What is Adventure Motorcycling?
 

Interesting question.. I thought I could answer it pretty well... in fact I'm a bit of an armchair adventure motorcyclist - that'll change in September - but I've read every single book I can get my hand on and talked to so many people....

So it was interesting when I was reading Ted Simon's latest book - Dreaming of Jupiter - that I found myself thinking..

"He's not really being an adventure motorcyclist because he's staying in hotels"

How stupid is that? I just caught myself in time and called myself many silly names... but it got me to thinking... what is it that makes a biker and adventure motorcyclist? Where does the line start?

In September I'm off to Morocco - I'm going on a CBF600 and will stick to the main roads where I can. Morocco is a well trodden route and as I'm not going off road, and I'm not on a KTM or a GS. Does that mean I'm just on a biking holiday?

Then in July next year, same bike, but this time I'm going to Russia and back, is that adventure motorcycling or just a long road trip on the bike?

Is going RTW on a bike and staying in hotels adventure motorcycling? Or do you have to rough it at every opportunity and try to break records?

It's quite interesting when you think about it and I discovered that I was being really rather elitist with no good reason - I'm sometimes a prat.

What do you think? (not about the prat part)

An interesting question which doesn't have a 'right' answer. But I guess this thread may well 'separate the wheat from the chaff' so to speak for all the world to see.

The definition of adventure is: a risky undertaking, or a remarkable and exiting experience.

The elitists will tell us we must have travelled 'hardcore' to call ourselves adventurers, being unswervingly committed and dedicated to (off-road?) travelling. The rest of us don't care and just enjoy our daily/weekly rides out.

Adventure is a state of mind, not how many miles you ride, how many wheels you travel on or where you go.

Enjoy every minute of your trip to Morocco and if you're passing close to Malaga on your way, give us a shout.

I haven't been to Russia for more than 20 years - I guess it's changed a lot since then.

Btw, I wouldn't call myself an adventurer - I just like riding my bike!!!

Being an adventure motorcyclist is an all encompassing term, we all have our thresholds at which a trip becomes an adventure, for some a long road trip to a different continent, for some a sprint round the world, some go offroad.
if it is a challenge, it becomes adventurous.
I guess it's a personal thing.
Going to morocco on a cbf may not be adventurous to some, but a life changing epic adventure experience to others.
Enjoy the trips!

No you are doing it all wrong and you are probably not enjoying what you do.

Adventure riding is everything supplied and paid for by sponsors, bikes, riding equipment, tools etc. Overcoming difficulties like not being given the bike brand you want. Plus you need a camera man, 4 men in a Toyota 4x4 carrying more spares, tools and tyres. An office team to sort out your finances, visas, inoculations, bike shipping, talking to the media and promoting the trip. Then when you get back you need someone to write the book and publish it and then you’ll be busy with all the personal appearances to go and promote the book and film.

Or you can you can just pay adventure travel company to sort it all out, then you just turn up and ride where they tell you stop where they tell to. They supply the support van and driver and they get to make the book/film and TV program.

At least that’s how I’ve seen it done.

Steve

Ahh now I understand - why didn't anyone tell me this before?

I think it's definitely a state of mind - it's an 'adventure' to me certainly...

My interpretation would be a trip into the unknown.
My first ever trip to the coast by motorbike many many years ago was a major adventure when a friend and I left at midnight (although I cannot remember why we did this) to travel from London to Weymouth but we'd never ever done anything like that before, so an adventure it was.
But once I'd done similar rides a few more times then it lost its adventure tag as it was a known entity.

serendipity
 

"But once I'd done similar rides a few more times then it lost its adventure tag as it was a known entity."

I think adventure=serendipity. Instead of sticking with the itinery, when you see that fork in the road, you go to the left instead of right, just because it feels right. Instead of staying at x hotel which was listed in Lonely Planet, you ask for a room at another, because someone you met by chance yesterday said the hosts were interesting. The list goes on. But basically, it's veering away from the plan, which will also mean veering away from your comfort zone.
Lorraine

Matt - good question. It really falls into 2 parts
- what others perceive as Adventure, and
- what you perceive as Adventure.


I am just back from 10,000 miles across Russia - about 25% on bad and 10% on very bad or non roads. Others, who havn't done it, call it an adventure but I don't. It was in truth little more than a trip from London to Devon, across part of the moor, and back - 50 times!

Sponsorship? Why? It makes you behoven to others who will want some form of payback from you, sooner than you just following your own pleasure.

