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  #16  
Old 31 Oct 2011
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Common sense is welcome along any footpath, bridleway, B.O.A.T or green lane whether on foot,horseback,two or four wheels.
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  #17  
Old 31 Oct 2011
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Originally Posted by palace15 View Post
WTF, There are SEVEN days in a week so no compromise, BOATS that they are on about are OPEN to ALL traffic 24/7, they either put up with it or move.
Now there's a tolerant, mature attitude

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  #18  
Old 31 Oct 2011
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What I find interesting is that some people on this m/c (predominantly) and 4x4 (to a lesser extent) travel forum think it’s ok to prevent their fellow m/c&4x4 travellers from using their legal (taxed/road-worthied/insured) motor vehicle on a legal (green a.k.a non paved) road.

How would you feel if when you’re travelling through other parts of the world to be restricted to pavement only? You then can all safely sell your “dual-sport” (FWIW the BMW GS moniker stands for Gelaende/Strasse = offroad/ onroad) bikes and get a road bike because you won’t need the better suspension/off road capabilities.

Trans Africa pavement only?

Ruta 40 pavement only?

Mongolia pavement only?


etc


etc




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  #19  
Old 31 Oct 2011
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The number of miles BOATS is miniscule compared that of bridleways and footpaths. There is no need to exclude vehicles from what little access they have. I am a TRF member and I do not go out on the lanes looking for awkward bits to negotiate leaving a trail of destruction in my wake. I go out to enjoy the countryside and my motorcycle. It is TRF policy to stop, kill engine and remove helmet when a horse and rider is spotted and not to proceed again until it is well out of the way. It is also TRF policy to keep below 20mph. There are some that do not comply with this of course, but they are a minority. The TRF are also conscious that large groups of bikes can annoy therefore will split into smaller groups if necessary.
If all users just exhibited common courtesy to each other there would not be an issue.
4x4 use is a little different in my opinion as they can cause some horrible damage if the drivers don`t show a bit of common sense when the ground is very soft.
In my opinion the villagers in the programme were just typical of people who have too much time on their hands and they came over simply as `nimbys`
The byways were there when they bought their house. As said above, If they don`t like it they should move.
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  #20  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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I watched the programme and, yes, the trf have it right.
Welcome to the TRF
There would be no point at all in giving up the legal right to transit byways open to all traffic (BOATs) - the name says it all - when there are so many vested interests intent on denying this legal right.

Yep, there are probably a few 100 miles of BOATs in the UK, 1000s of miles of bridleways for the horse community (and the walkers) and 10s of Ks of footpaths.

The so called green lanes were never designed for any particular use, having come into being before the concept of design, as the word is used in the modern way. The Peak District NP rights of way people appear to have done a good job, on what is sure to be a limited budget, and have upgraded sections of some of the BOATs that are most worn by modern traffic; that is design with the intent of providing "fitness for purpose". An alternative would be to expend a lot more cash on providing a modern highway with pavement/running surface designed to sustain the traffic. The programme hinted at some of the tensions that are sure to exist between the NP authority and the highways authorities covered by the NP over this issue.

Also, the programme showed the Peak District NP staff have done a good job to date of balancing the views expressed to them while meeting their remit to facilitate access to the park by all of the public and not just the persons with vested interests who reside there.
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  #21  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by chris View Post
What I find interesting is that some people on this m/c (predominantly) and 4x4 (to a lesser extent) travel forum think it’s ok to prevent their fellow m/c&4x4 travellers from using their legal (taxed/road-worthied/insured) motor vehicle on a legal (green a.k.a non paved) road.

How would you feel if when you’re travelling through other parts of the world to be restricted to pavement only? You then can all safely sell your “dual-sport” (FWIW the BMW GS moniker stands for Gelaende/Strasse = offroad/ onroad) bikes and get a road bike because you won’t need the better suspension/off road capabilities.

Trans Africa pavement only?

Ruta 40 pavement only?

Mongolia pavement only?


etc


etc




Within the UK you have only to go as far as Scotland to experience this type of limitation on vehicle access rights.
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  #22  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Bruce P and Maja, Whats it like to be so 'self righteous'?
I don't know.

What is it like to be so self centered ?

:-P
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  #23  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by *Touring Ted* View Post
Arguing on who has the right gets nobody anywhere..

What are the possible solutions ??

Personally I think that there should be dedicated days that off-roaders are allowed to use the green lanes. Tuesdays and Sundays for example.
But I like to walk on Sundays, and I am not retired. Can we restrict the bikes and 4x4s to Tuesdays and Thursdays please ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Touring Ted* View Post
That way there are plenty of days in the week for the ramblers to enjoy their retirement in total peace and if they chose to use the lanes on the motorised days, then it's really their own choice.

There needs to be a compromise. Sadly, there are too many people for this country and anything green is quickly being built over or developed.
And there is the problem. Shall we change the subject to building on Brown belt land ?

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Originally Posted by *Touring Ted* View Post
The problem is only going to get worse. If you blanket ban the bikes and cars they will only find illegal places to ride where people really will get hurt.
Or, they may find legal places. There is nothing to stop an enterprising land owner from setting up an off road course.

