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-   -   Warning rock throwing in Ethiopia! (https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/sub-saharan-africa/warning-rock-throwing-in-ethiopia-56794)

michnus 25 Apr 2011 09:48

Warning rock throwing in Ethiopia!
 
From Lake Tana when coming in from Sudan to Lalibela be carefull we were thrown with rocks 6 times on that road twice got hit by them.
On the dirt road towards Lalibela our friends in a Nissan 4x4 got their front window thrown out by a rock from a young boy.

Tourist routes are main problem

ta-rider 25 Apr 2011 10:05

Hi,

Thats nothing new...we got hit as well. Some people in Ethiopia are not use to work anymore. They are use to get monex given for free by stupid tourists, so they come up with ideas like throwing stones if they are bored and dont get there free money.

Better idea would be to produce something and sell it to tourists like they do in malawi etc. But that would require to work...

http://www.adventure-travel-experien...dition_005.jpg

LG, Tobi

chris 25 Apr 2011 11:29

The rock throwing has been happening for many years. It goes along with the "You You You" shouting. My opinion on Ethiopia: Nice views, shame about the people.
cheers
C

backofbeyond 25 Apr 2011 13:13

It's not just Ethiopia either; I've been on the receiving end of rocks in most West African countries ever since my first trip to Morocco in 1970. Mainly the young kids who would be primary school age in Europe.

Tim Cullis 25 Apr 2011 16:45

I don't seem to get so much as some people, possibly because I ride slowly with a flip-front helmet up through villages, but it still happens in Morocco. Even with girls.

I have a zero tolerance to this and will *always* spin the bike around and give chase. I took a mule hostage once and only released it once a women had given the kids a walloping. Shouting 'shame' (n'shouma) has results as older adults don't like their village to be associated with attacking travellers.

As a last resort I also carry a high-powered catapult that might give some of them second thoughts the next time.

mj 25 Apr 2011 18:52

I was actually wondering how one should react to kids throwing rocks. Never having been on the receiving end of such an atrocity I haven't given it much thought yet.

McCrankpin 26 Apr 2011 02:31

We spent a month riding slowly around Ethiopia (southbound) with no rock-throwing problems. We received good advice beforehand, as follows below, from an experienced northbound British couple, in Sudan, who also had no problems (driving a Landrover).

Except in the cities, private vehicles are virtually unknown. On the roads outside cities there are only buses and trucks, and very few of them.
So the roads are literally full of pedestrians and animals going about their business. And they have right of way. Adults carrying water and ploughs, and herding animals, children playing, huge groups of schoolchildren going to classes.

And they want the freedom to wander around the road without having to worry about strange traffic hitting them.
That includes, for instance, adults carrying huge wooden ploughs on their shoulders who cannot see behind but suddenly want to cross the road. In doing so their plough swings round across the road and they don't want some vehicle crashing into it.
That's reinforced in their mind by the fact that if a vehicle hits a pedestrian, in any circumstances, the rules say it's the driver's fault.

So you have to go slowly.

As it was, we were on small 250cc bikes, so rarely reached 80kph on the few empty stretches of road. Wherever there's a significant number of pedestrians you need to be at no more than 60 - 70kph, depending. Even less in villages.
Even at that speed, sometimes on entering a village, adults would give a little hand signal, sort of waving down towards the ground, which means "slow down." These adults have children playing around somewhere in the road or going to classes. Or their animals are on the road.

So, if you travel at a speed that respects all this, what you'll find is that everyone will wave at you. And you just have to wave back, equally as spirited. Or the stone throwing will start.
Or if you're simply going too fast in the first place you'll just get stones thrown at you.
As well as waving, the children will shout "you you you" and run up, hands out.
This is in response to the endless tourists who travel through this country (fewer now I think) and who throw pens, notebooks, money or sweets out of their windows without stopping. We were told that in schools now, children are taught to no longer expect stuff to be thrown out of vehicles, and to not run around begging, but that's probably a slow process.

