Ortlieb panniers or andy strapz expedition pannierz?
 

Hello, yes sorry I know there is alot of info on soft panniers, but im just looking for some info on these two, Im not interested in any of the other soft panniers. Any info on the ortlieb and andy strapz panniers would be great as would pics! Pics pics pics please as its easyer to see how the bags hang from bikes! Thanks alot

well I used the Ortlieb sling over pack a lot on my KTM LC4, they are made very well, but even so I'm still not happy with this bags for various reasons, (may it's the shape of my bike only) so I rather use a 50Lt Rucksack strapped to the parcel carrier for my long trips........ anyway.... haven't used the Ortlieb saddle bags for a long time now, just sitting in a corner.

now first the good news....... this sling over bags are very easy to handle, to fit and remove to any bike readjusting with there two very solid and wide 3inch Valkro adjustable loops across the seat, the bags are absolute water tight and have a ABS bottom to keep theme in shape. Easy to stuff your gear, ideal if you use a additional pack roll on top, across the whole thing.
If you drop the bike this bags can cope with a lot, like a sort of air-bag on the side.

Now the reasons why I'm not happy is that, the bags tent to slip around to one or the other side if not fully balanced, so I started to use a extra strap to tie the handle loops together to the parcel carrier, so it will be OK if there is no need to take the bags on or off the bike quickly. The more serious reason is that the bags got a sort of soft layer to the outside facing the side panels to protect this from scratches, well this foam type stuff melt very easy on the LC4 left side regarding the low distance to the exhaust, making sticky black marks on the V2A exhaust, after that I covered this side of the bag with F1-heat reflecting material but the plastic bike panels still get worn. on the right side of the bike there is not a lot of solid frame that prevent the bag from hanging in to the wheel arch, so the rear Wheel starts rubbing on the bottom of the bag especial if the set-up starts slipping to the right side of the bike..... (as I say may it's only the absent of support of my LC4, may other bikes have less problems supporting this saddle bags)

The Ortlieb page:
Ortlieb Outdoor Equipment see the English part
look out for there part-no: M22 on page 57 in there catalogue.

Material is black Nylon-reinforced PVC (lorry tarpaulin) with reflecting patches.
weight: 2.3 Kg
Volume: 47 Lt.
size: 38h x 28w x 21d cm

I had my Ortlieb bags from KTM-Sommer some years ago:
Packtaschenset, 42 L Volumen, black (10919) EUR 149,95
SOMMER KTM - ZUBEHÖR picture on there side !

well you where asking for a experience report...... and some opinions... here it is........ this bags are made and designed by folk's that make nice bags for push-bikes not for speedy, shaking and vibrating engines riding bad tracks or off-road............. :)
still this bags are usable for certain needs anyway.......... but don't expect to much of it.

take care
spooky

Andy Strapz.... I don't have pictures sorry, but they are by far the best soft panniers I have ever seen. I have two pairs.

Regards

Nigel in NZ

Wow!
Excellent report on the Bags.
I have had similar problems with soft bags moving around and getting hot.
I constructed a home made system to keep bag off pipe but not so good.
ON the other side I had success. I just used a piece of electrical conduit pipe.
I fabricated it to bolt in place. This keeps the bag off the wheel and you can
attach bag to it if needed.

I've not used Ortlieb panniers but did try a duffle bag. I sent it back.

I have used Tourmaster bags and now use some cheap Technic panniers,
$60 and a bit too big or off road.

I also switched to a very small GIVI rack to keep soft bag off pipe. Its not too heavy and is way better than my home made project where things still caught on fire.

I think it must be a bit of trial and error on each bike to see what works.
The real test is off road, going fast with bags loaded heavy. Then it will all go wrong ... or not! :thumbup1:

Patrick :mchappy:

I'm in the process of fitting Andy Strapz Expedition panniers to my CRF450X for my, er, expedition.

As Nigel says, they're extremely well made.

