Small guzzi?
 

Hi. Starting with a blank piece of paper and a list of criteria for a big trip bike. One bike that ticks most boxes is rarely mentioned, small modern Guzzis.
They have the shaft drive but not the weight of the big gs
Reliability must be good nowadays
Air cooled, lo-tech, good engine access, low seat height, aforementioned shaft , no CAN elec-tricks
Am I missing something? These bike rarely get a mention!

My dad runs a Nevada 750. It's a decent enough bike but not one I'd even try and commute on. The construction materials are the usual Cheese/toffee/kebab wrapper and parts availability is a disaster. Get it running and it does the job. When something breaks you find it there and then (it is simple if awkward to work on, the cylinders stick out sure, but they block access to all the stuff piled on top and the frame is always in the way), but then you take it off the road for weeks while trying to work out if the bit they used on a Tuesday can be substituted for the Friday part that some bloke in Holland might be able to get for you this month.

If you must have one, buy as new as you can, avoid the 750's and learn as much as you can about UPS!

Andy

Greetings Alan

I bought a second hand 2006 Breva 750 for my Beloved a few years ago. I decided on one these pretty well based on the criteria you mentioned. I also heard that reliability was supposed to be improved.

It's a very pretty bike but at the risk of incurring the wrath of the entire Moto Guzzi community it's turned out to be the most unreliable bike I've ever owned.

In the time that I've owned it, I've had a series of intermittent faults that have been very hard to find, the on board diagnostics associated with fuel injection system didn't log any fault when it was taken to a mechanic and hooked up the analyser.

The only way to really sort out the problem would be to swap out various sensors/components (I suspect my problem may be related to the oxygen sensor or the throttle rheostat) the only problem with this is that these are expensive parts to buy (at least in Oz).

I don't know any stats on how reliable the Moto Guzzis are these days and anyone can be unlucky to get a "Monday morning bike" but the number of faults and the fact they are intermittent doesn't inspire me to take it around the world or recommend it to someone doing the same.

Don't get me wrong it's a pleasant bike to ride but for me reliability issues and cost/availability of replacement parts would put it low on my list of preferred overland bikes (unless you have a tow truck & UPS/DHL phone number handy :smile2:)

Regards

IanJ

P.S It was only after I bought it I found out from the mechanic that a previous owner also had problems with it as well. :(

Griso
 

Hi Allan,
I bought a Griso 1100 new in 2007 and have 22,000 miles on it now and am kitting it out to take around the world next year.
I love it! Simple push rod v twin technology that has been around for years.
Super reliable (at least mine has been). So far all I have had to do is replace the speed sensor (a common problem, water gets into the sensor down the wire) It cost me £30 for a new one and took me 20 minutes to change.
Handles well, Marzocchi forks, Brembo Brakes, Zachs shock etc. And no problems what so ever from the single swing arm shaft drive.
Great sound track, more fun than you can poke a stick at!
Just went for a blast through the country today and got 45-47 MPG.
Build quality is great, I had 2 people ask me last week if my bike was new!
Maybe steer clear of the newer 8 valve 1200's, they have a problem with not enough oil getting to the top end.

It's a non starter then
 

Spoke to a few dealers the weekend. Two have thrown the towel in after Piaggio not playing ball so gave honest opinions. They pretty much agreed with you guys, i.e. pretty sweet handling bikes but fragile. Sunday morning bike basically.
So until BMW make a lo-tech HP2 or a real adventure model, it looks like I'm oiling a chain :0(

p.s.
Hey benmac. I was looking at a Griso in a dealers yesterday. What a fantastic looking bike and great write ups from press and owners alike. I am considering one as a road bike. You say the 11 is better. Someone else said it has more low down torque and does more mpg than the 12/8v model and you never need the top end power of the new bike as its a torque turbine. Would you agree?

Don't Do It!
 

I brought a brand new Cali Vintage in late 2007, it was OK when it was in the mood but was plagued by niggles and poor dealer/manufacturer service. Bits fell off or vibrated to pieces, electricals were erratic, dealer service was expensive and poor and parts supply from Moto Guzzi took and age (10 months to replace a mudguard). People always said they were so much better quality than they used to be, what the F*** were they like if this is an example of the better version?