Ignoring food and drink etc that I would need at home anyway, and the bike itself and routine wear and service items, it cost me the grand sum of £758.08 (the .08 was a repair, 4 rubles replacing a pannier frame bolt that shook out on a 30 mile bone-shaker of a mountain pass!).
Why sell your soul for so little?

I had no support, travelled alone apart from traffic pals along the way, but did have the advantage of our flat in Moscow and friends providing accomodation in towns and villages along the way for 37 of the 51 nights - saving perhaps £700.

Still £1558 is cheap for a wonderful 8 weeks on the road (I use the word as a generality!). But not really an Adventure.


Steve - great post. but you forgot to mention the spare helmets., How would they have done it without those? Too much chasing fame and freebies I think.

If the prospect of riding your bike from London ALL the way up to John O'Groats and back is a bit scary for you and you feel will be a challenge but you build up the courage and go out and do it and come back with a big smile on your face...then you are an adventure rider.

Yes on that basis, going around the corner to the local corner shop could be classified as a adventure trip and to some it is.

There are those that say the eastern route down to Cape town is merely running on the beaten track and many will say it's not really an adventure route. Well is bloody well new and challenging and adventurous to those taking it the first time.

I thought I'd try and see if there was a dictionary or encyclopaedia definition for 'adventure motorcycling' or 'adventure motorcyclist' but there doesn't appear to be one... so that got me to thinking... perhaps we should write up a definition for wikipedia?

Like Dakota and Hustler said "Adventure is a risky trip that you make to the unknown" ...and any route which fits to this, is an adventure...

But actually, i think what is important is that you enjoy yourself, and dont think or care about how others classify it. What is important is, how you classify it.

This year i went up to Norway through Spain ... total of 24,000 km in 42 days. Spend total of 36€ on acc. Slept on beaches, deserted fishing villages, parks etc.

Everyone who heard of the trip said ...WOW! What an Adventure! ...

But i think it was a just a biking holiday.

On the other hand i hear many people brag about their trips for which i would even get dress...

What is an adventure and what is not is quite relative .... Enjoy your trips, have fun and dont think about where it fits.... :)

I am with Dakota/ Hustler/USL..
An adventure motorcycles it some one who takes his/her bike outside their personal comfort zone INTENTIONALLY and REPETITIVELY (or at lest would like to), A motorcycle adventure is the single trip. Where, why, how long, how far, kinda of roads, cost, blah.. are all irrelevant only that it is new to the person... (it does not even have to be fun or enjoyed.. some of my "biggest adventures" were nightmarish and I was glad to have gotten out alive" I dont want to ever do some of them again, I am glad i left my comfort zone and I will not stop ..)

I even have my epitaph already written.. and i think it answers this question...

"Weep not for the dead, but instead weep for those in fear of death do not live."

So I guess that means living is an adventure....

okay i am getting way to zen for my own liking.. off to drink a beer or two... :eek3: oh wait that is what got me in this mood in the first place...:innocent: :oops2::innocent:

Matt,
Good question, well expressed.
You are just about there with the definition for W:- just put a link into W that goes to this thread!!

Cheers and good travels,

I tend to thing "adventure motorcycleing" is a marketing gimmick. <img>

--- " will also mean veering away from your comfort zone."---

I think Lorraine hit the bullseye : Adv Motorcycling takes you out of your hitherto cosy little bubble into faraway places off the tourist route ,where the itinery might be uncertain and the conditions unpredictable .

"I thought I'd try and see if there was a dictionary or encyclopaedia definition for 'adventure motorcycling' or 'adventure motorcyclist' but there doesn't appear to be one... so that got me to thinking... perhaps we should write up a definition for wikipedia?"


The Tao that has a name is not the Tao

Time to move on.

and nothing at all to do with motorcycling. Why?

This largely BMW crowd

I would prefer to qualify as a Motorcycle Traveler.

Adventure Riding: TO BOLDLY GO............................
 

where other people already live.

Unfortunately MollyDog, well said. I listen with envy to my Dad's motorcycle exploits when in the '40's, he and his friends toured around Europe and there was no one, and they camped in farmer's fields. Now the 'middle of nowhere' is becoming harder and harder to find. What I've learnt is anywhere there's a road, tourists are often right around the border... and alas, I'm one of them.
Lorraine

Yes I see your point Patrick - it was actually Mr Simon who got me thinking about this, as half way through his book he raises the question himself - is he really doing this thing right by staying in hotels - he answers it pretty well - of course he bloody is!

For my part I've found myself getting more and more caught up in the preparation for the trip - I enjoy the prep as much as going - I love devouring all the books, the magazine articles, wandering around camping shops looking at the latest gadget... I'm not made of money but I have spent a fair bit of dosh on kit I'm sure I'll end up leaving at home next time.

