crossing algierian border.

[gregor]

hi.

so, i read that agadez is closed for western turists and you can drive down by own car only with military escort (from algieria border).
north of mali are danger cause tuaregs rebel.

but crossing border from algeiria to niger or mali is still possible (november)?
is possible to get visas to these country in tamm? or better reach for this algier?

ps. i don't have mali and niger embassy in my country.

[ag]

Normally speaking, in Tamanrasset you are able to obtain both the visas... maybe with som delay.
One month ago they were open for this, and the 4x4 taxies were waiting for clients to pickup to Inguezzam.

Now, I'm not sure they will deliver any visa to foreigners :-(
Try to ask at ONAT office in Tam (sorry but I've no phone numbers...) maybe here someone have it (?)

Good luck
ag

[Sam Rutherford]

...but I believe you can still cross - just in a convoy. Not as much fun (!) but doesn't require you to cancel the whole trip.

Check this, though!

Sam.

[gregor]

ok.
but I can't cross the border without visas;/ ... I try to get visa in capital city maybe.

agadez is closed for foreginer turists for sure?
im asking, because I wanna get mali visa in agadez...

[Chris Scott]

Agadez is closed but as I understand it, it only means they wont let you into town or allow you to stay there (for your own safety). You can carry on down the road to Tahoua and out of the danger zone.

I did not know you can get a Mali visa in Agadez. In Niamey or Ouaga' for sure.

Bordj Moktar - Tessalit is the least risky central Sahara option right now but you'd want an escort down to the river IMO. And wear a helmet; there's a lot of food flying around at the moment!

Ch

[ag]

Just so report what seems to be happened (maybe or not, it's not clear) today between Tuareg people:
This blog ACTE DE FONDATION DE LA REPUBLIQUE TUMOUJGHA declare the creation of a new trans-nations tuareg republic...

Someone has other infos about? Is it only a flame?
ag

[silver G]

Looks quite impressive and serious

[silver G]

A quote from the blog
"Hello, I rejouis to be the first with emettre the comment. I have tears with the eyes when I write this message because it is a dream for me to see one day this nation. That God accepts this wish in this month blesses Ramadan. Together us y parvenons.le Tuareg people did nothing but too much suffer following these perpetuelles injustices to which it was victim since independences assaghid"

sorry the translation(babelfish)

[Sam Rutherford]

I hadn't realised that their 3000 year old country already skirted precisely around Algeria's border - or perhaps it's because they don't want to annoy the big guys in the North??!!

Sam.

[loots]

I have been reading this forum now for some time. In the merantime a aquired Chris Scott's book which is excellent.

I am planning a trans africa trip from south africa sometime next year with a unimog 416 converted into a camper.

From maps I have syudied and from the SAHARA Overland book it seems as if one can travel from Ghadamis along the border to Ghat.It looks as if it is approx 450 km. Will my mog be able to handle the dunes if any? It is very high approximately 900 mm above the cab roof.

It was also interesting to read Chris's comment about Unimogs in his book. I also read about his Sahara trip with the MAN and he seems to have been very hppy with the vehicle. To my knowledge the Unimog is something similar with more or less the same engine capacity and load carrying capabilities. It would be interesting to hear from Chris in this regard.

My other question is the security situation in Alegeria. Niger and Mali. Does anyone have the latest? Is it improving or detriorating. thanks Loot

[Sam Rutherford]

Your 416 should not have a problem as long as it is not too heavily loaded, the engine is producing the power it should, and you have (very) good tyres to be able to run them REALLY low on a few occasions.

You'll make the route, but don't expect to do it particularly quickly!

Sam.

[Chris Scott]

....one can travel from Ghadamis along the border to Ghat.It looks as if it is approx 450 km....

Note that I am told the alignment of the dune stage of this route as given in the book has since shifted to the east, deeper into the dunes. It no longer passes a few kms through Algeria or by the Tree to avoid the worst of them. Someone may have a current route but I believe it depends on your guide these days.