If you find, because of all the people and animals around, you can't take your hand off the handlebars to wave, you are absolutely going too fast. No question.
Adults will wave as well if your speed is OK, but not come running and begging. But if you don't wave back you'll see an immediate bad look in their faces.

If you find it all gets too much and need to stop, or need to buy stuff, as soon as you come to a halt, get your right glove off quickly. By then dozens of children will have reached you with hands outstretched, begging. Immediately you have to shake all their hands, saying "Hello how are you? No I don't have any money or pens!" with a big smile on your face. They'll immediately forget they were asking for that stuff and want to know all about you instead.
If you engage with them all properly you should find that no one, that you have properly shaken hands with, right down to 18-month-olds, will dare to touch anything on your bike. As well as "you", they'll probably also know the words "where", "who", and "why".

Occasionally (it happened to us a couple of times) a teacher or someone else who can speak English will come up and start translating. You'll be there a half hour at least. Taking lots of photos will be welcomed.
Then when it's time to go you'll have to shake all the little hands again and they'll all wave you off. If you're sitting on your bike, 6-year-olds will lift up 1-year-olds so you can reach their hands.

Ethiopia is a country that you just can't travel fast through, and we had nothing but pleasant times there.
This is the experience we had, and speed of travel was the key.

You may feel, if you do get hit by a stone, that giving chase is the thing to do. Only you can decide.
But you need to remember that stone-throwing is a common skill in Ethiopia. Herdsmen use it to control animals (no dogs are used for this). Mothers use it to control the wanderings of tiny children (not hitting them, but hitting the ground ahead of them). Children aren't often responsible for either of those, so they practice their skills (needed in later life) by controlling the speed of the three or four vehicles per hour that may pass by, if they're going too fast.
So if you catch someone, they'll think it strange that you chase them in response to their legitimate action in trying to slow you down.

We discussed this with various cyclists we met, as they too say the same. Some of them get stones thrown at them, some don't. We came to the conclusion it's still a speed thing. Bicycles are silent, so are expected to travel even more slowly as they can't be heard. And if cyclists don't wave, their speed makes it easier to throw stones at them.

The British couple in Sudan gave us one extra bit of advice if you're on 4 wheels - never have your windows wound up, and whenever you stop, get out straightaway to shake everyone's hands.

So to sum up:
Quote:

Originally Posted by mj (Post 333525)
I was actually wondering how one should react to kids throwing rocks. Never having been on the receiving end of such an atrocity I haven't given it much thought yet.

SLOW down and WAVE! And enjoy the welcome.

Margus 26 Apr 2011 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by mj (Post 333525)
I was actually wondering how one should react to kids throwing rocks. Never having been on the receiving end of such an atrocity I haven't given it much thought yet.

Turn around! (safely of course :) ) Usually they run away fully scared and you won't catch them, but it definitely will give them a lesson not to do it next time. And if you catch them, explain it calmly, even if you don't know the language - they'll sure understand what they did wrong.

If you see them starting to pick up the rock from the roadside or already thrown - NEVER continue riding on, because then the kid learns that it's actually fun to target-practice on a motorcyclist next time.

If all overlanders would do so I'd say it'd change in all those poor countries where many are without any education at all - kids need education.

Rock throwing by children also happens in many Arab countries we've visited but still I'd say we've had very rare occasions it happening and I've always turned around and the kid run off scared, almost broke his legs one time. I've wasted only a minute or two from my time doing so.

That said plus endless begging (you should beg back to show themselves from the mirror - mosty it works), Ethiopia is still be one of our most favourite contries in Africa so far! So keep it positive guys and travel responsibly, nasty small things happen in many contries but it won't stop you enjoying travelling there if you do it with a right mindset.

AliBaba 26 Apr 2011 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCrankpin (Post 333581)
SLOW down and WAVE! And enjoy the welcome.

Yes, people normally drop the stones when they wave back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ta-rider (Post 333483)
Better idea would be to produce something and sell it to tourists like they do in malawi etc. But that would require to work...