It's also become a bit of a competition between riderssometimes I think... 'well I have the XDGHBNSISSS GPS system that integrates GHT with ITH and OWN and then calls my wife to get the coffee on when I'm back in the country'... and that makes me laugh - but I wonder if I'm any better sometimes.

The biggest adventure I've ever been on was when I was 14, 4 of us from school threw our tents and rucksacks on our back and disappeared into the Breacon Beacons for a fortnight - we didn't buy any food, drink or anything else whilst we were up there - we stayed away from any kind of civilisation and had an amazing time - we ate off the land, cleaned ourselves in rivers and spent our time just wandering in the middle of no-where....

Sometimes I think all I've done since then is to re-create that experience.


m

If it feels adventurous?
 

I've just finished reading Ella maillart's "Forbidden Journey" (recommended, by the way). As she set out she wrote home to say "don't expect to hear from us for six months, and don't worry until a year has passed". That is adventure, but it can no longer be done; there is nowhere in the world where you could be so isolated for so long.

When I was still at school I went to the coast with friends several times, but I regard my first real trip as being a journey from Slough to Stafford to see Thin Lizzy. For the first time I was travelling alone and to an area I didn't know. On setting out I was apprehensive but excited, and on my return I felt I had grown by pushing my own comfort zone.

I know all I have done since then is trying to re-create that experience. The difference is that I am (much) older and (maybe slightly) wiser so my comfort zone has grown. Thus to get the same satisfaction I need to go further.

I am also aware that my children need a father more than I need that satisfaction, so I am no longer as adventurous. Perhaps that will change when they are both old enough to stand on their own two feet, or perhaps it won't.

Nailed it... 100% spot on!!! :clap::clap::clap:

Now I know I may get the boot for this.. But this weekend i realised that I am not a Motorcycle Traveler.. Just a traveler that prefers to do it by bike.. this is only because most of my travel has been on foot and I would prefer to travel by foot then not at all... I love overlanding.. and will do it anyway i can.. even by car/bus if i have too... So for me it is the Where and What not so much the how...


:ban: please can i have my bike back now?:helpsmilie::mchappy:

Xander,

Please leave your Africa Twin outside and your riding gear at the door, someone will be by to pick it up shortly.:stormy:

ROFL!!! :clap: :clap: :rofl:

BUS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!

Ye Gods !

Lorraine, don't forget that while others are talking about it you are out there doing it and being true to yourself, and were doing so before it started to become fashionable. While you may not get the public recognition that Ted (great bloke) and others get, you are no less worthy of respect - from me at least - for what it's worth!

Ha, great subject for campfire talk....
 

I agree that it's a current marketing term. People are willing to spend money for what's perceived by others as adventure. I'm not sure what limits are possible. Probably the usual: Milk it until dry and then move on to something else.

Good rant, Patrick. :)

Nice shorty comment, peter. With few exceptions, someone else has gone before. No, we aren't special.

I'll also agree with the 'being a traveler' comments.

Are you buying something, selling something, or doing what you do because it just plain gives you wood?
A mode of living, perhaps?
Some people are more curious than others, and they often look for things out of the norm.
A drink at Senor Frogs or a cold cerveza under a crappy palapa in a fishing village? Having choices are nice.

I don't disparage any person who seeks adventure in their own way.

I find this can be very uncomfortable on the bike, unless of course that's the 'adventurer' part? :innocent:

Should we have to drink our own urine, perform self-amputations, etc to qualify as an adventurist? Hah, i reckon if it's an adventure to you relative to your existing lifestyle then that's what counts. Why do we have to justify ourselves in order to please others? It's the old "i don't acknowledge scooterists on the road - they're not bikers" train-of-thought, if we use 2 (or 3) wheels to get around, having to cope with inclement weather/dopey tin-box drivers/iffy roads etc then we're all bikers.
PS. i'm not a scooterist, but i sure admire those i see buzzing along the motorway loaded up to the hilt to attend a rally on the other side of the country - at 40mph...
Just my two-penneth-worth!:mchappy:

It is an interesting question, to me, if the ride excites you, then it is an adventure. Maybe too simplistic for some.

This is one of those really interesting threads. Thanks for the accolades frinch11. But the comment which has really stuck with me was from TonyP who wrote:

I am just back from 10,000 miles across Russia - about 25% on bad and 10% on very bad or non roads. Others, who havn't done it, call it an adventure but I don't. It was in truth little more than a trip from London to Devon, across part of the moor, and back - 50 times!

