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TS185ER Ultimate long-distance weapon??
We have our bike now, and I have now started on the process to ready them for the ride from here in NZ to UK (except for the wet bits). Why a TS185? If you are asking that question, you are in good company. Many are
asking us that. I had a list of things that I considered important for a bike to use on a long distance ride thru the kind of roads and countries that are between here and there. We have many overland travellers stay with us over that last three years and using their words of wisdom and my own 35 years experience of riding on and off roads (I learnt to ride at 7 years old and rode almost daily for 9 years before I ever rode on a sealed surface) helped guide the choice. The bike must have the following attributes; 1) Reliable 2) Carry one person and reasonable amount of gear. 3) Light in weight (for m'lady who is a little 'un) 4) Easy to fix 5) Simple design 6) Economical on fuel 7) 350km Range on a tank 8) Spares easily available 9) Low seat height (see 3) above) 10) Adequate power 11) Comfortable 12) Easy to modify 13) Cheap to buy (Carnet etc in mind) 1) Reliable To address 1), I used to be a farmer and had the farm version of the TS185 for 12 years. In that time I had 3 on the farm, usually two at a time and know that they are one of the most robust and reliable bikes ever made. I have never had a crank, clutch or transmission fail. They were used every day for hours a day on the farm in all conditions from dusty summers to axle deep in mud and cowshit all winter. They were idled for hours behind walking cows and then trashed until the spark-plug electrodes melted together (True!! It happened several times). 2) Carry one person and reasonable amount of gear. Re 2) The TS185ER has a short two person seat with a large gap between the end of the seat and the end of the mudguard with the taillight. Part of the deal on the bikes meant that a well made Smiths carrier was included. While being heavy-ish (made of steel tube), they are easy to repair and well proven on farms all over NZ. There is also a proper sub-frame to support it and the rear guard, which is also going to be easy to strengthen. A smallish topbox, some custom made alloy panniers styled as much as possible on the Al Jesse panniers I have on the F650 will be made, and with a toolbox-cum-engine protector (wide enough to also act as crash protection) and some frames either side of the tank for panniers should see enough stow space. The plan is for my bike to carry 60% of the gear, and Kitty's 40% with the dual seat still fitted to carry the two of us when needed. 3) Light in weight Re 3): Being a 185cc two stroke they are certainly light, and slim, but with a fairly large frame they are still a proper bike to ride. Standard with all fluids they are 110Kgs. Being light and narrow they will be easy to freight, get in and out of doorways in hotels, guest houses, and alleyways, and of course stand up if when they go down. 4) Easy to fix Re 4): Hey, they are single cylinder air-cooled two-strokes, with cable operated clutch and brakes! You can strip out and rebuild the clutch, carbie, and both brakes in under an hour. The top end can come off and be back on in less than 15 minutes! I rest my case! Many components are common to a wide range other small Suzuki's (and other brands too!) Having been the person who did all the repairs on my own and most of my neighbours bikes when I was farming I know there will be very little that I cannot do myself easily. 5) Simple design Re 5); See Re 4) and then add bullet-proof electronic ignition, cable drum brakes, no rear suspension linkages (dual shocks so should on fail there is still one to help take the load), standard sized tyres and bearings, no water cooling, no hydraulics, no DOHC etc.... Need I go on? 6) Economical on fuel Re 6); Hmmmm... this is where a two-stroke is marginal... so far I am getting about 26km/l. I am sure any increase in efficiency as the bikes are run in would be off-set on a trip by the extra gear. I don't expect to get better than that. Still, it is about 6-8km/l better than I get with the F650. 7) 350km Range on a tank Re 7); Relates a lot to 6) but the standard 7litre tank will have to go. The farm version (TF185) has a 13litre tank and will fit without major mods, but at 25km/l that is still short of my 350km range. I could carry a spare can with about 3 litres, or more probably I will add small additions to the underside of the 13 litre tanks, as they are steel and will be easy to weld to. Is 350km enough? Too much? 8) Spares easily available Re 8); The Suzuki TS/TF185 and variants has been in continuous production since 1971!! They have been sold all over the world and are still sold in many countries new. They have many components in common with other Suzuki models. Many parts like bearings, seals and brake parts are standard to bikes of a number of brands in all the countries we are likely to travel through. Not only that but the technology will be familiar to anyone we need to help us. Tyres are a common size so will be cheap and easy to obtain. 