??
http://www.actiontouring.com/pic/ethkids.jpg

misterpaul 26 Apr 2011 14:35

McCrankpin - excellent post, completely agree that waving is the key. We spent 1 month in Ethiopia recently and didn't have any trouble with stone throwing either.

roamingyak 26 Apr 2011 19:14

Second that - a thoughtful and detailed post - always welcome!

ta-rider 27 Apr 2011 08:13

Hi AliBaba,

Nice picture...jes its probably more the "getto" areas near Gondar where people have stupid ideas. Its also these areas where they are together in big groups. Dont get me wrong. Ethiopia is realy nice if you are far out in the beautifull landscape where there are still people everywhere ;)

Travel safe, Tobi

michnus 27 Apr 2011 12:15

McCrankpin, I live in South Africa and close to the Transkei and Lesotho where for years we had the same problem with rock throwing. Lesotho goverment eventually saw tourism slowed down because of this and got programs going to get people educated. Today it is pleasure touring Lesotho.

We have learned long time ago to wave at people as it distract them from throwing rocks, also to go slow through settlements as people get upset with fast going bikes and cars. We also ride at least 700m apart it helps. About chasing them down, it's a must, even if you cant catch them, make them understand you are serious.

The first biker very rarely gets thrown, most cases the last one get the hits.

I know this is a old story in Ethiopia, my post intention was to make people aware and to be vigilant and keep the eyes open, nothing about being negative about Ethiopia or its people.

McCrankpin 28 Apr 2011 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by michnus (Post 333762)
I know this is a old story in Ethiopia, my post intention was to make people aware and to be vigilant and keep the eyes open, nothing about being negative about Ethiopia or its people.

Yep, understand all that. And agree. bier
It was just an account of our experiences on the roads, and to pass on the excellent advice we received which led to us having a great and safe time.
Hopefully it'll help others have an equally good journey.
Because it was certainly a sad thing, as we travelled on southwards, to meet other travellers who had bad experiences with the people of this country after we had had such a pleasant visit.

I hope this last example will illustrate it a bit more. We met a rider further south who had troubles in Ethiopia, and from the brief conversation we couldn't understand why. But he kept a blog, which I read.
Unfortunately it's highly critical of the people of the country, and highlights an incident where he was travelling at 100kph, close enough to pedestrians for one of them to attempt to slow him down by thrusting (unsuccessfully) a stick into his front wheel. IMHO, visitors need to understand, in this country (and others, Rwanda springs to mind), it's absolutely outrageous to travel at such a speed in the vicinity of pedestrians, and you'll have trouble if you try.
But a wonderful time as long as you don't give the locals any reason to feel you're a danger to them.

taniyamorris 30 Apr 2011 14:03

McCrankpin - top post & top advice. We have found this to be the best policy everywhere.

robinhelen 1 May 2011 21:00

Yep it works
 
I spent around a month in Ethiopia with the benefit of a pillion who can wave early!... and pretty much continuously. We saw quite a few rocks in hand which were immediately dropped in order to wave. I don't feel it has the same meaning as we in Europe think. It is a cultural difference that we are not familiair with or really understand, but there seems to be no malice in it. All part of travel.

farqhuar 2 May 2011 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Cullis (Post 333514)
As a last resort I also carry a high-powered catapult that might give some of them second thoughts the next time.

I've never had rocks thrown at me, but I did experience goat shepherding youths firing catapults at me while riding through the back blocks of Afghanistan in 1977.

Is this where you got your idea from Tim?

Trichelia 2 May 2011 22:30

A mate of mine was in Ethiopia on his motorcycle and he also had rocks catapulted at him by herd boys up in the mountains. One hit the side of his tank leaving quite a dent and the other wizzed past his head. He wasnt speeding at all, he was on windy roads, he felt it was just the national sport of bored shepherds.

While he was there he met a chap on a motorcycle who did received a direct body shot which resulted in him having a nasty accident.

adamiko 3 May 2011 20:22

Had the same experience in my 6 weeks tour around Ethiopia in 2009, And It is a shame…


My rules of engagement where simple: “Fire only when fired upon”. Always had a rock or two in the jacket pocket, and practice made
Good results. Feels great too…
Shoot back/turn around at the bagger!

priffe 5 May 2011 16:15

This thread shows two radically different takes of Africa and its inhabitants.