I'm very inclined to agree. And then a few minutes ago I read about the little known explorer Frederick George Jackson (see South Pole, North Pole News and Guide) who, "explored Australia on horseback, sailed across the Atlantic on a whaler, made a legendary winter crossing of Siberia, and in his spare time read medicine at Edinburgh University and launched his career as a travel writer." He was also an Arctic explorer. He was born in 1860. When I read this I thought, Has the bar been lowered in the past 150 years?? Is this part of the dumbing down process?

When I/we say, Oh there's no such thing as the middle of nowhere anymore, tourists are everywhere, etc etc.. Is this a cop out? So what if tourists ARE everywhere, and the middle of nowhere is hard to find. Wouldn't it make sense for us to then stretch ourselves further and find more challenging routes, ways to travel etc? And this is NOT to denigrate what anyone is doing presently!!!!!

But I think of T.E. Lawrence for example, and Ted Simon who was the first RTW biker and wonder where/who the new 'real' explorers are? And what the definition of that would be??? I'm thinking aloud here. And hoping I won't be shot down too much on this.... ouch. ;-)

Lorraine

Very cool. And of course there's the Goliath guy, the one walking around the world....
L

In the not so distant future, tune into the TV to watch the parapalegic husband and wife team who are dragging themselves around the world with the use of winches...while being filmed.
The husband is Chinese, a jew and past KBG agent. The wife is Nigerian, hindu, ex-lesbian...and pregnant.

Energy drink and clothing sponsrships are still available....

My, you're in a pissy mood tonight LR. ;-)

I don't think either of the aforementioned travellers are doing this as a publicity stunt. Wallking around the world is an extreme commitment and not something you do for kicks. Difficult to save up for an expedition which takes so many years. Explorers from years ago were either from wealthy families, government or privately funded. I suppose energy drinks and clothing are the modern-day equivilent???

As for my 'dog and pony show,' I'm not sponsored. Don't want to answer to anyone. However, if anyone wants to drop 20 grand my way, we can talk. ;-)
Lorraine

Lorraine,
I'm actually in a very good mood. I was making light, good or bad, of what's perceived as 'extereme'/'real', etc. And the limits, of which there are none.
I have no clue as to your own doggie deal, really, but I do love dogs...and cats...and etc.
It's sometimes difficult to understand the meanings and intentions of people's posts on the Net.

"It's sometimes difficult to understand the meanings and intentions of people's posts on the Net."

Oops, my mistake! Put it down to my being in a city for almost a month. It's obviously getting to me. :-( My apologies for misinterpreting your words.
Lorraine

An adventure exists in one place only- in the mind of whoever is having the adventure. Anyone else's take on that adventure will be inaccurate and worthless- just an inaccurate story.

Been there, done that!
 

LR,

It's been on UK TV! Don't know about the ethnicity etc etc side of this non-story, but they were definitely dragging their sorry backsides across somewhere in Africa in wheelchairs and who knows what else, perhaps as just one more charity based stunt - I really don't know any more because I was not the slightest bit interested, but you know how it is; you turn on a TV for some news and you get inudated with adverts for the latest TV producer's nonsense.
Reality TV is still the biggest thing on the TV in the UK and, if anything, increasing in coverage is my guess; afterall it is cheaper than finding and paying for real talent or reporting factually on interesting/newsworthy events.

So are you saying no one else should comment on the travel reports or ride plans of others?

The only person who can answer the question "What is adventure motorcycling?" to the satisfaction of the person asking, is the person asking.
You can have an opinion and you can comment on anything you like.
The point is that there can never be a definitive answer. So to the question "What is adventure motorcycling?" the most helpful answer I can offer is "Don't ask me"
It's similar to asking "What is happiness?"
I don't mind having your opinion on that Patrick.
I really enjoy your contributions and have found them useful, entertaining and informative.

"What does adventure motorcycling mean to you?" can be answered but was not the question asked.

"An adventure exists in one place only- in the mind of whoever is having the adventure."

If this is not the case then tell me where else it exists.

Spirit?
 

Lorraine - I think you've hit it pretty much spot on - or rather the way I think about it!

I've been reading the Faber book of explorers of late and there are people in there who sailed into the unknown knowing that their crews would hang them on the ship if they sailed 'too close to the edge'. There are people who would start out on a journey REALLY not knowing if they were coming back or what they would find - in my mind that's adventure.

The link to modern day exploration is more strained I think... money and sponsorship has always been an important part... in olden times you would sell your soul to the highest bidder to fund your expedition just so you could go - the sponsor would get land rights, or mineral rights, or just plain old bragging rights - but the explorer would always have to do some work or something to get the money....