9) Low seat height Re 9); 820mm with some room for improvement there too. Standard things like raising the forks in the clamps and fitting shorter rear units when we fit some decent after-market shocks should see Kitty's bike down to under 780mm. A lot better than the likes of an XT600 at 855mm. 10) Adequate power Re 10); Now this is where I am sure there will be dissent. What is adequate power? After having at least 20 Round-The-Worlders staying with us at times over the last 3 years, and riding with them, my guess is the average speed of most travellers, wether they are riding R1150GSs or DR230s, or anything else in between, is between 70 and 90 km/hr. The TS with 18HP will top out at around 125km/hr. I don't think touring at 80-85 km/hr is an unrealistic expectation. With the luggage off, they will make great bikes for exploring the more out-of-the-way places when we have set up camp. 11) Comfortable Re 11); Again a Hmmmmm. I am fitting the TF185 single saddle to my bike as I will have a bigger top-box covering the pillion seat. This means I will have most of the weight. The standard seat is no better than most traillie seats, but I am hoping with a sheepskin it will be OK for Kitty. The single saddle from the TF185 is designed for a farmers butt to be comphy all day so I am sure it will be as good as I can get. The footpegs are lower than most trail bikes so it is more roomy than you might expect. The little single does make more than its share of vibes, so I am going to weight the handlebars until things settle down. Softer heated grips are a must too. Not ideal but acceptable. 12) Easy to modify Re 12); There is always something to do here with any bike I think. Some good rear shocks, tool carrier/engine protector/front and rear panniers. Modified TF185 fuel tanks and seat, stock TF185 handlebar and headlight protector. Heated grips. A top box. Home made chain oiler. Reinforced subframe. Clean up the ports and maybe a very mild port job. What else? 13) Cheap to buy Re 13); This is one of the best things about the whole project! The cost of the bikes new here in NZ, including two spare knobbly tyres, two different spare back sprockets, one spare front sprocket, new DID O-Ring chain and Smith rear carrier was NZ$3295 (US$1700 at today's rate) including taxes. This was a special deal as I have done a lot of work for the dealer over the years, often working odd hours, to keep their computers going. List price is NZ$4400. This made all the difference when we were considering wether to take one bike or two. These two small bikes will not be much more expensive to freight than one larger bike (such as a BMW R1150GS). OK, I'm the first to admit there are good things about bigger bikes too, but egos aside, if the 185s are as reliable for me as the ones I used to run, then I honestly think these are the best bikes for the trip. I am very interested in what all you more experienced travellers have to say. Regards Nigel in NZ --"Ride tall, ride small"-- ------------------ [This message has been edited by Nigel Marx (edited 26 February 2003).] [This message has been edited by Nigel Marx (edited 27 February 2003).] |
Good choice Nigel!
I raced a TS185 very successfully - in 1972/73 - and it never let me down. Bullet-proof, even hopped up and flogged hard in cross-country racing / ISDT qualifier stuff. There was a large plastic tank available then, no idea if it still is, from a US company. As for speed of a small bike against a little bike on the long road, a Japanese woman travelling RTW with a friend on Honda CT90 "postie bikes" met up with some travellers on big trail bikes - 600cc +, and travelled with them through a part of Africa. When asked about speed of the CT90's against the big bikes, she said (essentially - I have the quote somewhere...) "we travel about the same distance per year..." I would suggest seeing about better rear shocks, and do as suggested for all touring bikes - get some of the weight forward via tank panniers. Also a container to carry good 2 stroke oil is probably a good idea - again, carried well forward. Otherwise I think it's a great choice. Looking forward to hearing more about your adventures on the road! Are you doing a website or do you want a blog? ------------------ Grant Johnson Seek, and ye shall find. ------------------------ One world, Two wheels. www.HorizonsUnlimited.com |
Hi Grant.
