard life / high mileage? On the face of it a little concerning BUT I have known the old venerable XT engine to go on and on and on. I have heard of one old XT600 (1986) engine which has done 200,000 and is still going strong. Not many engines can claim similar longevity.
Thanks for all the information guys. I think the milleage is REALLY high, but got the bike for a real bargain (Equivalent of 250 pounds) and it actually still runs very well for it's age. I was really hoping to just replace the rings as I would have to find an engineering company who can do a rebore for an oversized piston, but it seems that it might be the obvious solution to do so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mezo View Post
You have Yammy dealers in SA they will sell you some rings, but it may be time to go one oversize now? re-bore, new piston & rings, and it will be cheaper to buy an aftermarket kit in that case.
The Yamaha dealers around here charge an arm and a leg for parts, if they can still source them (and if they are prepared to help as customer service sucks in this country) so I agree with you Mezo that I'd rather try and see if can find an oversized piston and someone that knows what they are doing when it somes to reboring the engine....will be nice to have a bit more power from the old muel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bacardi23 View Post
150 bucks for a Wiseco 97mm piston+rings+wristpin+c-clips:

Wiseco Piston Kit Yamaha XT600 84-96 97mm | eBay

YAMAHA XT600 WISECO PISTON KIT 1MM OVER XT 600 84-96 | eBay


The first link, the seller says he also sells the top end gasket if you need it..

The price of the Wiseco kit is really not bad seeing as replacement rings for the existing bore and piston will cost me half as much, so it might just be worth the effort. I'll also just respray the block with black engine paint while I'm at it to give it a new look....all the paint has sadly dissapeared over the years.

I am aiming to rebuild this bike completely but it completely depends on funds and time at this stage. I also use the bike quite regularly to get to work and back so that leaves me without transport for a while.

Thanks for all the VERY helpful information guys. I really appreciate that I can come and ask for advice from people who know what they are talking about.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 21 Jun 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Africa,Gauteng
Posts: 27
Thanks bacardi, I checked out the updated links. I'll have to take chucky's advice and I think I'll have to open her up and check the current bore diameter first (will prove to be quite a job I suppose).

I think this bike has been through many owners, and it is very possible that someone has already rebored the engine to a larger diameter.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 23 Jun 2012
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: dublin
Posts: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mezo View Post
No, if they are worn, they are worn & half a liter of oil per tank is pretty bad.

I have members from SA on my forum & i don't think they have problems sourcing parts for there 84 XT`s.

You have Yammy dealers in SA they will sell you some rings, but it may be time to go one oversize now? re-bore, new piston & rings, and it will be cheaper to buy an aftermarket kit in that case.

To do it properly & to get long life your looking at $3-500 bucks.

Mezo.
Rebuilding my xt with similar problem 110 000,

I was lucky to find a new old stock Cylinder and pistion from bankrupt yamaha dealer for 200 euros!
So just need to work on head and now
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 24 Jun 2012
R.I.P. 25 November 2021
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 688
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwel View Post
Rebuilding my xt with similar problem 110 000,

I was lucky to find a new old stock Cylinder and pistion from bankrupt yamaha dealer for 200 euros!
So just need to work on head and now
Whilst you have the barrel off take a peek down inside at the gears for any chipped teeth, at that mileage id say your going to see some? unless its already been done?

And pop out your valves & check the seats & faces of the valves as well, may need to get them re cut.

Mezo.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 24 Jun 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Africa,Gauteng
Posts: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mezo View Post
Whilst you have the barrel off take a peek down inside at the gears for any chipped teeth, at that mileage id say your going to see some? unless its already been done?

And pop out your valves & check the seats & faces of the valves as well, may need to get them re cut.

Mezo.
Mezo....now you are starting to give me the creeps about rebuilding my bike's engine. I'm scared I start finding other little problems while at it and then won't be able to fix it because of low cash flow or no part availability.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 25 Jun 2012
R.I.P. 25 November 2021
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 688
Parts are not the problem, cash can be.

Its common for the 5th gear to be chipped, sometimes others.
You will normally get away with big end bearing & stuff like that but whilst the motor is in bit you may as well fix the knackered parts.

Nine times out of ten it just needs a new piston/rings & often replace the 5th gear, then there's tens of thousands of happy riding kilometers afterwards.

Yamaha made a pretty reliable pushbike in the XT600, look after it & it will reward you with many years of riding.

Mezo.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 25 Jun 2012
Registered Users
HUBB regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Africa,Gauteng
Posts: 27
Thanks Mezo,

I'll check that fifth gear - it does make a funny whining noise when the bike is running in that gear....

Just as a matter curiosity - Can I just replace rings without doing anything about the cylinder bore? Purely asking as I think that just engineering the cylinder will cost me quite a few bucks.

What is the standard size for the rings, because I don't completely understand the Clymer manual's measurements (Something like 94.00-97.00,95.00 - can't remember exactly). If the diameter of the cylinder is standard what size rings should I be looking for?

I really just want to sort out the high oil usage issue and replace the gaskets.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 25 Jun 2012
R.I.P. 25 November 2021
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 688
Yes if its not to worn you can just hone the barrel with a honing brush & fit new rings.



Mezo.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 25 Jun 2012
R.I.P. 25 November 2021
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 688
And im guessing your next question will be can i fit new rings without honing?

No, your barrel will have a glaze on there & fitting new rings will need a hone to allow the rings to bed in to the freshly de-glazed/honed barrel.

You cannot simply put new rings in, your initial problem will still be there (smoke trail for miles pissing every motorist off behind you)

Mezo.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
XT600 Engine Rebuild Phoenix6 Yamaha Tech 15 2 Feb 2015 22:02
DRZ 400 service interval suzuki vs users !!! Zimi Suzuki Tech 6 29 Mar 2012 09:47
Is this just condensation in oil? Guest121 Yamaha Tech 30 20 Mar 2012 00:10
A splash of two stroke oil for the DERV? Walkabout Equipping the Overland Vehicle 5 11 Feb 2012 01:08
XT600E 2002 Engine Oil Trichelia Yamaha Tech 17 17 Nov 2011 14:25

 
 

Announcements

Thinking about traveling? Not sure about the whole thing? Watch the HU Achievable Dream Video Trailers and then get ALL the information you need to get inspired and learn how to travel anywhere in the world!

Have YOU ever wondered who has ridden around the world? We did too - and now here's the list of Circumnavigators!
Check it out now
, and add your information if we didn't find you.

Next HU Eventscalendar

HU Event and other updates on the HUBB Forum "Traveller's Advisories" thread.
ALL Dates subject to change.

2024:

Add yourself to the Updates List for each event!

Questions about an event? Ask here

HUBBUK: info

See all event details

 
World's most listened to Adventure Motorbike Show!
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)



Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance.

Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.

Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.

Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!


 

What others say about HU...

"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia

"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK

"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia

"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA

"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada

"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa

"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia

"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany

Lots more comments here!



Five books by Graham Field!

Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook

"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.



Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!

New to Horizons Unlimited?

New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!

Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.

Susan and Grant Johnson Read more about Grant & Susan's story

Membership - help keep us going!

Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.

You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.




All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:50.