One is "Nice place - shame about the people"

Two is "Go slowly and give a friendly wave to the people and they'll wave back"

#1 seem to travel in a state of war with pebbles in their pockets.
I belong in #2, thank you (and never had a rock thrown at me).

chris 5 May 2011 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by priffe (Post 334794)
This thread shows two radically different takes of Africa and its inhabitants.

One is "Nice place - shame about the people"

Two is "Go slowly and give a friendly wave to the people and they'll wave back"

#1 seem to travel in a state of war with pebbles in their pockets.
I belong in #2, thank you (and never had a rock thrown at me).

The OP highlighted Ethiopia. The thread title clearly refers to Ethiopia. One other person referred to Morocco. Since then everybody has been on-topic(ish). So why now your summary of the views of everybody being about "Africa"?

In addtion, as you're quoting me as a summary of one side (your #1) of the discussion on "Africa and its inhabitants", I'd like to clarify I also didn't have any rocks thrown at me in Ethiopia, or anywhere in Africa for that matter. Maybe it was because I was waving too?

In Ethiopia I found the persistent You You You shouting annoying and that virtually everybody I met wanted to share my wealth (begging, inept b/s story etc). Having also travelled in other parts of (financially poor) Africa/ Indian subcontinent/ SE Asia/ Central/ South America I found the overwhelming majority of "non-Ethiopians" only wanted to talk to me because I'm a nice person :innocent:/ practice their English or just ignored me. It was only in Ethiopia where I felt they only wanted my money and I had to lock myself away to avoid them. I suppose their recent history (colonialism/wars/famines etc) hasn't helped their dispostion, but that's the same for lots of other parts of Africa too.

cheers
Chris
PS. I did throw a few stones myself: But only at rabid dogs sprinting next to me trying to chew my leg:stuart:

Simonsnork 26 Feb 2013 10:24

Rock Throwing in Ethiopia
 
We are currently traveling through Ethiopia on a TVS Apache Motorcycle and have been dismayed by the number of rock throwers we have encountered. It seems the rock throwing has now expanded to include any object at hand. We have had water bottles, clothing and toys thrown at us. Some children, lacking a throwable item, will spit out the food from their mouth into their hand and throw that at us! While the gesture may have initially indicated "slow down" it seems to have become a wide spread habit lacking any discernible meaning. Two Spanish cyclists we met encountered a great deal of rock throwing. They ran into the biggest problem when riding uphill because they couldn't ride fast enough to get away from the kids. On more than one occasion the kids would hop a truck and ride ahead of them so that they could throw rocks at them again. Unfortunately, this habit, if continued will start deterring foreign travelers.

We can't figure out why everyone keeps yelling Ewe! Ewe! Ewe! as we ride through towns. We haven't seen many sheep...

Walkabout 26 Feb 2013 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCrankpin (Post 333854)
Unfortunately it's highly critical of the people of the country, and highlights an incident where he was travelling at 100kph, close enough to pedestrians for one of them to attempt to slow him down by thrusting (unsuccessfully) a stick into his front wheel. IMHO, visitors need to understand, in this country (and others, Rwanda springs to mind), it's absolutely outrageous to travel at such a speed in the vicinity of pedestrians, and you'll have trouble if you try.

I have to admit, as one of those "highly educated westerners" (in relation to those who advocate education as the answer to the issue of rock throwing), that I have been highly tempted to shove a stick into the front wheel of those who ride too fast in certain circumstances. :innocent:
A pick axe handle should do the trick.
The last time I had these dark thoughts was on the route of the Stella Alpina actually, where I was riding at the time and sharing the track with complete knobs (come to think of it, there is an unlimited supply of rocks up there also!).
I don't have any right to make the decision about what is too fast, but I think the local people do have that right, in Ethiopia, or elsewhere. Anyone for a 20 MPH speed limit for their local city highway in the UK?

