Go Back   Horizons Unlimited - The HUBB > Technical, Bike forums > Equipping the Bike - what's the best gear?
Equipping the Bike - what's the best gear? Anything to do with the bikes equipment, saddlebags, etc. Questions on repairs and maintenance of the bike itself belong in the Brand Specific Tech Forums.
Photo by Daniel Rintz, Himba children, Namibia

The only impossible journey
is the one
you never begin

Photo by Daniel Rintz,
Himba children, Namibia



Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10 Aug 2005
John Ferris's Avatar
Gold Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Reno,NV,USA
Posts: 560
Mr Ron's new tire

Mr Ron stopped by and put on a new tire.
It is a Metzeler Enduro 3 Sahara "Tube type"
It was not his first choice.
When he left it was seated fine and holding air but he did not put a tube in it.
What do you think ? he has always tube-less tires, can he get away with no tube on a tube type tire.
He asked me to post this so he will have answer when he gets home.
If his tire blows out he will have his answer before he gets home.
John
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10 Aug 2005
Steve Pickford's Avatar
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 994
I don't think using a tube type tyre without a tube is a good idea? Doesn't the bead differ between the two types, for sealing purposes?

[This message has been edited by Steve Pickford (edited 10 August 2005).]
__________________
My photos: www.possu.smugmug.com
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 14 Aug 2005
Mr. Ron's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC, for now...
Posts: 792
Hello! Made it into Vancouver today with no problem! Tire leaked slightly from the bead until i hit 200 miles of gravel. Ran it at 28 pounds off-road and 34 pounds on the highway. John, my front tire blew in California, good thing i bought that tube, eh! Anyways, i think the big difference between tube and tubeless is weather you can fix it with a plug. Any other comments?? I'll continue running this tire tubeless untill i'm forced to install a tube.

BTW..i run tubeless Akront rims...
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 14 Aug 2005
Grant Johnson's Avatar
HU Founder
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Dec 1997
Location: BC Canada
Posts: 7,216
there is a difference between tube and tubeless tires and rims.

Tubeless rims are designed to hold the bead i nplace better, generally with a small ridge - that's why they're so hard to get off. Reason of course is that if the bead breaks you lose all air instantly! With a tube type the bead could break momentarily and the tube pressure would just reseat the tire.

I would personally consider it unsafe to run a tubeless tire on a tube type rim without a tube. (that's not taking into account the sealing issues around spokes or not, just the seating of the bead issues)

Tube type tire on a tubeless rim without a tube - unknown territory there, and I'm sure the manufacturers of both tire and rim would strongly recommend against it! I wouldn't run that combo myself. Might be fine, but I don'twant to be the guinea pig thanks.

Thanks for doing the testing so far Ron! If you have any problems be sure to let us know.

Grant
__________________
Grant Johnson
Seek, and ye shall find.

------------------------
Inspiring, Informing and Connecting travellers since 1997!
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 14 Aug 2005
richardb's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: guildford, surrey, UK
Posts: 138
ON a related note where do people stand on the tubes vs tubeless issue.

I've had a spate of punctures recently on my tubed Dakar. I've had slime, supposedly specifically for tubes, in the rear for nearly two years. Although it did slow down the puncture and I could rode several hundred miles on it over three days, it did not stop the leak totally although it claimed it would.

So each time I have had a new tube.

Sealants for tubeless tyres do seem to have a better reputation for a permanent fix, as do plugs.
So what are the benefits of a tubed bike? I'm seeing fewer.

plus - if you have a screw/nail embedded, but the air is holding - do you remove it or leave it until it does start to leak?

Richard

------------------
Richb
http://www.postmaster.co.uk/~richardbeaumont/60684/
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 15 Aug 2005
Mr. Ron's Avatar
Registered Users
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC, for now...
Posts: 792
Richard, in my experience i prefer tubeless over tube anyday. You can sometimes fix a tubeless with a plug without removing the tire. Tubeless tires don't creep when under low preasure for off-roading, where tube-tires require rim-locks, a huge PITA in my opinion. Tubeless tires are built stronger and can sustain heavy damage and still get you home. On my last trip i had a 2" cut on my sidewall of my TKC-80. With a patch inside to help hold things together and a tube added to hold the air, i managed over 1000 miles in brutally hot weather with no problems and a hole i could stick my thumb through. I donot beleive the average tube tire would of held up.
As most lessons in life, i learned mine the hard way: even with tubeless tires, always carry a spare tube! Sidewall punctures are not fixable and a tube is your only option. Be sure to carry an electric air-pump, and maintain it! I had to tear mine apart and fix it on the side of the road in the middle of a desert. After 20000 miles in the bottom of my pannier, the fittings worked loose and it couldn't build up enough preassure to seal the bead. Don't try to save weight with short flimsy tire-irons, the extra few pounds pays it's weight in gold!I use 14" cast steel irons. Finally, the most important thing to carry along with your tire repair kit is a big bottle of dish soap! Use lots on the bead of the tire to help it slip up onto its step. This also aids in breaking the bead with only tire-irons. I've been successful in breaking the bead on all tires i've put on using soap. If i allow a shop to replace a tire, i give them the soap and ask them to use lots for future benifit.
For problems sealing the bead, i carry a strap of 1" high-strength nylon webbing. Mine is rated for 2000LB (a very useful gift from a fellow i met at the Creel rally last year) Tie this around the outside of the tire creating a band. Insert the largest wrench from your kit and twist, tightning the band and sealing the bead to the rim. At this point the large amounts of soap will help create a seal. Once a seal is established, remove the strap and continue to pump up to the tires rating. KEEP YOUR FINGERS CLEAR OF THE BEAD!! If the bead is stubborn and doesn't want to pop, simply bounce the tire off the road until it does.
More than once i've pinched the tube while trying th wrestle the tire back onto it's rim, making you do everything over again. I think this is the main reason i prefer tubeless. I once put a plug in a rear Tourance and it lasted longer than the tread, over 15000 miles! However, YMMV
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 15 Aug 2005
Contributing Member
Veteran HUBBer
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: cardigan,wales
Posts: 249
I second your comments,Mr Ron.If you have the rims to go tubeless,i'd always do so.As far as the difference between tube and tubeless tyres is concerned,the bead bit of the tubeless tyre has a slightly thicker layer of rubber to help sealing whereas the tube type can sometimes be practically the canvas/kevlar material.I've looked at most makes recently and there does'nt seem to be much of a difference anymore,with all the tyres i've seen having a rubber bead.One tip i've found if you simply can't get hold of a T/L tyre for your T/L rim,is to use a bit of the sealing compound that fitters use.It's a sort of pink colour,the consistency of butter and works a treat!Also very handy if you've got a little bit of alloy corrosion on the seating bit of the rim.For a realy good setup,T/L tyres with OKO sealant inside(slime),and baring a split sidewall,you should'nt have any punctures.If you do pickup a nail or screw,LEAVE IT ALONE,and let the slime do it's job.

