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  #1  
Old 20 Jul 2007
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Argentina-over staying permission for moto

I had major problems with the moto while in Patagonia and finally left it in an unsecure location. It may still be where I left it, or not. Legally it can be in Argentina until Sept. 29, 2007. I am in the US. I may want to return to Argentina, find it and fix it, but not until after Christmas. My questions: 1. What do I have to do to legally drive it again and where do I do it? 2. Can the authorities confiscate it without up to date paperwork, or will I just be fined? 3. If it has been stolen, do I have legal rights to recover it after Sept.29? I have emailed Argentine Customs but no help so far. Any Argentine legal scholars out there? Thanks
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  #2  
Old 21 Jul 2007
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mmmm left unsecured?

Hi Martin
What do you mean left......not in open space i hope?
If that is the case you could get surprised and find your bike there or just the memory of it!
Once the temporary imoprt is expired you will be fined and the bike is confiscated.Paying is most of the times the only thing to do.And not little.Its a percentage of the value(Declared on).
No way you could extend that from outside the country.
Was she behaving so bad that you left your companion in the wild?hahahaha
As the bike is not registered in your passport this issue should not affect you reentry to argentina.Maybe if you enter with a second bike they could look into computer sistem and ask where the first is.
I am not a legal expert.
If you see the vultures flying up in the sky where you left the bike....just finish her with a shot in the head.
Wish you luck
KH

PS: you had terrible problems with customs for the spareparts before,what?
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America is a nice continent,not a country.All people who lives in this continent are americans.Discover it in peace!
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  #3  
Old 22 Jul 2007
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Overstaying

Yes, I had a terrible time getting spare parts in, but it was the fault of DHL (I am STILL battling them) not aduana. Aduana was very helpful and got the parts to my mechanic, finally. Then the electronics went bad and I left it. It was sheltered, but not in a safe or secure place. If you see a blue/green Harley Sportster with ammunition cannisters for panniers being driven around, it is probably mine. Marty
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  #4  
Old 24 Jul 2007
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Abandoned in Patagonia

What a sad story, I agree with BCK_973 for the most part...heart broken as you might be, gather your strength and consider the following options.

First, find out if your Harley is still at the location where you left.

Utilize a trusted HUBB resource to locate and relocate the bike to a secure location. If this is not possible...

Contact the highest management level you can reach at DHL, I know a little about the creation of DHL, it is a very interesting story...a couple of University of California grad students started DHL by utilizing luggage allowance of passenges on international flights to transport documents worldwide.... Do a little research as to who the current CEO is, they might see this as a positve or negative publicity and might take some action...

Play nice and explain in a "taped" conversation (get his/her permission for recording) to the high level manager at DHL, that non compliance by DHL of DHL's contract to you, caused you to abandon your Harley in Patagonia and all this could be made right if a DHL truck could be sent to pick up you Harley and store it for you until you are able to return to Argentina. Of course explain your shipment included parts needed for repair...

Hopefully, DHL security personel will be tasked to verify the existance of your Harley and maybe, just maybe, they will transport it to a secure location for you and store it for you.... It is a slim hope, but a hope.

Of course if you can secure your bike through a Hubb connection that would probably be better.

Once the bike is secure, don't worry much about getting it out of the country or even riding it in Argentina, as getting the documents updated is very do-able.

Hope this helps. Please keep me posted as I get great solutions while I am sleeping, which I am going to do right now. I live permanently in Buenos Aires, I am not an Argentine legal expert, but, I have my own great lawyer here , if needed... I am an international overlander with my own Honda...I am an America, and maybe I can communicate for you with the Buenos Aires office of DHL regarding this. I am also fluent in Spanish and have been a US Peace Corps Volunteer in Costa Rica for two years, thus my volunteer nature. Good luck and waiting to hear from you. xfiltrate
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  #5  
Old 24 Jul 2007
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Interesting ideas

I have written to the president of DHL and was basically ignored. Next thing I knew, without warning I was contacted by a collection agency, because I would not pay for parts delivery that I was promised 2 day delivery but took 30 and dozens of emails. I have used DHL twice for international shipments and have been screwed royally both times. I could not recommend anyone ever using them. I caught them in blatant lies, among other things, and would not trust that they would not steal the moto. They tried to charge me $1000.00 to return (instead of delivering) $145 worth of parts, on
top of the original delivery charge.
I have been unable to get anyone to verify if the bike is still there because 1. I hardly know anyone in Argentina ; 2. it is 1000 miles from Bs.As. where everyone lives and no one wants to drive 2000 miles roundtrip to see if a moto is still there. I am open to any ideas.
If the moto is still there, if I was to return, and if I could get it running, what is the penalty when I would be (eventually) caught at a checkpoint with expired papers? Confiscation? Fine? Both? Thanks, Marty
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  #6  
Old 25 Jul 2007
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The DHL Harley Patagonia Saga

Marty, the best I can come up with is none to creative, but will probably work. Thoughout Argentina ACA (Auto Club of Argentina) like AAA in the States is well respected and equipted. They have a chain of gas stations and are associated with international airlines and hotels. I have been working for two years on a "Crossing Frontiers" (border crossing manual for foreign motor tourtists), with FITAC the Federation International of Automobile Clubs, which is part of ACA and offers reciprical services to members of FITAC clubs. The American Automobile Association is a participating member of FITAC. Here is my contact information:

Lic.Diego A.Cosentino / Jefe FITAC
member@fitac.org
http://www.fitac.org
( 5411) 4802-4385
( 5411) 4801-7571
Fax ( 5411) 4808-4595
Voice mail ( 5411) 4808-4294
Avda. Del Libertador 1850 5to. (1425)
Buenos Aires - República Argentina

You can check the ACA/FITAC web site....