Or, demand to be treated like skateboarders and have the local council build a site on common land.
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  #24  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by chris View Post
What I find interesting is that some people on this m/c (predominantly) and 4x4 (to a lesser extent) travel forum think it’s ok to prevent their fellow m/c&4x4 travellers from using their legal (taxed/road-worthied/insured) motor vehicle on a legal (green a.k.a non paved) road.
I'm not sure why it surprises you, I ride a motorbike but do not watch motorbike racing.

Just because it is legal, does not make it right.

And if you watched the program some of the bikes in use were not legal, failed horns and illegal plates. Small matters maybe, but still illegal. If it is not legal, is that right ? :-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris View Post
How would you feel if when you’re travelling through other parts of the world to be restricted to pavement only? You then can all safely sell your “dual-sport” (FWIW the BMW GS moniker stands for Gelaende/Strasse = offroad/ onroad) bikes and get a road bike because you won’t need the better suspension/off road capabilities.
If they had such laws, you should keep to them. However, a lot of countries have a different attitude to open spaces, national parks. A lot of countries have more space available. A lot of countries have less walking paths and more "off road paths" (IMO).

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Originally Posted by chris View Post
Trans Africa pavement only?

Ruta 40 pavement only?

Mongolia pavement only?
If they actually had paved routes ... er, yes, why not ?
Not every one wants to "go off road".
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  #25  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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And don't we know it...

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Originally Posted by Walkabout View Post
Within the UK you have only to go as far as Scotland to experience this type of limitation on vehicle access rights.
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  #26  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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I'm quite surprised by the number of people on here who are suporting a ban on trail riding!
There is perhaps an argument for closing some routes in the wetter months to protect the environment, but most of the campaign groups seem to be using the green argument to cover their own interests of wanting the place to themselves.
There are plenty of trails and footpaths for walkers to use if they don't want to mix with the odd motor vehicle.
And let's not confuse responsible trail riding with the real cause of the problem who are the irresponsible off-roaders who don't ride courteously and don't stick to the legal trails. These riders are aggravating the situation for all the considerate and legal riders.
Horse riders and mountain-bikers may feel they can side with the ramblers at the moment to try rid the trails of motorized vehicles but once we've gone they will be next in the firing line.
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  #27  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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will someone PLEASE take that F--king Whistle off Joyce...
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  #28  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by mustaphapint View Post
I'm quite surprised by the number of people on here who are suporting a ban on trail riding!
Not me... I ride trails whenever I can, but I live in a place that is not pressed for space like the UK and the walkers give you a wave and a "bonjour" as you pass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mustaphapint View Post
And let's not confuse responsible trail riding with the real cause of the problem who are the irresponsible off-roaders who don't ride courteously and don't stick to the legal trails. These riders are aggravating the situation for all the considerate and legal riders.
And that, really is the problem, Here we are allowed to use the footpaths as wellas are the horses and cyclists. Abuse it though and things will change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mustaphapint View Post
Horse riders and mountain-bikers may feel they can side with the ramblers
That happened here a few years ago, but the walkers took it a step further and wanted ALL forms of transport banned... cycles, horses, the lot. Needless to say, those groups joined the trail riders and it was squashed.

Biggest problem here is getting shot by the hunters. Pastis is liberally imbibed before they go out

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  #29  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by palace15 View Post
Bruce P and Maja, Whats it like to be so 'self righteous'?
What´s it like to be so self righteous? Pretty cool, especially here in Chile where I am at present riding on big boy´s dirt roads and offending no-one. Ride safe.

p.s. like the pun?
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Last edited by maja; 1 Nov 2011 at 19:34. Reason: spell checj doesn´t work
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  #30  
Old 1 Nov 2011
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As much as I respect 1 groups so called "rights" over another, the paths of the peaks and dales were *not* meant for 4x4 or bike riding. I'm not even sure I find push bike riding acceptable.

Green lanes are for horses, cattle etc. Routes for farmers etc.

ILets face it, the only reason a 4x4 or bike goes there is to find the rough bits and go through them, making them worse.

There are sections of the Berwyns that are now nearly un-walkable due to the deep ruts cut into the, by off road vehicles.

There is only 1 simple easy solution IMO, and it is not to ban vehicles or a group of people.

For the sake of the environment, just make the national parks "zero emission zones".

Job done.

:-)
Does this mean that you wont be putting your name down for one of our Bunkhouse Trail riding meetings

I love the last Line... "For the sake of the environment, just make the national parks "zero emission zones". !!!!
You cant park anywhere in the yorkshire Dales NP in the summer because all the Enviroment friendly Ramblers pack the place with their cars..Drive 20/30/40 miles to park up and walk 5 miles and then moan about any other group useing the NP...Hypocrites....

I have been working and riding Yorkshire Dales area for 30 years, and I can say that the most complaints come from Townies , {Outsiders that have moved into the NP.} they even complain about Farmers getting Muck on the roads and Cows making a Noise...the Locals tell them ...If You Dont Like it F--k Off Back to the Town you came from.

I say...Live and Let live... when Leigh and I go walking, were smart enough to walk on FOOTPATHS there easy to find as they are over 140.000 miles of them , and we never have to come in contact with 4x4 or motorcycles.

When I go trail riding I only ride on Legal Trails.. {nick name Green Lanes }... so why is it that a walker thinks he or she as the right to stand in front of us to block our way ? If you try to do that on your High street. I should think that the police would take you away .


Dazzer.... Trail Rider.

Last edited by Dazzerrtw; 2 Nov 2011 at 11:16.
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