------------------
Just going for a short ride on my bike....
__________________
Just going for a short ride on my bike....
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 Registered Users and/or Members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


 
 

Announcements

Thinking about traveling? Not sure about the whole thing? Watch the HU Achievable Dream Video Trailers and then get ALL the information you need to get inspired and learn how to travel anywhere in the world!

Have YOU ever wondered who has ridden around the world? We did too - and now here's the list of Circumnavigators!
Check it out now
, and add your information if we didn't find you.

Next HU Eventscalendar

HU Event and other updates on the HUBB Forum "Traveller's Advisories" thread.
ALL Dates subject to change.

2024:

Add yourself to the Updates List for each event!

Questions about an event? Ask here

HUBBUK: info

See all event details

 
World's most listened to Adventure Motorbike Show!
Check the RAW segments; Grant, your HU host is on every month!
Episodes below to listen to while you, err, pretend to do something or other...

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

2020 Edition of Chris Scott's Adventure Motorcycling Handbook.

"Ultimate global guide for red-blooded bikers planning overseas exploration. Covers choice & preparation of best bike, shipping overseas, baggage design, riding techniques, travel health, visas, documentation, safety and useful addresses." Recommended. (Grant)



Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance.

Ripcord Rescue Travel Insurance™ combines into a single integrated program the best evacuation and rescue with the premier travel insurance coverages designed for adventurers.

Led by special operations veterans, Stanford Medicine affiliated physicians, paramedics and other travel experts, Ripcord is perfect for adventure seekers, climbers, skiers, sports enthusiasts, hunters, international travelers, humanitarian efforts, expeditions and more.

Ripcord travel protection is now available for ALL nationalities, and travel is covered on motorcycles of all sizes!


 

What others say about HU...

"This site is the BIBLE for international bike travelers." Greg, Australia

"Thank you! The web site, The travels, The insight, The inspiration, Everything, just thanks." Colin, UK

"My friend and I are planning a trip from Singapore to England... We found (the HU) site invaluable as an aid to planning and have based a lot of our purchases (bikes, riding gear, etc.) on what we have learned from this site." Phil, Australia

"I for one always had an adventurous spirit, but you and Susan lit the fire for my trip and I'll be forever grateful for what you two do to inspire others to just do it." Brent, USA

"Your website is a mecca of valuable information and the (video) series is informative, entertaining, and inspiring!" Jennifer, Canada

"Your worldwide organisation and events are the Go To places to for all serious touring and aspiring touring bikers." Trevor, South Africa

"This is the answer to all my questions." Haydn, Australia

"Keep going the excellent work you are doing for Horizons Unlimited - I love it!" Thomas, Germany

Lots more comments here!



Five books by Graham Field!

Diaries of a compulsive traveller
by Graham Field
Book, eBook, Audiobook

"A compelling, honest, inspiring and entertaining writing style with a built-in feel-good factor" Get them NOW from the authors' website and Amazon.com, Amazon.ca, Amazon.co.uk.



Back Road Map Books and Backroad GPS Maps for all of Canada - a must have!

New to Horizons Unlimited?

New to motorcycle travelling? New to the HU site? Confused? Too many options? It's really very simple - just 4 easy steps!

Horizons Unlimited was founded in 1997 by Grant and Susan Johnson following their journey around the world on a BMW R80G/S.

Susan and Grant Johnson Read more about Grant & Susan's story

Membership - help keep us going!

Horizons Unlimited is not a big multi-national company, just two people who love motorcycle travel and have grown what started as a hobby in 1997 into a full time job (usually 8-10 hours per day and 7 days a week) and a labour of love. To keep it going and a roof over our heads, we run events all over the world with the help of volunteers; we sell inspirational and informative DVDs; we have a few selected advertisers; and we make a small amount from memberships.

You don't have to be a Member to come to an HU meeting, access the website, or ask questions on the HUBB. What you get for your membership contribution is our sincere gratitude, good karma and knowing that you're helping to keep the motorcycle travel dream alive. Contributing Members and Gold Members do get additional features on the HUBB. Here's a list of all the Member benefits on the HUBB.




All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:12.