any one heard of the 'Crociera Saviem' 1977 - Horizons Unlimited

**coolkarim** · #1 18 Sep 2003

I read this on a website about the 2000 dakar rally

'The rally leaves Libya and enters Egypt following the route of the 1977
Crociera Saviem (Saviem Cruise)'

it looks like its south from Khofra (Libya) to Dhakhla (Egypt)

its supposed to be famous.
cheers
Karim

**Chris Scott** · #2 18 Sep 2003

Hi Karim, I think you mean the CROISIERE DES SABELS using SAVIEM lorries etc in 1977.
I have a very nice picture book of the expedition which proported, among other things, to try and establish a new east-west trans Sahara trade route from NKT to the Nile - something that was short listed for the chocolate-piston category of Useful ideas.
They are the origin of the blue and white 'Saviem balises' one finds marked on the Mich map (there is one near the Gilf as you may know)

They used TY250s and even lorry-towed paraglider-wing things to recce ahead but even then some lorries fell over and often sunk up to the axles in the Tenere,

As far as I can tell from the map, the final section went Kufra, curled round the north of the Gilf and then went pretty much due east to south of Kharga - a place called Baris. It took them 8 days.

There was no actual piste ever established, it was mostly cross country.

IMHO, like the Tom Shep 101 trip of the same era, neither truly qualified as a true lateral desert crossings with vehicles, although Shep west and Saviem east wouid have done the trick.
Its yet to be done.

Ch

**Reinhart Mazur** · #3 19 Sep 2003

Hello everybody,

to those few interested in activities of German-speaking Sahara community: there is a book,'Trans Sahara' by Gerd Heussler, giving a detailed account on a west-east crossing of the Sahara (from Nouakchott via Taoudenni, Tin Zaouten, Tam, Djanet, Seguedine, Traghen, Waw en Namus, Kufra, Gilf Kebir, Asyut as early as 1975 or 76. They used four old surplus Hanomag trucks, three of them they lost en route. This venture is absolutely comparable to those made by Tom Sheppard and the Saviem Croisiere.

@Chris: as you see Sahara-Overland is accessible now again.

Many happy travels to the Sahara

Reinhart

www.tlc-exped.net

**Chris Scott** · #4 19 Sep 2003

Correction, it's been done (by a bumper)! What were they all on in the mid-seventies, one wonders...

Ch

**Runner** · #5 21 Sep 2003

Quote:

IMHO, like the Tom Shep 101 trip of the same era, neither truly qualified as a true lateral desert crossings with vehicles,
Ch[/B]

What makes you say that the Shep trip doesnt qualify as a 'true lateral desert crossing'?

**Chris Scott** · #6 21 Sep 2003

They had to come right down from Tessalit because, I think, Alg would not let them in: Gao, Niamey, Kano, Djamena, El Fasher then up again. See p.166 and 169 of Sahara Handbook (not Overland...)
They were the first to drive across the Majabet el Koubra (the empty bit between Atar and Tessalit) though.
Now I look at it (168), the Belgians made a pretty deserty job of it in the mid-sixties with Unimogs, even if they did follow pistes all the way.

Ch

[This message has been edited by Chris Scott (edited 21 September 2003).]

**sunjan** · #7 22 Sep 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by coolkarim:
'The rally leaves Libya and enters Egypt following the route of the 1977
Crociera Saviem (Saviem Cruise)'

It looks like its south from Khofra (Libya) to Dhakhla (Egypt)

Some travel accounts along the Saviem route.
Egypt:
http://www.egyptianreporter.net/01112002/109308news.htm

Lots of photos from Gilf Kebir:
http://www.gilf-kebir.de/set4/4_28.htm

Map and coordinates:
http://www.padovafuoristrada.it/afri...adi_maschi.htm

Historical perspective:
http://www.fjexpeditions.com/frameset/expeditions.htm

Recommended reading, book list:
http://membres.lycos.fr/saharayro/fbiblio2.htm
(This site mentions a book: GALISSIAN, C., "Croisiere Des Sables", Arthaud, Paris, 1977)

**Chris Scott** · #8 11 Oct 2003

I found out more about this Hanomag trip and bought the book. I dont think their goal was trying to be a lateral west-east and their route:

Gibraltar
Morocco
Figiug (Oujda-Figuig)
Bechar
Tindouf
Bir Mogrein
Atar - (Nouakchott-Atar)
Chinguetti
Ouadane
Taoudenni
Tombouctou
Bourem (Niamey-Bourem)
Kidal
Tin Zaouaten
Tamanrasset
Djanet
Djado
Seguedine (Bilma-Seguedine)
Tummo
Sebha- (Tripolis-Sebha)
Tmessa
Tazerbo
Kufra
Gilf
Kharga
Asyut
Cairo

dipped down to the Niger river before going up to Algeria and there were excursions to Bamako and Tripoli (maybe not the whole group).
The nine month trip was plagued by ill health - many came and went - and by the time they left Kufra near the end there was only one guy per 'mag - and soon only 1 Hanomag left by the time they got to the Gilf!

So it seems a true lateral vehicle desert crossing (one that stays in the desert) still stands, staying, let's say, a couple of degrees either side of Cancer. It's only a stunt of course, and only politics and its consequences makes it impossible.

CS

For more on west east see this:
Sahara – West to East Crossing | Chris Scott's Desert Travels