When I've got them sorted out (avoiding the exhaust is the main issue), I'll post some photos. Then, as Patrick says, I'll go fast off road and post some more photos. :)
Stephan

Absolutely right !
Well about making some DIY brackets........... I think the idea of using soft bags like the Ortlieb or Andy Strapz is to keep the weight low and avoiding the need of bulky heavy support frames or brackets, making it easy and comfortable to carry any load with out doing any MODs to the bike.
For instant, the most weight of carrying panniers is actual the support frame, so there would be not much difference using a hard pannier box or soft bags if there is the need of fitting a additional frame.
Yes Offroad bikes like Enduros are very slim at the back, even a parcel carrier is tiny, regardless what brand, but exact this type of bike is used most for travelling on a small and light foot print to remote places, exact this sort of bikes need soft bags more than others.

I second that...
 

I got nice new boxes in May, used them once then got Andy Strapz.. I’m happy now :)


Shaun

Yee Haa!!! Great stuff so far!!! Right to the point about each of the systems so far, cant remember who said this but I too was also thinking that the ortlieb were not the hardcore panniers, more for the push bike and slow riders (not that there is anything wrong with that!!!). The first report was great and after reading that I had pretty much made up my mind anyway!! So it looks like its going to be Andy Strapz, but not untill the end of the week, so still time for more reports and pitcures!!!!!!!!! Thanks alot!

ortlieb panniers or andystrapz expedition pannierz ?
 

Good decision ! I have a pair and I am completely happy with them.

Hey. Just ordered some of the andy strapz expedition pannierz!!! Yee Haa!!! Really looking forward to getting them, and hopefully it will be pretty bloody soon as the delivery was an extra £20! But no worries, Im sure it will be money well spent. I will be sure to write up a review as soon as Iv used them a wee bit. Cheers for the advice!!!!

Recived them afew days ago!!! Iv only had them on the bike once but the seem grand. It says to give them a good soaking first so I just filled them with a hose and left them to dry, apperantly you need to do this to close up the seams, or something. My ride home took 2 hours, and 2 hours of some of the heavest rainfall I have ever seen in Scotland (I lived in Malaysia for some time, and I hadnt seen rain like it since then!!!). But the panniers didnt let a drop in!!! Also I havnt got any pannier racks for the bike so they were slung over the seat just behind me. They didnt move an inch as the have a couple of funkie little straps on then to secure them to the frame/grab handle. So far so good, they seem bullet proof. Just trying to make up a simple rack now for them. Will write a bit more when I know a bit more! Cheers, Ash

update
 

Any joy with the pannier racks for your Andy Strapz??

How are the Andy Strapz holding up when in contact with the exhaust?

I'm just in the (very painful) process of choosing how to store my crap on my travels and it looks like soft bags on a rack, with either the Ortlieb bags or the Andy Strapz expedition panniers.

Now the Ortliebs probably melt down right away if fastened to near the exhaust and 'd rather have some soft bags that can at least take a bit of heat, that is if I can get the Andy Strapz at all in Germany...

Interesting insight on the Andy Strapz panniers.

Soft Panniers recommendations ? - ADVrider

http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/tst...r/P1010291.JPG

I regretfully sold my AS panniers to 'Stephano'. I then fitted Metal Mule 31 litre panniers and the bike handled like it was towing a caravan. Bought another set of AS and with the additional AS Flatstrapz have the AS panniers fitted snug and secure around the pannier rack as seen above. The bike handles brilliantly fulled loaded. Only at very slow speed do i notice the extra weight.
Inside the panniers i bought the optional AS dry bags, which pretty much fit the internal shape of the panniers to ensure your good are waterproof.
AS are worth every penny IMHO.

Mike

I have only ever used hard luggage but am now going to make the change to soft. Thing is though, I always wondered what happens to all the fluids that I always bring when stashed in the soft luggage during a crash? This time I carry 500ml of ATF, 500ml of turps and a liter of oil (which I haven´t touched in 15000km, so might leave that. Or is that stupid?).

Scrap the ATF and turps. Keep the engine oil.

If the fluid containers have secure top then they should not leak even when presureised by a fall... try standing on the contaner .. not in the house! If you really are worried just have teh container full of water then stand on it ..

Yeah, I´ve got them in Trangia bottles. Bloody awesome for bike use, because of the valve top so you control the flow.

What am I going to use for cleaning the air filter and lubing the chain than?

Diswashing liquid. Re oil with engine oil.

Use filter skins so yo are not doing this freqently.

Engine oil.

Clean with desiel.