It's interesting to see the different experiences that people have had with their Guzzi's. They have always been regarded as an enthusiasts bike followed by a (usually) loyal fan base.
I can only go on my own experience Alan. My Griso is ideal for country B roads with loads of bottom end torque between 20-80 mph and handles the twisties very well. I think they were advertised as doing 11.2 sec 1/4 miles so enough grunt to have some fun with.
As far as top end torque goes, anything over 100mph on an unfaired bike and your arms start to stretch...and it gets harder to hold on to your license.
Like I said, I have had no reliability issues whatsoever.

Earlier Guzzi's
 

Hi Tourider, I only know the one Guzzi, 850 Le Mans 2, and that's enough to send anyone to the loonie bin. Despite that I still keep it. What went wrong?

Falls off its stands by itself. Side stand slowly bent under bike, unnoticed till it snapped off. Don't start me on the points!!! Newtronics ignition keeps it running well past the 200 mile limit of the points. Frame paint? Did they actually use any? Mild steel for various parts? No I suspect it's sun-dried Parmesan in a job lot. Like to take it to the 100mph it looks as if it's doing when stationary? No problems if you don't mind 1 litre of engine oil over the rear tyre et al. Instruments: The rims dent if breathed on. The back lighting is useless even in the dark. The screen blocks the instruments in all conditions...Oh damn, speed camera! The wiring is not fit for purpose due to cheap (soft) connectors. One wire gets warm near the fuse box. Three 20 A wires are attached to the same single 20 A fuse. The seat is open cell foam and stays moist for weeks after a rain fall. The side panels self destruct on removal. I now have seven broken ones. The clutch activating rod wrecks its oil seals and deposits gearbox oil onto the clutch plates. Left dormant for a while (how long I don't know) the front and rear crankshaft oil seals dry out then rip when the engines turned over. The exhaust system demonstrates the theory of entropy along with the effective cast steel discs. All in all it simply is not suited to use outside an arid zone. Yet it still is an amazing bike. I think I must be mad but I can't get it out of my blood stream. Yes, they HAVE improved!!!!! Lindsay.

I'm currently in the 'saving up and hoping they come to the USA' portion of a love affair with the new Guzzi V7 Stone's. 5+ US gallon tank, 50hp v-twin, shaft drive, fuel injection, screw type valves? Make mine in white please...

http://www.sydneycaferacers.com/stor...7-stone-05.jpg

Havent owned one yet, but did take a 2011 V7 Classic for a test ride in and around Tulsa. Found it to be enchantingly wonderful to ride personally.

Too risky
 

I can't get a ride on a griso. Only one small dealer locally and his is brand new so won't fuel it up just for test rides. Understandable maybe but I'm not shelling out £9k on a bike I haven't ridden and it sounds like that's the only way you fall in love with guzzis is a test ride as statistically they suck.
Sounds boring maybe but I'm drifting towards an R1200r. I owned an 1150 and loved it, no issues. I know you should never go back, too many bikes to try and not enough years but it's a fun bike for short trips (yes really) and stick panniers on and a fly screen and you've got a continental tourer.
Negatives: It's not pretty and dealers are arrogant and unenthusiastic but plentiful. Just one left to eliminate, the KTM/SMT....

Interesting!
The dealer network for KTM is nearly as sparse as for MG, don't you think?
Grapevine says that some KTM dealerships have packed in (I am referring to those outside the dirt bike fraternity i.e. those who went into a dealership with KTM when their bikes became more road oriented); the grapevine reason is that KTM is restricting supply to the UK, for whatever reason - perhaps they can make more profit per unit of production by selling elsewhere - perhaps there is a lack of "left hand of the road" versions, who knows??

"I know you should never go back, too many bikes to try and not enough years" - Yep, that's me as well. But, I may just do that anyway.
Be like a good politician, doh, never say never.