I know Diego very well and I trust him and I trust ACA and FITAC. If you like, I will discuss the possibility of having an ACA truck, of which there are many in Patagonia, dispatched to locate and pick up your bike. I doubt they will deliver it to BA, but, I believe Diego can locate safe parking, probably at an ACA affiliated Hotel garage until you arrive. If you join AAA in the States and can provide Diego/me with a valid AAA membership number, getting the bike to safety should be no charge, or minimal charge, depending on kilometers to the garage, if excessive.....this is because of the reciprcal services agreements between clubs...

Everything will have to be arranged in advance to your satisfaction, and the actual location of the bike withheld until you are confident the idea will work. You can e-mail me directly at: pcvolunteers800@hotmail.com.

It might be best if I meet with Diego to update him... and then we arrange a phone call to you or from you. I will work out the details if you like.

Meanwhile, if you are not a member already, join AAA in th State where you live, get to know a manager, do not go into detail of your problem , at this time....

I am very curious regarding the DHL point of view on the delivery of your parts. There are regulating agencies that provide recourse for international shipments. If you feel comfortable, give me their side of events and I will discuss the situation with my attorney here for possible liability action later.

The best solution is for you to return and you and I can handle all this together. I do not know the dollar amount of the fees you will have to pay if the bike overstays, I do know extentions are possible before the expiration date arrives. I will need more time to get this info for you.

Maybe we can turn this nightmare into something better for you. At least, it is a possibility of getting the bike to a safe location with little or no cost to you.

If anyone has any other ideas, please help. How about Grant and Susan, anything?

Keep posting on the Hubb as this might all be informative to others. Standing by for your orders..., xfiltrate
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  #7  
Old 25 Jul 2007
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Where

I am taking the bus down tonight from BA to Rio Gallegos and then on to Ushuaia to collect my own bike, only a Honda 125, but it got me from Mexico to Ushuaia last year with only three punctures: see BLOG at home
and hopefully will get north now to Duchess County, NY.
Do you want me to try and check out if ypour bike still exists - or is so far off all nrmal routes as to make this impossible?
simon
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  #8  
Old 25 Jul 2007
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Yes and YES!

Well, I have nothing to lose that I may not have already lost.
To Simon: The moto is actually very easy to find if you are taking Ruta 3 back North. Once you have collected your bike, email me and I will give you the location. Unfortunately, I had lost my GPS so I do not have the precise coordinates, but I do have the kilometer marker. Are you motorcycling in the dead of winter from Ushuaia to the north, or staying there until the weather is better? If you are heading right back north, I will give you the information as above. But if you intend to remain in Ushuaia several weeks, perhaps it could be checked on the bus trip south, although the bus driver would probably not be agreeable to looking for it in a 3 km. span of Ruta 3. It is south of Comodoro Rivadavia.

To Xfiltrate: I am kicking myself right now! I have (and had) the best AAA membership, called AAA RV Plus. In the U.S. they will tow the bike 100 miles to a location of my choice for free. I probably could have done that while I was there but just did not think of it. The moto had had so many problems the entire trip that I was just tired of it, I guess. When Simon tells me if it is there, I will get back to you to fiqure out what to do. My return flight to Bs.As. is August 26, but there is no use returning if the moto is gone.

Thanks to both of you for your efforts and offers. Ain't HUBB great?!
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  #9  
Old 25 Jul 2007
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Mid Winter For Maniacs

OLD MEN CAN'T WAIT. Depending on the roads, I am riding or putting the bike on a pickup next week to Puerto Natales, taking the ferry to Puerto Montt, then definitely riding. I will talk to the bus driver. Sounds as if you had a seriously miserable time instead of what should have been a great experience. Bummer...But better luck and more joy next time.
My small Honda is hard on the butt and slow. However, I can get spares everywhere (though haven´t needed any). And I have great boots and thermal underwear from Alpinestars so I should be warmer than I was on the journey south.
home
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  #10  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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Private message

Simon, I am going to try the private message system here on HU, eventually to tell you the moto's location. Let me know if you get the test run. Martin
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  #11  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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Simon, I just realized...

you are going to Rio Gallegos tonight. You will probably be south of where the bike is before you get this message. So close....yet so far. Martin
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  #12  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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My brother is driving from Ushuaia

Martin
If plan A shouldn´t work send me a PM.As my Brother is picking up a jeep to drive from Ushuaia to BA in the next days,he could find out what is from your bike left.I am keen to think its gone!
Good luck with plan A.
KH
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  #13  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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DHL Harley Patagonia Saga

Martin, good thinking to have your AAA card, and now you know you can use it in Argentina. AAA doesn't offer the RV plus 100 mile coverage in all States, and I doubt ACA would honor a 100 mile tow without charge, they might. Any charge for excess Kilometers will be minimal when compared to paying a regular tow truck for sure. It is my understanding, that you can get a tow to nearest services for free, but if your bike is discovered to be ready for a tow truck, I will nail down all potential costs to you, with my friend Diego at ACA/FITAC here in BA.

I understand you might be frustrated, but you got yourself out of a bad situation, and you lived to fight for your bike another day. Well done. I am ready to help anyway I can.

Hey Simon, best to you old man in thermals on a 125. We each make our choices and you have made yours. Keep posting your progress on Hubb, I am very interested in knowing how you are doing. xfiltrate
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  #14  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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Pm- xfiltrate

I sent you a private message to see if would work. Did you get it? Martin
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  #15  
Old 26 Jul 2007
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Correction

xfiltrate- I sent the message to your email, not the HUBB PM. Get it?
KH- Thanks for offering your brother. I'll let you know soon about asking him to check. When is he leaving for Ushuaia?
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