thoughts on emigration
 

My daughter moved to NZ 4 yrs ago with no plans to return to the UK. I've visited a few times & understand why she loves it so much. But the grass always seem greener when on holiday :)

She marries a Kiwi next year which has prompted discussions of me applying for a visa. I'm lucky(?) to work in IT so have sufficient points to apply as a skilled worker but the process is costly with no guarantee I'll be accepted at any stage nor whether I could obtain a job (re: age).
I have no loyalty to this country; there is no "significant other" and my only other family is a sister & niece.

In my 20's, I emigrated to Germany but due to divorce it was a short-lived experience. However, I found it reasonably easy to live abroad (pre EU).

Have you migrated? Would you? & if yes, where to? Pro's / Con's?

I'm hoping that someone will offer advice / share their experience which will prompt me to make a decision before the opportunity window expires :confused1:

Kiwi eh ?
 

First of all if your thinking of moving to NZ you really must learn the New Zealand national anthem "I Guess thats why I call Australia home" secondly the weather is a bit like where you come from so you will feel at home anyway.
Finally where you live is where your happy & that is usually with family. So start eating Fushnchups & get ya pommy arse over there & be part of ya daughters life....you won't regret it (unless you decide to follow the all blacks)
Not to mention it actually maybe the most beautiful country in the world, but if you tell a Kiwi that I will deny I said it !!!!
Cheers
paul

good and bad
 

Hi

I migrated to Australia in 1992, had wife & family. with me. I was 31 at the time and keen to take on new things. Dealing with an industry that was 15 years behind UK was frustrating but I kept on and found a new direction. I have my own business and earn good enough living and can afford to come home to UK every now and then.

If you can fully adopt all the values and irritating things about leaving home then you will be fine. You have to give it at least two years though. Not sure about living in NZ, I've been on holiday there and it seems nice, nice people etc.

I think even after this time I'm still about 60/40 in favour of Australia vs Scotland. I've known some people migrate here to last 5 days, some 2 years and some would never go back. You have to try it. what have you got to lose?

I can only speak for Australia but, I think at my age now I'd struggle with all things aussie and probably return home to UK frustrated at some of the social issues here. No decent pub culture, the telly and radio is complete shit and newsprint not much more intellectual than the beano. I've heard UK has gone a bit simpler as well.

Its good for unskilled people here, they earn a wage for simple unskilled work that they would never earn in UK. More qualified people tend to have to fight for recognition of qualifications, despite their knowledge being way above that of the local education. Some get frustrated and leave their profession or the country altogether.

I'm looking to buy a house in Scotland so that I can some place that is mine there. I'll still live here but need that thing familiar I can touch there.

The true test of how settled people are is: "would you die here"? strange question but most say "no way" Proves to me where their heart lies.

This is just my experience, I have a mate who hates UK and would never go back, he even sounds Australian and came same time as me and only a year or two younger, so there ya go.

I think you have to try it, what do you have to lose?

I'm in a similar boat, only I'm not fortunate enough to have a skill that gives me enough points. I left UK at 18, a young soldier sent to Germany. Being in the army in a different country was no great deal, I did not have to learn the language, but I met a girl and decided to stay after my service finished. I've lost her now and I'm still here.
Cant stand the UK as I've been away too long.

The question "would you want to grow old and die here" I'd have to say no way in Germany and no f******** way to UK. I'm going to NZ over xmas, initially it was a look / see and then to make plans to emigrate. Now I'm not sure, I'm going walkabout next spring to try and find "Home"

I hope you find a place for your heart that you can call "home"

Nick

I left the UK and moved to Australia (Perth) with work, at the start it was great and i loved it but after about 6 months the honeymoon period had worn off

I am a Oil/Gas offshore worker so i am use to my time off as i mainly work a maximum of 6 months a year and have always traveled.

In Australia i was very limited to where i could travel to due to the long flights and on my time off i would also get asked to come into the office so any travel plans would be shit canned

I was on a 457 visa so you are only limited to so many days you can leave Australia to gain full permanent status (PR) in a 2 year period and after that if you would want to gain citizenship it is the same again for another 2 years.

At first this was my plan to fully move over, i had to fly from Perth to Darwin alot which took around 3 hour 40 minutes (prop aircraft) which is roughly the same time a flight takes from London to Moscow (Turbine aircraft)

After awhile i soon realized how lucky i had been to be living in Europe as there are so many interesting countries i have never seen which are so close as living in Australia which is a massive country made me open my eyes to this

For me at my age (30) not being able to fully travel due to being kind of chained to work was one of my deciding factors to leave and come back to the UK.

Since then i am back in the UK working less than 6 months a year and just finished my first motorbike trip visiting all the interesting places i dreamed off whilst in Oz

I meet some great friends in Australia and being there for just under 2 years change me into a better person so i don't regret going there but for my circumstances being back in the UK is better... for the time being :innocent:

For unskilled workers it is very good but in all the cost of living is very high compared to the UK so really it kind of equals its self out.

I also prefer the weather of the East coast of Scotland :thumbup1:

If you're unhappy at home, you'll be unhappy in an adopted country.

I reckon the first rule of migration is "keep your negative opinion of your adopted country to yourself" - if you hate the place, fine then leave.