Point taken
 

Pint taken beer but I happen to have a good KTM Dealer nearby (they gave up on Guzzi last year due to Piaggio...) I'm guessing the SMT will be a hoot to ride but too tall. The boring old Beemer is a hoot too and I am tired of squirting expensive gunk on my chain only to wipe it off my back wheel a week later. Anyway we're a mile off topic by now. The little guzzi doesn't seem up to the abuse a big trip dishes out and the Griso does look gorgeous but Piaggio need to sort out their 'sales prevention technique' before I'll see one in my yard

Hello Alan. If you are thinking of an R1200R, my sister has one, she has had it from new, and is thinking of selling it. She lives near Cambridge. If you are interested, I can find out its vital statistics and put you in touch.

Ive worked on about a dozen or so Guzzis, from mid 70s restorations right to 2012 models and my opinion of them is.... rubbish.

They're built in such low volume that the quality control is all over the place, wiring can be routed wrong/dangerously, loose bolts, poor finish. The cycle parts they use on the latest bikes (locks, relays, switches etc) are the same used by scooter manufacturers about 15 years ago and corrode and fail very quickly if they are garaged and cherished. For European touring, a good one would be ok, but I wouldn't fancy my chances when the road gets rough

Thanks.
 

Not being sarcastic. Thanks for that post. I am forever wondering if any Guzzis made since about 1973 are in any way reliable. I had genuinely thought that in the last, say, 6 months Piaggio had raised the standards to an acceptable level. It seems not. So prospective owners still need to be what is politely put as, " enthusiasts". Lindsay.

At least with the early Guzzi' the 'home mechanic' stood half a chance of working on them, one of my brothers and friends had Guzzi' whilst I had and still have a /7 BMW, if you would not go far wrong with an early BM, many still about at resonable money, easy to work on and good speres(if needed) availability.
Failing that look into The Old BMW 'K' series triple and four pot models.

Don't sell this brand short....
 

Sounds like the old Ford versus Chevy argument - no one wins! There is a huge following of Guzzi fans and justifiably so. Many more in Europe than the US but nevertherless in spite of the sparse dealer network they do have their following in the states. I have a Breva 750 and just love it, no issues and would not hesitate to tour. There is currently a couple doing a tour of the US on a Moto Guzzi Breva 750 which has over 50,000 miles. On The Road Again – 2012

Before you make a decision you should check out some of the Guzzi forums and chat with owners about the pros and cons...don't sell this brand short, like all brands they have had their moments but they do make some beautiful bikes that perform well.

I must come to the defence of modern Guzzis. I've had my 1200 Sport for 3 years now and apart from having a new clutch fitted under warranty when I first got it it hasn't missed a beat. I've done 4,000 mile Euro tours on it and it's been perfect in this role. Smooth, comfortable and fun to ride. The noise it makes is worth the cost alone!

This is my first Italian bike and I was always worried about the reliability of these machines but I stopped listening to the rhetoric from people who haven't owned one and read posts from actual owners. Everyone loved them so I took the plunge. I'm glad I did as this is the best bike I've owned. It feels special compared to Japanese machines. I know it's a cliche but it has soul.

Mine is one of the last of the 2 valves. The new 4 valve bikes have had some problems with the cams. Guzzi have now changed the supplier of their cams so hopefully that is sorted. Having said that I don't have much confidence in the new head design so I'll be hanging onto my 2 valver, it's a keeper.

I have no experience of modern Guzzis, although I think the new V7 is the best-looking bike I have seen in many years. Pity it's sub-50 bhp, as with a bit more power I would have one in a heartbeat.

I had a 1979 V50II for a year or two in the early 80s. I regret selling that bike more than any other. In terms of character, soul, whatever, it was the sweetest little bike I have owned (my current XT excepted, of course). The only issue I had was keeping the carbs in sync. They would go out of tune very quickly and to keep the bike on song they needed synching every 2-3 weeks. Once I had bought the Davida gauges it was a 15-minute job, so no big drama - and a great feeling when it was running right again. No issues with the mechanics or the electrics - a very user-friendly bike. It probably wouldn't cut it today, but against the sports bikes of the time it showed a clean pair of wheels to many faster bikes on a twisty road.

Guzzis have always had very loyal fans, and there's a reason for that, although the reason may not be 100% logical. But are we ever 100% logical about our bikes?

Here is another blog with lots of owner input on Guzzis
 

I do not recognize the unreliability issue with Guzzi's.