Read http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/tec...ration-offroad

Saw an on line advert for some american soft panniers (dirt bagz??) where they came with a frame to keep them off exhausts, wheels.

Seemed to consist of a bar running from the rear rack handle/sub frame to the rear/front foot peg bracket. Prob easy to fabricate yourself as it seemed to be non load bearing but aimed to prevent sag/wheel contact. If strongly made however I presume it would act as additional sub frame bracing.

cheers

38

Pre-filter or filter skins don´t work on the F. Unifilter don´t even do them because they couldn´t make them work as the air intake is really narrow, and it caused intake problems. I don´t see the advantage of replacing one fluid (ATF) with another (engine oil) when only one of the 2 gets used normally anyway. I used ATF everyday, but never use oil. The F just doesn´t use it. Hence my idea of ditching it.

Similar issue with dishwashing liquid. I tend to clean my filter a lot, because my Mrs doesn´t like to ride far back, and hence sucks up a lot of dust, I end up doing it in deserted places at camp. So I would have to carry dishwashing liquid. Would it require more liquid if cleaning it with dishwashing liquid? Haven´t used it. Turps works really fast and I don´t use any water.
Don´t like the idea of using engine oil on the air filter, but the unifilter oil spreads really well, and so I´ve only used half a nalgene bottle in 15000km (10 cleans).

I have cleaned Suzuki genuine foam air filter with gasoline from tank and oiled with engine oil. Some have reported that gasoline can ruin foam but with Suzuki filter I see no difference in foam after having cleaned with gasoline.

Umm filter skins go over the top of the original filter - like panty hose. They collect most of teh dirt, once removed you have a fairly clean filter underneath .. put on a clean filter skin and go again. Once you have dirtied all your filter skins you do a big clean.

You carry engine oil incase you hole a sump. You don't replace teh ATF container with another engine oil container .. simply use the engine oil you are already carrying .. and get more engine oil before you leave. Same as replacing teh AFT/Turps/petrol while you are on the trip .. you don't have to start out carrying it all with you.. buy it along the way where and when you need it - thus saving carrying it with you ...

-----------------
Your Mrs needs to ride further back .. so she can see better if nothing else. That is a saftey item and should be followed. The person infront can keep an eye in the revision mirror for the following dust cloud - if it stops - turn around and go back.
Another point is that the slowest rider should be in front .. but I think that comes to personal preferences ..

You should have dishwashing liquid for cleaning up at those remote camps ...

Sorry to the original poster for hyjacking this thread, not my intention at all, but it´s a pretty interesting discussion to me.

Firstly, petrol is an abrasive, and does wear foam, even if you can´t tell the difference with the naked eye. Unifilter and other manufacturers dis-approve using it, and I´m not going to argue with that, although I have used it on my old bike. Don´t want to risk it with my new one.

Frank, try argueing with my Mrs. She does ride further back than she used to though, but if she´s upfront the pace is too slow for me, and she just sits back without extending herself. But that´s my opinion. I´m not good with cruizing.

Are those pre-filters universal in size? The unifilter comes with a spring in the filter to keep the shape they want, so I have thought about using a sock or something but haven´t experimented yet.

Might try engine oil in future. I have time to experiment now, but did have some trouble finding the oil I wanted on this trip, and when I did it was specially imported and very expensive. My reasoning for ditching the oil was that I like the way ATF works the chain and because we´re on 2 bikes I could plug the engine with epoxy and get towed to a place with some oil, or send the Mrs to get it. Than again, if the oil is only for the rare case of a crack in the casing, I could just get any oil in the correct weight for the chain. Hmm. Need to really go through my gear.

Petrol is a solvent mostly.. and I think that it degrades the foam/glue they use.

The "Filter Skins" come in various sizes ... they simply gover the tope of the original filter ... like a glove. Someone said you can use pool filters too at 1/3rd the price .. basicly it is a bit of cloth ...

-----
tmotten you need to relax more on the holiday .. let the Mrs go first .. If she is pushing herself she is more likely to fall.

Yep... I do it every time I travel .. helps to think it out slowly. The slower the more thinkin is done the better the end result. When you come back you know what did not work so well .. or never got used .. think those things out as they usually provide the gretest improvment.