I have also had these negative thoughts regarding those who ride in places where it just isn't "right"; those who think it is a great weeze to attain an altitude record where, in fact, bikes have no logical reason to be there in the first place; those who ride off-road in the UK where it is not permitted.
All of this stuff just equates to a form of vandalism for me.
?c?

michnus 17 Mar 2013 17:30

The rock throwing in Ethiopia is not due to travellers that speed.

itchyfeet38 17 Mar 2013 21:47

We're the kind of people who try pretty hard to make sure we never knowingly offend. We read up and sought advice about stone throwing before arriving in Ethiopia and formed a strategy.

Go slow (we always go pretty slow so this translates as go VERY slow)
Windows down
Eye contact
Smiling/waving

It worked like a charm for our first few weeks on the road and passed our newly acquired wisdom on to other travelers. Some weren't impressed - particularly the chap who had a rock the size of an orange come through his rear window whilst almost stationary (it narrowly missed someone in back seat and smashed a laptop).

Week 6 - as we waved and smiled and braked to a crawl a stone took out a side window costing us plenty of cash/trouble/good feeling.

Conclusion.

This is a cultural thing - kids throw rocks at passing cars. They are excellent shots as they throw the same rocks at their herds of goats and sheep day in, day out and as such will always have a rock in their hand. No particlular message or sentiment involved. Just something they do.

Don't take it personally and don't expect to manage it. You'll either get lucky or you won't.

It's still a fantastic country to travel in and I would go back in a car without hesitation.

*Touring Ted* 17 Mar 2013 22:17

They only throw little stones...... And they only seem to aim at the big expensive looking bikes.

And it's worth it when you stop.. Laugh, and pretend to shoot at them with a pretend gun !



GIMMI BIIIR

GIMMII PEN.



Ethiopia is a FANTASTIC country.

Anacondor 18 Mar 2013 09:57

I fully agree with McCrankpin's post.

We were there for about 6 weeks last year and I remember that one or two times to small kid throwed a stone to our car. These were tiny stones and probably we forgot to wave (although our hands were in the automatic waving mode for weeks). I absolutely loved almost all the children in Ethiopia; they were cute and natural models for our photos.

A topic about warnings for stone (even: rock!) throwing in Ethiopia does not do justice to that lovely country, the great travel experience and the sweet kids; in my view it's a little exaggerated, like so many things.

uk_vette 18 Mar 2013 11:33

Another good reason to let Africa fester in the depths of hell.

Would I go to Africa to be thrown with stones, rocks and boulders?

Not on your life.

vette

Anacondor 18 Mar 2013 12:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by uk_vette (Post 415815)
Another good reason to let Africa fester in the depths of hell.

Would I go to Africa to be thrown with stones, rocks and boulders?

Not on your life.

vette

Wow, that's an interesting opinion :mad:.

Let's indeed all go to Texas, I've heard it's great out there.

Habari 18 Mar 2013 12:17

When we started our trip I carried under the roof rack of my Landy a big piece of polycarbonate cut to measure on the windshield just in case anything would happen in Ethiopia or elsewhere, well it is still there unused...
I absolutely agree with the others that waving and smiling is the best way.

We did experience other funny things though, like people pretending to jump in front of the car and then jumping right back laughing or, worst of all, pushing a sheep in the road as we were approaching.
I suppose that if you spend you life on the top of a mountain looking after sheeps day after day you may get a bit bored at times...
Cheers

chris 18 Mar 2013 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by uk_vette (Post 415815)
Another good reason to let Africa fester in the depths of hell.

Would I go to Africa to be thrown with stones, rocks and boulders?

Not on your life.

vette


Thank you for your balanced contribution.:rofl: I suspect the Africans/ Ethiopians won't miss you either.:taz:

Gecko 18 Mar 2013 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by uk_vette (Post 415815)
Another good reason to let Africa fester in the depths of hell.

Would I go to Africa to be thrown with stones, rocks and boulders?