Yes, I agree about the standard shocks. I have my eye on some Hagon off road shocks for NZ$375 (under US$200) for a pair. With a bike that is about half the weight of most travellers bikes, I am sure the shocks will get an easier life. I have a plan for some tank panniers in mind, with a frame fixed to the tank, engine bars and bike frame that extends slightly forward of the tank and forks,with clearance for turning of course, as the tank is quite small (short). There is not much room for a tank bag/tank pannier arrangement without going forward. A supply of good two-smoke oil is a good idea too. I had in mind a custom built alloy container under the front of one bike's engine, and a similar container but for tools etc under the other bike. But I am sure things will evolve as time passes and no plans are fixed yet. regards Nigel in NZ --"How can I be lost if I don't care where I am?"-- |
Hello Nigel and Kitty
Wow, congratulations on your decision. I know that you thought long and hard about it. I would first like to apologize for not writing you guys sooner to thank you for your warm hospitality in NZ. On another note. Remember Melie's Suzuki DR 200. The little princess has 45000 klms on it and has no signs of stopping. So far we have: Replaced battery Replace headlamp Replaced front brake pads. Replaced original chain and sprockets Replaced frt sprocket fastening bolt (fell off!) Adjusted the valves once. THATS IT! The bike burns about a cup of oil every 4000 klms. Melie has crashed the thing more times than I can count ( I would have quit riding long ago if I crashed as much as her in the first few months). The bike has no crash damage, I repeat the bike has no crash damage. Not even the mirrors or turnsignals We attribute this to the soft saddlebags that we used. The bags and the flyweight of the bike saved it everytime. Sure the bags got torn and ripped off the straps etc, but We are certain that had they been alum boxes Melie and the bike would have faired ALOT worse. Nigel, I know that you know the whole bag vs box issue, but for a learning rider that often puts an errant foot down at inopportune times, a solid piece of box is much less forgiving. Topboxes are nasty things if you decide to let go of the bars and the bike wants to travel a few more meters on its own. We had a small top box made out of cordura and put a smaller sealable plastic type lunchbox inside it to protect our goodies. I learned to sew as well. The weight was reasonably well balanced and required no rear rack. We never cracked the rear frame. The dr200 never had crashbars for the engine, and it was skinny enough that we felt they weren't needed. Handlebar protection is needed. THey also keep your hands out of the windchill. A few points to ponder: vibration, yes but not as bad as my new KTM. Foam grips, good padded gloves, rubber dampened footpegs and the seat. Would adding a bit of weight to the flywheel/magneto help? Electrics, enough watts to run heated grips with headlight on. Can headlight be turned off? Is there an oil filter, at least a magnetic drainplug? We never had any overheating problems, but we are 4 strokers with 800 ml sump. Melies bike was asthmatic before we found a drill to open the airbox. You may need to put some kind of snorkel on the baffle to keep the bike from drooling goo all over your stuff. Drum brakes last 2 days short of forever. Economy of motion. Hmm got me there. They could be a bit thirsty at speed. 2 stroke oil can be found almost anywhere. I wouldn't worry too much about carrying liters of the stuff. You want to be as light as bearably possible. We were very impressed with Melie's bike. If it wasn't for my ego, I would say it was the best touring rig that we came across in SE Asia. The power was good enough to maintain 95 kmh throughout Australia. I didnt even change stock gearing. The bike was a bit hard to accelerate to a floating speed on the loose sand and took some flogging. Melie said she would have liked a bit more horsepower then(after she beat my Dr 600, a Dr 650 and an 1150 to the top of Cape York!) We never overheated it. Long steep uphills at altitude with head winds took a bit more patience, but we were still passing trucks. Be very careful about the security of your machines. They are much closer to what us 'common' people use and a lot more desirable than that big intimidating fuel injected digital whatzit 1000 that don't have a kickstart. Theft could be an issue. Frankly I had been dreaming of taking Yamaha Dt 175s around the world for the same reasons as you two. I think it is one of the most practical bikes you can ride. You will never turn your back on a road because your bike is too big and heavy. Anyway, I am starting to ramble. Let me know if you have any questions. take care, mike and melie |
Hi Mike and Melie.