Usually I try to do 'maintance' close to some major centre so I can get the bits I need .. that way I don't have to carry them, well not far anyway.

Totally agree. Exept for the holiday part. This is not a holiday. Sitting with my lazy arse on the beach, having a bit of surf and sipping cocktails in between is holiday. This is stress and adventure. Often more enjoyed after the event than on.

Like the pool thing idea. Might have a look for it when I get back. Definately slowly making conclusions is better. I have a huge list of crap that´s going out which will give me room for using soft luggage instead.

Question about soft panniers
 

I have always used soft panniers and think the AS luggage is amazing - however I feel if your by yourself a set of hard panniers are better for the sole reason that they are too vunerable to theiving

every trip I have done i have wanted to stop throughout the day, have a rest and look about somewhere. I have always cmpromised on this due to the possibility of having things stolen. Hard panniers you can just lock up and therefore you aren't carting you things with you whilst having a wander about.

Anyone have a solution to this?

we noticed on this trip that even with all hard luggage we still didn't like leaving the bikes out of sight. Plus, if you only put clothes in them it doesn't matter anyway. Depends on your setup though. I'm aiming for having all tools in a fake exhaust, electricals in a small top box and camping gear in a stuffsafe sack.

I used 2 55L Pacsafes for my AS panniers. Getting in and out of them swiftly becomes a royal pain in the ass however so my day to day stuff was kept in my ortlieb bag:

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/m...a/IMG_0110.jpg

Pacsafes
 

That is exactly what I had in mind for my Astrapz! I used a pacsafe for my ortlieb on our Brighton2Capetown jaunt.

In response to a previous post re: regretting not being able to wander around. I would counter that my biggest regret was not being able to take my bike into more extreme/remote areas because I was lumbered with too much stuff in huge/heavy metal mule panniers. I regret that more than I envisage regretting the wandering part (after all I'm riding around the world, not walking :thumbup1:)

pacsafe now do a waterproof bag with the mesh cut to the exact size called the stufsafe.

Mike
Your former bags have been doing sterling service on loan to a friend on an Enfield in India for a few months. :thumbup1:

When they come back in a month, I'll get around to fitting them on my CRF and post photos.

Stephan

I have only used ortliebs ... but I can tell you they are 100% waterproof.

I have heard from those who have had Andy Strapz that they are not ... especially on a long journey.

Waterproof is a beautiful thing.

Hard to compare as I dont know anyone who has actually owned both and ridden transcontinental with both.

I am using Andy Strapz Exp. panniers at the moment and they're freaking awesome, I'm in the middle of Bolivia in the wet season and so far nothing has got wet. I would definitely also recommend the Strapz too (similar to Octopus straps/bungees) I couldn't imagine not having them now. Having never seen ortliebs I can't comment on those but I am positive AS are better than Aluminium panniers (though far less secure of course). Also Andy Strapz gave me a small discount for placing an ad on my website, you may be able to do the same.

Ortlieb on motorcycles
 

My experience of using Ortleib is primarily on cycles both on the rear pannier and front lowriders. They have always been excellent and without problem. Only one little winge on my older models (some 10 years old) the plastic bar holding the top pannier carrier mounts will bend when the pannier is stuffed full making fitting to the rack a little tricky. Pack them properly and there is no trouble.

Remember that using them off road on a bicycle they get far harder hits than when protected by the suspension of a motorcycle.

For a temporary set up on a journey of some 1500 miles I rigged up a couple of low loader racks using the motorbike rear rack mounting points, a luggage strap and some cable ties. The racks held position and the panniers were still instant on an off forming a good base for drum bag and tent.

Some gentle of road, many miles of 90+mph (it is a Highland :innocent:) motorway and slow weaving through thick traffic, no problem. Good stability, narrow and cheap. Also I snagged a road sign doing an idiot manoeuver out of a car park at 25mph, enough to hole the pannier but did not knock it of the bike or rip off the rack. Rigid 'mortuary boxes' would have either had me off or had a costly load of damage. Also they are significantly narrower making filtering far easier - see photoshttp://www.weetwood.force9.co.uk/kt1.jpg

http://www.weetwood.force9.co.uk/kt2.jpg

http://www.weetwood.force9.co.uk/kt3.jpg

http://www.weetwood.force9.co.uk/kt4.jpg

http://www.weetwood.force9.co.uk/kt5.jpg

Something to consider, the $AUD is very low at the moment, 65c to the US dollar so Andy Strapz would be 35% cheaper than they were this time last year if you live in the states.