Not on your life.

vette

Some deep and meaningful input from our friend from Texas. :thumbup1: Excellent progress indeed because it would appear that word of the existence of a wider world has reached his little corner of our planet.

priffe 20 Mar 2013 13:20

Some of my friends just did a grand tour of Africa in three 4x4 , and they said that the -only- country they had a problem was in Ethiopia. They were surrounded in small villages and the situation went out of control, so they had to basically flee before property was lost and/or someone hurt.
I think perhaps an educational campaign may be a good idea? By the government, for the people. Ethiopia has a large potential for tourism.
There may also be recommendations for travellers behaviour on order.
That is something we could and should discuss here (to some extent we are).
I don't think pebbles in the pocket is the answer.

uk_vette 22 Mar 2013 09:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by priffe (Post 416077)
Some of my friends just did a grand tour of Africa in three 4x4 , and they said that the -only- country they had a problem was in Ethiopia. They were surrounded in small villages and the situation went out of control, so they had to basically flee before property was lost and/or someone hurt.

.
So I guess that party won't be returning to Africa in a hurry.

AK47's next ?
Grenades instead of stones, , , , , ,

It wont be long before the whole of Africa is like this.


vette

reggie3cl 22 Mar 2013 10:32

Quote:

So I guess that party won't be returning to Africa in a hurry.

AK47's next ?
Grenades instead of stones, , , , , ,

It wont be long before the whole of Africa is like this.
Oh it already is, mate. Here's the wife dealing with some grenade chuckers in Namibia. God, it was hell. Still, she got to be a pretty good shot with the Glock in the end....

http://i648.photobucket.com/albums/u...ibfinal194.jpg

levelo 22 Mar 2013 16:36

Well, I am afraid it has been many a peasant's pastime for a long time... I rode my bicycle from Eritrea all the way down to Kenya back in 1995, the country had only been open for independant tourism for 2 years and there were very few travellers back then, but rock throwing and cursing ( F... you ! ) were already a huge problem. And I was slow, not protected by tainted windshields and windows, smiling and interacting as much as I could with the locals... I met quite a few fellow cyclists who gave up, flew or bussed their way out of the country.

priffe 22 Mar 2013 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by uk_vette (Post 416332)
.
So I guess that party won't be returning to Africa in a hurry.
vette

Well actually they are going back all the time, as they know it and they love it.

But their next trip is to Caucasus - Pakistan - India....I am sure they will find rock throwers there, too.

In your country, I faced a shotgun last trip. In Conroe, TX.
And years ago I was very nearly shot by a large posse near Rochester, MN. Case of mistaken identity.
Conclusions? Nah. bier

*Touring Ted* 22 Mar 2013 22:10

So....

Is it the bikers or the land rovers who are getting attacked here ???

I was there over a month and never had a single rock thrown at me..... On a bike !!!

I did hear of the 4X4's getting a little flak though.

jpyrek 18 Apr 2013 20:09

Having driven through Ethiopia recently I have a few thoughts. The slow down thing may have been true in the past, but we certainly didn't see it. For one, the roads weren't good enough (I wasn't willing to destroy my vehicle) to go very fast one...plus all the people, livestock, etc. milling about. Secondly, I didn't WANT to go fast. THe country is gorgeous and I didn't go to Africa to drive through as quickly as possible.

What we noticed about the rock throwing was that it was only around Gondar. Down south near Awassa...in the east near Harar, we just didn't experience it at all.

My personal opinion is that these kids KNOW that it is bad. No adults or teenagers threw stones, it was kids about 10 years old or so. They would wave as you approached, you'd wave back but once you'd pass they'd quickly pick up a rock and run into the road and throw it and then if you slowed or stopped they'd run away. From that I gather it is not a "you should slow down, thus I am justified in throwing a rock." It is clear that this is a fun game and they understand the damage and that it is not a good thing to do.

We had the rear window of one of our cars destroyed by a thrown rock and the kid ran off down a hill. I reversed quickly, gave chase, and threw a rock at the child as he climed and embankment on the other side of a stream. THe rock hit him and he fell into said stream getting covered in mud before running away.