Today many people get sponsorship to carry out journeys they otherwise couldn't afford, they sell themselves and their time to get cash and the sponsors get bragging rights and other advertising... it's not that different to the time when.

But the difference today is that none of us really expect NOT to come back from a trip - we accept a certain amount of danger but we really don't think we wont be coming back, and we certainly are not heading into the unknown - I think exploration now is about breaking records and carrying out scientific research in locations otherwise not considered normal.

Top Gear this week features Jeremy and James driving to the North Pole... yes they drove in a car... to the North Pole... WTF!?!?! Is that adventure driving? They made light of the fact that they got there in ease and comfort....

So... I guess after all of this my point is that Adventure Motorcycling today is not about exploration in the wider sense, it's a personal journey that allows the rider to explore their own mind, their comfort zone and how hard they can push themselves beyond the 9-5.

m

If this becomes a bit long (it shouldn’t but just in case) I apologise in advance.

What a great question.

Adventure: noun [C or U]
an unusual, exciting and possibly dangerous activity such as a journey or experience, or the excitement produced by such an activity:

Motorcyclist noun [C]
a person who rides a motorcycle

So, to my way of thinking it is doing something or going somewhere new, which gets you excited both at the prospect and while you’re there. Then choosing to do it on a bike. Simple don’t you think.

However there are some i have found who believe it’s about difficulty, distance, off the beaten track, RTW etc. etc. Personally I would ask them to challenge their own reasons for doing it. Look at all the books Sam’s “Into Africa”, Ted Simons “Jupiter’s Travels” for example. Read them again, it was about discovery, discovery of themselves and how they interact with the world around them. It, I believe, was not about the distance or about being labelled an Adventure Motorcyclist.

Perhaps to some the title “Adventure Motorcyclist” is more important than the journey. Surly a person who has ridden 36k around the world is no better a rider than someone who has done 36k around Europe. They only have different experiences. May I suggest that riding through some back streets of a major European city can be equally if not more adventurous than some of the places on a RTW.

Lastly it would be a sad day if this happy band of wanderers who choose to have their own personal adventures on motorcycles became subject to the same segmented, clicky divisions we experience almost everywhere else in today’s society. Let just be a group of people who get together every now and then, or meet up on the road to share a personal glimpse into our adventures and swap some stories.

Instead of “Adventure Motorcyclist” as I hate being labelled I’m just someone who suffers from Dromomania.

Sorry if this is long but I did warn you.

mattcbf600, I just heard of a book, Out There, In the Wild in a Wired Age, Ted Kerasote - Writings in Nature, The Environment, Indigenous Peoples, and Outdoor Recreation which vaguely pertains to the idea of going into the unknown, and truly not knowing if you were going to return. At the risk of being redundant, perhaps part of what takes the adventure away in the present day is because we are so hooked into being 'in contact.' I know even when I was traveling across the US with a cell phone, when I knew I was going somewhere that didn't have reception, I went through some momentary fears. Not in terms of being somewhere dangerous, but of cutting that umbilical cord. Twenty years ago it could take a month to pick up letters from a poste restante. I doubt 'kids' nowadays even know what that is! ;-) 100 years ago, the letter might never arrive.

However, stepping back in time a hundred years, did Shackleton etc explore thinking they wouldn't return??? Do we consider that now? I'm not sure they ever did, or we do. I wonder if there's an invincibility 'adventurers' feel which transcends eras. And perhaps that invincibility is perhaps what gives people the bravado to go? What does your Faber book say? Of course, the memoirs travelers kept ages ago are different than the ones now. They were more concerned with technical data than 'feelings'.

"...Adventure Motorcycling today is not about exploration in the wider sense, it's a personal journey that allows the rider to explore their own mind, their comfort zone and how hard they can push themselves beyond the 9-5."
Or perhaps that much easier than the 9-5??? Commutes can be gruelling...

kas55-If you're being long-winded, I'm rambling. ;-)

"Surely a person who has ridden 36k around the world is no better a rider than someone who has done 36k around Europe. They only have different experiences."
I would think perhaps different skills. It can take huge amounts of patience to cross some borders... ;-)

"May I suggest that riding through some back streets of a major European city can be equally if not more adventurous than some of the places on a RTW."
Certainly more dangerous!

"Lastly it would be a sad day if this happy band of wanderers who choose to have their own personal adventures on motorcycles became subject to the same segmented, clicky divisions we experience almost everywhere else in today’s society."
I don't think those on this thread are guilty of this. I think we're just philosophizing a bit (escapism) and having fun with an interesting thread. But, I get your point.