I had a Falcone, a T4, a LeMans and have known a lot of Guzzi drivers with V7, Lodola, V1000, Calif etc.

I had no such unreliability issues.

I have been driving all of Europe on all of them from northe to south, west to east and vice versa, even 2 up on the old Falcone without any stops except for fuel.

I am not Guzzi owner anymore and can't report on "modern" Guzzi's reliability.

I bought a Nevada 750 new in 2006 and put 23,000 km on it with no mechanical problems. I sold it to a friend who now has 33,000 km on the clock. We just got back from a 2000 km trip through Austria and Germany.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z...2/DSC01206.jpg

The only problem I had with it was trying to get work done under warranty by the dealership I bought it from. :thumbdown: That's why I ride a different brand now. My friend has found a reliable mechanic at the new local dealership, though (the old one lost their franchise). :mchappy:

Small Guzzi
 

Alan,
I have owned a 650 NTX for 4 years now (1994 model) it has only required consumables to date, and can be home serviced with ease. I have not done a long overland trip on this bike yet, but I would have no issues with a long trip (Road biased) but it is a bit heavy for unsurfaced, rutted roads. I have done some mods to the standard suspension. I would agree that spares availability can be patchy for anything other than consumables. Later injected models are more economic than carb model like mine.

In 25 yrs, no Guzzi I owned gave me any problems. If you're still interested in buying a Guzzi, join the Guzzi club online forum (no membership required).

Have a look at this site: Guzzi Overland

Take a test ride on the bike you select & have fun!

I bought a cheap V50 mK 3 a few weeks ago and it is a charming little bike. It was running rough when I got it but after adjusting the valves and balancing the carbs (both simple jobs) she runs beautifully. I think I am correct in saying it is a s powerful as the current 750 versions due to the emissions etc that they have to comply with. I would be quite happy taking it on a long tour. It cost me £550 with almost a full MOT!!

Good score, Mark. You're right about the power. I think they were 50 bhp or so, which is ahead of the 750 Classic's 47 bhp.

Valves and carbs are easy on these bikes, like working on the bench. Electrics not so much. They hide a lot up there between the V and the tank.

Treat it well. You will love it.

(My only 'I once raced Barry Sheene' story. I was commuting with my V50II in Lincolnshire - about 10 miles each way, short straight stretches linked by 90 deg bends. I saw a bike come up behind, fast, so I did the usual thing and speeded up. It was a Norton Commando. Every straight, he caught up with me, every corner I left him behind. Eventually I turned into my drive and he went by with the usual wave. Thought nothing of it, but months later, I was in the local bike shop and mentioned my Guzzi. Oh yeah, said the owner, 'Local Racer X' was in here the other day saying he raced someone on one of these, on his Commando. Mad b@stard, couldn't catch him at all. Rode like a nutter. Modest as ever, I kept quiet.

My memory says local racer X was Rob McElnea, but I could be misremembering that. But the Guz was a lovely handling bike. On those roads, more than 50 bhp was wasted.)

I raced a guy on a Shuttleworth Snap once and beat him , mind you , he was playing a yukele as he rode .jeiger


:innocent:

I've had Guzzis for some years now, including my newest addition, the 2011 Stelvio 1200 NTX. No reliability issues during its 25000 kms, apart from a blown coil (Champion) replaced under warranty. Was a bit rough running @ ca 3500 rpms, but sorted. Wife's 2004 Breva 750 has been running 65000 kms flawlessly. My 1984 850 T5 hack has been serving as my winter bike (Norwegian winters, remember) for the last six odd years. No issues, apart from a worn clutch @ 80 000 kms (of hack pulling) and a few snapped wires now and then. I even have a SP1000 in the garage, being rebuilt for classic racing (for a couple of years, admittedly...). Nice, well-running engine, despite its 30 + years of duty before me rebuilding it. I've also had a 2007 850 Griso - no issues - and a 1992 Quota 1000 - no issues (I don't consider a loose battery cable "an issue" - and I'm to embarrased to tell the whole story...). If I'd be world touring, I'd opt for an older ('80, early '90) carbed Guzzi, and strike a deal with Stein Dinse for parts shipping if needed. I just love those bikes!

Don't tell me, 'duelling banjos', and you were on the gee-tar.