In the midst of all of this, he had abonded the goats that he was tending and soon a couple of adults came. One spoke very broken English and was extremely saddened by what had happened and expressed disgust towards the now abscent child. Looking at the goats, they seemed to know exactly which kid it was that did this and expressed that they would tell the parent of the embarassment that this child had brought.

Now, whether or not that happened, I have no idea. It was clear though that the behavior is not tolerated or seen as appropriate and the reactions across the board from the misses and the hits our cars received seem to back this up.

THe truth of the matter is that the perception of tourists/travelers/foreigners that is fostered among these folks all comes from what they are told and what they experience. I am always keen to meet and talk and show people that 99% of us aren't super rich elitests that view Ethiopia as the armpit of the world. I chose to go there because I wanted to see it. Hell, we raised money for several charities there and raised enough to build a school at an orphanage.

I don't expect that I changed the world or anything, but I do hope that the child will give a second thought before hurling another rock at a vehicle.

In regards to bikers, I sort of feel that a cyclist or motorcyclist is seen as more human as there is no "protective shell" around them. It is easier to throw a rock at an object than at a person. A car is much more de-humanizing than a motorcycle and because in my personal opinion, these kids KNOW that it is wrong, they aren't going to be as blatant about it when they would have to physically throw a rock at a person.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

Advice though, just be mindful. Be friendly to folks, and watch your mirrors as you go through town.

Sidenote : We also came across a fake roadblock manned by 4 kids (one without pants) and they tried to demand a toll. Of course we blew through their rope across the road with a couple of sticks beneath it....but still. The day before we came across a fake checkpoint manned by 7 men (3 with guns) that jammed sticks in our wheels and tried to rob us. I guess if these are the folks doing the parenting, the rock throwing doesn't seem as bad.

*Touring Ted* 18 Apr 2013 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpyrek (Post 419236)
In regards to bikers, I sort of feel that a cyclist or motorcyclist is seen as more human as there is no "protective shell" around them. It is easier to throw a rock at an object than at a person. A car is much more de-humanizing than a motorcycle.

Without even knowing it, you've described one of the main reasons why travelling on a bike is better than a four wheeled shell...

jpyrek 22 Apr 2013 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Touring Ted* (Post 419238)
Without even knowing it, you've described one of the main reasons why travelling on a bike is better than a four wheeled shell...

Oh, I was well aware of what I was saying. That is the good and bad with riding...you are more exposed. Many times that works against you...and many times that works for you.

I'm an avid 2-wheeler, but have never done it in a multi-country roadtrip.

To me though, that is a big part of the "rock-throwing" equation.

motoreiter 22 Apr 2013 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpyrek (Post 419236)
The day before we came across a fake checkpoint manned by 7 men (3 with guns) that jammed sticks in our wheels and tried to rob us.

Yikes, so pray tell, how did you get out of that one?

jpyrek 22 Apr 2013 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by motoreiter (Post 419661)
Yikes, so pray tell, how did you get out of that one?

Well, we had discussed what we we do in that situation in a general sense multiple times over the past year or so. We figured it would be in Libya, Uganda, Burundi, Kenya, et. where we would run into those issues. We didn't expect it to be Ethiopia.

We were two vehicles at that point and I was driving the 2nd vehicle...we had radios but it all happened too fast to stop and chat a bit about what was going on.

We were driving and came across sticks and brambles in the roadway along with some rocks and then a rope across the road anchored by some sticks on either side. There were 2-3 men standing near the rope and 3-4 well off the side of the road, maybe 20-25 feet or so. As we approached, I saw it and realized it was NOT a legitimate checkpoint...as all of the men had scarves covering their faces with the exception of theire eyes. I was hoping that driver of the first car wouldn't think that this was legit. He slowed down a bit, but then gunned it and smashed through their rope and sticks. The men closer to the car tried to jam sticks in the wheels, but they just broke the sticks. The other guys that had been further off of the road were now on the road and pulled out AK-47s and started to point them at our car, which was moving at about 25 mph towards them. I told my gf in the passenger seat to duck, I also ducked down low and then gunned it, hit a couple of the guys in the road with the car...bumped over a few things (not sure as to what, as my head was down) and kept driving.