Thanks for your kind words and encouragement. I am glad that Melie's bike has worked out so well. I know you were considering it as a "starter" bike for her but were reconsidering while you were here. I have always been a fan of small bikes so it was no "leap of faith" for me to go down that road. So far Melie's is the only long distance bike under 600cc that has graced our garage, and I had even mis-remembered it and talked of it as a DR230. As to your advice; I will head it well and have now changed my plans for Kitty's bike. Soft panniers for her to start with and if they turn out well, I will make some for mine too. I have seen some fine stainless steel soft bag security protectors that might be the go with them too. I will also head your advice about bike security too. Some good cable locks will be included in the budget. Being small I hope we can put them under cover or inside hotels more often which will also help. But fuel economy is still a worry. As the bikes are now more run in and I ride at about 80km/h the milage has dropped to around 24km/l. I can see some customing of fuel tanks in my future. I had come to the same conclusion about a snorkel for the exhaust as even the number plate is splattered now. I have also got an email from some interesting sounding chaps who is doing some serious miles on two TF125 Suzukis. 25,000km with no problems so far, in Africa and Asia. May the faith spread! *grin* Regards Nigel in NZ --"How can I be lost if I don't care where I am?"-- |
hi all,
yes, I agree - very good choice ! and thanks again for the invitation to nz, but I had spend to much time in oz and wanted to get to South America. for my girlfriend we bought a xr200r (made in Brazil) in buenos aires - fantastic bike. Only the crankshaft bearings were bad quality, but easy to replace in Brazil. I guess you will find two stroke oil all along the way, but better to carry a liter. and with the money you save, not taking the bmw, you can return via South America to NZ ... greetings from Sao Paulo MIKA ------------------ |
Nigel,
Just a small point, but you might want to consider U-Locks for bike security......having seen several cut cable locks lately lying forlornly on the ground, I now use a simple one through my back wheel. It makes the heavy end non-wheelable and will slow down anyone without friends and a truck. I like yellow (avoids abrupt stops because you can't forget it as easily). Terry. |
TS185Errr very easy to fix..I seized mine in city traffic ..overheated. i went back the next morning with a hammer..removed the head and hit the top of the piston till it freed up then replaced the head and rode it home! I continued to ride it for some months after without any further attention just not as hard. Come to think of it my MZ ETZ250 had a similar experience.Have fun.
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Thanks for the words of advise about the cable lock. I will heed it well. Several more people have chimed in with good things to say about soft panniers rather than boxes. Looks like they will be the go. High-sided my bike a few weeks ago when I got a bit air-borne coming into a tight corner with only some small scratches on the front mudguard the result. So I now know they crash pretty damn well too.
Regards Nigel in NZ --"How can I be lost if I don't care where I am?"-- |
Hi, Everyone.
I just registered this site and hope I can get some answer. I just got my new DR650 and my dealer told me to come back after 500miles so they can check up but the cost is $300 US so I'm wondering if I should(it's not required by law)do it. 2 of my friends said it's too expencive and not worth doing. I want to know your(you guys!) opinion. Thanks!
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Wow! My old post lives again!
Be careful about not getting a dealer to do the service as often your guarantee will be void if the schedualed services are not done (by a dealer!). Regards Nigel in NZ |
Not only does it live again but it serves to inspire again.
I had forgotten how much fun I had as a younger man on my '77 TS185. Two up, with luggage we toured Ireland. Never once thought about lack of power. I will be searching for one. My wife's gonna kill me. |
And what about the TS250 and TS400? I have just been searching and there are a few 250s about. I can't remember seeing the 400 in the U.K. I imagine the 400 was a fantastic ride.
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I was with you all the way Nigel until it got to the two stroke bit :)
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The 2 strokes are no longer marketed here any longer (as street legal) as I'm sure you know. I think the Kawasaki KE100 was the last offered. We have a 2000 KE100, a fine machine but the DR200SE is quieter, a bit larger, and gets better fuel economy. I grew up with a 73 Kaw 175 and 78 Yamaha IT175 and my current DR200SE is just a continuation of the tradition. |
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Kind regards Nigel in NZ |
Well Nigel. I went ahead and bought one, A 1981 250. I'm just off to pick it up. It looks good and has only done 11000 miles. I'm excited, my wife is not. This is bike No.8. Ebay is a dangerous place for the motorcycle enthusiast.
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Bike number eight? Is that all? I have about 35 runners! Tell your wife she's lucky!
Kind regards Nigel in NZ (With THE most tolerant partner in the world!) |
35 runners. I'm not sure whether or not to show this to my wife as evidence that I am not as sick as she thinks. She will only start to worry about the company I keep.
The '81 TS 250 is not as good as it first appeared but nothing too much wrong. Is 65mph what I should expect as a top speed? Perhaps the gearing has been changed or maybe it's my expectations that have changed. The kick start lever is clearly the wrong one. It has a much coarser spline than the shaft, although it looks like a Suzuki item possibly off an earlier TS. For now I refuse to look at it too closely. I get a sick feeling and go dizzy. Any knowledge regarding splines and different models would be welcome. |
Ts185 clutch problem
You guys sound like you know what you are talking about so you might be able to help me. I recently bought a TS185 1984mdl and the only problem with it is that when the clutch is pulled in it still remains partially in gear. The cable is adjusted right and you can feel that it is pulling the plates apart but it still remains in gear. Someone told me that because the bike might have been sitting for awhile the plates could be stuck to together so I pulled it apart and cleaned it up and replaced the oil but it still seems to be stuck. The clutch plates did still have alot of meat on them, although they were far from new. Any advise would be great.