Will my mog be able to handle the dunes if any? It is very high approximately 900 mm above the cab roof.

There is no avoiding the dunes on this route. With a car or a bike you have some momentum to play with; with a truck you have to grind your way through. I would have thought a camper body etc adds up to a ton, plus all the fuel etc. Along with the usual tricks like tyre pressures, it takes a few days to get the feel for your machine the first time in real dunes, picking the lines a top-heavy truck can manage safely and knowing when to back off. A tall back body can be especially intimidating as IME they wobble around a lot on the 3-point frame. (Some have suggested fitting dampers from camper frame to the chassis). A lot of effort (if not necessarily time) can be saved by recce-ing ahead on foot for firm ground. In my case I had the luxury of bikes to do this for me but on that Libyan route you may be following tracks which helps.

It was also interesting to read Chris's comment about Unimogs in his book. I also read about his Sahara trip with the MAN and he seems to have been very hppy with the vehicle. To my knowledge the Unimog is something similar with more or less the same engine capacity and load carrying capabilities. It would be interesting to hear from Chris in this regard.

For that trip supporting 8 bikes over a range of up to 5-days/1000-km I had little choice in support vehicles and the MAN performed much better than I thought for a truck so part of my satisfaction was actually relief. But give me a regular car any day! And according to this web page a 416 is a ton lighter but is rated to carry a ton less and only has 100hp (as opposed to 136). I believe the next generation U1400 is more comparable to my MAN which only carried up to a ton at times in the desert (part of the reason it performed well I believe).

As I say on the MAN webpage, I stand by what I said in the book, although it's often overlooked that I'm refering specifically to the extremes of desert driving, not general overlanding where priorities are different. My next bike tour will probably be with a modern Hilux (although that is partly because I like to try new ways of doing the same thing).

I would say try that route on the way back after you have had some desert driving experience in your set up and where the crux is not halfway along a long route. Fyi Ghadames to Serdeles is 600km of piste (at least 200L of fuel), plus another couple of hundred down the road to Ghat.
As for trans-Africa overlanding, your mog will earn its stripes along the Congo-Angola route for sure.

My other question is the security situation in Alegeria. Niger and Mali. Does anyone have the latest? Is it improving or detriorating...

I would say that apart from the posibility of swift escorted transits, Mali and especially Niger are not going to improve fast. The Algerian Sahara is fine, as it's been for years. We're going back in November and January.

Ch

[neil parsons]

I am planning a trans africa trip from south africa sometime next year with a unimog 416 converted into a camper.

From maps I have syudied and from the SAHARA Overland book it seems as if one can travel from Ghadamis along the border to Ghat.It looks as if it is approx 450 km. Will my mog be able to handle the dunes if any? It is very high approximately 900 mm above the cab roof.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Loots
Your Unimog will not have any problems handling dunes if you reduce your tyre pressures to 1bar, do not carry any thing on the roof, and carry your fuel and water at floor level.
I have found that the Michelin XZL is the best tyre for the Unimog and have run them at 1bar for hundreds of kilometers without problems.
My Unimog-U1300L with 170hp also has a camper body(total height 3.3 meters)
and weighs 6.75 tons fully loaded with 750 litres of fuel handles dunes exeptionally well with reduced tyre pressures.
good luck with your travels.
Neil Parsons

[Tuten]

Getting back to Gregors original question about visas. Wether or not you can obtain the visas in Tam or Agadez, I would strongly advise against it. I used to travel around getting the visas as I went along until it has happened twice that my entire trip has screwed up due to this. I once ended up selling a nice car destined for south africa in the Gaza strip because the Saudis kept us waiting for 10 weeks in Jordan to give us a transit visa (i.e. after 10 weeks I gave up) and for various reasons Egypt was not an option. Other people came up the other direction and we met people who one month before us got their visas without problems. Since then I always get all the visas I can in advance, even if it means to go to some other country to apply.