Lorraine

Sorry...
 

Yes sorry - I'm very guilty of starting these rambling discussions - I'm the same in the pub after several pints ;-)

Lorraine - yes I see what you're saying, on the trips I'm planning now I've been working hard to make sure I'm never out of contact, making sure I can update my blog and send my photos home, making sure people know where I am at all times... perhaps it would be a 'real' adventure for me if I left it all at home!

As far as the old explorer accounts go - yeah your right - they're very technical - 'today we travelled 20 leagues south until we encountered a land with people who wore no clothes. We landed and told them the Lord would not be happy'.

Feeling invincible? I'm not sure, in older times ship captains would make a point of having their affairs in order before they left, today I doubt any of us would even think of making sure our will was in order and our insurance was up to date.

Kass55 - why didn't I think of that? - just look it up damn it! (much like I had to Dromomania :clap: ) I don't think it's a case of some people being a little snooty about being 'adventure motorcyclist' - although I think there are some people like that - it's more that I caught myself becoming snooty about other people preparations, and their kit and 'they're not really taking this thing seriously' - and I just thought that was insane.... and then that got me thinking... which is always a very very bad idea ! :oops2:

Right, I'm going outside for a cup of tea, I may be some time.

Dromomania. Well that is interesting. This reminds of someone who used to live in Egypt who said, 'The great thing about being an expat is you get to reinvent yourself every time you move.' Perhaps that's an unpsychotic, less 'mental' condition of dromomania.

As for the insurance issues, I know plenty nowadays who DO make sure all their affairs are in order before their departure dates. So there goes my theory of invinsibility. ;-) But it sounded good, didn't it???
Lorraine

Yes sounded very good! Very tough! :rofl:

Am™ ;-)
 

Dare I claim that I first coined the term in the mid 90s? No, I better not but Lorraine's
--- " veering away from your comfort zone."---
is always the way I've defined it. IMO for most of us from the privileged 'West' that means independently travelling in Africa, Asia or Latin America where just regular riding is challenging and unpredictable (partly because we are conspicuous and unusual).
Back in Europe or with support in the 'Adv Zone' it's a holiday or touring. It can be physically demanding but the defining mental challenge is largely missing because what's the worst that can happen? Of course adventures can befall us anywhere but in the A Zone it's guaranteed which is why we are attracted to it.

I agree the A-word is being watered down - it's a look you can buy but that's to be expected; I bet if Golden Wonder sold Adventure Crisps they would be a hit. A mag about trail biking in the US that used to be called Dual Sport News renamed itself 'Adv M'cycle (DSN)'. One story I read was about a bloke who slipped on a log and got lost in the woods one Sunday. A raccoon ran off with his packed lunch and it took him a while to get back to the car.

To me AM is about not being certain how a long journey will work out but taking the chance anyway, cutting loose and putting your faith in your resourcefulness - and encountering the world on the way. Even if we think there are lots of us here on HU, only a tiny minority takes the risk which I believe still takes guts.

Chris S

From the horses mouth himself :wink3: thank you Chris - beautifully put .

Why didn't I think to even ask the gentleman behind Adventure Motorcycling ~ the website of the Adventure Motorcycling Handbook !?

As I head out solo into the Salar de Uyuni and the patchwork of roads south to San Pedro de Atacama, on my fuel-injection 650GS Dakar that doesn't want to start when in the cold and at altitudes above 3000m, I was thinking I was being stupid. Its nice to know I'm just doing the AM thing. :thumbup1:

I just bought another liter of alcohol for my Trangia stove - if the bike won't start, I'll light a fire under it and warm up the engine oil (exhibiting resourcefulness!). At the same time, its potable, made from cane, so if the bike won't start, I may not care.

If not heard from in a few days, send limes :rolleyes2:

Chuck I expect to see your own `Israeli backpacker sans ropa` efforts on the salt flats. :eek:

And no being cold doesn`t cut it. I was damn cold too!

Well I now have my very own definition of Adventure Motorcycling.

This afternoon I've been digging through a huge box of photos my grandmother has given me and came across this

A very young me on a scooter on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

now tell me that's not an adventure!

Also, on some systems turn on the key... wait about 20 secs. then start.

It's a programming thing. In September, 2006, BMW sent out a service bulletin regarding a fix for the 'hard start' problems. With a couple replacement throttle control springs, and a reprogrammed unit, it should be better.

Of course, none of the dealers in Ecuador or Peru know about this. You'd have thought BMW would have clued the high-altitude folks in on this problem of hard starting at altitude - sent them a gross of them springs (for free!) and made sure they had the software update.