:)

maybe guzzi isn't built for bashing around dirt roads on...
 

Traded my F800gs (which I bought after a short test ride and hated every mile on it) for a R1200R Classic which is just like my old 1150 but improved in every way. This is a bike I enjoy every time I get on it but still leaves me searching for a travel bike.
I saw a Guzzi V7 in a dealers yesterday which started me off on a merry go round web search, (mainly on here) and although a great bike on paper I think a big bumpy journey would shake it to pieces. I want to ride with the occasional fix and not the other way round. Lack of build quality control, spares (un) availability etc. So I'll go to the Birmingham bike show next week with an open mind then spend the following two weeks riding round Goa on my hired Enfield Bullet doing that head over heart thing (you have to love your bike if you're going to spend so long travelling with it) trying to decide which bike to buy when I get back.

Good post and thanks for resurrecting this thread!

This is why I haven't taken the typical short test ride offered by dealerships in many years: but I do take note of what folks are prepared to say about makes and models of bikes when they have owned them for a while.
'twould be of value to state your views about the F800 and the R1200 in the BMW section?

Both of these Beemers are "travel bikes" so it comes down to what you are looking for nowadays - the attributes of a bike that matter to you.

Maybe I read this wrong but you come across as brand prejudiced. If you like brands buy a Honda and be happy with everything except the parts prices.

The v7 is a Piaggio. This in my experience (5000 miles so far on ) is very different from the what they made back in the day (my old man had a Nevada which was reliable until he had to try and buy brake discs for it and no one knew what year it really was) .

I very much like my V7 and think it is better built than any BMW or Triumph I've had this century.

Andy

no bike is perfect.
live with that fact and you will be happy .
it doesn't matter what anybody else rides or what they think.
"ride what makes you smile"

In my 5k experience...! wtf
 

Why do (some) people use these forums to switch the topic from bikes to amateur psychiatrist?
I am not whatever you said. If anything Guzzi is a cooler brand. Stop analysing people, you get it wrong.
Right, back to bikes.
Did three weeks in Goa before Christmas. Hired a bullet. Perfect bike for the job. Short trips, easy local fix, great "king of the road" feeling and everyone wanted their pic taken on the bike.
I got back and set off the next day to Spain with a mate for three weeks over Christmas snd NY as I find it a real damp anticlimax here (UK).
Went on my R12r, mate has R1150. We chewed through about two and a half thousand miles chasing sunshine and dry mountain roads. We had a real blast and both agreed we had the perfect bikes.
Why? Road only trip, super comfortable, brilliant factory luggage, alternators that powered everything (Gerbing xxxx) while charging everything else at the same time, wind protection limited but happy not to have the bedroom furniture bulk when running around town (check that R12 weight, lot less than you imagine and it hangs looooooow) but most of all they're ugly, quirky mounts but have buckets loads of character.
Can't wait to do it again next year, maybe Croatia. Same bike.

Why I didn't like the F8gs. I just never gelled with it basically. Technically for dirt it's way too tall and heavy especially with luggage and way too expensive and fashion fragile to drop. (what is it with all this plastic fashion furniture on new so called "adventure" bikes?) it also made a shoit road bike with a very narrow saddle and a 21" hoop up front that combined with a rear weight bias made high speed wet riding downright frightening. Plus, imagine an "unstoppable" adventure bike that required removing battery, battery holder, air box, ten sensors, a hundred bits of plastic (including the f***ing front mudguard!) and a thousand mini screws just to see the spark plugs. Now you did think to buy that special long unique plug extractor that doesn't come with the bike didn't you...? Honestly.
So I love my funky rare ugly R12 with a passion and would only maybe swap it for the fashionably beautiful RnineT as a long term keeper although would miss the extras and creature comforts.
I've realised that I personally need two bikes as I love road touring and weekend blasts (in comfort ) on proper road rubber however for things more third worldy I do need the ability to venture off road and mix it with the locals to get the best out if a trip and not chew up a thousand miles so something simple relatively small, light, simple and reliable is needed. You would still be a two wheeled God on a ten year old 600 single in most countries around the world simply by virtue of the fact that have the freedom and money to travel. That awards you that status, not the bike underneath you.