I have no idea if I hurt the guys or anything. They never fired their weapons (not sure if they even had bullets) although they did throw some things at the car as we passed.

ONce through we radioed back and forth about the ordeal and stopped about 5 miles down the road as the first car thought something was broken...turned out it was just some of the broked sticks wedged in between the wheels and the brakes.

We all assume they were just bandits trying to get some money/goods/etc...and perhaps weren't really ready to kill or use excessive force. However, we weren't going to find out and didn't want to have to take chances as to whether or not we could talk our way out of it.

We are lucky it ended the way that it did and even more lucky that in our entire trip THAT was the worst experience that we had.

It doesn't deter me from going to northern Ethiopia again, but will definitely be vigilant and try to travel in groups through that area.

roamingyak 23 Apr 2013 08:01

One nice thing about Ethiopia is that the police leave you alone on the roads, as soon as they see you are foreign they wave you through. :thumbup1:

Ethiopia is a very complex country for people - 80+ tribes in a country. Addis is quite a nice city by African standards and has a great collection of food compared to the rest of the country. If you spend much time there you start to realise that a lot of people there are refugees from the countryside - they had to run for their lives away from troubles and tensions.

I had a long chat with an Ethiopian in London the other day. I calmly told him my thoughts on the country and on the negative things he completely agreed and said he has to put up with this as well, its not just tourists. NGO workers I meet there carry thousands in cash under their seat in case they hit somebody, else they said they would be killed.

I meet a young couple who ran over somebodies foot and they were very lucky to only be a few km's from a police station who was quickly surrounded by a hundred or so people throwing stones. They had to pay $3,000 to get out of their alive.

I also meet a lot of nice people in Ethiopia - rasta guy who wanted to give me a huge brick of hash as a welcome present, guides in campsites who brought me lamb stew as I was alone, friendly people on the street and so on.....

The Afar people by contrast were extremely hostile and unfriendly, though across the border in Djibouti much less so...?

People are complex ;-)

Not much chance of anything happening from the government side of things, they are as corrupt as any other and cause many of the problems and tensions between people. There is a huge land grab going on all across Africa with politicians signing away land that displaces people and of course projects such as damming the Omo river:

Indian investors are forcing Ethiopians off their land | Global development | guardian.co.uk

http://www.guardian.co.uk/global-dev...es?INTCMP=SRCH

Ethiopia dam project is devastating the lives of remote indigenous groups | Global development | guardian.co.uk

jpyrek 23 Apr 2013 15:20

Ethiopia overall was an interesting place for us. At least here in the US, everyone thinks of the distended bellies, drought, etc. when Ethiopia is brought up. While it is certainly not a rich nation, that is a totally outdated image.

In talking with folks we got a sense that while hardline, many people like that the government has made strides in sanitation, healthcare, infrastucture, education, etc. However, it actually has made it more difficult for foreign aid to come in. As we drove through the country we would see so many failed NGO projects...and old signs for projects.

Many of the reactions from locals to us were that we were white, so we must me extremely rich and must be NGO workers. This is also outdated and when talking to some locals in Addis they explained that the adults taught the children that, because that is what a white person was in Ehtiopia in the 1980s.

I was shocked how divided the country was on religious lines though. I really hadn't been aware that there was such a massive Muslim population and how segregated the Christian and Muslims were outside of the large cities. We noticed these pockets of diverse culture as we crossed the nation and headed into Somaliland.

Of all the places I have been, I feel Ethiopia was the one where my preconceived notions were the most off-base.

I'm interested to see how things change in the next 10-20 years.

priffe 24 Apr 2013 07:27

Could we try to pinpoint where bad things have happened and where to be vigilant.

jpyrek 24 Apr 2013 20:06

For us the rock throwing occured from outside of Gondar heading south till about an hour south of Lalibela.

The bandits we ran into were about halfway between Gondar and Lalibela.

The rest of Ethiopia....no issues.


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