Second rule "whenever a local ask's how you like the place?" - you always love it. This one simple statement will open doors to a social life that will let you truly love the place, your circle of friends will expand and you'll get introduced to places/things that takes the locals years to find/do. You have to remember that you are not unique - many millions have gone before and will have tainted the locals views - hence the "whingeing pom" tag in Australia.

Third rule "become a citizen as soon as you're able to" - keep your old citizenship if allowed, but do the people of your adopted country the courtesy of taking part in their society fully - they'll appreciate you even more. It also confers great responsibility - you can now abuse the local politicians at the pub!!

Emigration
 

Do it- you are already halfway there!

Based on my personal experience (UK to Norway) there will be ups and downs, and you should keep away from ex-pat communities. In my opinion they are rather sad, hankering after an England that never was, and running down their new country and its people.

Good luck with your new horizons.

Peter, in Oslo

I've left & returned to the UK several times and currently reside, for part of the year at least, in Canada. I am currently pondering the wisdom of a total and permanent relocation......

My advice would be:

1. Don't make any irreversible decisions e.g. if you own property and like it, rent it rather than sell it.

2. Keep your UK bank accounts and credit cards.

3. Sell as much non-sentimental stuff as you can e.g. esp big depreciating items like vehicles.

4. If you can maintain a sterling income stream, do so as it mitigates financial risk.

IMHO - pros - myriad, from meeting new people to drinking new beer to having an adventure etc etc; cons - none.

I say go for it - if it doesn't work out you can always come back.....

I emigrated to he US over 8 years ago and dontregret it. Miss a decent pub and good sport - rugby for me. Go home to visit familt every 2-3 years. I left lock, stock and barrel and am now a US citizen. Regrets, only not seeing the family as often as I would like, but Skype helps. Good micro brews around, no pub culture, and at 51 I can still play rugby here now and again!!! Oh and they drive on the wrong side of the road, but after 8 years, well:thumbup1:

love it or leave
 

good points & agree with some rogerM.

I have to be honest and as I said many times I'm 60/40, sometimes 70/30 or the reverse. No today I'm 55/45. There is the turmoil in my soul.

The aussies are very tolerant and put up with a lot from migrants, perhaps more than we in UK would.

Yes I do love bits of it, bits of culture, people, the weather mostly but have a few moans as well. No one here wants to hear this so i don't talk to Aussies about it anymore.

I feel I'm not allowed to criticize anything Australian for fear of being told "love it or leave". I tend to shy of conversations with Aussies when it comes to things contentious like that as it sometimes ends up in "well if you don't like it - leave then" so I never really connect with the locals fully to some extent. Despite living as a citizen and paying taxes here for 21 years does not qualify me to voice a negative opinion. There are other cultural and intellectual differences too but you have to change your ways a little to fit in.

There is good and bad being a migrant and those who have never done so would never understand. Not trying to be some sort of smartass here so apologies in advance, but immigrants will know exactly what I'm saying. also you'd be amazed at what stupid ridiculous things you miss from home. Usually they are stupid and blown out of all proportion. e.g. white sheep, sparrows, decent pubs, UK humour, danish bacon and sausages, yes don't laugh but there it is.

I also appreciate what its like to see immigrants take over your country, I'm from UK after all.

I understand the 6 month thing, I loved it for first 3 months then at about 6 months hated the place. I was going to stick it out for 2 years regardless and pulled through.

This thought doesn't really rule my life, but in a way, I don't really belong here, sadly I don't belong there either. I reckon the transit lounge of Singapore airport is where i'll be buried.

hang on a minute, I belong on my bike for gawds sake!

Thought provoking comments, thank you :)

I don't even know the British one! ;)
I don't know what that means. Do I care where I die? Not really, I'll be dead. However, I do care how & when (on my bike, somewhere beautiful & when I'm a lot older) :)
Here, you have a point. Apart from my childhood home, I've never felt settled anywhere. Currently in my 14th abode since leaving my parents & I've never been in the forces! Perhaps I'm part gypsy :cool4:
I only partly agree because the reasons for being unhappy are complex. I miss my daughter, we have a close relationship & whilst Skype is great, it's not the same. But I've also become cynical about Britain, the EU, my employer, banks & occasionally, so-called friends!
I have no choice but to sell up so I have to think of this as a "no going back" move.
Parts of the UK are incredibly over-populated and multi-cultural to the extreme but the majority of us remain very tolerant. In general we don't say anything outright in fear of being labelled racist or a bigot then taken to court! Many nations could be quite out-spoken & nothing would happen to them! :ban:
I'm not a pub person & never drink tea so won't miss either.
I'm at my happiest when riding my bike so I can live anywhere that offers this freedom, but more so if they have wonderful vistas and great cafes. NZ has these :clap:
I will miss the easy opportunities to visit EU countries :confused1:
NZ has Sand Flies which love to bite me :thumbdown:
& I worry that the minute I migrate to NZ, she'll find a job in the UK! doh

They bite everybody, even the Kiwis! In some places they have a "Sandfly Bar", "The Sandfly Caffee" and "The Sandfly Petrol Station"... Sometimes we put our compete Gear incl Helmet IN THE TENT B4 putting it down...

Good luck, we are on our way to NZ as well! Maybe c u there!

Cheers Sascha