Forge a drivers licence ?

[niels]

hi guys,

i hope i dont upset some people here with my unconventionel questions..
but my girlfriend and me really wanna leave next year on may for the americaride. we are really really budget travellers (did a thailand-belgium trip on a ttr250)and wanna save some money on paperworks.
I have my IDP, but she doesnt, she has only the carlicence.a motobike licence will cost her about 1000 euro in france, so.. now i wander if it is possible to do without one (not a single person checked mine in 25000km) or to forge one. is it really needed for the alaska-argentina ride? wich countries will check? anyone some experiences or stories on forging papers?
any advice welcome ;-)

by the way, any other budget tips welcome...

greetz and peace
niels

[Riq]

I don't know about forging papers however in Canada, specifically in the province of Alberta, as long as you have a valid licence your girlfriends car licence acts as her learners permit on the motorcycle. This only restricts you to driving in daylight hours if you should hgappen to get stopped. After that I would simply plead ignorance.

Have Fun
Rick

[Grant Johnson]

Of course we would NEVER suggest forging papers!

Do note that in the US and Canada, if you are stopped by the police you WILL be asked to show licences - and they will be looked at closely. IF it is noticed that she does not have the motorcycle stamp/whatever in her licence, that is the same offence as driving without a licence - and that's expensive.

Surely she can get a mc licence for less than 1000euros somewhere else? For that matter, it's very cheap in Canada and very easy to pass the test. All you need is an address...

Also note of course you MUST have insurance in Canada - Lois Pryce didn't and it cost her $600. USA not necessary in all states, but a VERY good idea.

For Canada and USA insurance see Motorcycle Express - quote Horizons for a discount.(link on the links page)

Needless to say I must recommend doing it right - getting caught isn't fun. In Central and South Amrica no big deal, but Canada and USA it's important to be legitimate.

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Grant Johnson

Seek, and ye shall find.
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One world, Two wheels.
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com

[JonStobbs]

Niels.As you said,the chances of it being checked normally are nearly zero.Where she WILL come unstuck are if she is involved in any accident(even if not at fault).The insurance companies/lawyers involved will look at everything through a microscope to try and avoid having to pay-out,and having no valid license will almost certainly be just what they're looking for.I know in the real world it's not likely(especially if you're going to be riding with her all the time anyway),and i'll stick my neck out here and say that if i did'nt have a license in those circumstances then i certainly do what you propose.But then i'd fully understand what i could loose by doing so.What does she think to your idea?In the end,it's her neck on the line if the worst should happen.Another option which might work is for her to take her test in the UK(or another EU country that's cheaper) if she has a friend here who can co-operate regarding the "home address" bit of the license.Being an ex-motorcycle instructor myself,i can say that if she's got a reasonable grasp of riding a bike,and can speak even a little English,she should have no problem at all in pasing first time.

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Just going for a short ride on my bike....

[Steve Pickford]

I agree with Jon, take the test in the UK. There are several options to choose from.

It's one thing getting caught piloting a bike without a licence, it's a far more serious offence getting caught & then you're found to have deliberately forged a licence, unless of course Third World prisons appeal to you.......

Any insurance you have will invalidated, leaving you personally liable for damages.

On a personal note, I have no time for uninsured riders & drivers. How would you feel if taken out by such a person? How would you pay any compensation?

[PaulJ]

I am not sure it would be much cheaper doing it in the UK. A direct access course probably costs between £500 and £600 and then there's the cost of getting over here and living here while you do the course.

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Africa Trip web journal

[niels]

hi, thanks for the many quick replies...
maybe the option of getting the permit in canada sounds the most interesting (read cheapest) solution. i have some friends overthere and i hope they can check it (price) out for me..
i am also still searching for the cheapest solution for the bikes. maybe also buy them in canada while she takes the test? dont know about the prices and paperwork (pro-contra shippingcost and doability with obtaining one in another country)
i will keep you guys informed with the info if i found something, any other suggestions an advice more then welcome..

thanks guys
greetz Niels

[Simon Kennedy]

I agree with what's been said about legality in the rich world. It is no hard to pick up a licence in north america. Do it.