I use the ortliebs on my 800 GS. I took them off recently to wash some of the road salt off them and dunked them in the bath. They were 80% submerged and not one drop of water got in. Not even through the plastic retainers that hold the stiffened liner in place.

I use them everyday in all conditions and they are as tough as nails. I brushed off a few things when squeezing through tight gaps and they show no signs of damage.

my bikes rear end is wider than the 1200 believe it or not so I didn't want the Ortliebs to have that pulled up / splayed out look so I bought some velcro that could bridge the gap and let them hang down to their normal position. (no pun intended :blushing:)

Extending my Panniers - a set on Flickr

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3213/...d6128dde_o.jpg

I'm pleased with the Ortliebs and the end result of their position on the bike :thumbup1:

I had the same problem. I'm using Wolfman soft bags on a DR650. Solution ... velcro! I swear that stuff is almost as good as duct tape.

I bought six or eight feet of velcro from a large roll at a hardware store. I brought the Wolfman bags to a tailor. He sewed a strip of velcro to the underside of the more forward of the two sets of straps that connect the panniers atop the seat.

Across the seat, I fastened up another strip velcro so that it would mate with the velcro on the pannier strap. This is glue-back velcro so it stuck nicely to the seat, and I stapled it up beneath.

Works like a charm! :mchappy: Zero movement on those bags now. A brace easily fabricated from aluminum bar keeps the right bag off the pipe.

BTW ... hiya Patrick!

Mark

How pliable is that PVC insert in the ortlieb panniers. I'm changing to soft luggage because my wife has awesome skill with coming off without injury, but seems to get here legs cought underneight the edge of the hard pannier on this bike. Not being able to pull her leg from underneight it. Don't like the idea of going soft but with the hard edges.

small bags
 

Hi guys,
I'm swaying towards soft panniers because they don't have the $100,000 look and seem more practical, despite security concerns.

AndyStrapz an Ortlieb seem to be the main suppliers. My reservation is that both seem quite small (Andy 15L-25L, Ortlieb approx. 23L) per bag. Aluminium stuff seems to be around 35-40L per pannier.

Are there bigger bags out there or does this make them to combersome and raise strenght issues?

From their dimensions it seams the bigger Steel Pony panniers are almost as big as Zega 35l boxes.

I have a set of the Steel Pony bags and have been happy with them for the last 13k km. here in Mexico. The OP asked to talk only about Ortlieb and Andy Strapz, so i'll just say that one really nice feature on the Steel Pony bags is the optional silicone mat that velcros' to the exhaust side. It is 100% effective in protecting the bag from the exhaust and should be considered with any soft luggage you plan on using.

Some research on their website indicates a capacity of 37 litres.

Geoff

Steel Pony's seem to meet the criteria. They look to be well made and are huge - combining the best of both worlds. Anyone know if these bags are available in Europe? Shipping and taxation from Oz to Europe will probably make them unaffordable. Thanks for the tip buebo

Unfortunately you have to ship them over to Europe, which adds quite a bit to the price. In the end I decided on the Giant Loop since it was available in England (the EU at least) and considerably cheaper.

Just have to get rid of the pannier frames now...

I got a quote from SteelPony.

It's just an enthousiast who has a very small production line. The develop their product on the road. His wife is the seemstress who puts it all together.
They're working on 2L bottlepockets on the bags right now, I was told. A very nice feature.

Shipping to the Netherlands si $ AUD 110. Adding import taxes adds up a bit too much for my likings. (12% added to the price of the bags + shipping) + 19% VAT = about 350€. And time to ship was approx. 2 months.

For a lot less I can get the wolfmans expedition dry saddlebags, which will stay waterproof without a problem. With textile bags there's always some do's and don'ts. You have to buy the bottlepockets seperatly, but still is a lot cheaper.

Although I like the Steelponys the best, I'm thinking of going for the Wolfman. Less expensive and still very good.

Andystrapz is a definite nono to me. Too many bad reviews and experience you can find online:
YouTube - Andy Strapz Bag Tests