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Hi Lance.
Partial release of the clutch means that the plates are not stuck, especially if you pulled the cover off and took out the plates. Did you have problems getting the pins back under the clutch springs? That can be a bugger of a job, and easy to loose the pins if they ping off. The other causes of partial release are: Over-adjustment of the cable. You should only have about 2-3mm lever travel until you see the cable start to move. You say this is OK. Bent clutch plates. Almost always the steel plates are the ones that bend, usually from a cooked (overheated) clutch. The only solution is to replace the clutch pack. Worn Clutch basket fingers. This traps the plates stopping them from sliding apart. Dress the grooves out with a fine flat file, but not too much or there will be more free-play in the driveline. Cheers! Nigel in NZ |
Suzuki TS185
Hi there I found this thread a very interesting read as I've just brought myself a brand new Suzuki TS185ERC. I live in Mexico and the bike is still available here it cost me about $2500 (US). I'm 44 and haven't ridden a bike since I was 18, but so far so good and I'm very pleased with the bike around the city and off road. You can see some pictures of the bike here:
http://www.bikepics.com/suzuki/ts185/06/pics.asp As you can see the bike comes with a 13 Litre steel tank as standard so I guess this part is still available if anyone wanted to increase the tank size of an older model. I have one question about the top speed. I have just run mine in (1000 miles) and opened it up I can't get it to go above 7000 rpm in 5th gear (unless going down hill or with a tail wind) this gives a top speed of about 110kmph or 66mph. I've read in this forum that the ts185 should have a top speed of 75mph any idea why it won't go above 7000rpm in top gear. Regards |
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I'm surprised you have problems finding parts from what I can gather parts are still readily available in the US. For example:
Alpha Sports - Suzuki Motorcycle Parts Catalog click on 1980 on the left hand side of that page and you'll see the TS185 is listed. Or try searching for "suzuki parts fiche" in Google I'm sure you can find someone who will ship to the UK. Regards |
ts 185 er restoration
Hi folks I`m in Australia and i can only find very few pieces for my two ts185`s the list posted in the link here says parts are no longer available they have a few but not the major pieces....
Hey nice bike that guy in mexico has I have looked everywhere to try to get one new here but no one will have any part in it I looked in suzuki`s site American Suzuki Motor Corporation they still make em but why will no countries import them??. I say countries because i believe aus is not the only place where u cant buy these anymore hope this topic is still alive or is there a newer thread for suzuki ts 185 thanks in advance, looking foward to catching up with peeps with ts`s themselvsbeerchug |
Hi there. This thread and other like it generated so much interest over the years that there's been a dedicated TS/TM/TC website opened. It here:
Suzuki TS TC TM Forum • Portal Sign on over there, and tell us what parts you are after. There's lots of TS185 people there. Cheers bloke Nigel in NZ |
thanks u are a champ
i`m there see u`ss all there!!!:funmeteryes:beer
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revs and reliability
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I didnt have a huge oil issue as some found in this thread and maybe a better quality of oil should be used but not needed to be synthetic. I never found the power some say and the speed some expect. 7000 rpm would be best you can get. Exhaust is too restrictive to go higher. You wil blow the manifold gasket very often for revs over 6000. to me 5500 was tops and all that is needed and you ran out or past the power zone. These bikes were made to last by standard gearing and speed no more than 85 kmh. I would be happy to take one around the world. cheap, easy to find parts. easy to repair. maybe no repairs needed and no issues expecting 50,000 km if you are doing long km and days the bike is hot all day. These bikes would do 400,000 km in the philippines and many 125 would work 18 to 20 hour days pulling a sidecar and 6 people as passengers. In the rice field they use 3/8 rods as spokes welded in and can carry 500 kg. I've seem 15 passengers on one bike. Suzuki have made many of the most durable bikes in history in my opinion and I have had over 100. I own 9 now but always had 5 or 6. Looking to buy a ts 125 er or a new drz 125 big wheel now for son. the ts is hard to find in good cond cheap enough and a brand new 2015 has been offered to em at 3250 aussie dollars!!! I want him to start on the old TS but im not going to pay $1,500 for it. Those TS 185 ER are legendary, people still quote my stupid comments "why would you want anything more" i used to say. My TS worked hard! Now my stead is a ktm 525 and I have come to know proper and suspension. |
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