I've tried everything you've mentioned - its a problem with the bike - one of the first of the dual spark 2005 models sold in the US. Unfortunately, I've been outside the US for the past year, can't get a fix here in SA. Otherwise, teh bike runs fine at altitude. It just won't start.

(I got me some jumper cables - just need a passing 12v battery and I'm alright).

"As I head out solo into the Salar de Uyuni and the patchwork of roads south to San Pedro de Atacama, on my fuel-injection 650GS Dakar that doesn't want to start when in the cold and at altitudes above 3000m, I was thinking I was being stupid. Its nice to know I'm just doing the AM thing."



This is probably no help whatsoever but last winter my wife's car started exhibiting similar symptoms (without the altitude bit) - would just not start from cold but was then perfectly normal for days before playing up again. We eventually called out the AA and the patrolman checked the usual stuff - sparks, fuel etc. He then poured about 50ml of petrol from a bottle straight down the throttle body and cranked it over. It fired up straight away.
Lesson learnt for me because this is the sort of thing I've been doing for decades with bikes and older cars that won't start but this new fuel injected stuff, it's much more sophisticated and you don't want to mess with it, right? Well it's still an internal combustion engine underneath all the wiring and a bit of "manual override" might be applied now and then. If heating the engine up with the stove is taking too long try tipping some of the Trangia fuel straight into the engine!

Adventure begins... when the money runs out.

"Adventure begins... when the money runs out."

Well said. Or, when the bike/van starts making funny sounds and you pull over and someone else does too t see if they can help. Or you take a 'wrong' turn and get lost. Or you throw away your guide book. Etc. etc etc.

Lorraine

Just back to civilization (Salta, Arg.) from doing the SW of Bolivia (Salar de Uyuni). At the Laguna Colorado stopover (where there's shelter for the traveler), I was able to get a jump from a 4-wheel vehicle. It took about 5 minutes of cranking, but it finally started (probably warmed up a bit from all the cranking). That was at 4600m, and around -10C that a.m. It had been inside the hut all night. I had it parked inside a hostel the night before in San Juan, just south of the Salar where it was under 4000m but the air temp was well above freezing. Started that morning, with a minimum of cranking - no jump required.

The ride was damn tough for a fully loaded 650 (me, the bike, all my gear weigh in at 850 lbs.). Made it without problems, without crashing (one drop) - glad to be out of there!

Now I'm at 1500m and it starts just fine. I shouldn't have any more starting problems - at least not due to the altitude.

Let the next adventure begin! (Ruta 40)

Wow, sounds like a great ride. Where am I off? Are you carrying camping gear?



Total : 760 lbs. ??

First off, you have to actually get on a scale with EVERYTHING to check your weight - one of them roadside scales (I went to the local landfill where the scale was graduated to next 20lbs.).

You'd be surprised how much you weigh in all your riding gear (boots, helmet, suite, armor) another 20lbs. or more (don't forget all that stuff in the pockets you carry while riding).

Next, touratech cases add what? 20+ lbs. with rack. The Touratech/Elkamet fuel tanks are another 20lbs or so with rack - and for the Salar they were full, so thats 22 liters = 22 kilos. I used just over 1/2 my fuel from Uyuni down to the Bolivia-Chile border. From there, instead of having to go to San Pedro de Atacama (where you have to do immigration & customs), I was able to go east directly to Argentina and fuel up some 480 miles from Uyuni. I got to just north of Jujuy that night. I'll hit Chile again from Mendoza - skipping the Atacama Desert.:thumbdown:

I am carrying camping gear - bag (glad I had it the other night!), tent, Thermarest, cook kit and a few cooking items. I have 3 books - LP Backpackers Guide to SA, small English-Espanol dictionary, a novel (currently Whirlwind by James Clavell).

There's extra tools - small rachet/torx/hex bit set, vice grips which I haven't used yet, a few others, some spare parts (levers, cables, spark plugs, a small can of nuts and bolts which I've dipped into several times, mirror bolt and other stuff)

Stuff like the above, you just don't think about, and it adds up.

But, indeed, it is an adventure. Tonight I'm in Cafayate, on Ruta 40, heading south. Another great day of riding.:thumbup1:

Adventure Motorcycling - when you realise you left modern life behind so long ago you are making funny noises inside your helmet because there`s just nothing else to talk about. I do a passable chicken, haven`t perfect a horse yet.

