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African Roads 20 May 2012 14:04

Private HGV Registration
 
Hi,

After a bit of information. I have a Man truck with a self built body on the back. Unladen comes in at approx 9.5 tonnes (she is quite big!). Totally for personal use, no hire and reward involved. Has a fully functioning anaologue tacho fitted. Will get that calibrated to play it safe.

Question I have is: I would like to tax her as a PHGV.

To do that, do I need to get the V5 changed to classify her as a PHGV, or can I leave the V5 as HGV (which she is currently classified as), and just buy the tax as PHGV?

Hope that makes sense what I'm asking!

If I had to change the V5 to PHGV, would DVLA or VOSA or whoever is involved want to see pictures as to why I want to change the classification, or even inspect her at a vehicle station?

Thanks for any advice.

graysworld 20 May 2012 23:35

Hi,
I got my 4 ton Iveco mot'd as a camper and then took the documents to the local DVLA office and they did it just put or say that you want / it is PLG. they told me they might want to inspect it, because I was changing the body type. They did not bother. The inspection I have been told is only for the inside, but even so VOSA testing is not so tough.

Graeme

African Roads 21 May 2012 20:38

Thanks Graysworld.

Thing is, you're less than 7500Kgs, and I suspect less of a concern to VOSA in terms of safety (just thinking out loud not sure that is the case).

They're pretty strict with 7500kgs plus. Like I say we come in about 9000kgs, and Im worried if I were to get pulled over and the tax disc said PHGV but the V5 HGV they would throw the book at me.

rclafton 21 May 2012 23:20

You need it as private hgv, now this doesn't seem as easy in the midlands as graeme had with his cos I got passed between VOSA and the DVLA loads of times in one phonecall trying to get my similar Iveco transferred to Private HGV (tax is cheaper, and thats also what it should be as a 4 tonne truck)

The tax rates are the same I believe, but being private HGV gets you out of some regulations I beleive, if its HGV then you need tacho calibration and you'll need to drive to the tacho ?

Is it converted to live in ?

grizzly7 23 May 2012 19:03

Hiya

PHGV is the taxation class. Which class you fit into depends on body type among others.

A motor caravan is a PHGV regardless of weight once over 3500kg.

You have to prove it covers all the DVLAs requirements of being a camper to them, if thats what you are aiming for? If the V5 says HGV then thats what you tax it as, tacho and plating req'd. You may as well be asking if you can tax it in the same class as a Prius, I don't think you're supposed to be able to choose yourself! ;) If you google DVLA requirements for a camper several forums have a list, but getting the info from the DVLA seems impossible. Send a photo of each of these features, plus overall extras perhaps, with the ammended V5 to the DVLA is all I did about 2 years ago, no hassle. Look on the SBMCC for more info too maybe?

There will be other catagories of type, but I don't know what they are. A race truck for motorcross weekends doesn't count as a camper since a MX bike in a big campers garage is not required for camping, so seems to count as goods, different V5 class, tacho etc required.

I looked at one ex electric board cherry picker that had a flat bed put on the back instead, classed as something which allowed PHGV taxation but couldn't put anything in the back, even a spare tyre according to the seller, but again no tacho required.

I don't know how long ago you passed your Cat C driving licence, but since its illegal for a Cat C learner to carry goods, the driving school's vehicle is PHGV and doesn't require a tacho. They do because they're probably second hand and used to "work", and if the school need to sell they can easily. As well as the fact you need to learn how to use the tacho to pass the test.

All as far as I know.

:)

ps Any pics please?!?

African Roads 24 May 2012 20:23

Hi Rich and Grizzly,

Thanks for all the info. Not yet converted to live in, but will be done in the future (havent got the time and money this year, hoepfuly in 2013). For the next year, I just want to drive it around UK a bit to test drive it, maybe go for a few weekends away in for camping etc....so really I just want it to be road legal.

1. When you say plating, do you mean the metal plaque with stamped numbers on it that details axle weights, Vin number etc? If so, it has one in the cab rivetted in the stair well, original plate.

2. Tacho is working, and I will get it calibrated and sealed and stickered. Then if VOSA so pull me they can't get me for that.

3. Have had Class 2 licence since 2007, and have done truck driving so know the ins and outs of tacho rules okay (well, as good as I can , the rules are a load of bollocks as far as Im concerned but thats another story). Also have a digital tacho card I have used at times when doing some extra work.