Elseewhere is another matter. It is worth getting a few copies of your licence made for S America.

A lot of people alos fake an insurance certificate - it is always going to be your fault anyway, so why shell out for a useless bit of paper?

When the cops stop you for an offence they will take your licence and expect you to turn up at the station the next morning to collect it with a bundle of cash to pay the fine. Handing over a fake one will save you this inconvenience.

Big towns in S Am have print shops who'll copy them for a few dollars.

I am not in favour of flouting the law like this normally - most driving rules are actually good sense. But in the poor world it is another matter. No one obeys the rules, and to do so is quite dangerous sometimes. Speeding is a good example.

The numbers posted on the speed limit signs work as a kind of warning, not as a limit: for example, if it says 40, the idea is to reduce everyone's speed from 80 to, maybe, 70. To slow down to 40 would put you in danger from the traffic all around.

You can imagine how that plays out: it means the police can select who they want to give an on the spot fine. And this means the rich foreign bikers.

This is particularly the case on the Pan Am in Peru I found.

Simon

[beddhist]

Think of something else: you will probably want to come back to Europe to live. She will want to continue riding (we hope...). To do so legally she will need a NATIONAL licence, e.g. French. A foreign one will not do. Her insurance will want to see it.

So, why not bite the bullet?

[David and Cheryl Laing]

Dear Neils, Our first trip was for 18 months and we were only asked for our licences once, and that was in Greece. We have been on the road for just over a year this time and no one has asked to see our licences.
But two things......we havent been involved in an accident with other people and really that is when you need all the paperwork you can get your hands on.When it all goes wrong.
And second, trust me, she is going to want to continue riding.....trips like this do not put you off riding as you must have learnt....they just make you want to ride even more....so she really does need a 'real' licence. Wish her good luck....I love to hear of more female overlanders. We will be passing through belgium next week.

[mjp.xrl]

Hi there all.
While we are on the subject off a motorbike license,is there any way that I can do my motorbike license for less than 400 gbp in the uk.I have looked around but the cheapest i can get it for is 450 and that is still to much.
Anyone got any suggestions?
Anything would be appreciated.
Cheers

[davidlomax]

I have posted something similar on this before but I cant remember where, so here goes again!!

If you have a UK car licence and you go to a post office to get an IDP you pay 5 pounds. In the IDP you will find a whole series of stamped sections entitling you to drive pretty much anything. During my previous purchases the good old UK post office have stamped everything in mine. I'm sure I was qualified for fly a jumbo jet by the time they finished!!

This coupled with only the photo section of the licence (omitting the paper detailed section)would be my best UK bet...But I'd NEVER do it myself ;-)....

but if you got caught.......


Dave

[mjp.xrl]

Thanks for the info
Definitly going to give it a try and see wat happens.
Would report back as soon as I have done it.
Cheers
Matt

[JonStobbs]

Matt.Don't know what the normal price is for the complete test in London,but here in West Wales you can do the lot for less than £400.That is the direct access course,including all bike hire,riding gear,test fees,everything.I'd have thought that if you shop around where you are,you should be able to find some cheaper deals as there's more competition than here.My mate at work has just signed up for it,and did his CBT last weekend,after having to listen to my travel stories for ages!

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Just going for a short ride on my bike....

[mjp.xrl]

Thanks for info.
I did a few searches on the net and in the mcn but the cheapest I could find was 450 gbp that is including a cbt.
i have to do the cbt and direct access course and 450 gbp is a bit to much.I was looking for something more around 300 pound mark for both off them.
Know off anything in west wales for that price?
Metropolis bike in london quoted met 650 pound for the cbt and direct access,totally crazy i would say.
Cheers