You will catch me in Mendoza it looks like Chuck. Smooth sailing on ashphalt apart from a few assorted sections. If you ask around you can do a detour to the dinosaur bones - 300km north of San Juan.

Near Villa Union on the map, think it is 60kms one-way detour couldn`t do it myself as I have decided I`m late. Didn`t make Mendoza today. Too bloody cold.

from San Juan and glad you`re safe!

Josh, pick up an Ojos de Brujo CD, a very cool Tango band.

Oh dear oh dear! Funny noises in my helmet? I already do that just on the commute to work - what do those long lonely miles have in store for me!?

And being Welsh of course I'd always prefer a good ewe in heat :innocent:

But as for adventure motorcycling - I've decided my butt doesn't need that much adventure and bought this

Dirty naughty rubber toy on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Where are you riding to, Amsterdam?

My word be sure to give us a product review on that. Turning the vibrations into a soothing massage?

My first moto adventures were weekend riding from Glasgow to Glencoe, most weekends summer and winter, (or similar Highland destinations). This was the 1970's, on a shitty old BSA with crap lights, crap brakes, crap everything. Oh and those horrible Avon tyres with the square profile. It was only about 100 miles, but I assure you it was an adventure.

So the definition of adventure is elastic, and its what YOU say it is, for you.

I class adventure biking as going away for more than a few weeks, caus to me, thats just a biking holiday !!

Also, going somewhere unknown where you are exploring and seeing new sights and experiencing new things etc. A bit of risk and uncertainly makes it "adventurous"

Then again, just because you know where you are, doesnt mean its not an adventure.

As someone already said, its a state of mind and all revative to your own experience and dreams.

I guess were all adventurers, just some are more hardcore than others.

We're not hard core, we mostly pee sitting down....but do try to have a good
time

Ain't no trees around that I can see (so easy on the tree huggers).

Must be them damn environmentalists, want to preserve the earth from all the irresponsible developers, wreckless recreationists, the mining and forestry industry before they destroy it all before the next generations get a chance to see what the earth used to look like.

There's not a single user of the land - farmers, miners, forestry, recreation users, land developers - that willingly limits their impact on the environment until the government has to step in and force them to do it. Same goes for the chemical, oil and gas industries - hell, when it comes to industry, they don't willing spend any more than they have to, and spending it on preserving or restoring ain't in the budget unless the gov says so.

God bless the tree huggers.

Hey Quastdog don't classify all farmers as being the same ,some of us do have a conscience and believe it or not - and would ya have guessed - maybe not all govs have their country's best interests at heart .
Come and see Canada the home of phoney baloney .

God bless the tree huggers ,just so long as they don't wanna ban motorcycles .

Treehugger subject moved to new thread
 

Rather than risk banishment or buggery from the enthusiastic police force

For me adventure motorcycling is a state of mind which can occur on a longish trip.

I think the base factors (for me) are that I have to trust my own skills and equipment. The fact that there is impossible to get help (from friends, doctors, mechanics, no phone..) while I am in an unknown area might switch my brain to adventure-mode. If the culture is totally different and I don’t speak the local language the feeling gets stronger.
The logistic (fuel, water, food++ ) is a big factor.

It’s very difficult to get this state of mind if you travel with friend(s), and I have never had it unless there have been things as guns, total mechanical break down or injured people involved.

Pretty often I go on shorter trips in my own country and even if the driving might be pretty technical and far from people and help I wouldn’t call it “adventure motorcycling”, maybe “action touring”…. On these trips there is more focus on the driving. Logistical problems are few.

As an example I would say that riding in the dunes Algeria was “adventure motorcycling” but riding in the dunes in Namibia was not… In Namibia they had doctors, food, beers and even workshops available.
Luckily I enjoy both, but it are complete different situations even if might look similar.

This is just my personal thoughts; I don’t think there is an answer most people can agree on. What is love….?

Is this??????

for me its the dogs bollocks, pure and simple!

Yes Quasto - excellent point and well made.

Like Q, lets all avoid rightwing, neo-con, redneck views about the land and its welfare.
Whats that Woodie Guthrie song? "This land is your land, this land is my land....." etc.

I wholeheartedly agree with you about the thought police who roam around here like hyenas. They cant take a robust point of view but go squealing to mummy every time someone disagrees with them. They should be ashamed to be such mummy's boys.

I dont agree with you about this topic Patrick but hey! thats just fine - neither you nor I are going to whimper and whine like those haters of free speech. And there's plenty of them out there waiting to banish and bugger.

How can these wimps even think about going on a bike trip if they cant even engage in a debate without crying? Pants wetters.....

Good for you P.

Luvvly Jubbly!!!!