4. HGV tax is only marginally more than PHGV isn't it (like an extra £50 or something like that)? If so, nothing stopping me keeping it as an HGV and just paying HGV tax rate?

Thanks for your thoughts guys much appreciated.

tacr2man 29 May 2012 20:11

The plate is not metal its a piece of paper (usually laminated) pink in colour , with various bits of info regarding vehicle on it . eg axle weights, body type, vin , etc . This has to be displayed in a holder on the vehicle.
There is another very similar that should come with vehicle, that has much the same on , but also tyre sizes. They are VTG 6 and VTG 7 IIRC .
Going from HGV to PHGV is basically a paper excercise, its getting caught carrying goods for hire or reward that will cause you big problems.
Going to motorhome , allows certain exemptions , from regs (eg tachograph) , but you are only allowed to carry items needed for living , as mentioned earlier you cant carry a racing car , or horses etc . You could carry say a coupleof bicycles , or microcar , scooter for getting around .
HTSH

African Roads 29 May 2012 21:36

Thanks for the advice Tacr2man appreciate that.

Don't have this laminated paper you mention. All I have is a metal plate, rivetted to the side of the footwell in the cab. It has all these details imprinted/stamped into the metal...chassis number, engine number, axle weights, gross weight, train weight etc.

How would I go about getting this paper version if I don't have it? Apply to the manufacturer?

Advice heeded about hire and reward.....all I will carry is the basics I need for a few camping weekends....tent, boxes of food, chair, personal baggage etc.

tacr2man 30 May 2012 20:24

plating
 
The vehicle should have a plating cert if it has ben previously registered in the UK (ie it has a british reg number plate) . It should have come with the vehicle , as any vehicle over 3500kg needs to be "plated" from new . The plating cert lists all the weights etc. You should be able to obtain a duplicate from VOSA . If you alter the vehicle this could well affect the plate details, certain mods are notifiable by law . VOSA can answer your questions as to what you need to be legally on the road in UK . Their tel number is
0300 123 9000 HTSH

tacr2man 31 May 2012 19:15

Bit more info for you , if your vehicle says on v5 that it is motorhome, or such then you will not need a plating cert . If it does not then you need to contact DVLA and if you can substantiate it , ie comply with requirements for motorhome , eg fixed table, cooking , water, bed , storage etc There is a publication available on line from directgov . This may get you out of tacho requirements, speed limiter etc . HTSH

African Roads 2 Jun 2012 12:09

Thanks again for all the advice.

She will certainly be a motorhome within the next 2 years when time and funds allow me to fabricate the inside, but for the moment she will be an empty body on the back of an HGV chassis.

Therefore I will have to keep the tacho and the HGV status until the time comes that she can be built and re-classified as a motorhome.

Like I say, she is at the stage where the mechanical overhaul is done and the body is built, but she is empty inside.....and I would like to take her for a few spins around the UK until i get the time to finish her.

So will apply to VOSA about the paper duplicate you mention.

The truck I have doesn't have a speed limiter fitted....and no evidence of ever having one. She is a 1988 model.....think they became compulsory at stage of manufacture around 1991?? Would I have to get one fitted if it doesn't have one? Whats the deal if VOSA pulled me and found it doesnt have a speed limiter fitted?

Again thanks for all the information bier

tacr2man 4 Jun 2012 17:43

Re speed limiter , from 1 jan 88 if over 12000kg
from aug 92 7500 to 12000kg
so VOSA wont be bothered.

You will probably require sideguards to be fitted as its after after 1 april 84 , unless its a tipper ?
same with rear underun bar as well .
You can drive on road to place of fitment .

You will need a tacho as its over 7500 kg , but wait till its 25years old and you are exempt as historic vehicle. and you can just use as a speedo BTW only needs KM speed markings ! but you will still need it to have an initial calibration plaque , but will not need it to be recalibrated every 6yrs if analogue type ,or 2 yrs if digi type . HTSH

Have a look at calibration plaque make sure has your veh reg or chassis number on it and if dated it lasts 6yrs .

African Roads 17 Jun 2012 23:48

Great info thanks for sharing! :thumbup1:

Question: What's a rear underruun bar? Do you mean the drop bar from the chassis which stops vehicles from going under you if they hit you up the ass?

tacr2man 18 Jun 2012 22:26

Yes thats the bar like a rear bumper :thumbup1:


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